:laugh4: I can just see armies of Hoplites invading Turkey
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:laugh4: I can just see armies of Hoplites invading Turkey
Why we attack, the situation of both armed forces, the backings of different nations, civilian opinion etcQuote:
Originally Posted by Bar Kochba
YesQuote:
Originally Posted by Bar Kochba
:beam:
Turkey has one of the largest army in the world, but a large army can easily be defeated by an experienced force the the mountains :2thumbsup:
im sure some of our turkish friends here wont be to happy about your plans for glory and empire :2thumbsup:
Well thats what you get from nationalists :beam:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bar Kochba
It would be like me saying Israel should invade Jordon and some other sourounding countries becuase they were once part of Solomons empire
If they were that nationalist, sure :beam:
Well the settlers are. lol. Just the lefties in goverment arnt perticularly
Bah, leftiesQuote:
Originally Posted by Bar Kochba
are there alot of nationlist greeks out there?
Of course. It's our main export :laugh4:
LOL anyway weve gone off the subject completely.... Now Britian is going to have Thousands of bulgairians and romanaians coming here to work aswell as our hundred of thousnads of polish people. Fun
The EU has expanded too quickly its now bloated with far too many countires that cannot contribute forcing the larger members to foot their bill... god help us if we let Turkey in too...
Long live Europe eh?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bar Kochba
:laugh4:
everyone in Eurpoe wants a piece of the pound.. there are some places in London where it is just polish community they got shops and they all drink loads.. crazy
edyzmedieval made a post enquiring about the role of the EU.
I would appreciate if we moved away from the unhelpful nationalist sabre-rattling and got back to the thread topic.
Thank you kindly.
:bow:
Two pages of :furious3: complete off-topic nonsense! Great way to mess around when moderators aren't looking :thumbsdown: .
About Israël as a possible member for the EU. This was a [sarcasm\] brilliant idea [\sarcasm] from Blair in order to lessen the problems in the Middle East. It's just laughable when you consider it. It won't change much about Israëls policy (even if it wants to be part of the EU which I doubt) and furthermore it will destroy the small leverage we have in that area.
About Turkey joining the EU. It won't happen in the first 10 years if it ever will happen. Turkey isn't adopting fast enough and on certain matters not at all. If a country doesn't acknowledge a country that is part of the EU and is even boycotting it, that country doesn't deserve to join. If it was up to me I would freeze the negotiations for at least 5 years just to get the message across but then again I'm no diplomat.
About the new EU members. There is a negative atmosphere around the EU for quite some time, certainly in the UK (Thatchers "I want my money back"). The feelings towards the euro can be used as an example: Price augmentations are being blamed on the euro although research have proven the difference.
I, however, have to admit that the EU has grown to fast.
Politically, the old system based on 12 members can't manage the number of member states we have today effectively.
Economically, it will take a while before most new members are up to speed with the rest while they will need a lot of help that now is used elsewhere.
And don't forget problems with corruption, new alliances in the EU itself, ...
The EU will remain problematic for a number of years or even decades if this expansion continues without the EU orginasation following it.
Though I don't mean to say anything against the citizens of the two countries in question, I can't help but think that the decision to accept them into the EU was motivated more by strategic reasons than any other. Certainly both, and all other new members, will benefit greatly from joining the EU, that is unquestionable.
Both countries are fairly rich in resources, and Romania still has oil reserves (even though they are lessening) and a fairly large amount of population to serve as a workforce.
There is an interesting pattern to the expansion of the EU and the expansion has a special accent on the former Soviet block of countries ... the Baltic countries, Poland, Hungary, now Romania and Bulgaria ... even aiming at Turkey. Who wants to bet that the EU will be aiming at Ukraine and Belorussia next? And after Turkey eventually gets in ... who wants to bet that Georgia, Armenia and others will be aimed at?
Now, it seems to me that the EU is slowly developing something of a ... rivalry with Russia, especially with Russia holding so much oil and gas that Europe likes and, as things stand, with the situation in Russia actually improving, it seems that the EU is interested in expanding it's zone of interest, while lessening the Russian one, and fast.
Not that it matters and not that there'll be a war or anything, but it just seems to me that the EU is pushing in on the Russian sphere of influence, and quite successfully it seems, too.
Or perhaps that the EU is simply incorporating whoever wants to be included. Morocco has asked to join, but entering Africa would lead to difficulties with land borders, so why not let the Mediterranean be a natural southern border? West is the Atlantic, and north is the Arctic - no expansion is possible there. So, under pressure to expand, not least from the countries asking for inclusion, we've gone steadily in the only direction possible - eastwards. IIRC even Russia had discussed the possibility of being included at some point, before its recent re-infusion of pride under Putin - there may well be an equal partnership or entente at some point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Keba
The EU is an organization that forces you to pay taxes so rich elite politicians can toast in Champagne on a cruise to the Pacific where they discuss how to solve poverty, the length of bananas, and other important things.Quote:
Originally Posted by edyzmedieval
Also be aware that it is now officially illegal to toss dwarves. That is a directive (or regulation) that the commission has forced on its members... bah!
About Romania and Bulgaria: there are too many new members who are too underdeveloped and have joined too soon.
Nonetheless: welcome and here's to a fruitful partnership. ~:cheers:
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Well so much for your favourite pasttime then, hey?Quote:
Originally Posted by Sjakihata
No, wait. Being a sensible and intelligent poster you probably have never tossed a dwarf and are quite repulsed by the idea. Really, I don't see the problem, Sjakihata.
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This is so not a relevant description of the expansion. Or shall I just be frank and call it conspiracist rubbish? There is no secret masterplan to sneakily encroach on anybodies sphere of influence. That's the Russian/Tsarist/Communist/Putinist way of seeing the world.Quote:
Originally Posted by Keba
The EU isn't 'aiming' at countries it would like to pry away from Russia. There has on the contrary always been a quite open invitation to all European countries to join according to their own free, democratic will. Pannonian already pointed out the apparantly not so devastatingly obvious: to the west, south and north there is only sea. By 1989, the whole of democratic Europe was a member of the EU, with the exception of neutral Switzerland andKuwaitNorway. Which means only countries from the east were eligable for membership after 1989. [Pedantry]: after 1986 to be precise, as that was when the last west European countries joined[/pedantry]
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More than anything else I wish we'd make up our mind about Turkey. Either we want them in or not. These 'negotiations' have been dragging on for over forty years now. Mostly it's just staling for time because nobody has the guts to either allow Turkey in or give it a clear no.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peasant Phill
I dont' want them in. I want a decent set of treaties installed for an equal partnership, with close economic and military ties. If the majority do want them in, then fine too. But then present Turkey with a clear and definitive list of standards, with a clear prospect of membership after meeting them.
But for God's sake stop with these endless bogus negotiations that only serve to avoid any decision, and which - completely justifiably - exasparates and antagonises Turkey.
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In Greece? Nah. No more than - oh, let's say - some ten million.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bar Kochba
The EU in it's current state is doomed to fail. The simple fact that there is this debate about new members and it's become so heated is proof enough why. Yall are English, French, Dutch, Spanish, Italian, German, Polish, Romanian, and not European's.
Good luck to the new countries on their venture.
Can the EU effectively enforce its policies on a military level? I doubt it.
And Greece would totally pwn turkey. Their horse-archers arent that great now with the invention of long range guns.
:laugh4:Quote:
Originally Posted by holybandit
Janissaries watch out!
~:( Aww, but I love my little conspiracy theories ... they're so entertaining, especially when people believe them, which appears not to be the case here, unfortunately.:laugh4:Quote:
Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat
Besides, I am a communist, raised in a country that was communist and a Slav at that (at least partially).
What an odd statement, most of my generation (currently going to various universities) do, in fact, consider themselves European, with only a minor accent on national identities (in the form of cultural uniqueness).Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTex
Oddly enough, I am the only one amongst them who actually has reason to consider himself European first (since the only country, if one counts ancestry, I could list for being my nationality is now gone a good 90 years).
I guess you should give it time, in a generation or two, I suspect things will be quite different. If someone fixes the horrible mess the EU is currently, that is.
Why should hey have to?Quote:
Originally Posted by holybandit
The EU doesn't even have an army. It doesn't need to as the EU isn't a new country but a highly developed economical, political and social alliance between independent member states.
EU needs to die. Only costs money and slows down already painfully slow decisionmaking, and it sticks it's nose where it doesn't belong. And they just don't get a hint, we said NO to your consitution so LISTEN instead of trying to covertly implement it anyway. The majority of us DON'T want Turkey in the EU, so LISTEN instead of throwing them on our laps.
Accepts Louis' wisdom and excludes Sweden, Finland and Austria as democratic nations and that they belong to western Europe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat
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