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The Council hasn't come to a decision yet it seems. But the four active members are spread between Europe and the States, not an ideal configuration for a nimble committee.
I'd love it if you used my plan, I made charts and everything :2thumbsup: , but in the case of a hung jury, I'd say your free to use your discretion. I wouldn't want to hold up the game.
Having an army governed by a committee is probably not the wisest (and certainly not the fastest) method of command - for that reason, Henry will be pushing for the Council of Crusaders to be disbanded once it takes Jerusalem.
I agree with Overknight, I don't think the Council deliberations should be allowed to hold up the game. Ideally, the Chancellor should coordinate with the Crusader liason (Tincow) to try to anticipate and avoid such delays. But if that fails, as in the present situation, the Chancellor should just infer the wishes of the Crusader Council as best he can.
My reading of the present situation is that two of the Council (Kagemusha and I) back Henry's plan for the rearguard to doubleback to the bridge to join the knights. Otto's plan has not gathered any additional support. Tincow logged on last night but did not post in the Council so I would treat him as an abstention (unless he posts before Ituralde returns to the game). Perhaps the advanceguard could follow the path Otto sketched?
BTW, while we have only 4 players on the Council, I think we should give TC the casting vote given his role as liason with the Chancellor.
Ituralde,
Have you moved all spies/assassins yet to boost their skill? :)
Sorry, I didn't read the Throne Room last time I logged on. I have voiced my opinion now. If my vote is deciding and the move hasn't yet been made, go with OverKnight's plan, as indicated in my post.
I will now move the Crusader army according to the wishes of the Council. Glad I waited as my plans are more in line with those proposed by Overknight. The route he has drawn exactly matches the one I had planned to travel with the Teutonic Knights.
@FactionHeir
I'll try to use the ones that are idle, but usually wait for high percentages of success to let them acquire better traits.
Check the crusader thread Ituralde, TC's supported my plan. So it's 2-2.
Edit: Oh wait, I'm confused. . .are we going with econ's plan or mine?
Ituralde is going with ur plan. Think Econ decide to give a deciding voice in the crusader council to TC, as he is the council coordinator, to speed things up incase of ties or tactical requirement.
Quick question - hopefully someone online now can answer this.
I am to play the battle using FactionHeir's newest file, the version 1.2 of his fixes. Correct or not?
That's my understanding, GH.
Thanks. :bow:
Savegame uploaded, I'll do the battle report ASAP.
Erm no. Not 1.2. Use 1.2a
Actually....it doesn't matter much since you aren't the acting chancellor :)
1.2a is what I meant/downloaded, so no big deal then. :yes:
Unless the Venetians or the Hungarians near the border block the way for Hans to move into Hungarian territory after you end turn, I would like you to move him to the southwest tip of Sofia and besiege it (must have enough MP for the siege please make sure he does!). In case Hans gets attacked by the Hungarians at the next end turn then, withdraw from battle so he auto moves into Venetian territory and can continue from there :)
Is this a game trick I am not aware of? What's the advantage of besieging Sofia?
I think FH is hoping to use the retreating exploit to increase his movement point per turn... :P That is assuming the retreat moves him in the correct direction and not get attack by another stack... then he is out of luck... :P Think the besieging is to force the AI to break siege immediately as FH only has a small number of troops. And maybe kill some trade from the settlement as a by product?
What possible IC reasons could there be for besieging Sofia with 30 men? While technically not a cheat, this would make no sense from a narrative view point.
IC reason, and with ~23 men by that time....good question!
It wouldn't be a true siege as Hans doesn't have any infantry and with a small bodyguard, you can't siege a citadel. See it as blocking the road to hurt the Hungarian funds somewhat and stealing some of the resources from the merchant wagons that would have gone into/out of Sofia. (He might buy a few mercs from those stolen funds)
I mean I wouldn't have to retreat as I could just fight the battle and run in circles till the timer expires and thus possibly take Sofia, but that would break an edict.
Also, I'm withdrawing from pre combat and not in combat. Withdrawing in combat nets a lot of extra movement. Withdrawing pre only moves me down 2-3 squares.
The OOC point of besieging instead of just standing right next to Sofia is that I won't have to move through the Zone of Control around Sofia the next turn plus Hungarians move after Venetians so once they sally and I withdraw, I won't have to worry about a Venetian stack attacking my exhausted unable to retreat unit.
Note Hans is a promising tactician ;)
FactionHeir, you've repeatedly urged us to use various game exploits or 'features' to our advantage in this PBM. I think you're missing the point. Victory is not really the objective here. The game doesn't get more fun when it's over. I think stuff like this is actively bad for KOTR and it should be actively discouraged. If you want to play like that SP, be my guest, but I suspect you misunderstand the fundamental purpose of the PBM to begin with.
Ituralde, I urge you not to do this. There is no legislation at all dictating Hans' movements, so you can do what you like with him. If you feel inclined to let him march after the Crusade, he should have to risk his neck and possibly die in the process. Using game exploits to make it safer for him ignores the entire downside to his choice to go to Budapest in the first place. Decisions have consequences.
Right, while I don't feel the need to argue with you as it would be pointless anyway, I do feel the need of refuting your blatantly false accusations aimed at my persona.Quote:
Originally Posted by TinCow
First of all, I want you to find a post in this subforum where I am 'urging' anyone to use an 'exploit' or 'feature' in your sense to gain a quick victory and end the game. If you can, I'd be amazed. I can tell you now already that you won't find anything. This is because I do not 'urge' or 'force' people into doing these but I merely state observations, as in the case with the sally for dijon, which by the way was what I found possible and if you read carefully not meant to imply in any way what anyone else should be doing, or suggestions, as the double movement for crusades (which btw is in the Swabia forum you shouldn't be reading or commenting on) which I only explained how to do but not saying "this should be done, there is no other way" or with any similar implications. Also, the thing with papal elections was again an observation to what GH said to inform him that in SP he could have achieved killing several popes a turn, but you again will not find any hint of a suggestion and/or urge in that message. If you cannot take innocent observations that people like to post on online forums (such as "hey there is a shield bug" or in this case "you could have killed that guy a few times, too late now anyway", just because they go against your own morals, then don't comment on them or ignore them. There is no need to go on ranting/flaming peope for things you cannot handle.
The reason I even posted the current suggestion for Hans movement instead of just doing it via PM where there would probably be a lot less hate from you (you probably wouldn't even have noticed) was that I was looking for input on whether sieging Sofia was acceptable or whether I should just stand Hans on the square I designated without sieging. I wouldn't have expect you to take this as flame bait. I suggest that you sit back, relax and read carefully over things people write before drawing conclusions, because its easy to read words the way you want them to read like and the way they are intended to read like by the writer.
That's taking it a bit too far.
I think the goal of this PBM is to make the game as enjoyable as possible for all players involved. All other goals are second to this, and correct me if I'm wrong, but this PBM would be a larger success if the Reich eventually fell but it was fun while it lasted, rather than if all goals of victory were met but wasn't interesting from an RP experience.
Obviously, the game does have several flaws in which our position can be enhanced, but we shouldn't exploit them if there's no RP justification. I think each flaw and its potential to be exploited should be examined individually, since there have been instances where it would have made sense RP-wise.
The Whack-a-Pope thing did make RP sense, since why did Heinrich have to wait two years for a new Papal election?
However, in this case with Sofia, I really don't see how it will play out at all. CA does give cavalry extra campaign map movement points. Hans should just keep using those. Eventually he will catch up with the Crusading armies.
Both of you guys need to calm down. No need to get into a flame war over game mechanics.
:flowers:
Pretty much what you said and why after getting a general opinion I think its better not to instigate a siege but instead move as far as possible towards Thessalonica on the road without entering Venetian territory and leaving at least 1 MP square left so Hans can retreat from battle if attacked (note you can only retreat if you have at least 1 MP left)Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief
Nice smiley, where did you find it? I only see the few to my right.Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief
With the smileys thing just press the More button down the bottom of the smiley box. Or go to your user CP bar and then press Change favourite Smileys or something.
Ahhh finally I got some useful smileys :thumbsup:
Happy joy joy.. :) keep the flames in the Diet.. :P
Do the crusaders have a specific city as their target in mind or will it just be any city in the Levant and be more of a situational thing?
Jerusalem or bust.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xdeathfire
Regarding Henry's letter to the diet:
How are crusaders going to vote in the upcoming diet being that far away and communication likely breaking down in hostile territory in terms of realism? A split empire?
Econ, I thought at least 2 cities will be taken, one for the Empire and Jerusalem for the Pope so as to defend him?
If any good opportunities would happen to arise lets say, a poorly defended Antioch or Iconium, will the crusaders stop and take the city?
It will have to be discussed amongst the Crusaders, but I think so. I would actually expect to see a chain of HRE provinces (not necessarily connected) once we get deep into Turkish and Egyptian territory. It makes sense strategically and is also historically accurate.