Good point. Never thought of using Berserkers that way, though. I much preferred packing the streets from kerb to kerb with axemen.
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Good point. Never thought of using Berserkers that way, though. I much preferred packing the streets from kerb to kerb with axemen.
What about spear warbands, they are perfect for street fighting provided you don't move too much and have the phalanx roughly the width of the street. Packing units inside each other for maximum exploit effect.
If you add some chosen archers behind them it tastes even better ~DQuote:
Originally Posted by katank
Problem is, you have to get them through the gates first. I had the ill luck of having my spear warbands engage an enemy in their front contesting the breach, while two units pop out from nowhere and slam into their flanks, with a general's bodyguard completing the rout. I sent my cavalry in too late, and lost one barb cav as well to the white flag. Spear warbands are better than hoplites/pikemen in that they have no secondary weapon, so they don't drop spears and spread out to swordfight, but nevertheless they are extremely troublesome to wield as a unit in the streets. Only until the town square do they do nasty things to the garrison.
That's depending on the type of siege. I frankly find the open nature of barbarian towns far more suitable for spear warbands.
I simply see neat rows of enemy dead when assaulting a barbarian settlement where they tried to make a stand and were mercilessly cut down by spears.
For civilized settlements, I typically have a barbarian swarm tactic where I have spear warbands with phalanx turned off mixed in with axemen simply swarming through the gates. The spearwarbands then try to engage phalanx when they start tangling with the enemy.
Also, don't forget that spears clip through walls, thus while fighting at the gates, some spear warbands might be able to "flank" the enemy while out side the town.
Once you get clear of the gates, then form a nice phalanx and let the killing machine rip.
eee, i hate the spears poking through walls trick. It's so cheaty :-P I feel guilty taking advantage of an AI bug.
Be aggressive. Do not sit in your forest and wait. Your easiest money makers are west and northwest. This will knock out two thorns in your side and provide the resources to complete the short campaign.
True. Those are the easiest. however, the biggest are south. Make a beeline towards Rome is almost must have for any imperial campaign.
PreMarian troops cannot stand a wall of spearwarbands backed by screechers with flanking barb cav and extra size war puppies.
and if you do it right, there won't be a post-Marian army. Never used dogs myself, though, except when then AI gives it to me, then I'm like, 'but, but I never asked for it!' I do well enough with 10 warbands and four-five units of cavalry of any sort. I'd be a REALLY happy general if someone threw in two units of chosens archers into the bargain. On defensive battles this composition is sure to win you a whole bunch of heroic victories, and even on attack it probably will as well, if you play it on a defensive slant. Otherwise, replace 2 warbands with 2 axemen/night raiders and you've got your warwinning army. Perfect for a Mao army-cheap, spammed and human-waved.
So, I have decided to take Germans for this time.
If you wanna talk cheesy, then 25% extra than normal warhound units are surely your ticket.
I built them out of a +3xp temple and a single unit can hold 4 warbands on their own.
Germania has one of the sweetest setups. Their town level combo is already very nice. A solid wall of giant phalanx units with screechers to demoralize and flank.
Later, throw in puppies for disruption, axemen to guard flanks and barb cav to provide shock.
Even later, you get night raiders to add to the fear element and just are all round nice melee troops, also fast for flanking. Chosen axesmen are armor piercing and good flankers. Berserks are again good flankers. Gothic cav are simply line crashers.
Hahaha, I was just posting on another thread about deciding to play Germans as well. Guess we'll be seeing each other again, no? I'm only 5 provinces away from the end of my Greek campaign...Quote:
Originally Posted by IliaDN
So I started campaign with sending troops to Alesia , Samarobriva , rebel town near the capital , Campus Gothi.
So there are 4 main streams in my campaign.
1. After Alesia was mine I began slow expansion on Gaul's lands;
2. After conquering brit coastal town I took defensive position there eridicating all brit troops that came there;
3. After capturing rebel town near capital I sent troops on my western front;
4. After capturing Campus Gothi I moved to " Home , sweet home " and acquired it as well.
Then I moved one of my armies to gaulish towns near Italy and was attacked by Julii , so I captured those two towns and moved to Julii capital there I had grand battle with the Senate and Julii and was victorious.
You are really fast. How hard do you play?
VH/M , huge.
Now it is about 258 B.C.
Nice... I went into debt almost instantly, I abandoned all my home provinces. My starter units are now concentrated into two armies moving south into Italy. One will go conquer northern Italy, the other will take Iuvavum, Patavium and the south before moving into Sicily. I'm slower than Ilia, but things are about to get a lot faster (and a lot more profitable). It is now 267 BC and I have my starter provinces in addition to Mediolanum and Iuvavum. Patavium and Segesta follow in the next two turns.
Into debt immediately? It's quite possible to avoid that.
Go for Alesia ASAP and I believe you can siege it on turn 2 (build roads to make it marginally faster, you need the very last couple of movement points). They will sally and get trashed. You will have it during the AI's turn. You can exterminate it for cash. Alesia army goes for southern sweep and sacks Lugundum, Massila and then Narbo Martius.
Leave all your towns empty on the first turn and queue temples and peasants.
After that, build traders whenever you can and have taxes on very high.
I expanded into Denmark with my faction leader's army and then went south.
Easternmost army went towards Northern Italy and sacked rebel towns along the way. Everything else went south.
I marched into Rome in 263 BC. Glorious days of Germania.
I personally did not war upon the Brits until they stabbed me in Alesia with a siege. A relief force was sent led by a lucky adoption candidate with 5 stars and only 18! ~:eek: He was a promising general who with help of spearband, puppies, and screechers became a great hero and the conqueror of Brittania.
Ah, I accumulated units into two armies and went south into Italy immediately. In debt from Turns 3 to 9, but after capturing Mediolanum it was all good. It is now turn 263 winter and I'm slightly slower than you (you're the master of katanking, after all :P), but I'm at most 2 turns away from marching into Rome. Could've been faster if not for the fact that I didn't have enough money to build roads in the Alpine provinces... I know the Brits were going to attack me anyway, so I decided to surrender my settlements to them if they attacked. I don't war the Brits until I cripple the Gauls. Meanwhile, I'm concentrating all efforts on a speedy conquest of Italy. Cities are falling about one every one to two turns.
After I read about all your insanely effetive expansions, I decided to try some blitz krieg myself.
The year 261 BC. I own 14 provinces, with Luvavum to join my migthy empire the next turn.
The Gauls are so weakened that I can just march into their lands without resistance, and that have never happened to me before, this is kinda freaky :freak:
Maybe all of my next campiagns will be blitz krieg campiagns. `cause this campaign have made RTW alot more funny.
But you guys never said anything about how many provinces you got, maybe I`m not that bad after all?
Meh. I think my province count was something like 18 by 263. Blitzing was a strat that I found back in the days of MTW.
People used to complain that the MTW Turks were the hardest faction in early. I showed a blitz strat that would more than triple the treasury on the second turn (on expert mode, comparable to VH in RTW).
I did blitzing ever since. I've frankly found every faction to be fairly easy as it's quite possible to double or even triple your empire in the first 5-7 turns. The AI just cannot deal with blitzing.
Also, due to how little it is into the game, you can plan for exactly how many units you will come up against as starting armies are fixed.
The strat is a bit too effectively however. It really takes the challenge out of games.
100th reply to the german thread ~:cheers:
Anyways, I don't like the whole idea of giving up your homelands to other tribes.
What I did was I took Sambrovia as soon as I could. This kept the Brits at bay. I allied with the Romans in exchange for me attacking the gauls. I took their capital first. They allied with each other in a pathetic attepmt to save themselves. I had decided that I would wait to take out Rome until they were strong.
In the east, I went as far as Domus Dulcis Domus before setting up forts to keep the Scythians out. I sent a diplomat to get an alliance to free up my eastern front when I found that they were in an alliance with britian and gaul. I was considering attacking them when I realized how much like WWII this was like. The Gauls(French), Scythians (Russians) and Brits (Brits) were allied together but I was still at peace with Scythia. I was allied with the Italians. Hmm...
I was determined that my empire would end like the it did in WWII. I immediately invaded Britian with 2 armies and took London first turn with the help of my spies. I quickly took the rest of England when I realized they weren't dead. They had taken Tara. I had never, ever seen the AI take Tara before. I took the city and the Brits were dead. I got a ceasefire from Gaul and allied with the Scythians. With the British out of the picture, I have moved my armies back to the mainland. My next move is to take an army down into Dracia, break my alliance, and take their 3 towns in northern Greece. From there, I will wait until the Romans are strong enough to think they can beat me and attack. I will not start the war, but I will finish it. When they attack, my armies in the old Dracian provinces will attack the Brutii in Greece. My main attack force will come from the north where I am now producing Chosen Axemen and Gothic Cavalry with 3 xp. I will drive down, wipe out the Julii and plunder the Roman capitals before taking the Scipii towns on the Mediteranian Islands starting with Sicily. I will let them keep their African province if they ever get them to begin with. The Cartaginians just defeated a stack and a half of Scipii beseiging Lilybaeum. The Julii haven't gotten past Patavium, and they lost at Mediolanium. However, their full stack army is coming to finish that job now. The Brutii are doing about as I expected. They have Apollonia, Salona, and Segstica and are besieging Thermon. They are allied with Macedon who has the rest of Southern Greece.
A few things about the Germans:
Like it was said before, population growth is painfully slow. That make's it very difficult to get some boats to hop the channel into england. I had 2 full stack armies waiting around for a port to be built.
Economical, the germans aren't too great, but they more than make up for it with their superior military. You can go and take all of the towns around you without much struggle. Once you get your cities developed a bit, you get Chosen Axemen which can cut up the Roman Legions fairly easily. Also you get Gothic Cavalry which is most likely the best cavalry that you will encounter in your game unless you go to the far east. Berserkers are also nice shock troops, though they just don't have the numbers that you need to effectively fight the Romans.
Strategy Against the Romans:
I have found that if you have an army of mostly spear warbands, 4 or so groups of Chosen Axemen, around 4 Gothic Cavalry, and around 4 Chosen Archer Warbands, you can beat just about any roman army. In most cases, let them come to you. Have your spear line with Chosen axemen on the flanks and the Cavalry all together on one side. Have your archers behind your line with flaming arrows on. It is quite obvious what to do now. Have your spearmen engage when the enemy gets close with your Axemen cutting them down on the flanks. Have your archers focus their fire on A) any missile troops the enemy has B) if they don't have any, concentrate fire on the center of their line. Your cavalry must run to the rear of the enemy, and take out the enemy archers before they can destroy your Axemen. After the archers are dealt with, have them smash through the very center of Roman line. This lets your axemen kill more and more importantly lets your cavalry mash the enemy against a literal wall of sharp, pointy sticks. It is Alexander the Great's "Hammer and Anvil" Strategy adapted for use by the barbarians. The enemy line will soon rout and your main line will be saved. The whole line of the enemy will soon collapse, letting your Gothic Cavalry chase down the routing soldiers. Works like a charm.
bubbanator,
very good job and excellent report. Glad you were not one of Hitler's generals ~:)
Let's not lie the germens suck. They get attacked by everybody. Dacia, britannia, romans (later), and the gauls. They also get no money coming in. So you got to be good with money and have some bad ass generals( with tons of luck). I'll finish this post later.......
They most certainly don't suck. They have an excelent military. Have you actualy played as the Germans? Because Dracia will gladly accept an alliance and will almost never attack you because they are being smashed between Macedon, Thrace, and the Brutii.Quote:
Originally Posted by roman god's
And besides that, you armies can crush Dracia, Britannia, and the Gauls easily. The Romans are more difficult and you need to wait 'till you tech tree is in full bloom before you can beat the combined Roman forces.
The economy is slow at the begining but it is fueled by your rapid expansionism. Once your economy gets rolling, it dosen't stop either.
well mostly thats true but you have a kick @$$ army that can easily overun gaul and britannia
then you can turn your attention to rome and wipe their faces all over italy
then take out dacia, they arnt that strong, spain, they arnt that strong either, and then maybe carthage or greece
by this time youll have boatloads of cash to take on anyone left, maybe egypt or greek cities/macedon assuming you finished off the brutii
what about MP?
i've found that chosen axemen and gothic cavalry are a punishing combo. as well as spears for that "anvil" effect. however, i haven't found much place for the "lesser" units
i find that most all light cavalry (except in huge 6 or more swarms) gets routed extremely easily. I've never really found the 'fear' bonus of night raiders to be all that helpful, and i've never tried to use screechers in mp.
I also find that because of their low armour, germans get wrecked on anything but forests (cut down by archers or swept by cav)
anyone have any interesting german mp techniques?
You want to talk to Wishazu for MP German tactics. He's good with them. But I've only seen him in a forest with the Germans.
I crippled the Gauls in Turn 2-3, actually... Sold my map info for them, they were willing to pay thousands for it. And considering they were spamming swordsmen and warbands, and they only start with 5000d, well... They were soon in such immense debt they were in no shape to resist my Germanic legions :-D But they shaped up after I slaughtered a few of their spammed armies, but it was too late... :-D
It's now 241bc and I own 40 provinces because I slowed down to take in the scenery... I have 7 armies, all over 14 units in strength, crawling over Europe, and an 8th under construction consisting purely of cavalry for the steppes. Fun. While someone *points upwards* preferred Hitler's empire, I initially aimed for Barbarossa's, then tried to figure out the logical paths to take from there. :-)
Pez,
great success!
Just started a new game with the Britannian. Why don't you join us? You find us in the Colloseum!
Can't join you, Franc, holidays and I've been barred off the internet cos I'm not in school... this is the rare occasion I came back to school... Will join you once the hols are over, yes? Another week or two! ^_^"
btw, I'm playing spain now... :-P
Well, for a change i diceded to keep the overpowered stuff (this means Spearabuse + Barb Cav madness) out of the game.
The game actually got challening:P
However, the fact that I actually got losses druning my battles significantly slowed down the expansion.
i haven't tried germania yet i did once and i got my but kicked but that was a while ago so i think im ready
Have anyone tried berserker + axemen combo + chosen archer warband combo? I smashed right through gaul and oblierated britan with two armies consisted nothing but axemen, berserker and archers, and of course, two 10-star generals. And when it is the julii's turn to suffer, I crushed their pathetic armies wave after wave, earning my about 10 famous battle sites down at Massila...
BTW I preferred axemen rather than chosen axemen because the later has too low of a defense regardless of their good attack and armour-piercing ability...
Here's how it works:
axemen=*
berserkers=^
archer=!
your kick-ass general+additional support calvaries=@
^ ****** ^
! ! ! !
@@
This works particularly good on the defensive. Set on flaming arrows. And when enemy troops come within 1o feet of your units, let out warcry! This will sure demorlizes them and boost up your units' attack, and flanking with berserkers+warcry, engaging with axemen+warcry and flaming rain of death by your chosen archer warbands will almost certainly cause an instant rout (98=99% of the time, everytime) and the rest is just mopping up the trash with your general and calvaries...
Oh and phalanxes only work well when you'er besieged...just place them as close to the walls as possible and they'll poke anything that comes near the wall...
Yep, phase through wall spears kinda make sieges too easy.
Spear warbands are just generally overpowered. When fully upgraded with temple of Woden and weaponsmith, they are a insanely good phalanx unit that can almost compete with highend pikemen in melee.
All of this for a fort level or city level if fully upgraded is a bit much.
Yes, they're fearsome. Even when the AI controls them. When I played Greeks and encountered them, the hoplites (not the armoured ones, though) had real difficulties in dealing with them, mainly because they are oversized. Oh, and did I mention that the AI had actually built a lvl 3 Woden shrine....those spearbands kick arse. especially in greater numbers which are easy to obtain even for the AI.
Germans are one of the strongest factions despite being Barbarians. The only perceptable challenge consists in playing on huge unit size: with all your crappy little settlements, it will take a while to level them up as long as you fight on all sides at once, even more so against opponents who don't have similar handicaps.
But if you do something like blitz into Italy while crippling Gaul at the same time right at the beginning, then there is no handicap.
Dare I say overpowered?
mmh you're right. they should've been made somewhat weaker or at least more vulnerable, as the HRE in MTW was. very nice faction, back then. ok, Romans never conquered a lot of Germany, but outside their lands the Germans were not really up to them, either.Quote:
Originally Posted by katank
Actually blitzing in general seems a bit overpowered.
Germania in blitzing gain the particular fast population necessary. By the time you hit Italy while blitzing, most places are already cities, thus giving you your best units in less than 10 years' time.
~D ~D ~D ~D ~D ~D ~DQuote:
Originally Posted by Deus ret.
Germania was never united. It was always a collection of tribes. But nevertheless - it were Germanians that destroit and conquered western Roman empire
:charge: :charge: :charge:
True, the widescale coordination of strikes makes the humans overpowered. Maybe we should make random AI mistakes like having armies wander aimlessly to simulate German disunity?
Well, in regards to Blitzing: its 14 turns into the game and my Thracians are siegeing Athens after having killed Macedon-.-
For fun you could try the "Völkerwanderung", take all you germans and go for rome.
It could be that you have to do some linehugging against the Senate but it is possible to conqeur rome something like 12 turns into the game.
Oh, and the rest of the world happens to be in deep XBOX because you can now pump out High End german units like nothing.
Man, I should have read this guide crap before I started Germans......
These guys are the poorest bastards I've yet to play (I haven't played Parthians but even if they start out poor there's a bunch of rich Seleucid provinces ripe for the taking). I've been trying to play this faction historically and so I left the Gauls and the brits alive, and so they still have all their richer provinces.
Plus these guys have the slowest growing provinces EVER. Compiled on top of this I built way too many units in the beginning so I ended up having to put most of my cities on growth build policy which made my money situation even worse. Its 234 or something and I barely just got a city into minor city category. I captured all bordering rebel provinces though, but it seems like they're just sucking more of what little money I have.
Spear warband was a pleasant surprise, their battle performance is pretty good. Definitely arguably the best in the first tier. Axemen are superior to Gallic swordsmen one on one and can take out hastati relatively easily as well. One thing I don't like about Chosen axemen is that they take too many casualties; the only way I will let them in my army is if they had considerable armor upgrades otherwise their survivability is too low. Therefore I plan to use night raiders as my main battle line. Judging from the stats of Gothic cav, they're even better than companions and cataphracts, if I remember the stats correctly (gothic got 17 attack and 23 defense I believe, cataphracts have similar defense but only 7 attack, companions have comparable attack but only like 15 defense or something), putting them as the best cav in the game??
Yeah, I probably should have rushed Rome, or at least Alesia, Patavium, and/or Mediolanum. This money situation is getting out of control. Capturing Samarabrovia from the brits helped out a little, but I need more, I can only afford 1 field army at a time and I have 3 borders to defend.....
Whoever said the Brits were backstabbing bastards was right. They betrayed my alliance three times and I even offered them peace after their armies were completely destroyed. I've had it with these blue people, I am going to invade and exterminate.
Gauls must be wiped out ASAP too; I didn't realize they made enough money to send 1 1/2 full flag armies at you every turn.....quite tired of fighting these weaklings....need those damn Romans to get Marius reforms so I can start fighting legionaires....
Chosen axes are invaluable against legionnaires. They can even take urbans provided you time warcry properly.
Gothics will probably lose to catas in a straight fight due to armour piercing secondary of the catas.
Yeah, I'm going to use the Chosen axes for flanks and night raiders for the main line. I'm just not gonna let the chosens get into the army unless they put a shirt on (preferably a mail shirt, i.e. need armor upgrade!). 6 night raiders, 4 chosen axes, 4 chosen archers, 4 gothic cav, and some berserkers plus general should make a fun army to play with.....
Yeah. They need armor badly.
Try fighting in woods more and then they should be less afraid of missiles.
The good thing about germans is that their Tier 1 stays usefull in the late game.
The valour 3 Spearman can contend with most high end phalanxes (well, Spartans are better, but your Spears will hold up their Spartan longer than their remaining force will hold up you remaining germans).
In addition, they can beat most Phalanxes when flanking them in straight mellee.
The reason seems to be that their propably is an additional malus when having phalanx activated while melleeing.
My lategame Germans look like this:
4-6 pupmped Spears
4x chosen Axes
4x Chosen Archers
Lots of varios cavalry.
Some puppys (Speed and Morale wins battles, not neccesarly stats)
doggies are the best charge stoppers in the game (bar chariots and elephants of course). Anytime I see any kind of cav or infantry about to charge my flank, I send in the dogs and they cement the charging unit there and when my chosen axes get there its over.
I'm currently creating a mod where all missile units' missile attacks are doubled, and all units' armour is raised insanely high. Something like an SPQR mod. But melee attack will remain the same to slow down the battles. In this mod, too, Germania will lose its phalanx capability and its crazy 9-8 spear attack. They will still have an advantage in that they use spears like the Libyan spearmen, but they will be like any other ordinary barbarian gaesatae band (that's what I changed their name to) with 7-7 attack. Germania is too overpowered otherwise.
Strategy-wise I believe that the Romans must be conquered first in every single campaign, because they get too strong otherwise. In response to some of ther earlier posts, I have to say that you don't even run any risk fighting the Romans early on. It's not even difficult. I once took on 2 Roman full stacks (one of them the Senate) with 17 units of Germans, made up solely of spear phalanxes and generals' cavalry, and won a heroic victory with only 100 lost for over 4000. The discrepancy is even greater if you fight the Senate army one-on-one at the rIver ford immediately next to Rome. In that case all it takes is 5 spear phalanxes and you have a heroic victory against 4 times that.
^^
Quite on the contrary, Rome needs to be left alone so that they can expand and become powerful. This makes a much more challenging game towards the end.
Why give them a chance to grow and not the other factions?
Rome are boring at mid/end-game. They pump out cohorts upon cohorts at you. *Yawn*
Yeah. And why would I want a challenging campaign? My objective is world domination, the streamlined, fast and painless way. Which means striking where the enemy is not, where the armies are not. Not using force against force, which is costly, painful, risky and not completely necessary. Hence my nick--master strategist. I like winning by strategy and moves, not by tactics on battlefields.
If you want a really challenging middle game, play rubbish at the start.
YES my god I did that the first time I played Germania. By turn 50 I was crashing in flames as Dacia, Brutus, Britannia and Gaul came knocking. Stupid German economy. :-/
The cohorts are funny to harass with your armoured elephants though, I simply love to do that. But yes, after doing that campaign after campaign it get`s incredible annoying :furious3:Quote:
Originally Posted by Craterus
That`s why I always mod the romans to pieces in all of my campaigns.
In one campaign I even managed to destroy the House of Julii the very first turn without lifting a finger.
Harass with armoured eles? You mean use eles as horse archers? LOL.
With Germania, the money is tight and pre-Marian troops are no fun to fight. Better just kill them and get your better troops faster.
Ah damn my english :embarassed:Quote:
Originally Posted by katank
I like to smash the legions with my eles :charge:
Germania is too overpowered, given its early ability to katank Rome, its unbreakable phalanxes and its awesome unit roster. I have decided to mod its spear warband stats down so it becomes a standard warband, strip it of its phalanx capability, and make it 7-7 instead of 9-8 attack. After all historically I'm sure CA justified their giving of the Germanic phalanx by the accounts of the Germanic battles at Aquae Sextiae where under Marius, the Germans formed a shieldwall with spears, and at Strasbourg where historians reported the Germans adopted a 'semi-phalanx'. But nowhere was it a real phalanx. If based on this they would give the Germans the phalanx, then they should give the same to Gaul and Britannia. Ergo, Germania must lose its phalanx--its people should not be disciplined enough to stay in the shieldwall.
Anyway. I don't know where this came from. But do you think it's a wise move given your campaign experience of Germania?
Howdy All. I'm an old timer having come back for more Total Warfare. I been playing again for almost 3 weeks now. Yesterday I started a German campaign. Playing it on VH. For strategy I decided on take out Britain and Gaul first before moving south against the Roman Legions.
As everyone knows the hardest part about the German factions is that they are poor. So I built roads first, then markets, and then farms. Basically get money into my treasury. Then I started on the temple stuff. Mostly Freya to get population going but added a couple to Donar and Wotan on some for variety and extra bonuses.
First I attacked the Denmark settlement and pushed east till I butted up against the Scythians. I also pushed south and southeast till stopping before modern day Italian and Dacian borders.
In the west I made alliances with Gaul and took the continental British town in the modern day Normandy area. Then I took the Gaulish captial. Then I marched on the town in modern Brittany that has a port. And thats where I am now in the game. My next move will be to invade the Brittish Isles and then turn my attention south against the Gauls and then the Romans.
Sorry about not using the actual town names. I'm at work and dont have my game map with me to read them off.
All of the rebel towns I just occupied outright since their population is low. Alesia and the British town I enslaved the population to help out my own German held towns. The northern Gaulish town that has a port on the English Channel I exterminated the population because I needed the money badly.
I havent been bribing because I dont like giving the gold to the enemy. Better to not give them a means to fund more units at this point. Besides, I need the gold more than they do. Normally when I do bribe in this game its usually to quickly move a rebel army out of my pathway so it doesnt slow me down or I'll bribe a army that might be planning to attack a army or town of mine that I feel I cant beat. Generally I dont bribe though.
So far my family of generals is sufficient and has a fairly steady supply of new members coming in so my leadership is looking pretty good.
I have my diplomats roaming the world making alliances and selling map info as fast and as much as I can. This has been a big help so far. Once I get to the point of having archers I will be set for world conquest. When playing these campaigns its pretty standard tactics. Have a solid line of spear, pike, or hoplites (hastati, principes, or legions if a Roman faction) out front, some archers for artillery support behind the front line, and some cavalry to screen, flank, and run down routing units.
So far my strategy is fairly straight forward in this current campaign. Spears out front. Keeping them 3 to 4 ranks deep. If I have swordsman or axemen I keep them on the spear flanks and then cavalry on their flanks and ranged units in behind as artillery support. March them up to the enemy line till the ranged units in back are in range. Once they start throwing that generally triggers the enemy AI to attack and I let the enemy waste themselves on my spearpoints. Then I use my cavalry to flank and pursue when the enemy flees. When on defense its the same setup and strategy except I let the enemy come marching to me. :charge:
Skott, the faction you bribe doesn't receive the money you give to the army. Just because you bribe them doesn't mean they will have more money, just that their upkeep falls somewhat. Bribe by all means. It only weakens the enemy, not strengthens it.
Germania is poor, but has a distinct military advantage (I'm sure you noticed). It also has incredible fertility for an infertile place, since you get factioners on the average of 1 every 5-6 turns, which is incredible.
You would be able to build up archers much quicker if you went straight for a decapitation strike on Rome. My style is to throw my line back and play defensive, forming a ring or semicircle, with my cavalry guarding the rear and my archers in the empty space in the centre, and let my enemy waste himself. But warning, this is not a good idea to be used against enemy hoplites. Attacking wise, I advance in the formation of my defensive ring, enough to lure the enemy to me, then I rotate units into the defensive ring and wait. Once they start routing I unleash my cavalry on a rampage.
Wow, all this time I thought the bribe money went into the factions' treasury. I knew with rebel armies it didnt matter but just figured giving the enemy troops money was later used to build more units or buildings against me. In any case with the German campaign money is too hard to come by to part with for bribes anyway IMO. Although today I did bribe away three different armies to give myself time to build up. I hated doing it but it was necessary to buy me time.
Anyway today I got an army over onto the British Isles and captured Londinium. Managed to get a ceasefire with the Gauls while I take out the Brits. Once I conquer the British Isles I'll start again on the Gauls and probably the Romans.
I read that blitzing the Romans early on was possible and a sure fire way to get lots of fast cash but I opted not to. Decided to go the slow way via Brits and Gauls first. Maybe next time I'll try a blitz into Northern Italy.
Actually I'm currently running two different campaigns. My German campaign and today I started a Egyptian campaign. These campaigns can be long and boring at times so my attention can shift alot. Running two at the same time gives me some variety to break up the monotiny. ~D
If you're already in Britain, consider capturing Deva-Tara and Londinium-Samaro at the earliest opportunity. These are excellent trade pairs whose trade income is OMG wonderful. It'll give a huge boost to your economy especially fi you build every trade-inducing building you can in them.
Have played Germania vanilla before on M/M . Easy win , if I remembered my empires spans until the nile valley.
Now in RTR 5.41 will play again , after I finish my Armenian campaign. BTW when I was playing Macedon (RTR version) I'm at war with Germania but I found that they're an easy picking with my hoplites armies. Don't have much cav use except my Companion generals.
How does it fae in RTR ? Anyone played it yet ? Any advice ? Maybe any new units / tactics ? Is spearwarband still have the same stat ?
Cheers.
I havent had a chance to try Germania 5.4.1 yet either. Currently working on the Britons (Which I'm not enjoying very much) in 5.4.1. From what I heard they toned down some things for the Germans so they werent as easy. So far I'm finding 5.4.1 much more balanced than v1.0 vanilla overall.
If you get a German faction started before me let me know your impressions. I dont think I'll be starting a German campaign soon. Trying to get thru this Briton campaign first.
I just started playing for a few turn. The first army consist of 2 generals and lots of axemen. Moving that arny down south towards Rome.
Still haven't had any battles yes. Both time encounter rebels but they retreat. Didn't pursue them , just clear them off the bridge and roads.
Have restarted my Armenian campaign so it will be a long time before Germania campaign kicks off.
I'm in the middle of a grand campaign with the germans, and its a pretty fun campaign.
Right from the start i concentrated on wiping out the britons while trying to remain friendly with everyone else. After a few years, while i was tied up in britain, the gauls hit me without warning (they managed to sneak through an area where i had no watchtowers). A few towns changed hands, and about three years later i was able to get a ceasefire to buy to breathing room.
Britain is a great area to take over, as once you have it, you can forget about it, and it earns pretty good income to boot. Just needs a small garrison force to keep the peace.
Once you have britain, you then have the income to maintain a couple of standing armies, which let you move down to spain and italy. I haven't really touched any of the more eastern provinces, not sure if they are worth the hassle, and i'm beginning to need more money.
Don't go east, provinces aren't rich and you'll find a lot of distance between cities. The steps are barren, leave them.
The msot effective tactic for Germania is the German Blitz. Basically, it's a beeline for Rome. Check back a few pages for all details. After you have Rome, and the Romans are gone, you can go whereever you want.
In either 1.0 or 1.2, easily the most effective tactic for winning the game is the "blitz." Quick consolidation of your minimum "home base" followed (or accompanied) by a lightning stike on Rome with a powerful army. Whether or not this army ever comes home is secondary, so long as you have destroyed all 3 Roman factions and SPQR. Even if these provinces rebel, you have lost little and probably still have 240+ years to complete your objectives.
The point in striking Rome so hard and so quick is to strangle them like a wolf cub before they can grow. Since they are the factions with the greatest power to actually defeat you (or prevent the conquest of Rome), they are your prime target -- so don't wait. :charge:
This approach is also:
A-historical,
Strictly based on manipulating game mechanics to your advantage,
largely unrealistic,
anachronistic in that it utilizes military strategy and tactics which were not developed until after the development of the internal combustion engine,
and presumes a level of knowledge about geography, comparative strategic development, and a teleological orientation that would have been completely foreign to virtually everybody of that era. :embarassed:
Actually, I have always felt that some of the AI problems on the strategy map result more from these last two issues than any inherent "flaw" in the AI. The AI is set to be somewhat more historical in its methods/plan for expansion. All the players begin playing with all the lessons of the blitzkreig etc. already in mind.
Seamus
Nice opinions there, and I have to agree. It is an effective strategy, and one of the easiest, but it takes a lot of things for granted. If you are up for a challenge, you should take an alternative route and take the Romans on later in the game. But, as I said before, the Blitz is the most effective start to the campaign.
I'm currently playing the Germans after a long layoff from RTW. My broadband was down so I played RTW the past week.
I took out most of the troops from Germany then went after Britain then Gaul as well as the rebel tribes. While waiting for my cities to grow I hired tons of mercs to help conquer Gaul, Britain and some rebel cities. You should conquer Londinium and Samarobriva ASAP. Building a port in both cities will get you around 2000 denarii every turn via two-way trade. Conquering Alesia also weakens the Gauls a lot. Tara-Deva also has decent two-way trade.
The fastest way of growing cities is the destroy and replace strat which I remembered after a years of my campaign. Build shrines to Freyja, wait, then destroy and replace with Woden or Donar once your cities are large enough.
The phalanx warband is powerful but I'm frustrated from all the phalanx bugs I encountered in my previous Pontus game that I don't use them as much during my German game. They have this stupid tendency to keep switching to knives or stop attacking an opposing unit so I have to keep pressing attack to make them start attacking again then stop so they'll attack with spears instead of knives. Also, they take forever to get their formation, especially in sieges. One unit out of 121 gets stuck somewhere while sieging and they'll never form a phalanx.
Well observed, andrewt. I think you're the first one I've seen besides me who's observed the trade pairs, of which Corduba-Tingi and Athens-Kydonia add to the number.
Do not worry about the phalanx warband, and use them all you want. They do not have secondary knife weaponry, they only have that spear which does an above-average damage of 9. Which actually makes the Spear warband superior to any other phalanx formation save the elites since they will always maintain their spears which is their best bet for survival.
I've always known about the Tara-Deva trade, and I know it brings in a nice income for Britain. Check back in the Britannia thread, I've mentioned it a few times there.
I think Germania are the "best" barbarian faction, and one of the easiest if you use the blitz at the start. They have the Spear Warband that can beat almost, if not all, first level units. They have great infantry later on, and Gothic Cavalry to sweep up. They're also one of the most unique factions, as they have a fair few unique units (Beserkers, Chosen Axemen, Spear Warband etc.)
Having played the Germans on very hard very hard in rtr, i had to use pretty "tricky" tactics.
In General, although the German foot troops arent bad, on vh they arent going to beat anyone. (wtf, I lost 36 out of a medium axe unit while attacking some barb peasants...).
The Spear warbands can hold up an enemy, but will not beat them. (very hard bonus for the AI).
The fact that there are no puupies anymore kinda hurts your morale.
So, the only thing that left is the cavalry.
This adds the nifty fact that you dont bleed your population dry be rerecruting.
As blitzing rome without the phalanx was out of the question (lol, I would propably not get past the Julii), I had to contend with the Gauls. Well, i am in war with them anyway.
After some happy Cav abuse (i may play without the pause button next time, would make it more challenging) i quickly managed to get Alesia.
I also managed to rapidly expand into the east, just to give me more breathing space if the Scythies come knocking (they can have dmois dulcis dmous if they have too, but vicus gothi is mine).
I cnathed Behmia and Austira with a contignecy force (use your warcrys, and use them right. Managing to sperate enmy troops also helps), and desperatly hoped that the Dacians would start to come at me (if they would, I would have retreated, these lands are junk, so I wont sacrifze anything to hold em).
Some enslaving acutally got me to level 2 population in the major cities.
This gave me enough Cav to roll the Gauls straight back to Spain.
As the Roman/Italo Gauls attacked me with large forces at Massilia (bless these mountain passes, lots of oportunites to make the Romies really tired), i managed to hold in some desperate defense.
However, my accompaniyng infantry units actually had enough exp to beat/hold up considerably outexped Hastati.
Meanwhile, my central cities got to level 3, and it was time to scratch these Freyia temples, go Wodan! (the healing that coems from the priests is quite cool too). I happily employed hit and run tactics to stall Dacian prgoress (well, hit a bit, lure the Dacians out of their towns, introduce them to my eastern all Cav force).
The Brits (for some reasons, my light Cav cannot get their chariots...) where more of a problem, but deceid to strom Friseurum.
This lead to a wholesale hugging of their forces, incuding two of their generals (there arent many things that rtr German spears do accomplish on vh, but they can kill crappy british chariots if they charge them).
I managed to stablize my eastern front by getting the Scythies up against the Dacians (turned on me later though, however i had all of the river crossing protected by forts).
My first serios non all Cav army was completed, and went to greet the Brits.
Level 3 germanic Lancers are nifty, to nifty for the Blues to cope with.
I experineced that shooting the British cahriots is better than chasing them around.
I caprutred Brittain quickly (well, now I actually could assault a settlement instead of hacing to siege it to death), rerecreutied my army at London (thanks for the weaponsmith, now i am even stronger).
And, coupled with an All Cav army from Gaul, went to have a little chat with the Italo-Gauls.
Another mixed army took care of the Dacians, however, trouble with the Scythies disabled me from using my advandatge.
The Gaul resitance in Italy was light, but the romas (all allied with Gaul, sure)
countrattack in force.
Patavium had the experience of a full Bruti stack every 4 turns.
Sometimes it was so crass that I stared to give names to individual soldiers.
I manged to get silver chevron Bastarnae mercenaries out of them, the unit was 4 men strong (the famous heroes known as Hack, slash, Crash and Burn) and ended up as a decesive element in several desperate(1 to 5 outnumbered) siege battles.
The General leading the Patavium army got every single one of the last stand/defender traits.
Meanwhile, my high tech mainstack mucnhed through the Juli cites, and began sieging rome.
The Scippiee counterstrcuk, the SPQR sallied out and remaingin Juli also attacked me.
In true German facion, I instantly marched agaisnt the Scippiee army, while the SPQR/Juli were forming up behind my back.
The Scipii fled just in time (well, their General fought to the last man, alwthough my Gothics charged him in the back more than 3 times).
Just before the SPQR/Juli Cav could hit my back, i reformed. Although I could not construct a Phalanx, my chosen Axes and mellee fighting Lancers manged to dispatch their horses.
The now Cav less Juli/SPQR force was nasty, but, with a stupidly large amount of flank charges, some serios chosen archer mellee action (got no arrows left anyway) and continous cursing about that !"§$§" horde formation that prevented my chosen Axes from doing overlapping charged with my Axes, i somehow did it.
On a happy sidenote, Rome was mine:P.
As I finally managed to get the Juli cites and rome to somehting akin to production, my hold on Italy got tighter, and I succesfully beat the Romans out of Italy, they did put up some fights, however, a fully fledeged, upgraded and ably lead army of Germans is not going to be beaten, not even by post Marian scipii (suckers got Karthago to size 5-.-).
After this, my succesfully doom stack got to Sicily, which did not pose a significant problem.
Another Island hop later I was standing near Karthago.
This town needed some serios razing action before I establishe some kind of control over it.
Meanwhile, my Eastern front asnt idle.
After getting some small but nearly unbeatable (for Scythies at least) garrisons consisting of 2 Lancer + 3 archers and some light cav) river garrisons, the rest of my army swept trhough Dacia and is now attacking thrace.
their amries looked qutie imposing, but somehow got the idea to attack Germanic lancers on top of a mountain during a snow storm, which quiklcy lead to their total distrcution.
From now on, I quited.
I had Italy, Carthage, all of central Qurope and Britain.
I had 14 provinces capabe of prudcing level 3 German troops.
I had a signifcant cash flow.
The rest would be a basic amount of mopping up the rest.
I decided to give both myself and my pc a break from BI and started my first major Germania campaign. having previously only attempted a short campaign, and given recent expansions, I was interested to explore Barbarianism at its core once more.
First target, as always. was to weaken the Gauls. I hate the Gauls! Dirty, backstabbing, traitorous beings, who never hold alliances or trade agreements or even their protectorates! I went for Alesia. That meant Spear Warband, Barbarian Mercs, Cav, Skirmishers, my heir and the leader. 900 strong. I took the capital on turn 5.
Next up Sambrobriva. The brits decided to attack my capital at trier with a full stack full of their best units - so much for trade rights. They had however only left two units up in Sambrobriva. They had no chance. Wasn't too long before they came back for trade...
But you've probably heard all this before. The early game is straighforward for germania. Its a walk in the park against the Gauls. The question really is how soon do you want to face the Romans? Im prepared to wait for Noble Cav.
Ive got Alliances with Macedon, Greek Cities, Scythia, and Spain. Agreements with everyone else but the Gauls of course. The strategic map is clear, trade is flowing, money is not an issue.
But first, Im going to finish off the Gauls. All of them. :duel:
Garvy:
Are you playing vanilla RTW, or is this RTW after 1.3/BI? If the latter, have you observed any differences?
Seamus
Playing v1.3. I'll post my observations later tonight.
Seamus..
Not much noticeable change in v1.3 that wasn't noticeable in v1.2. Even harder to bribe, perhaps?
I think they just fixed the save/load bug.
Others may have noticed more with different factions.
Hi,
while playing the German campaign, I made a tech tree with all buildings and their respective units.
http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/...compressed.JPG
The pic is somewhat 'blurred' as I had to compress it to fit my space available.
I'd like to upload the .jpg to share with the community if there is an interest.
:bow:
Heyyy that's really nice. By all means upload it. I never had the time to do it...