Poll: Thumbs Down on Prez Hillary Clinton

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Originally Posted by Tachikaze

By the way, the US never passed the Equal Rights Amendment.

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Because it was stupid. :bow:

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That's one of the main reasons I'd be willing to suspend my abject loathing of the Republican party in the context of Rice becoming the prez. If she was running against Hillary I'd be in a bit of a dilemma, because I also think it'd be a damn high time for a black prez too, so Rice'd be a nice two-in-one package, but I dislike the Dems a whole lot less as a party...

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That kind of view is amazing to me. You'd be willing to support a party that you apparently hate ideologically just because they run a black female candidate. I honestly don't understand it... :shrug:

I don't care if a candidate is black, white, male, female, or whatever. If they will represent what I believe in I will vote for them. I can't understand what difference their race or sex should make.

What amazes me is that hilary-haters are labeled as mysoginists.

I'll make it blunt for you, Tak: I don't want Bill Clinton in the white house again. We can argue circles all day and night about how good or bad of a president he was, but that doesn't change the fact that he's a package deal, he will be making decisions, and the dems will be subject to cronyism all over again, and there are plenty of democats -- even democrats who supported him and thought he did a decent job -- who simply don't want him in the white house again.

Not just that, but if Hil gets the nomination she will lose. Simple. And it will show the dems that they learned nothing with Kerry. And I don't want the dems to lose so I don't want hilary.

Well, its been no secret that Hilary's negative score was robust. Interestingly, she faced the same hurdle in NY, and got over it with relative ease. She would be divisive and polarizing and would bring out the GOP vote like few Democrats could -- but don't count her out entirely. Regardless of what you thought of them as leaders and policy makers the Clinton political team was brilliantly effective.

What I would like to see is a Democrat party that had something to bring to the table. My own party is suffering for lack of decent competition. The Dems have been unable to articulate a positive message for change and have therefore been unable to wield any effective leverage in elections. Unfortunately, this lets the GOP be sloppy, start to fall in love with the trappings of power, and atenuate their own ability to accomplish anything. This galls me. We need an opposition that forces us to do our work well.

Neither the '00 or the '04 effort by Bush was unbeatable, and the various Congressional elections since '94 have featured their share of Republican mis-cues and yet the Dems, lacking a cohesive central message, haven't been able to apply and meanigful pressure.

To use a football (American) analogy, even a geriatric quarterback can complete the pass if the defense gives him 25 seconds to throw because they can't apply any pressure -- and in a two team game there is no incentive to field better players if the ones you have keep beating the opposition.

Just a thought....

What I would like to know is: what would people think about Laura Bush for president? ~:idea:

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Originally Posted by Major Robert Dump

What amazes me is that hilary-haters are labeled as mysoginists.

I'll make it blunt for you, Tak: I don't want Bill Clinton in the white house again. We can argue circles all day and night about how good or bad of a president he was, but that doesn't change the fact that he's a package deal, he will be making decisions, and the dems will be subject to cronyism all over again, and there are plenty of democats -- even democrats who supported him and thought he did a decent job -- who simply don't want him in the white house again.

Not just that, but if Hil gets the nomination she will lose. Simple. And it will show the dems that they learned nothing with Kerry. And I don't want the dems to lose so I don't want hilary.

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But not everyone who attacks H. Clinton has the same reasons as you. B. Clinton was very popular at his height and even still quite popular after the Republicans did their little political assassination of him.

I stand by what I have said. I think a significant number of US men (enough to decide an election) believe that, in general, a woman doesn't "have what it takes" to be president and, specifically in the case of Clinton, are afraid or distainful of strong women.

This is not to say that Clinton doesn't have faults. I am not enthusiastic about her.

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Originally Posted by Kommodus

What I would like to know is: what would people think about Laura Bush for president? ~:idea:

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Jenna is the zany one.

A real ho by all means. :laugh4:

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Originally Posted by Tachikaze

But not everyone who attacks H. Clinton has the same reasons as you. B. Clinton was very popular at his height and even still quite popular after the Republicans did their little political assassination of him.

I stand by what I have said. I think a significant number of US men (enough to decide an election) believe that, in general, a woman doesn't "have what it takes" to be president and, specifically in the case of Clinton, are afraid or distainful of strong women.

This is not to say that Clinton doesn't have faults. I am not enthusiastic about her.

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You must really hate yourself, white skin and penis and all.If it makes me a sexist because I don't want to vote for Hillary Clinton because I don't agree with her on any of her social issues or her politics then so be it. You know Tachi, you're no better than David Duke when he says bad things about Blacks in general because at the end of the day you're doing the exact same thing by calling the majority of the male public as misogynist as Duke calling blacks savages. You're a hypocrite of the largest order and its a complete and total shame that you were blessed to be born in this wonderful country only to loath it. I really think that you should leave. Its obviously so horrible for you to be surround by all these horrible people, racists, homophobic, religious, misogynist, ignorant, rich, white, male, conservative, etc... Wait a minute, I'm not exactly sure, but you sure are not very accepting of people. Good luck on finding a better place because Tachi, you will NEVER see the US become anything close to what you think would be a better America because the America you vision is even more narrow minded and bigoted than any Republican could ever dream of and the US is too great for a self loathing, unappreciative, little hypocrite such as yourself could ever change. I wonder how you can watch NASCAR and enjoy it so when there are all those white males driving in circles for hours at a time. How can you, Tachi, support this sport when it has sooo many of these evil flag waving white males that would sooner give Bill Clinton a Lewinsky than vote for his wife. Well thats my monthly Tachi rant, please feel free to respond, its a free misogynist-infested country you know.

The "liberal" media has been pushing Hillary on us for years now. Hollywood has put a TV show with a woman president in it to show us how good it would be... Well America has rejected the Liberal left and the Democrats have no idea of what to do. The message that the Republicans are wrong, only works if you can state why they are wrong and what the right choices are (ahead of time, not using hind sight). America's silent majority has finally awakened and they are people who have had enough of the liberals. We are tired of the liberals telling us that its wrong to punish criminals but okay to kill unborn children. Tired of more concern over a tree or a animal than over the betterment of a people. The Liberals are trying to make a socialist society without calling it that. So far, with very few exceptions that type of government has FAILED!

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Originally Posted by Tachikaze

I stand by what I have said. I think a significant number of US men (enough to decide an election) believe that, in general, a woman doesn't "have what it takes" to be president and, specifically in the case of Clinton, are afraid or distainful of strong women.

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Her real problem is that showed 'weakness' by staying with Bill after the lewinski affair, this gave her a conflicting image: the strong female politician and the weak wife who gets cheated on and tolerates it. That's what really ruins her chances imo.

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The "liberal" media has been pushing Hillary on us for years now.

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Reasons and examples please, show me twelve instances of the mainstream media pushing Hillary Clinton as President. If this has been going on for years that shouldn't be too hard.

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Hollywood has put a TV show with a woman president in it to show us how good it would be...

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Yes Commander In Chief is being aired for that reason. Not because it could make an interesting story(I don't know, never watched it), but the point stands writers sometimes sit around and ask each other "what if?" and write what they think might happen in that situation.

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Tired of more concern over a tree or a animal than over the betterment of a people.

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Have you considered why conservation and environmentalism are good? Do you know what happens when we cut down too many trees? Oxygen goes away, you and me stop breathing and die. Besides how do 'Liberals' not want to better people?

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The Liberals are trying to make a socialist society without calling it that.

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By increasing the size of the federal government, increasing federal powers, and helping to centralize economic power?

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Originally Posted by Devastatin Dave

You must really hate yourself, white skin and penis and all.If it makes me a sexist because I don't want to vote for Hillary Clinton because I don't agree with her on any of her social issues or her politics then so be it. You know Tachi, you're no better than David Duke when he says bad things about Blacks in general because at the end of the day you're doing the exact same thing by calling the majority of the male public as misogynist as Duke calling blacks savages. You're a hypocrite of the largest order and its a complete and total shame that you were blessed to be born in this wonderful country only to loath it. I really think that you should leave. Its obviously so horrible for you to be surround by all these horrible people, racists, homophobic, religious, misogynist, ignorant, rich, white, male, conservative, etc... Wait a minute, I'm not exactly sure, but you sure are not very accepting of people. Good luck on finding a better place because Tachi, you will NEVER see the US become anything close to what you think would be a better America because the America you vision is even more narrow minded and bigoted than any Republican could ever dream of and the US is too great for a self loathing, unappreciative, little hypocrite such as yourself could ever change. I wonder how you can watch NASCAR and enjoy it so when there are all those white males driving in circles for hours at a time. How can you, Tachi, support this sport when it has sooo many of these evil flag waving white males that would sooner give Bill Clinton a Lewinsky than vote for his wife. Well thats my monthly Tachi rant, please feel free to respond, its a free misogynist-infested country you know.

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I said a significant number of US men. If you don't want to count yourself among them, don't.

Leaving the US won't make its problems go away. I may be happier in another country, but I won't run away. Perhaps one day the US public will come to its senses and the Republicans will complain and then I will advise them to leave.

I don't support NASCAR. I have not given them a cent since 1988, when I attended a race in Arizona. I would be happier if NASCAR ceased to exist.

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Originally Posted by Kommodus

What I would like to know is: what would people think about Laura Bush for president? ~:idea:

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Statistically, she would be leading the third invasion of Iraq. :inquisitive:

And I'm betting it's with the words "third time the charm" :laugh4:

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Originally Posted by Romulas

The "liberal" media has been pushing Hillary on us for years now. Hollywood has put a TV show with a woman president in it to show us how good it would be... Well America has rejected the Liberal left and the Democrats have no idea of what to do. The message that the Republicans are wrong, only works if you can state why they are wrong and what the right choices are (ahead of time, not using hind sight). America's silent majority has finally awakened and they are people who have had enough of the liberals. We are tired of the liberals telling us that its wrong to punish criminals but okay to kill unborn children. Tired of more concern over a tree or a animal than over the betterment of a people. The Liberals are trying to make a socialist society without calling it that. So far, with very few exceptions that type of government has FAILED!

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What sound does a fox make?

Is it like sheep?

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Originally Posted by Romulas

The Liberals are trying to make a socialist society without calling it that. So far, with very few exceptions that type of government has FAILED!

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Socialism is not a kind of government.

It doesn't really matter who is president in 2008. You are run by faceless corporations. Give it 20 years and all you septics will get tagged at birth by the corporations. They'll be farming you from cradle to grave but you'll think of yourself as free because you're allowed to shoot each other and pray to Jeebus in public.

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Originally Posted by Idaho

It doesn't really matter who is president in 2008. You are run by faceless corporations. Give it 20 years and all you septics will get tagged at birth by the corporations. They'll be farming you from cradle to grave but you'll think of yourself as free because you're allowed to shoot each other and pray to Jeebus in public.

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Well Idaho Ive realized the whole western world will be. Your corporations will cover the UK in bubble wrap and there will be pc police on every corner and christmass will be cancled. At least we get to shoot minorites:inquisitive: and celebrtate Christmas:inquisitive:

Idaho and Strike are both right (Idaho's slight exaggeration and Strike's attack on pc notwithstanding). Where the US goes, the Western world will follow to various degrees and at various rates. The US, and even Japan, may be too far gone, but hopefully, the rest of the world will have the wisdom to resist.

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Originally Posted by Idaho

It doesn't really matter who is president in 2008. You are run by faceless corporations. Give it 20 years and all you septics will get tagged at birth by the corporations. They'll be farming you from cradle to grave but you'll think of yourself as free because you're allowed to shoot each other and pray to Jeebus in public.

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Well, Idaho, 5 points for honesty, even if you immediately lose them for poor grammar. 'Septic' is an adjective. If you wish to refer to the entire population of the USA as pieces of excrement, might I suggest several words that actually DO qualify as nouns? Here ya go... feces, bowel movements or refuses. Again, full marks for honest expression of your true opinion.

Tachi, it's always easiest to despise the familiar. Certainly, women in the United States do not have it as easy as men in the United States. You'd have to be a fool to claim otherwise. That being said, there are very few places in the world where the disparity between women and men is as slight as here. While you continue to dispense your scorn, derision and venom for America and all things American, might I suggest you reside in foreign lands long enough to understand the nuances of their socities and see if we really and truly are as bad as you make us out to be? Last I checked, female circumcision and gender selective abortions are not allowed within the USA.

Tachi, by what means should the world "resist" the American "Empire"? Just curious to what extent you think resistance should be applied.

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What sound does a fox make?

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It sounds like the truth. Greeting and Salutations from the Conservative Right!

Hillary Clinton will not and should not be president of the United States of America because she has absolutely "NO" qualifications for the job. Lawyer, First Lady, and (by riding Pres Clinton coat tails) a Senator from New York. (Not her home State) Up to this point the only important decision she has had to make is what side of the hill to leave Vince Foster's body.

And that is who the Dems want to put in office!

There will be women who are qualified and should be elected. And one day that will happen. Until that happens we will still put our views from the left and right head to head, and give every American the right to vote for the person the wish to represent them.

I'm not going to engage in the usual attacks on Hillary. I'm a big opponent of a 1 payer health care system, and I imagine, that would be the substance of her campaign. Therefore, I'm opposed to her on ideological grounds, and I'll leave it at that.

The Democratic Party has no better fundraiser than the Democratic Leadership Council (read Bill & Hillary). Primaries are all about fundraising, not polls. She's far from out of it. To be fair, I do monitor politics on the other side of the street, and if I had to pick the Democratic nominee "I" would be most likely to vote for, I'd select Senator Evan Byah (D, Indiana). A man of some good ideas, though I seriously doubt he'll make it (Midwestern Democrats don't seem to ever be able to close the deal... look at how big a lead Gephardt blew).

If I knew already who the Republican nominee was going to be, and I knew that I wanted to support them, personally I would be thrilled to see Hillary get the nomination. Her fundraising prowess aside, she would be a lightning rod in a general election, and while many on the libertarian would be tempted to stay home otherwise, she would singlehandedly guarantee Republican turnout in record numbers, no matter how much they hated their own nominee. Hell, Newt Gingrich could get elected running against Hillary (please God, not that!) :help:

Newt and Hillary could make EVERYONE stay home!

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Originally Posted by Idaho

It doesn't really matter who is president in 2008. You are run by faceless corporations. Give it 20 years and all you septics will get tagged at birth by the corporations. They'll be farming you from cradle to grave but you'll think of yourself as free because you're allowed to shoot each other and pray to Jeebus in public.

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:inquisitive:

When you find the time to pull your dilated eyeballs from that infallible crystal ball of yours could you provide us with the names of some of those faceless corporations that will eventually enslave our flesh and control our thoughts and desires? I figure if it's inevitable that 'The Man' is going to stick it to our collective Yankee Doodles I should at least try and profit from the venture by buying some stocks now.

Oh, and my septic can beat up your septic any day of the week...

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Originally Posted by Devastatin Dave

Tachi, by what means should the world "resist" the American "Empire"? Just curious to what extent you think resistance should be applied.

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Tachi, please answer my question. thank you...

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Originally Posted by Don Corleone

Well, Idaho, 5 points for honesty, even if you immediately lose them for poor grammar. 'Septic' is an adjective. If you wish to refer to the entire population of the USA as pieces of excrement, might I suggest several words that actually DO qualify as nouns? Here ya go... feces, bowel movements or refuses. Again, full marks for honest expression of your true opinion.

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Septic tank = yank = american. It's rhyming slang DC!

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Originally Posted by Romulas

It sounds like the truth. Greeting and Salutations from the Conservative Right!

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And that, sir, is all I require from you. ~;)

Tachi'


:idea2:
I just realized you're a Freudian thinker...


"America is a mistake, a giant mistake."
--- Sigmund Freud



Please remember that Freud's ideas have been largely superseded.
~:joker: ~:joker:

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Originally Posted by Romulas

It sounds like the truth. Greeting and Salutations from the Conservative Right!

Hillary Clinton will not and should not be president of the United States of America because she has absolutely "NO" qualifications for the job. Lawyer, First Lady, and (by riding Pres Clinton coat tails) a Senator from New York. (Not her home State) Up to this point the only important decision she has had to make is what side of the hill to leave Vince Foster's body.

And that is who the Dems want to put in office!

There will be women who are qualified and should be elected. And one day that will happen. Until that happens we will still put our views from the left and right head to head, and give every American the right to vote for the person the wish to represent them.

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So, in the 230-year history of the US there have been qualified women? :inquisitive:

Many past male presidents had no more qualifications than a military record or they served as a senator.

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Originally Posted by Devastatin Dave

Tachi, by what means should the world "resist" the American "Empire"? Just curious to what extent you think resistance should be applied.

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I'm not referring to the American empire with my statement; I'm referring to corporate oligarchy, the effective rule by the corporate elite. We have put the true political power of the US into the hands of private industry. This is also largely true of Japan.

The rest of the world should not allow the rampant escalation of corporate power to the obscene degree it has here.

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Originally Posted by Idaho

Septic tank = yank = american. It's rhyming slang DC!

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Yes. It is used in many countries as rhyming slang for american.