Scotland's PUL community

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Originally Posted by HoreTore

There's an extreme difference between a football fan and a hooligan.

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I don't think those who look down their noses at football fans is any better than the worse end of football hooligans, in terms of how I'd mix with their type. While football fans collect in their tribal groups, there is also an understanding that, on certain things, those tribal divisions dissolve for mutual, generally humanistic interests. In some ways, football is the ultimate in multiculturalism, as it forces other cultural trends to take a backseat to another cultural trend, its own, which is both inclusive as a tribe and appealingly exclusive, and which further expresses a cultural code that is inclusive on a wider level. I haven't watched the video, but if these guys are still Rangers fans after their travails, I have every sympathy with them, and contempt for anyone who mocks them. "Where were you when we were :daisy:?" I'm proud of my answer. I'm proud of their answer too.

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Originally Posted by Pannonian

I don't think those who look down their noses at football fans is any better than the worse end of football hooligans, in terms of how I'd mix with their type. While football fans collect in their tribal groups, there is also an understanding that, on certain things, those tribal divisions dissolve for mutual, generally humanistic interests. In some ways, football is the ultimate in multiculturalism, as it forces other cultural trends to take a backseat to another cultural trend, its own, which is both inclusive as a tribe and appealingly exclusive, and which further expresses a cultural code that is inclusive on a wider level. I haven't watched the video, but if these guys are still Rangers fans after their travails, I have every sympathy with them, and contempt for anyone who mocks them. "Where were you when we were :daisy:?" I'm proud of my answer. I'm proud of their answer too.

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My life revolves around football. I love everything about it. The game, the atmosphere, the attitude, everything. I spend every other Sunday at the stadium during the season, and I travel to England to watch Championship level and below games during the winter. Not because of the standard of football, but because I absolutely love the fans and atmosphere in the English lower leagues.

Still, there's nothing I loathe more than hooligans. They ruin our sport. They chase away fans by their refusal to act like decent adults. A section of a stadium or a game where a father can't bring his 6-year old son means we've lost. Hooligans keep these fathers from bringing their sons to games.

The Rangers and Celtic fans(hooligans) in particular, along with fans like Millwall and West Ham, do this. They should all burn in hell for ruining the greatest game on earth.

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

Ugh, why do I bother?

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Why take every word posted on the intertubes literally?

But my comment on never watching political videos online should be taken literally.

I'm very much in favour of raising the destitute, Rhy. But I do not see why that should mean restricting immigration or "multiculturalism", nor do I see why it's important that they live in the UK rather than an independent Scotland.

As far as the latter is concerned, what I see is that they find themselves in inadequate living conditions after centuries of British rule. How then can continued British rule improve their situation? And so, how can Scottish rule be any worse?

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Originally Posted by HoreTore

My life revolves around football. I love everything about it. The game, the atmosphere, the attitude, everything. I spend every other Sunday at the stadium during the season, and I travel to England to watch Championship level and below games during the winter. Not because of the standard of football, but because I absolutely love the fans and atmosphere in the English lower leagues.

Still, there's nothing I loathe more than hooligans. They ruin our sport. They chase away fans by their refusal to act like decent adults. A section of a stadium or a game where a father can't bring his 6-year old son means we've lost. Hooligans keep these fathers from bringing their sons to games.

The Rangers and Celtic fans(hooligans) in particular, along with fans like Millwall and West Ham, do this. They should all burn in hell for ruining the greatest game on earth.

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I'll give your props then for being able to talk knowledgably about football and football culture. Although in the spirit of one-downmanship, I've actually paid to watch non-league football.

FWIW, I respect all football fans, but my own club is infamous for being the opposite of hooligan-ridden.

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Originally Posted by Pannonian

I'll give your props then for being able to talk knowledgably about football and football culture. Although in the spirit of one-downmanship, I've actually paid to watch non-league football.

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My siggy should've clued you in though ~;)

I had a dream of seeing AFC Wimbledon's first ever football league match... Sadly, I didn't get the chance to do so...

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Originally Posted by Pannonian

FWIW, I respect all football fans

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I don't consider the imbeciles(like many of the ones in the OP video, I'm sure) who make other people stay at home to be football fans at all. They're drunkards, hooligans and lowlifes, and nothing more. Hang 'em all, I say.

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

I know your comments here were not in response to me, but I just want to make clear that the culture surrounding the football clubs of Rangers and Celtic is only a very small part of the story of Ulster-Scots Protestantism/loyalism and Irish Catholicism/republicanism in Scotland.

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I see Rangers and Celtic as adults who refuse to act like adults.

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

Your attitude in this thread shows to me that behind your ideology and academic viewpoints, at a more visceral level, you find the masses to be detestable.

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I'm not part of "the masses"...?

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

You could have listened to any of the concerns raised in the video (unemployment, poor benefits, homelessness, etc), but instead you chose the one comment on immigration and used that as an excuse for your hatred.

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That was the comment I picked up on, yes. Not from watching the video(I didn't), but from your OP and previous posts in this forum.

But I can ask directly then: are these guys nationalists? Are their demands nationalist in nature?

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

Because a decline in Britishness, in the British state, and in British institutions has gone hand in hand with the decline of a once strong, vibrant working-class Protestant community, and its recession into some sort of lumpenprole "white trash" underclass. There is a deep hatred within respectable Scottish society of the PUL community and everything they stand for, and if parliament is reduced from the British to the Scottish level, then this hatred will be focused in a much more concentrated and untamed way.

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So, the British government has turned the "vibrant Protestant community" into a white trash lumpenproletariat, but the British government is the guarantee for the well-being of the PUL community....?

That makes no sense.



Also, do we have here a group of immigrants who refuse to integrate properly into their new host country, clings to their owns ways and demands the majority to cater to their needs instead of treating every citizen as equals? What does that situation remind you of?

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

As PVC pointed out, look at the whole way the video is composed. It basically amounts to "lol poor people".

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I was attempting to make a different point, but it appears I failed in my delivery. It doesn't matter. :bow:

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Originally Posted by InsaneApache

It won't happen. You'd never get a Weegie in a frock.

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How about a kilt? I'm sure there are some bearded kilt wearing Scots... Are none of them PULs?