Why not seek the shelter of Caen or Paris ?
Retrain some men and move on Angers next season
Same for Ruppel...
What's the hurry ? Herrmann's men going AWOL put aside...
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Why not seek the shelter of Caen or Paris ?
Retrain some men and move on Angers next season
Same for Ruppel...
What's the hurry ? Herrmann's men going AWOL put aside...
As per O&R thread, I'll see if the spy can open or not, if he can and Lancelot does not have night attack, Welf would likely be able to join with Ruppel to assault Angers this season and take it, thus preventing desertion.
From the Reports thread:
I should hope not. I thought it was considered extremely bad etiquette to move someone else's avatar without permission?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramses II CP
Heh, but with the crusade over you won't be reaching Rome until, at the earliest, next year, and your ships will cost five times as much if there's actually one available, etc.
:egypt:
Generally yes, although the Chancellor can do it, of course[1].Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief
When there are coordination issues, as here, though, it gets tricky. If the player would have wanted to be moved, then moving them might not extremely bad etiquette.
For example, with the crusade, I was not sure whether Tristan wanted to join the assault on Angers or not. In the end, I encouraged FH to move him without permission as I inferred he would want that (to get the stats boost). May be we should have waited to hear from Tristan but likely it would have delayed the game by a day and IMO it did not seem worth it.
Perhaps we need some mid-level command position, between Chancellor and individual generals, where the area commander is authorised to make such moves. Dukes are the natural candidates for this and perhaps Ruppel acting in lieu of an active duty Duke in Swabia.
The Chancellor can always authorise another player to make a movement on his behalf (e.g. Ramses here would have told FH to get Hermann moving first). Perhaps making someone theatre commander with a little discretion over other's movements could be part of this delegation of authority.
[1]However, if a player flat out does not want to be moved somewhere, I would like to see even the Chancellor desist from moving him (unless it is supposed to be in irons). The 24 hour window at the start of the turn is designed to allow players this kind of freedom.
I thought I had made it clear that I wanted in, though if I didn't I'm happy you took the initiative to move me in position for the final assault.Quote:
Originally Posted by econ21
I just didn't make my move further out from Caen as I did not know what you and FH had truly in mind.
So thanks for having Hugo in...
I'm increasingly of the opinion that having a single Chancellor may be an impediment to involvement and scheming. I expected the PvP stuff to take off fairly quickly, but my threat to strip people of their armies seems to be making them cautious. I think it would be interesting if we had 4 active players as Dukes to have them act as 4 'Chancellors' with one elected person, the Kaiser, setting the budget for each and general strategy for the nation. This could also help out with inactivity and vacations, as the Duke could be authorized to fight battles for his subjects, etc.
I thought when I assumed the position that moving the game along quickly would bump up interest, as the story would progress, but we're still missing a fair number of players who not so long ago were engaged with the game. If there were a more definite air of competition for resources and armies between the four houses there would be more excuse for discussion and debate.
:egypt:
Hi Ramses,
I'm sure most of your ideas are included in TC's revised edition of this game. :beam:
In my opinion we have had a mini explosion of players which has resulted in a diluted experience because of too many people in the end.
This happened well before my Chancellorship.
With nearly 20 active players at one time there seemed to suddenly be no where near enough responsibility or action to go around. In a natural response it seems many people have taken a far less active role.
This of course occurred when TC and Econ gave up so much of their private time to provide a "Choose your own adventure" style of game. Now that we have gone back to the traditional format we have seen a drop in participation as the structure is not really supporting that many people very well.
Your idea is a classic response to "get people back in the game".
So, it seems we are seeing the final throws of this game and the structure of the next game will be one hell of a discussion, which I honestly think needs TC and Econ to have a set time limit or we will be debating it indefinitely. :laugh4:
If we could get the trial of Lothar moving, things would naturally and rapidly move in interesting directions.
In the early days I'd be 100% sure that the lack of overt action would be due to back room negotiations and double dealing...now, I'm pretty sure it's because nothing is in fact happening. :inquisitive:Quote:
Originally Posted by TinCow
yeah things have slowed down loads, the House of Franconia thread hasn't been posted in for years.
In Outremer a combination of Byzzie superarmies (definately not worth going after in their own land, too many casualties) and the fact that all those super armies are dancing around just out of Imperial territory have made it hard to find things to do.
I did manage to conquer Cyprus. :clown:
Quote:
Originally Posted by AussieGiant
Yeah, looks like "trial" is just another word for delay. I'll probably just bide my time and kill everything!
I just posted a poll to see how active everybody is. There's only 24 hours to vote, which should be a good window.
I honestly don't know which way to vote. I kinda wish there was a third option, although anyone with enough time to answer the poll is probably fairly active.Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief
Myself, I've found it rather difficult to work up much enthusiasm with all those uber-armies running about. Once Becker dies I doubt I'll take another avatar. (Though KOTR might end before he does) It's been a long time since I've actually enjoyed having a battle to fight, and recently I've found them to be all nervousness and tension without any sense of triumph or achievement. Indeed, there doesn't seem to be any difference between victory or defeat. There are still full armies to fight regardless.
I'm especially troubled by the sudden invasion of Sicily, as we have apparently reached the point were victories have no meaning, and any action we may take has the same consequence: Endless armies of triple-silver and triple-gold chevrons regardless of who the enemy is and what he is capable of. With such a strong foe it is not wonder this place has been so boring, the threat of foreign armies is so severe that it is difficult to justify any degree of conflict in-house. And this PBEM is rather dull when we're not scheming to ruin one another and/or prevent each other from being ruined.
I'm quite new to this whole game but surely the level of opposition seen from the Cataclysm onward has something to do with how things have quieted down...
The outer threats are more worrisome than any internal threats and so people tend to concentrate on how to extricate themselves of lose-lose situations and do not bother with Reich politics...
Plus the addition of new players with no prior background makes it hard to settle as supporter of one policy over another...
Finally, the loss of some players (thinking PrivateerKev notably) has also quieted the proceedings as he had the knack to probe where it hurt the most and never left his opponents without reaction...
I think the main problem lies in two of four Dukes being relatively absent/quiet and the Prince not usually talking. Usually its them bickering.
I am not sure the AI armies are uber - it's just most of our armies are comparatively weak. The AI armies generally observe the rules on historical army composition but our own forces are far from maxed out in terms of knights. Becker in particular has had to struggle with a mainly militia force from the cataclysm onwards. I'm very impressed he's still in there fighting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cecil XIX
The weakness is partly that we are still recovering from the catalcysm. Partly that Magdeburg has been blockaded so many times and Franconia had few fighting generals. Partly, that Franconia has not been prioritised (Bavaria and now Swabia made big inroads). And partly that Fritz the Attacker seems to want to push everyone to be as aggressive as possible.
Ramses asked for the Sicilian invasion, perhaps because he feared Bavaria becoming too quiet. I am not sure our actions have no consequences. Outremer has stabilised and expanded. Swabia has reclaimed its lost French territories. North Italy is liberated. Yes, there are still significant AI armies but the AI does not seem capable of driving us back.Quote:
I'm especially troubled by the sudden invasion of Sicily, as we have apparently reached the point were victories have no meaning, and any action we may take has the same consequence: Endless armies of triple-silver and triple-gold chevrons regardless of who the enemy is and what he is capable of.
I've generally given neighbouring AI factions 2-4 stacks every 5 turns. The larger factions getting 4 or so, the smaller ones getting 2. I have tried to avoid giving more to those that have lost more, as that would mean victories have little consequence. However, this time, the Poles and the Hungarians did receive the smallest buffs. The Polish settlements are generally too far from us and the Hungarians are uber enough without needing much more support.
Buffing the AI is a tricky balance to strike. With aggressive players like FH and Ramses, the HRE at this stage of the game could nuke an AI faction within a few turns. Maybe I am overdoing it - I know the situation outside Angers was very tough and I had to wimp out of an expected battle. But I think the rate of recovery under Chancellors Arnold and Fritz has been about right - an immediate jump back to hegemony after the cataclysm would have felt wrong.Quote:
With such a strong foe it is not wonder this place has been so boring, the threat of foreign armies is so severe that it is difficult to justify any degree of conflict in-house. And this PBEM is rather dull when we're not scheming to ruin one another and/or prevent each other from being ruined.
If I could add my two cents,
I'm still enjoying the game, I'm still having fun and I don't know about Zim, but I feel we've got a pretty good two man band going in Outremer. Every once in a while, I get a little frustrated because I know another death stack is around the corner. However, we've expanded a tad despite this, and when I took Adana I definitely felt I earned it. Without the adding of armies, I'm sure Matthias would be building a pyramid of skulls in front of the Hagia Sophia by this point, and while that would be satisfying in its own way, it would be unrealistic.
Still the super armies can be problematic. One person's intriguing challenge is another's seemingly insurmountable and frustrating nightmare. When I first encountered the uber armies, I had to fall back (unthinkable!), which frustrated me. Still I elevated my game, changed tactics and pulled through, after some whinging of course. Perhaps more communication between the Chancellor and individual players would keep everyone near their comfort zone when it comes to battles.
For the game to be entertaining, you have to put something in to get something. This isn't a passive entertainment like TV; plot, fight, post in the threads, and it will be rewarded and the game will be more immersive for everyone.
Still, I'd like to see the Trial of Lothar proceed. Of course someone will have to make the first move. There was this wonderful revelation, but it seems to have ground to a halt. I'll be back within a day, so bring it on. :2thumbsup:
Sorry for the rambling.
I've been enjoying the game. Having to be so careful with your resources in Outremer has really made it challenging. We've had some luck in that many of the uber Byzantine stacks have been dancing around the Turkish ones just outside of our reach, but I still think we've had to fight for every piece of ground.
I could definately see why some in the other theaters may differ. I've long since lost track of the number of full stacks sunk into Italy, and Austria's seen rough times as well (as has Andreas' House of Swabia, but FactionHeir and Tristan have been kicking butt there recently). If I barely made it through three beefed up stacks, then a turn or two later three more spawned/appeared, I might be a little put out.
Add in some players out on vacation (OK and deguerra until recently), nonactive Dukes, and a shocking twist involving the Emperor and Lothar which seems to have gone nowhere thus far, and we have a recipe for inactivity. Once something happens regarding the trial thing, those new players who have been putting off on picking a side will likely find themselves involved in the politics of the game, and things might heat up latele.
Good work OK.
In my opinion we need those bronzed up stacks to prevent the game from being too easy. There must be some struggle to attain the rewards or it is just meta gaming.
The most telling point is the investment of time and resources by all of us into the game.
Watching others develop their story telling, battle reports and Diet ramblings has been some of the best times I've had here.
The recent round with Gibbo was great...but this was an isolated incident now days. At the beginning it was the norm :beam:
Losing PK was a blow to the overall level of input. But many have toned down their level of input.
Still...there is work to be done and as the game progresses I'm pretty sure something will grab the attention of us all. When we all have a topic that motivates us then we see the most "action".
When are you back OK?
I have to admit that the level of challenge provided by the "uber" stacks is what got me in KOTR in the first place...
However having faced some half-stacks (notably at Antwerp, a bridge battle) I can understand how some might be reluctant to fight those without respite...
I never had so much tension playing M2TW than playing those battles mainly because of the emotinal side effect of having your own avatar to care about and having the whole game to consider, your failings could mean that some other player will face even harder times...
To conclude, I'll say keep on with the uber stacks even if consideration of player availability would avoid having one player facing all hardships...
I truly hope the Trial will come to fruition soon as it will give us all a bone to gnaw
The point of the poll is just to see how many people are checking the Throne Room/KotR threads regularly. Not to see if people were able to fight battles or anything. :oops:
-edit- Also, add me to the list of people who want to see the trial go somewhere. Perhaps we could actually play it out in the thread, like we did for the trial of Publius Laevinus back in Will of the Senate.
For my part I never really had much desire to be Chancellor when I got started. I was figuring to get a random avatar, hopefully with high loyalty, and then to throw him into some situations that tested his loyalty via storyline, Duke vs Kaiser, etc.
Then Fritz fell into my lap, and he's a good character but not really my sort (Notice his dread hasn't advanced since I took him, which is really foolish on my part), plus given the situation it didn't make any sense for him not to run for Chancellor. He's one of the oldest Counts in the land, his brother is a Duke and Prinz, his two other brothers were a Duke and a Kaiser, and his father (IIRC) was a Duke as well.
So I got into his mindset, pushed to Arhus to try to shore up Franconia's flank and since then I've been stuck there. Can't leave because the Danes will advance, but I can't attack because there are no professional soldiers available, so he's taking his aggression out on all the other fronts in the Reich. :laugh4:
I think we're sitting at 34 provinces now. If it were a solo game we could be at the victory condition very quickly. There are excellent armies on all four fronts, so if not for the AI buffs I think we could probably get 5-6 of those provinces this turn in fact. I like fighting the uber stacks for the most part, especially if I have some good cavalry. It changes the dynamic of the game if you can't just wait for the crash, flank, and chase routers every battle.
The problem in Bavaria was going to be, simply, that there wasn't going to be any problem in Bavaria. The success there has been overwhelming, but the southern reaches are virtually unguarded. If there was a land bridge to the Sicilian holdings we'd be fighting them constantly because we're weak on their borders, but because the strategic AI is so pathetic we could just drive through and crush all their settlements at will. It didn't seem reasonable, though I have to say I was imagining something more like dropping one stack near Palermo and one near Naples. :laugh4:
Hrm, rather lost the thread of my thoughts here, but basically: I'm enjoying the game. Fritz has been very quiet for a long time really, but I've had the Chancellor run to make up for it, and soon, barring PvP, I'll get to go and be truly nasty to the Danes at Stockholm.
:egypt:
The way you and the Bavarians have carved through the Byzantines, that would not have been an invasion - more like an excursion. :whip:Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramses II CP
So do I...Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramses II CP
And I would like to express my most heartfelt thanks to FactionHeir and Econ who went to all the trouble to create Hugo and give him such traits that are really making playing him a real fun experience...
If we would like to speed this up, we could just agree that the trial was conducted, and that Lothar was found guilty. A simple post to that effect in the Diet would be sufficient. I assure you, my response would move this onto the next (inevitable) phase.
Just have your Austrian lackey declare his findings whichever way you favor and we'll get right on with things... :yes:
:egypt:
On the trial, Cecil has offered to try to set something up, PMing some people on Friday. I think we should give him over the weekend to start the ball rolling. A trial of some sort involving several players in key roles would be much the best thing. However, if time constraints or other factors mean it is not possible, we can just through the ball in the back of the next as TC suggests.Quote:
Originally Posted by TinCow
If we're going to do the "multiple roles" approach, I volunteer to be the star witness if nobody else wants it.