Palestinian TV carries 'blatant anti-Semitic and Holocaust-denying' broadcast

laconicly speaking, the palaistinian tv statement is just annoying, what Israeli gov do to those people is monstrous.

I agree 100% that what the sheikh said was wrong.

What I find interesting is that the Israelis, while imprisoning an entire people, get all huffy if they say something nasty about them.

What did the Israels expect after decades of torturing Palestinians, massive human rights violations and an illegal and brutal occupation? A testimonial dinner?

But in the middle period between Israel stopping recriminations and the the Palestinians stopping strikes (which could be several months long) the Israeli people would be infuriated with their governments failure to respond to threats to their safety. It quite simply wouldn't work.

well remember that ceasefire not long ago ? It lasted a month (minimum) and that was with israel doing nowhere close to what im suggesting, i would think the public pressure (palestinian on terrorists) would keep them in line, i think there'd be a few desperate attacks from those wanting to keep the conflict going, maybe im just an optimist.

Imagine if America had just ignored Al Qaeda after the September 11th strike in the hope that the terrorists would just go away if they didn't give them a motive.

I think the situation is to different to make an adequate comparision, no offence.

Hearts and minds is an expensive approach

to be honest other than mass murder i think its the only workable approach, military and anti-terrorism measures can only do so much. Can you think of another way other than mass murder or hearts and minds ?

This gets stopped though every time there is more violence.

vicious cycle

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Originally Posted by Idomeneas

laconicly speaking, the palaistinian tv statement is just annoying, what Israeli gov do to those people is monstrous.

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What both sides do to each other is monstrous. Israel is at least attempting (recently) to work towards common ground, in working with Abbas. Abbas is clearly interested only in escalating the situation.

However, I'm actually done defending Israel. If they want to sell our most advanced weapons systems to the Chinese, they clearly have all the answers and should be prepared to take care of themselves.

Abbas is clearly interested only in escalating the situation.

what makes you think this ?

Look Grizz, if in the course of the thread you haven't seen that Abbas is whipping his people up, nothing I can say is going to open your eyes. But, one last parting shot on this topic, and then I'm done. Go pick up a Palestinian geography book. Flip to the section on the Middle East. Try to find Israel. Even more chilling, pick up one of their social studies books. Flip to the section on ethnic minorities among the Palestinians. Try to find mention of Jews. Meaning? In the 'future', there will be no Israel and there will be no Jews.

Like I said, Israel seems to think that it's okay to take weapons systems we've sold them and turn around & sell them to the Chinese. They were outraged that we got upset about it, claiming it was a question of sovereignty. They keep spying on us to get that which we hold back from them, in light of these sales to China. I think we have to reexamine the relationship.

How did this turn into another Isreal Palestinan thread. Some of you seem to be missing what this nut job said. He didnt say Israel is the cause of all evil but the Jews. This goes back way before the creation of Israel. Imagine if a Rabbi came on Israeli tv and said that Islam has always been the cause of all the evil in the world.since its inception. The outcry accross the world would be deafening. It has nothing to do with hating Israel but everything to do with hating jews no matter where their from. If there were no Israel he still would say the same.

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Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

How did this turn into another Isreal Palestinan thread. Some of you seem to be missing what this nut job said. He didnt say Israel is the cause of all evil but the Jews. This goes back way before the creation of Israel. Imagine if a Rabbi came on Israeli tv and said that Islam has always been the cause of all the evil in the world.since its inception. The outcry accross the world would be deafening. It has nothing to do with hating Israel but everything to do with hating jews no matter where their from. If there were no Israel he still would say the same.

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You make a very good point there. Okay, back on topic...

All right, he's a nut job and he shouldn't have said what he did, and it shouldn't have been broadcast.

Its going to be a very short thread if the topic is "was the mullah right".

I mean, I've seen settlers on TV claiming they were Gods chosen people and the Palestinians were trespassers in God's holy land whom were more or less asking to be shot with God's holy bullets, so, what, we should do a post saying who agrees with the wacko?

Actually, if you have links to transcripts to that sort of thing, I think you should start a thread on it. No surprise, but we don't see the settlers ever over here, unless they're getting carried away on a stretcher. We know they're religious fanatics, but we never hear them speak in interviews.

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so, what, we should do a post saying who agrees with the wacko?

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Well peole here seem to be saying well of course he says things like that look what the Israelis have done to them. The problem is thats not why he says it. Its an underlying hatred for Jews that I fear most Palestinians and for that matter muslims seem to have. No not all of them.

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Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

How did this turn into another Isreal Palestinan thread.

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Because you started it and you start most of the Israel/Palestine threads. Most of which start off with some nasty thing the palestinians have done. So, we respond.

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Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

Some of you seem to be missing what this nut job said.

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No, we noticed. Most of us, if not all of us, thought he was 100% wrong to say it.

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Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

Imagine if a Rabbi came on Israeli tv and said that Islam has always been the cause of all the evil in the world.since its inception. The outcry accross the world would be deafening.

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I thought you said that. ~;)

And no, it wouldn't be.

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Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

It has nothing to do with hating Israel but everything to do with hating jews no matter where their from. If there were no Israel he still would say the same.

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The guy is a nutbar. To hell with him.

But you cannot mention Jew and Palestinian in the same sentence without mentioning Israel and Palestine. The situation is much to deep for that. Could you talk about the black population of South Africa in the 1970s without refering to apartheid? Can you mention Booker T. Washington without refering to slavery? You cannot mention any Palestinian "event" without refering to the brutal Israeli occupation they live under. Sadly, it colours every aspect of their existence. It overwhelms them as a people exactly as slavery and apartheid did to the black populations of the US and South Africa.

Look Grizz, if in the course of the thread you haven't seen that Abbas is whipping his people up, nothing I can say is going to open your eyes.

well post 26 tribesman said

Why should the head of TV resign ? It was a live broadcast , you can have no editorial control over what someone says live on TV .
Should the Palestinian Authorities censor every statement ever made before they are broadcast , should clerics submit their semons for government approval before they are allowed to say anything ?

is he wrong ? did abbas actively encourage or allow what was said ?

Go pick up a Palestinian geography book. Flip to the section on the Middle East. Try to find Israel. Even more chilling, pick up one of their social studies books. Flip to the section on ethnic minorities among the Palestinians. Try to find mention of Jews. Meaning? In the 'future', there will be no Israel and there will be no Jews.

i don't see them suddenly being able to do that, i bet you once the israel palestine situation has been resolved ethnic problems between them will start to receed.

Some of you seem to be missing what this nut job said.

obviously he's an idiot i don't think anyone thinks otherwise ?

Well peole here seem to be saying well of course he says things like that look what the Israelis have done to them.

i think its a symptom of it, it doesn't excuse it...

Its an underlying hatred for Jews that I fear most Palestinians and for that matter muslims seem to have. No not all of them.


rivalaries fade after any excuse for them is gone, think england france now....

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Because you started it and you start most of the Israel/Palestine threads. Most of which start off with some nasty thing the palestinians have done. So, we respond.

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So Im getting to you ~D

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No, we noticed. Most of us, if not all of us, thought he was 100% wrong to say it.

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But you seemed to be saying he was accussing Israel of these things . I was pointing out it was all jews. The probems between Israel and Palestine didnt create this . Theycame about because of teachings like this.

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I thought you said that.

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You now I never said that. Besides Im just a shmuck on the internet in a gaming forum. I doubt Ill have any effect on public opinion anywhere.

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But you cannot mention Jew and Palestinian in the same sentence without mentioning Israel and Palestine.

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Not in front of you it seems. ~:)

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Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

So Im getting to you ~D

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From the moment I met you. :sweetheart:

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Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

You now I never said that. But perhaps I'm being unfair.

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Weeeeeeell, you have pointed your boat in that direction once or twice.

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Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

Besides Im just a shmuck on the internet in a gaming forum.

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Shhhh! Not so loud. AdrianII and Panzer both think this site is linked to the UN.

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Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

Not in front of you it seems. ~:)

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Chu got dat right baby! ~D

Back on topic.... The guys a complete racist and denialist.

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Actually, if you have links to transcripts to that sort of thing, I think you should start a thread on it. No surprise, but we don't see the settlers ever over here, unless they're getting carried away on a stretcher. We know they're religious fanatics, but we never hear them speak in interviews

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Fair comment. I'll see what I can find on a reliable source from the lovely Moshe Levinger and his mates in Gush Emunim, obviously I'm a bit reluctant to post quotes attributed to them by just anyone since they may be made up. Although if the views attributed to him are true this could be a problem since reputable new organisations don't often give a platform to extreme racists who advocate terrorist actions, which is where we started.

In the mean time though I did find this which is OT but rather illuminating in its own way...

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Beginning in 1967, when Israel militarily seized Arab East Jerusalem, Jewish terrorists on more than 100 occasions have laid siege to the Muslim Mosque. Here are a few of the assaults: August 1967 - Chief Chaplain of the Armed Forces Shlomo Goren - later Israel's chief rabbi - leads 50 armed extremists onto Haram al-Sharif. "It is a holy commandment," Goren said, for Jews to go to the Muslim grounds, which Jews call the Temple Mount."

Writing in an Israeli publication, Eti Ronel reports: "Many rabbis, including members of the Council of the Chief Rabbinate, support Jewish sovereignty" over Haram al-Sharif.

August 21, 1969 - Jewish extremists set fire to Al Aqsa, destroying a priceless wood and ivory pulpit sent from Aleppo by the Muslim ruler Saladin. The arson prompts the United Nations Security Council to condemn Israel's failure to curb terrorist attacks on Islam's shrine. Four months later (19/12/69) a group of militant Jews storm their way to Haram al-Sahrif, in order, they claim, "conduct Hanukkah prayers."

March 3, 1971 - Gershon Solomon leads Temple Mount Faithful followers onto Haram al-Sharif. After struggling with Palestinian guards, they are expelled. Three years later (3/3/74) Solomon again, with followers, storms the Mosque. Again (14/7/78) Solomon leads militant Jews onto the Islamic holy grounds. Palestinians stage protests. Israeli troops hurl tear gas to quell the rioting.

August 10, 1980 - Three hundred Gush Emunim fanatics, heavily armed, overcome Palestinian police and storm the grounds, but are later dispersed. A month later (15/9/80) armed Gush Emunim settlers associated with Stanley Goldfoot and the Temple Mount Faithful again force their way onto the Mosque grounds. After scuffling with police they are evicted.

April 11, 1982 - Alan Goodman, an Israeli citizen with a U.S. passport, marches into al Aqsa with an M-16 rifle and opens fire on worshippers, killing two Palestinians and wounding others. After a short sentence the Israeli government releases Goodman. Unrepentant, Goodman boasts, "I fulfilled my mission."

July 25, 1982 - Yoel Lerner, a member of the militant Meir Kahane Kach movement, storms the mosque grounds with plans to dynamite and destroy the Dome of The Rock.

March 10, 1983 - Armed Gush Emunim fanatics climb walls onto Haram al-Sharif, attempting to overcome security guards and take the mosque by storm. They have in their possession large quantities of explosives, automatic rifles and pistols. Twenty-nine are charged and held for trial. September 21, 1983 - An Israeli court acquits the 29 Jewish terrorists who six months earlier had laid siege on the mosque.

January 27, 1984 - In the most ambitious plot to dynamite and destroy the mosque, Jewish terrorists, armed with 250 pounds of explosives, including dozens of grenades, boxes of dynamite and 12 rounds of mortar, attempt to dynamite and destroy the mosque. They are led by Rabbi Moshe Levinger, one of the most militant of Jewish extremists.

1994 - The Israelis appoint Meir Davidson, a senior official of Ateret Cohanim, as municipal adviser on Palestinian properties. This signals the Israeli government will work closely with an organization whose aim is destruction of the mosque.

September 1996 - Ateret Cohanim, funded largely through tax-exempt dollars donated by rich American Jews, including Miami millionaire Irving Moskowitz, opened a tunnel - excavated in secret night-time operations - that runs the length of the Al Aqsa complex. The controversial tunnel sparked intense fighting which claimed the lives of 60 Palestinians and 15 Israeli soldiers. Israeli Prime Minister Binyiman Netanyahu proudly visited the tunnel, as have fundamentalist Christian leaders.

October 18, 1998 - Gershon Solomon, with followers waving Israeli flags and blowing rams' horns, mounts a ramp to the mosque grounds. "The time has come to rebuild the Jewish Temple," said Solomon. To underscore this point, Solomon parked near an Old City gate a flatbed truck carrying a 4 ton marble "cornerstone" for that new temple.

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The palestinians resorted to terrorism (creation of the PLO and its charter saying the destruction of Israel was its goal in the eraly 1960s) to destroy Israel before Israel 'occupied' any of the 'palestinian' lands.

They aren't fighting to end the 'occupation', they are fighting to destroy Israel. Arafat was advised by the KGB that if he pretended to want peace, aid money would flow like water because the westerners would believe he meant it. And lo, many seem to have fallen for it.

Crazed Rabbit

They aren't fighting to end the 'occupation', they are fighting to destroy Israel.

yes all palestinians just want to destroy israel, the fact they've been occupied and have had relatives killed by israel is purely coincidence.

Like those damn iraqi rebels was it in 90 ? 91 ? just wanted to destroy the race that was incharge

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Originally Posted by LittleGrizzly

They aren't fighting to end the 'occupation', they are fighting to destroy Israel.

yes all palestinians just want to destroy israel, the fact they've been occupied and have had relatives killed by israel is purely coincidence.

Like those damn iraqi rebels was it in 90 ? 91 ? just wanted to destroy the race that was incharge

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Before one takes only the side of the Palestinians read the manifesto's of the PLO and other groups that are committing the acts of terrorism in the state of Israel. When you look at these Manifesto's pay close attention to the date that it was written.

The PLO manifesto has called for the destruction of the state of Israel since its conception. Do a web search or even a hard copy research - some libraries (SP) have a copy of the manifesto.

Both sides are equally quilty of continuing the conflict - to where it is in its present state. To state otherwise is just - well fooling yourself in my opinion. Several times Israel has been asked to bend to world opinion and work with the Palenstinians - and when one leader actually tried to do this a Israeli zealot shot him dead. The Palestinians have also been asked several times to work with the Israeli government to halt the bloodshed and find away to resolve the issues - and each and everytime another zealot begins the cycle of violence again.

Its a nice little vicious cycle that has been around since before the formation of the state of Israel.

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Originally Posted by Al Khalifah

Back on topic.... The guys a complete racist and denialist.

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Palaistinian people has the courage to stand unarmed against tanks, armed to the teeth soldiers and throw stones with slings just for the sake of pride, and ready to face concequences. what you expect to praise Israelis?
The first victim in war is the truth.
But the main point for me is that this is just a silly statement in tv. You know how much of those are said worldwide? Trillions. A stupid fanatic statement though cannot erase what is going on down there a nd even more what a people that promotes themselves (officialy) as everlasting victims do to another people right now.
For example If i had somebody down, kicking his head on the street and he was calling names on me. As passing by viewer you would stop and mark that he shouldnt say such words or that i should stop before i kill him?

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Originally Posted by Idomeneas

For example If i had somebody down, kicking his head on the street and he was calling names on me. As passing by viewer you would stop and mark that he shouldnt say such words or that i should stop before i kill him?

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I know exactly what I would do - however do you know what you should be doing if I was kicking that individual in the head?

However this does not apply to the Palenstine - Israeli situtation. Because just as often as its the Israel state doing the violence - there is a Palenstine zealot also doing violence.

The difference is that the Israelis are brutally occupying Palestinian land.

The Palestinians aren't occupying anybody.

There is an aggressor and a victim here. There is a right and a wrong.

Israel is wrong.

Actually, if you have links to transcripts to that sort of thing, I think you should start a thread on it. No surprise, but we don't see the settlers ever over here, unless they're getting carried away on a stretcher. We know they're religious fanatics, but we never hear them speak in interviews.
But I thought you had Fox news over there , don't they claim to be fair and balanced ~;)
Come on they must have carried some of the settlers statements recently , there have been some really good ones lately , stuff like Sharons plans for a partial withdrawel of a few thousand illegal settlers is a bigger atrocity against Jews than the Holocaust was !!!!
Bloody nutters everwhere you look :embarassed:

Not for nothing Tribesman, but where I come from, when somebody acknowledges that you might have a point and asks for more information on your point of view, it's considered poor form to shove it up their $^!. But hey, we Americans are an ignorant folk.

Just out of curiosity, what does "Wear the fox hat" mean, anyway?

The PLO manifesto has called for the destruction of the state of Israel since its conception.

I now but i think the vast majority of palestinians would rather live as a normal country than keep thier lives a misery to destroy israel

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Originally Posted by LittleGrizzly

The PLO manifesto has called for the destruction of the state of Israel since its conception.

I now but i think the vast majority of palestinians would rather live as a normal country than keep thier lives a misery to destroy israel

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And I would agree - but to only point the blame at Israel as some are doing is disengous (SP?) toward what the problem is in Israel. Just as only blaming the Palenstine people is disengous (SP).

For instance why is the West Bank occupied? If you just consider the occupation and that is all you focus on - you will always conclude that Israel is the transgessor and therefor in the wrong.

If you go back to the two of the Arab-Israeli Conflicts, especially the 1967 war then you see that the arab nations when they attacked Israel assembled and massed from some of the areas that are now occupied by Israeli forces.

Should Israel remove themselves from the occupied areas - sure, but they must have some sort of security guarntee (SP) before anyone can expect them to move out. So far it seems some Palenstine and yes many Arab states will not grant them the right to exist as a nation.

Like I have always said on this issue - both are equally at fault.

but to only point the blame at Israel

I disagree with those people, i understand why the lands were originally taken.


Should Israel remove themselves from the occupied areas - sure, but they must have some sort of security guarntee (SP) before anyone can expect them to move out. So far it seems some Palenstine and yes many Arab states will not grant them the right to exist as a nation.

well they haven't attackjed since the deal with american deal with egypt ? egypt would be nessecary for an attack, UAE just opened an israeli embassy and withdrawal could only improve relations.

it's considered poor form to shove it up their $^!.
I that legal in your state . ~;)
Sorry about the tone of the reply Don , its just that with all the mentions of Liberal bias in the American media that erupt on this board every now and then I would expect this Liberal bias to actually have some substance , but I suppose that would be like expecting Fox News to be fair and balanced or O'Reilly to stick to his "No Spin" bull .
For the best coverage of statements from either Palestinian or Israeli nutters read the Israel and Palestinian newspapers , most are on-line free and avaiable in English , the Knesset , IDF and Palestinian authorities websites are also a good source .

Just out of curiosity, what does "Wear the fox hat" mean, anyway?
It is from a short lived radio commercial that was withdrawn after all the complaints for its use of foul language .
Next time you cannot find something try saying it , but maybe you need the accent to go with it ~:cheers:

Well, fair enough, but you're taking the one issue that Liberal and Conservative (large L & C, local to America) agree on. Both sides pander to Israel over here, and so do both sides of the media. As far as America's concerned, it's not a left/right issue.

And it took me breaking out my cheesy fake brogue, but I get it! ~:cheers: