Let's all boycot the Console TW

they'll still have the PC versions but I think they might become a little bit crappier than what we have now. I remember Knights of the old republic and how great of a game the first one was. I was disappointed to learn the second one was just a lame rushed production. Apparently the company that was making it decided to abandon it for Jade Empire which is due mid april. Some other company finished up KOTR II and i've read reviews about how it isn't so fun and just seems to be put together sloppily. Hopefully, that will not happen to RTW.

man RTR sucks, every time in the fourth Rebel turn it CTD's, it was good but 5.2 and 5.3 suck. also their skin sucks.

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Originally Posted by lars573

And developers don't abandon the PC market they just put it second. They make games that are bound for a console first then come to the PC.

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Sure they do. Look at Interplay. They had an established market for their Fallout series and had Fallout3 under development when they chose to shut down Black Isle Studios, lay off the staff, and shelve Fallout3 mid-development so they could focus on some console project that they didn't have an established market for.

Some console games that get ported to the PC platform can still be successful (GTA, KotOR, etc), but others end up as a PC game that still requires a gamepad controller to effectively navigate the UI (FFXI).

These are the reasons I'm not thrilled to see some of my favorite game developers embracing the console platform. Yes I realize it is often a sound financial strategy for them and it isn't something we can stop, but I don't have to like it.

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Originally Posted by Emperor Umeu 1

well i ain't afraid cause i got my immortal gaylords with me that will **** you to death.

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I was just quoting monty python.

yeah Like Pro Evolution Soccer 3

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Originally Posted by Arrowhead

I was just quoting monty python.

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oh oke then never mind Arrow trough his head.

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Originally Posted by Emperor Umeu 1

oh oke then never mind Arrow trough his head.

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Arrow through whose head? My head? If that were true I would be a very stupid archer (like the ones in RTW).

Sorry mates, but boycotts don't work.

For every person here who might participate, there's 5 out there who have never heard of the Org and will see the title and say 'wow this looks cool'.

However

For each one of those 'wow' guys there's 10 saying 'Sega stinks, my money goes to XBox or PS'.

So the real threat to us isn't that devs will flock to console and abandon us (altho that is a threat). It's that Spartan TW for Sega will bomb and some corporate bean-counters will say 'oh no we tried that and we lost big money so never make a TW game again'

Welcome to your future.

ichi

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Originally Posted by ichi

It's that Spartan TW for Sega will bomb and some corporate bean-counters will say 'oh no we tried that and we lost big money so never make a TW game again'

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Do you think that they will be able to distinguish between Total War and Total Warrior then, as we are asked to do now? :smug:

I really wish I wasn't so hard to entertain...

Ichi,

I could be wrong but I am fairly certain that Sega is dead as a console after getting wasted in the console wars a couple years back. From my understanding they remain as a parent organization for software development on the "winning" consoles.
Check out their site in the states: http://www.sega.com/home.php
They don't even mention their own console.

It's kind of like the relationship between activision and Creative Assembly. Resource and profit sharing.

Regards.

Sega dropped out of console making years ago; now they are a developer and publisher. They have made some pretty good games in recent years, and some quite oddball ones at that. They have also been involved with PC games, publishing mostly IIRC, but they also converted and released some of their own games a while back.

Saga have a reasonable standing in the frog's books; if this announcement involved EA, Activision, Eidos, Microsoft, [inset other usual big name suspect here; I can't be bothered to list them] then I'd be more concerned. Sega have proven in my eyes that they will take risks, do new things and support their products (developed in-house or by others) so they come out bug free and complete. So I am very slightly optimistic; if Sega ended up publishing future PC Total War titles in addition to the console ones we might get a better product ...

Eidos and Microsoft would be the worst possible people to be involved in this deal IMO; they are the companies I have the most experience with when it comes to late/shoddy/dropped PC games when consoles are involved.

I’m reserving judgement until more is know, both about the game and about the deals.

I really wish CA wasnt as big and successful as it currently seems to be. Purely for selfish reasons I'll add.

Ive been a major follower of the Combat Mission series of games and where the real gem has been the companies lack of widespread commercial success and the fact that it doesn't care. Its got its community of dedicated Grognards that support the game and it produces pretty much perfect 3D tactical war games. Its success is that it keeps its head above water and keeps its niche community supplied with a great game.

My point- CA has become so successful that it needs a big corporate structure and if anything is losing touch with its hard-core players. This seems to be breeding a culture that misses the details, for example- the traits, AI save and pri-sec bugs all cry of rushing a product too fast and missing little bits here and there. The trait bugs seem to be mainly down to getting < round the wrong way- easy to do when under pressure. But the market is now large enough that the *bulk* of people wont care or notice these issues, they simply want the pretty graphics, big battles and a tv tie-in product.

I still feel RTW is a masterpiece, albeit flawed and unfinished, but one of the great games of all time and CA is one of the most original developers currently working. But the last thing I want is a massively succesful CA that produces a diverse array of games accross many platforms and sells on the strength of its brand- rather I want a company that has attention to detail, that recognises and caters for us geeks first and foremost.

Hmm, turned into a rant- been saving that up for a while. ~:cheers:

I congratulate CA for expanding their horizons. After all, nobody boycotted Blizzard when they jumped from RTS games to MMORPGs, now did they? Dont like the idea of the game, dont buy it, but dont pressure others to not buy it.

If it was EA I would be horrified. Yeah it would look pretty but it would be crap.

Even my 11 year old brother has picked up on that entirely on his own, just playing Xbox games.

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Originally Posted by kekvitirae

I congratulate CA for expanding their horizons. After all, nobody boycotted Blizzard when they jumped from RTS games to MMORPGs, now did they? Dont like the idea of the game, dont buy it, but dont pressure others to not buy it.

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In fact wouldn't it be kewl if there was a TW MMOROPG? It would be the best game ever!

You could be an Emperor!

EA is a great example of where compaines go wrong. I was a huge fan of their products when they were developing for the Sega Genesis. They could be relied upon to consistently deliver games of greater than their competitors. Then... well then they were replaced by evil coporate EA.

If any of you remember, there was a Rome strategy game EA produced 10 or fifteen tears ago called "Centurion". It was actual quite similar to RTW in many ways. You could establish protectorates, etc and eventually protectorates would assimilate into the larger body of Rome. Quite a bit of diplomacy and some interesting tactical level unit battles (which were either way to easy or impossible depending on the difficulty setting). If anybody has a Genesis laying around, I recommend hunting down a copy of this game at your local used game store.

Anyway. It's sad about EA. Let's just hope CA stays grounded.

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Originally Posted by Byzantine_Prince

In fact wouldn't it be kewl if there was a TW MMOROPG? It would be the best game ever!

You could be an Emperor!

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Damn. That would be great. I already have trouble peeling myself away from the Comp. Managing battles would be a pain though. What happens when you are sleeping and your army in the field is attacked? The stratgey level would work, but I wonder about coordinating the tactical level.

Maybe you would have to work your way up from Centurion and coordinate with others to form larger armies... This could be good.

Where have I heard this discussion before?

I posted something similar a little while ago. I mentioned it again because no one paid attention the first time.

Yeah and you could also be a Spartan. Can you imagine it. Getting in a phallanx formation with your buddies fighting off thousands of greeks. That would be awesome!

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Originally Posted by Divinus Arma

Where have I heard this discussion before?

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You have wired the CA corporate phone? ~D

Alright now.. alot of people here seem to be living in the dark ages. Now at I am not a console fan (although i have an xbox) BUt this Boycott shit is just that.... SHIT! it is childish, like the war between nerds and jocks.

I mean come on people, HOW many of boycotted BUNGIE when they made halo for the xbox or how many of you are boycotting BLIZZARD because the next Starcraft game is for console? think about people, They are 2 great game companies that know where they belong/their true home is, not to mention that Blizzard started out on the SNES. CA are the same as Blizzard & Bungie, ok so rome was up to many peoples expectations, but hey it does happen, IMHO look at C&C generals ( yes they are 2 different games but they are classed as RTS)

Now as for this new game Spartan, i belive it will be in the same class as Dynsty Warriors on the ps2/xbox but hangon, (insert sarcasm) " I dont know what Dynsty Warriors is because I hate consoles and boycott game compaines who make games for consoles" (end sarcasm). Dynsty Warriors IS not a RTS it is and Action RPG/Beatem up ( think arcade games like the DnD games/Knights of the Round) but 3d and set in china the catch is you have shitloads of men on side to help you (witch you dont controll) and shitloads of men to kill plus there generals etc etc. That is what i supect SPARTAN: TOTAL WARRIOR will be like

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Originally Posted by hoom

How does it display the units?

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Kay,

http://img1.exs.cx/img1/3672/86ab1.jpg
http://img1.exs.cx/img1/6509/25mp.jpg

The 2 screenies show Zhuge Liang casting his fireball power. This game isn't exactly realistic.


http://img1.exs.cx/img1/9099/32hc.jpg

This is Sun Quan's division engaging Zhang Liao's division in one of the naval battles in the game.

http://img1.exs.cx/img1/1091/75hr.jpg

Guan Yu's cavalry engaged with Hu Zhi's spear men

http://img1.exs.cx/img1/3530/killerchop5ir.jpg
Another of the special generals abilities, in this case duel.

http://img1.exs.cx/img1/9363/guanyu1nf.jpg
Guan Yu's cavalry manuvering outside a fortress.

http://img1.exs.cx/img1/3159/charge2na.jpg
Another special ability cavalry charge as preformed by Meng Huo's elephant brigade.

http://img1.exs.cx/img1/884/ptkessen...06ssp2k211.jpg
An army of the Kingdom of Shu lined up for battle

What are the little numbers for? Points earned so far?

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Originally Posted by hrvojej

What are the little numbers for? Points earned so far?

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Troops numbers, as in Sun Quan has 10571 men fighting Zhang Liao 12334 men on borad 2 junks grappled together. It's distplayed on screen at about 100:1 scale, 10000 men is represented by about 100 characters on screen at once. The little dots are the formation the troops are in, this changes to call when you gather for a charge. The bar underneath is the units morale, the lower it gets the crappier your troops will fight. Also when units are fighting like in the Sun Quan/Zhang Liao screen you take control of the general and can wade threw the melee to help out. Hacking about to keep up your men's fighting spirit.

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Originally Posted by hung41584

they'll still have the PC versions but I think they might become a little bit crappier than what we have now. I remember Knights of the old republic and how great of a game the first one was. I was disappointed to learn the second one was just a lame rushed production. Apparently the company that was making it decided to abandon it for Jade Empire which is due mid april. Some other company finished up KOTR II and i've read reviews about how it isn't so fun and just seems to be put together sloppily. Hopefully, that will not happen to RTW.

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Going a little off topic here, but you are missing out here. Firstly, I don't believe Obsidian "finished off" KOTOR2, the whole design was contracted out to them from the start - they just kept KOTOR's engine. Secondly, KOTOR2 is about as great as the first one, IMO. Yes, it was rushed - the ending in particular suffered - but is a fine game, from a promising company. I can't see how someone can like KOTOR1 and not KOTOR2; if there is any criticism of the sequel, it's that it is more of the same. But I for one wanted that.

Back on topic, I don't have a console but more money going to CA is a plus in my view.

While I whole-heartedly agree with the power of the consumer to effect change in the products they buy, a boycott of a TW console game by TW diehards is meaningless. CA knows fully well that many/most such players wouldnt buy a console version anyway. They are trying to attract a different group of consumers. IMO it wont hurt the PC game and if it generates more revenue and more interest in the genre it may help. The best we (the diehard grognard types) can hope for with regard to future TW titles is that the game includes a version for us or that less critical factors that we wish to mod are hard-coded. I dont believe that will happen however. There is simply no money in pandering to our wishes and, at the present time, it doesnt look as though CA are showing much loyalty to their long term fans of the more tactical sides of the game. On the other hand, we can always hope for a new game to emerge.

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Sure they do. Look at Interplay. They had an established market for their Fallout series and had Fallout3 under development when they chose to shut down Black Isle Studios, lay off the staff, and shelve Fallout3 mid-development so they could focus on some console project that they didn't have an established market for.

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Er, yes, they had an established market. A very, very small established market. Fallout was hardly a blockbuster, though it was a damned fine RPG.

Oh, right, on topic: Yes, let's boycott the new game we know next to nothing about, have never played, and apparently never will play. All...what, thousand of us, best case? Yep, CA'll be feeling the loss of that revenue, you betcha.

Forum boycotts are, ah, less than effective ~;)