12th playable faction

By interest it would be Iroquois, then Persians, then Mughal. All others are probably very similar to some existing faction, except perhaps the Crimean Khanate, but the Persians would be similar enough.

However I assume "playable" means playable at the beginning, and all factions can be unlocked once you beat them. So I chose Mughal. For this reason: the Iroquois can be easily unlocked by playing as Americans, or British or French. The Persians can be easily unlocked by playing Russia or perhaps Uthman/Osman Empire. The Mughal are the only very far away one, and it would be more convenient that way, else you'd have to unlock it by fighting till the ends of "the world".

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Originally Posted by ThePianist

By interest it would be Iroquois, then Persians, then Mughal. All others are probably very similar to some existing faction, except perhaps the Crimean Khanate, but the Persians would be similar enough.

However I assume "playable" means playable at the beginning, and all factions can be unlocked once you beat them. So I chose Mughal. For this reason: the Iroquois can be easily unlocked by playing as Americans, or British or French. The Persians can be easily unlocked by playing Russia or perhaps Uthman/Osman Empire. The Mughal are the only very far away one, and it would be more convenient that way, else you'd have to unlock it by fighting till the ends of "the world".

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Factions are not unlocked by beating them. There are 12 playable factions, all of whom you will be able to use from the start. No more factions are playable, the only way to unlock them will be mods.

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Originally Posted by retep219

Has anyone heard what they mean by "unplayable?" In Rome Total War, you could play any "unplayable" faction by modding descr-strat, but they were, in general, far less developed than any other faction (Harder campaign, more cloned units, and less units overall) Will it be the same in Empire? Or will the "unplayable" factions be truly unplayable?

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Same as RTW.

Well in theory we should find out the 11th faction today, I assume it's going to be Marthas and no one will be all that suprised lol.

We will see, not sure what time they usually release the info. I'd assume in about 8 hours or so, but I could be wrong.

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Originally Posted by Polemists

Well in theory we should find out the 11th faction today, I assume it's going to be Marthas and no one will be all that suprised lol.

We will see, not sure what time they usually release the info. I'd assume in about 8 hours or so, but I could be wrong.

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If you go to the Factions page on the main site you can see that Austria's name and link has now moved to the left of the three columns rather than being in the centre like it was previously. That seems to be a good indication that thr site is abou tto be updated with a new faction. :2thumbsup:

Well it's noon now, hopefully either nowish or at 1 they will announce it.

I am hopeful it will be one, as they need a hour to prepare the awesome demo announcement :)

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Originally Posted by Sir Beane

If you go to the Factions page on the main site you can see that Austria's name and link has now moved to the left of the three columns rather than being in the centre like it was previously. That seems to be a good indication that thr site is abou tto be updated with a new faction. :2thumbsup:

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It was already moved few days ago

I am already pessimistic. I believe it will not be Portugal although I voted for it. The cutting of South America just reveals how "British Empire: Total War" this game is. How could anyone cut a continent of such an importance in the Imperial International arena? Portugal went to get most of its income throughout the period of Brazil's gold mines, and its inclusion would be an interesting possibility to start with a weak country and turn it into a potentially Great Power. Since Brazil and Africa is not in, the large Portuguese Empire which Portugal maintained is cut to Goa. *pfft*

Pessimistic? *shrugs shoulders* The History is written by the winners.

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Originally Posted by Lucidus

Pessimistic? *shrugs shoulders* The History is written by the winners.

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I love it :2thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by Lucidus

Pessimistic? *shrugs shoulders* The History is written by the winners.

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That's why we all learn the Vietnamese War and its worldwide political implications through Vietnamese official history.

Portugal would be a clone of Spain, not to mention the extra language MP3's. So I doubt it'll be Portugal, and I hope it isn't. The Iroquois would be really interesting, but I wonder who still know a word of Iroquois. So probably Denmark-Norway, for the ease of historical research. Then maybe Safavids or the Mughals.

Still no mention of the 11th faction, let alone the 12th.

Guess CA is late again, only two weeks until we get the entire game, think they could release factions on time at very least.

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Originally Posted by ThePianist

Portugal would be a clone of Spain, not to mention the extra language MP3's. So I doubt it'll be Portugal, and I hope it isn't. The Iroquois would be really interesting, but I wonder who still know a word of Iroquois. So probably Denmark-Norway, for the ease of historical research. Then maybe Safavids or the Mughals.

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In AOE3 Iroquois talked in their REAL language, so no problems would be to do the same with ETW.

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Originally Posted by Polemists

Still no mention of the 11th faction, let alone the 12th.

Guess CA is late again, only two weeks until we get the entire game, think they could release factions on time at very least.

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The 11th Faction is Mughals or Marathas. (CA stated only one of them is playable, it was PM to one member of Yuku)

Pm is a pm, to me it's not confirmed until I see a flag, and a two paragraph of historical text :P

Now you know and one to go!

Marathas

Despite all the arguments I think next tuesday will come down to Portugal or 13 Colonies.

I know 13 colonies should not be a playable faction, I've heard the arguments, but not sure if CA is going to define them that way or not.

Next tuesday we find out, then the following tuesday it's game time :)

Now where did I read that the 12th could possibly the 13 colonies once the RtI has been played through?

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Originally Posted by Polemists

Despite all the arguments I think next tuesday will come down to Portugal or 13 Colonies.

I know 13 colonies should not be a playable faction, I've heard the arguments, but not sure if CA is going to define them that way or not.

Next tuesday we find out, then the following tuesday it's game time :)

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They have said (In the same PM message) the 12th faction is in North America.

Well I don't see it being the iriquois so i guess 13 colonies it is.

Unless it's something ultra-amazing like zombie pirates

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Originally Posted by ThePianist

Portugal would be a clone of Spain, not to mention the extra language MP3's. So I doubt it'll be Portugal, and I hope it isn't. The Iroquois would be really interesting, but I wonder who still know a word of Iroquois. So probably Denmark-Norway, for the ease of historical research. Then maybe Safavids or the Mughals.

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Well considering the absence of Africa, most of Asia and South America(which is odd considering the scope of the game), theres really not much interest in making Portugal playable.
Otherwise it should be present for obvious reasons.

Dont know where you got that "clone" idea, its incorrect to say the least.

And yes i agree with the Iroquois, I would gladly play them. And as far as i know theres still a reasonable number of Iroquois speakers.

V.

Damn... If it's really the Thirteen Colonies, I'll feel disappointed. I mean, I can see how it makes sense from a marketing standpoint, and the USA could make for an interesting campaign... But I don't intend to play it myself. It's just a personal prefference, really, but I would've much rather had another middle-eastern empire in the final slot, either the Mughals or Sefevids. That'd make for three non-European main factions in total, not that much since there are three times as many European factions. Europeans are the main point of this game, yeah, but it'd be nice to have more different flavoured campaigns than just the Ottomans (big surprise...) and the Marathas (which are somewhat a surprise, as I definately wasn't thinking about them the first time I heard of ETW; their campaign is probably going to be a blast, slugging it out against the Mughal behemoth... reminds me of Hayasdan/Pontos in EB :skull: ).

I still have a small sparkle of hope that instead CA will go for something else as the final official factions. The Thirteen Colonies got their own campaign; shoving someone else onto the spotlight would be nice, be it Portugal, Mughals, or the odd Crimean Khanate. Hell, I'd play the Iroquois and be glad they're playable - now that'd be different flavor.

The 12th faction is almost certainly the US or Portugal. The Iroquois just wouldn't make sense. How can you build an overseas Empire when your biggest ship is a canoe? And if they correct that by giving them SOL's won't it be a little odd seeing a First Rater crewed by Native American Warriors? It's bad enough that the Maratha liely won't have very unique ships.

Either they have an extremely historically innacurate Iroquois faction, or an extremely unbalanced one. I'd rather not see either as the 12th faction. At least the US or Portugal could conciveably compete with the other 11 playable factions.

Just my two cents.

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Originally Posted by Polemists

Pm is a pm, to me it's not confirmed until I see a flag, and a two paragraph of historical text :P

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linderasses PM him for the pic.

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Originally Posted by Lusitani

Well considering the absence of Africa, most of Asia and South America(which is odd considering the scope of the game), theres really not much interest in making Portugal playable.

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Indeed. "Because Portugal is not a world power at the moment, historians feel free to give it scant attention. It is a case of history belonging to the victors.The greatest obstacle to gaining a true understanding of the past is our human tendency to read the present into it", says Norman Fiering, founder of the Forum on European Expansion and Global Interaction.

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That's why we all learn the Vietnamese War and its worldwide political implications through Vietnamese official history

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Well, the 12th century faction is almost certainly the US. Which is (historical) odd. I will say it again, history will always be written by the winners.

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Portugal ,... a clone of Spain

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According to Russel-Wood (Johns Hopkins University), "such statements testify to the ignorance concerning the Portuguese Empire"

People seem to be assuming Portugal will be a clone of Spain because they are geographically close. Which is a really silly way of judging a faction. Prussia is next to Poland-Lithuania, yet no one has claimed they will be identical.

At this point in history there was very little to differentiate world powers. Most factions will have near identical unit rosters, as they did at the time. Portugal will be as similar to Spain as Spain will be to France, or Britain will be to Prussia. Very similar units with different uniforms, maybe different stats and one or two special units for flavor.

The only way to truly differentiate factions would be to start making things up. And we know where that leads (flaming pigs and Roman ninja).

People suggest Portugal shouldn't be in because they were on the decline. But the US didn't even exist. I know who I'd pick to be more likely to win in a fight :tongue:.

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Originally Posted by Sir Beane

People seem to be assuming Portugal will be a clone of Spain because they are geographically close. Which is a really silly way of judging a faction. Prussia is next to Poland-Lithuania, yet no one has claimed they will be identical.

At this point in history there was very little to differentiate world powers. Most factions will have near identical unit rosters, as they did at the time. Portugal will be as similar to Spain as Spain will be to France, or Britain will be to Prussia. Very similar units with different uniforms, maybe different stats and one or two special units for flavor.

The only way to truly differentiate factions would be to start making things up. And we know where that leads (flaming pigs and Roman ninja).

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Absolutely.

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People suggest Portugal shouldn't be in because they were on the decline

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Not exactly...not at all.

Session abstract, next August 4, XVth World Economic Historic Congress, 2009:

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The Iberian Transatlantic Commercial World in an era of Reform and War, 1750-1821

Over the course of the eighteenth century, Spanish and Portuguese colonial commerce expanded rapidly with far reaching effects on the region's economies and societies. In the second half of the century, agents of the Spanish and Portuguese Crowns introduced political and economic reforms designed to "modernize" their commercial systems. The Bourbon and Pombaline reforms attacked vested interests, dismantled long-standing institutions, and lifted barriers to trade, all with the goal of boosting Crown revenues, expanding imperial commerce, and reducing territorial and economic encroachments by foreign powers. The resulting "golden era" was abruptly interrupted by the outbreak of the Wars of the French Revolution and Napoleon and ultimately paved the way for independence of most of the Latin American colonies. This panel explores and assesses the wide ranging social, political and economic economic effects of trade expansion, commercial reform and international war on the Iberian transatlantic world of the late eighteenth century.

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I highly recommend this book:
http://press.princeton.edu/titles/8285.html
"Sovereign and Revolution in the Iberian Atlantic", Jeremy Adelman; it shows how the Portuguese and Spanish empires responded to the pressure of rival states and merchant capitalism in the 18th century.

The gamestop review led me to believe America would be the 12th faction in the campaign.

Well I do not really mind what it is. Even in the G4 interview he stated what has been true since the dawn. We will like always make every existing faction from game playable. It has always been 1 .pdf file and CA usually even wrote Faction Descriptions for them. Since CA commented on this I am sure they have not changed it. As for Emerging actions well leave that to modders and give them a little more time

Yes, I mean if anyone is in decline, it's Spain...that's what I find ironic. I mean spain is a major player of this era so you can't not include them but I think Portugal has a easier time coming out of the 18th century then Spain, who has debts, lands they can't keep, and no loans to buisness owners :P

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Originally Posted by Sir Beane

People seem to be assuming Portugal will be a clone of Spain because they are geographically close. Which is a really silly way of judging a faction. Prussia is next to Poland-Lithuania, yet no one has claimed they will be identical.

At this point in history there was very little to differentiate world powers. Most factions will have near identical unit rosters, as they did at the time. Portugal will be as similar to Spain as Spain will be to France, or Britain will be to Prussia. Very similar units with different uniforms, maybe different stats and one or two special units for flavor.

The only way to truly differentiate factions would be to start making things up. And we know where that leads (flaming pigs and Roman ninja).

People suggest Portugal shouldn't be in because they were on the decline. But the US didn't even exist. I know who I'd pick to be more likely to win in a fight :tongue:.

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Indeed. If anything it is the Thirteen Colonies which are a clone of the UK. They speak the same language, use the same currency, share the same culture; Things which do not happen in two countries which had been apart (by then) for 600 years.

Hmmm....so I think theyre done announcing factions (after Marathas). And of course, its been said that Portugal is definately not on that list. Im very disapointed. I mean, Portugal wasnt even included in MTW, in MTWII they were just added as an extra Kingdom to steamroll (Spanish accents, and Conquistadores??!!). Now it seems Portugal is being swept under the rug again...just another nation to steamroll, again. Im actually a bit offended. I know I shouldnt take it personally, but you know....

I voted for the Persian Empire and then got to thinking about conducting guerilla warfare with a native american faction and changed my mind.

That's just too cool to pass up.

I see some of the objections to this, but I think the solution would be giving that faction unique victory conditions. Yes Beane, I'm looking at you lol. You're right, it would be ridiculous to see SOL's full of Native Americans.

Well clearly there is no 12th faction, (Unless you consider the 13 colonies)

A native american faction would be interesting, but will have to be a mod it looks like.

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Originally Posted by Polemists

Well clearly there is no 12th faction, (Unless you consider the 13 colonies)

A native american faction would be interesting, but will have to be a mod it looks like.

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Check out the screenshots here http://uk.media.pc.ign.com/media/958/958390/imgs_1.html. Under the 'Major Nations' tab in the Diplomacy menu screenshot it lists the 11 factions we know so far plus the Mughal Empire. Which is interesting.

Not quite what you meant to show!

Try this one instead.


http://uk.pc.ign.com/dor/objects/958...page=mediaFull

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. Im actually a bit offended. I know I shouldnt take it personally, but you know....

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Well, Portugal was a Minor nation during the 18th century, and Poland-Lithuania and the Mughals Major empires.:dizzy2:

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Originally Posted by Lucidus

Well, Portugal was a Minor nation during the 18th century, and Poland-Lithuania and the Mughals Major empires.:dizzy2:

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Portugal were much, much less minor than the US though. In fact at the start of the game they have one of largest overseas Empires and were quite powerful.

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Originally Posted by Sir Beane

Portugal ... In fact at the start of the game they have one of largest overseas Empires and were quite powerful.

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Actually, the second largest overseas empire, at the start of the game (1700)
(I was being ironic)
Sincerely, I don´t get it. :wall:

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Originally Posted by Lucidus

Actually, the second largest overseas empire, at the start of the game (1700)
(I was being ironic)
Sincerely, I don´t get it. :wall:

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Oh right, my bad. There are so many people who think Portugal was a minor nation I've got used to defending them :laugh4:.

[QUOTE=Sir Beane;2151142]There are so many people who think Portugal was a minor nationQUOTE]

CA for instance. Portugal is in the list of the minor nations.

I noticed in one of the campaign map screenies, you see the diplomacy scroll, and its split into major and minor nations. There's 12 nations listed as 'major', besically all the one's we know to be included, however the US is not there, but both the Mughals and Marathas are. I think these must therefore be the 12 playable factions for the main campaign.

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

I noticed in one of the campaign map screenies, you see the diplomacy scroll, and its split into major and minor nations. There's 12 nations listed as 'major', besically all the one's we know to be included, however the US is not there, but both the Mughals and Marathas are. I think these must therefore be the 12 playable factions for the main campaign.

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That would make sense if it weren't for the fact that CA stated that only one Indian faction is playable, and we know that that is the Maratha. Theres also the fact that the US seem to be the 12th. It's really quite a mystery.

Perhaps they arn't counting the Mughals as Indian, after all the Mughals themselves weren't, plus are they not listed as playable in the demo files?

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Originally Posted by KozaK13

Perhaps they arn't counting the Mughals as Indian, after all the Mughals themselves weren't, plus are they not listed as playable in the demo files?

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Maybe they are then, it would be nice if they were I guess. It's all very vonfusing really, with a lot of contrdictory info. But in a week it shall all be clear :2thumbsup:.