Capo de Tutti Capi - II [Concluded]

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Originally Posted by Kagemusha

In my family´s kill there were 3 people last night.go count how many are shown in the description. That shows just how much you can read from those. But like i said already. While Cunnios are lower then dirt.Mafia victory is what counts, trying to give the town victory in form of anything is against what is said in our role pm´s.

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Let see now, while your truce is technically legal, it's also impossible to play Capo with it in practice (how many of the players are/were pro-mafia, especially when you count out inactives?), as a 5 family united mafia eats the town alive.

You don't think that Seamus was allowing a bit of bending of the rules to spice up the game in the end then? You can also notice that the kill is formulated as a hit of unknown numbers but implicates atleast 2?

While your 3 man hit on me doesn't say anything about the numbers (well the rose mafia that hit me doesn't show up in numbers)... And yet it's a obvious 2 man hit on EF? :inquisitive:

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Originally Posted by Kagemusha

Gah! my family cant beat the Cunnios in any scenario, without also giving the victory to the town.

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If we're outnumbered, how can we win?

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Victory Condition

You achieve victory by voting to lynch suspicious individuals and/or participate personally in their removal until such time as: a) all of the Mafia Dons, original and created, have been killed and b) the remaining townies and unaligned WiseGuys outnumber the remaining Mafiosi. Your personal survival, though important, is secondary to the overall success of the town.

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As long as alternative b) cannot be fullfilled, then town cannot win. And according to your theorycrafting we need scottishranger and Gibson as wiseguys to win.

Edit: And it's already checked with Seamus, the town cannot win unless requirement b) is fullfilled

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Originally Posted by Ironside

Let see now, while your truce is technically legal, it's also impossible to play Capo with it in practice (how many of the players are/were pro-mafia, especially when you count out inactives?), as a 5 family united mafia eats the town alive.

You don't think that Seamus was allowing a bit of bending of the rules to spice up the game in the end then? You can also notice that the kill is formulated as a hit of unknown numbers but implicates atleast 2?

While your 3 man hit on me doesn't say anything about the numbers (well the rose mafia that hit me doesn't show up in numbers)... And yet it's a obvious 2 man hit on EF? :inquisitive:



If we're outnumbered, how can we win?



As long as alternative b) cannot be fullfilled, then town cannot win. And according to your theorycrafting we need scottishranger and Gibson as wiseguys to win.

Edit: And it's already checked with Seamus, the town cannot win unless requirement b) is fullfilled

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Run a scenario and look what day the town will outnumber the mafia.If mafia attack each other, the control of this game returns to town, which will be the neutral party, which will again choose who they want dead.This cycle started from the backstab of Cunnio. And will probably continue until town has won.

So no more war then?

Kage, tell your guys to join us, that way no one will die.

And I told you the Cunnios didnt kill EF. Therefore, Gibs and Scott have no reason to hate us.

No more blood spilt is necessary. The game has been played, and there is now an opportunity to end the war. These are totalwar forums, and I think there is a good saying from Rome:

"Sometimes the stronger warrior must except, no matter how it is rationalized."

So, Kage, Barzini, join us, end the game. All we need is two people. Its been great, you have to admit..but do we really need to carry it on?

It's not that easy I'm afraid TP.

I acted without honour and, according to some (probably most), do not deserve to win the game because I didn't play like a real Don etc.

The choice is with the remaining Barzini now.

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Originally Posted by TruePraetorian

So no more war then?

Kage, tell your guys to join us, that way no one will die.

And I told you the Cunnios didnt kill EF. Therefore, Gibs and Scott have no reason to hate us.

No more blood spilt is necessary. The game has been played, and there is now an opportunity to end the war. These are totalwar forums, and I think there is a good saying from Rome:

"Sometimes the stronger warrior must except, no matter how it is rationalized."

So, Kage, Barzini, join us, end the game. All we need is two people. Its been great, you have to admit..but do we really need to carry it on?

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What nonsense is this? A free round of propaganda?I have said dozen times that after my personal defeat im all for mafia victory, even if it was the filthy crowd called Cunnio family aka the towns female dog. But if the remaining Barzini decide to attack you, i wont cry for you. There is no point trying to talk to me.Im dead, you lynched me. If you want to talk to Barzini,contact the living ones.

TP - I've been skim reading thread again so correct me if I have some of this wrong.

Cunnio's proposed the idea of peace treaty and united mafia victory, which you try and convince us is possible under the rules, then we find Craterus would rather either only his family wins or the town.

Cunnio's deny being responsible for killing EF, no all they did is sanction and encourage all the townies to try and do it. Craterus sending order in would mean it only needed two wg's in town group for it to succeed.

Then they sit back and plead innocence while remains of mafia turns on itself and takes out Kage in a lynch vote.


There is scum in this game and there is such scum that a victory on their side would be worse than any form of defeat. To any remaining mafia with an ounce of honour out there, yep take out the town remnants tonight - use don bloody C's orders if you must to get wg's able to kill, but do not accept offers to join his family.

It would be better to lose as an independent than join such scum. Sort out the town and gain the 'mafia' win the rest of us worked so hard towards, but treat these scum with the contempt they deserve and do not join their shallow victory.

EDIT: oh and townies he conned you all as well apparently - but that bit I don't mind :)

Actaully, we DID NOT SEND IN A WG/MADE/ANYBODY


We had Myself, Craterus, and Xehh II....NO ONE ELSE!

Kage had 4 men..3 on one kill if hes not lying, and then 1 doing what? proabably his "luca protecting him."

Either that, or T'Blade is still a made like people say he is, and he counts as towards a 2-3 person group.

(ps T'Blade your welcome to join :beam:)

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Originally Posted by TruePraetorian

And I told you the Cunnios didnt kill EF. Therefore, Gibs and Scott have no reason to hate us.

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erm, once again..... so your actual people - for some strange reason few decided to join you - didn't kill EF, you just arranged for the towns folk to do it.

Then sat back and saw gibs and Scott accused of killing own don, until some townies smelled a rat and pointed out the truth?

Read above post :beam:

And werent you tatagalia?? We have nothing against you!

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Originally Posted by Makanyane

erm, once again..... so your actual people - for some strange reason few decided to join you - didn't kill EF, you just arranged for the towns folk to do it.

Then sat back and saw gibs and Scott accused of killing own don, until some townies smelled a rat and pointed out the truth?

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Mak, is either of them Made of tataglia?

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Originally Posted by TruePraetorian

Read above post :beam:

And werent you tatagalia?? We have nothing against you!

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Ofcourse you dont.You dont have anything against any family unless their Don happens to live.:laugh4:

Honestly guys, Gibson and I did not kill EF. We went after Shlin(who we knew was a townie doctor), and somehow he survived randomly.

No, we thought you guys were in a position to attack us, witht the whole army of people you had there, and decided to strike first.

Dont even try to tell me you werent planning on doing something when Craterus wasnt director..just dont :laugh4:

Kage remember you and I are both dead I can't confirm or deny anything even being Tataglia - that is something CR said its not in write up.

EXCELLENT REMINDER! -- SF


And no apparently the Cunnios have nothing against any mafia - so long as the other groups don is dead and the remnants agree to sign up to the Cunnios

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Originally Posted by scottishranger

Honestly guys, Gibson and I did not kill EF. We went after Shlin(who we knew was a townie doctor), and somehow he survived randomly.

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FOS Scottishranger. How convenient of him to survive just randomly, while the townies supposedly were killing your Don.

Wow, this is all getting awfully complicated. :dizzy:


I will share my thoughts:

- The town did not kill EF. Craterus did. However, this is not even important. Either way, Craterus betrayed the mafia.

- The object of the town is not a win. This is not possible. Since Saturday, the object has been to force the mafia families into war. And then seize any opportunity. Presently, the object is to hop from one family to the next, forcing an eventual stalemate and a draw.*

- The mafia war did not happen through our effort. (So no more need for inflammatory taunts from us). The mafia war started because of the masterplan and betrayal of Craterus. This, all the same, was a blessing for the town.

- Kagemusha**, and others, all the mafia families have been deceived and betrayed, by one of the families. Here's the proof: Kage was lynched by the bloody mafia, eh?

So there's no such thing as 'a mafia win at all costs!' anymore.

Really, you can be mistaken in thinking that the town killed EF last night. You can still be, in fact. I can even see why anybody would think that. But surely, the lynch was there. The mafia lynched Kage. A don, no less. What more proof of cunning mafia deceat and betrayal does anybody need? So what's with all this talk of the town that needs to be defeated at all costs? ~:confused:

- I didn't think I would say this, but for the love of all those dead mafiosi who were betrayed from within for their effort, please, no living mafiosi team up with the mafia betrayers. I really don't see how people even contemplated it. You don't honour all the dead mafiosi and the mafia truce by joining the mafia betrayers, you honour it by punishing them.

- The non-Cunnio mafia can't win anymore on their own. This is obvious. What they can do, however, is join the masterplan of the town: force this game into a stalemate. How? By forging a new alliance between all non-Cunnio players.

The choice, however painful to accept, is clear. Either, team up with the family that broke the truce, be betrayed again, and lose to them. Or team up with everybody else, avenge the mafia betrayers, and not lose the game.



* And the object is not and has not been a town defeat while taking out as many mafiosi as possible, as some townies seem to think. Come on, guys, where is your ambition. Surely, I am not the only town player who has not even blinked his eyes once since Saturday? What's with the panic all of the time?

**You are Finnish, I believe. Great culture. But let me tell you about Mediterranean culture. If somebody ***** you over, stabs you in the back and drags your dead body down the streets, then your family does not team up with the people who did this to you. Instead, they drop everything and fight this vendetta out to the last.
This is mafia, Kage. You are not simply Latin, but Sicilian too. And a don, a Godfather at that. For God's sake, if you send your family to join the Cunnio's, I will send you a real-life ticket for a holiday in Sicily this summer. There, you can tell how you played mafia, how you were a Godfather, how you were stabbed in the back in broad daylight for all to see, by people you knew by name and whom your family was allied with. And how you then requested your family to not take revenge, but instead to join up with your backstabbing killers, in the name of 'honouring your family's obligations'. :inquisitive:

Here's what: you will be quartered by a pack of mules right on the spot, simply for making such a mockery out of Sicily's millenia old and very proud civilisation.

Wow Kag, there is no way I would kill EF. Gibson and I attacked Shlin, it says both of us.

I ask you this, who attacked Shlin then? Hmm?

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Originally Posted by scottishranger

Wow Kag, there is no way I would kill EF. Gibson and I attacked Shlin, it says both of us.

I ask you this, who attacked Shlin then? Hmm?

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Read the thread.

EDIT: And Louis, if you want to start teaching lessons to me about bad temper, id suggest you teach someone else. The Cunnios make me sick at the stomach, but you dont seem to understand that some things are greater then your own benefit and this is the mafia victory for any mafioso, if he reads his pm. You have bad habbit lecturing people how to play while you were killed yourself ages a go, because your group was unorganized. Dont assume things of people you dont know.

You know what? I don't even care who wins anymore. I just want to watch this thing go on longer.

Seriously, the last ten pages or so are an example of human psychology at its finest. :yes:

I have been Kag, and I know you have absolutely no reason to trust me, none at all. But I know that I sent in orders to kill Shlin, and I know Gibson did to. We have no idea how Shlin survived, no idea(though it appears to me to be some red text luck)

Why would we kill EF? Why would I even want the town win? I have been mafied aligned this entire time, even as a townie. I need the mafia to win.

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Originally Posted by rules

A mafia family may, during each “night” phase, make one killing for every two made gangsters or sanctioned wise guys.

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the town claim is quite plausible, damned Caius has claimed to have participated as half of a two person sanctioned kill on BSR already, and possibly other kills (Made Caius of the Cunnio could explain some things), the list of townies circulated that pm was according to bit I found quoted

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Caius; Ironside; KukriKhan; Leet Eriksson; norwegian nerd; Proletariat; shlin28; Twilightblade

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Kage I think you would understand that orders can work even if they have surplus participants. So that only needs one other wg with Caius to have sent order and the whole lot to have been approved by Craterus for the kill to have worked.

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Originally Posted by scottishranger

I have been Kag, and I know you have absolutely no reason to trust me, none at all. But I know that I sent in orders to kill Shlin, and I know Gibson did to. We have no idea how Shlin survived, no idea(though it appears to me to be some red text luck)

Why would we kill EF? Why would I even want the town win? I have been mafied aligned this entire time, even as a townie. I need the mafia to win.

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All i know is that you are a backstabber. backstabbing one, is just as easy as backstabbing another. From our talk from yesterday, i sensed right away that you had predetermined even before talking with me to turn against me and your pall gibsons just avoided me. Your DON fossed Craterus and next Gibsons votes me. I wonder what made you choose Cunnios over us,while we have been cooperating with you for half of the game, while Cunnio was lurking.My honest opinion is that either you or Gibsons or both are townie traitors.

Now... who did kill EF? :sneaky:

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Originally Posted by scottishranger

blah blah blah blah blah

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You killed your Don. :mean:

I did not kill EF

Honestly, the only reason I went with Craterus is because he talked to me first. When I was talking with you, I genuinely felt like going to your side. I really did, I just did not want to betray Craterus, and I still dont.

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Originally Posted by Sigurd Fafnesbane

Now... who did kill EF? :sneaky:

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I lead the thingie.

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Originally Posted by Makanyane

the town claim is quite plausible, damned Caius has claimed to have participated as half of a two person sanctioned kill on BSR already, and possibly other kills (Made Caius of the Cunnio could explain some things), the list of townies circulated that pm was according to bit I found quoted




Kage I think you would understand that orders can work even if they have surplus participants. So that only needs one other wg with Caius to have sent order and the whole lot to have been approved by Craterus for the kill to have worked.

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Made Caius of the Cunnio could explain some things

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Im not Made.

Caius you have also established in this thread that you lie a lot when it suits you ... your responses are not likely to be believed

I'm protown, I have been protown , I will be protown, no matter if TP or Crate invite me to their family.-

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

You know what? I don't even care who wins anymore. I just want to watch this thing go on longer.

Seriously, the last ten pages or so are an example of human psychology at its finest. :yes:

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I agree.

And I must say, as I already said to Kage, that when you have a certain percentage of gullible people among the townies, you can expect a similar percentage of gullible people among the mafia. :laugh4:
That is if the choice is actually somewhat random and the amount of people in both groups as high as in this game.