Dynasty

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Originally Posted by Franconicus

Chapter 8. First group forms the first line of attack. The second group is the second wave, it is important that the commander has the right timing. Third group is our reserve. Now I have to decide how to deploy the troops and to nominate the commanders.”

Please make proposals for the deployment!
Here are your troops and commanders:
BOHEMIAN: 2,200 knights and 4,500 peasants
Ottokar,
Walter (agent), unexperienced in battle
Wladislaw, Bishop, but also experienced on the battle field; gradualist
Paltram vor dem Freithof, knight from Vienna

ALLIES
Heinrich V (born in 1248) von Schlesien, Nephew of Wladislaw, loyal and combative
He has 800 Silesian knights
Przemysl (1257), Duke of Poznan, and Heinrich IV (1256) Duke of Breslau, both unexperienced, commanding 900 knights,
Wladislaus I (1225) Duke of Oppeln-Ratibor with 600 knights
Ekkehardt, pugnacious, with 2,000 knights from Brandenburg

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First Wave:

Ekkehardt, pugnacious, with 2,000 knights from Brandenburg
Przemysl (1257), Duke of Poznan, and Heinrich IV (1256) Duke of Breslau, both unexperienced, commanding 900 knights



Commander: Ekkehardt
Total Strength: 2,900 knights

Second Wave:

Wladislaus I (1225) Duke of Oppeln-Ratibor with 600 knights
Wladislaw, with 1,000 Bohemian knights

Commander: Wladislaw
Total Strength: 1,600 knights

Third Wave:

Ottokar, with 1,200 Bohemian knights
Heinrich, with 800 Silesian knights

Commander: Ottokar
2,000 Knights

So we are facing the Kaiser just where these two met in reality. One big question is where are the Alsacian knights? Marching towards our rear i presume? I agree with Ducky about the order of battle. Maybe we could atleast set a ambush for the Cumans and Szekelys by leaving our camp relatively open, while setting an ambush for them as there is little doubt they could resist such a prize? While atleast at the start of the battle we should have some advantage in Knights. Our two first contingents could hold the line, while our reserve with the peasants could set up an ambush for the Hungarian light horse around our camp. The distance is so small that our reserve could head back quickly to battle when needed, as if the Hungarians would have to dismount in order to blunder our camp. 4500 peasants and 2000 knights attacking from ambush could make short work out of them and then we would definetely have an advantage over our enemies.

I have to take advantage of being the third!!! - I am completely with Kage on our course of action, especially keeping the third wave as a flexable force to guard against attacks on our rear. perhaps the peasants could make some rudimentary defences - stakes for example. I'm English - I like stakes!! A 1,000 longbowmen would sort these amoured dandies out!!

By the way - I am so impressed I beat Warman to the third post - he must be off looking for women!!! - see the Frontroom

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Originally Posted by King Kurt

By the way - I am so impressed I beat Warman to the third post - he must be off looking for women!!! - see the Frontroom

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I was at the doctors you evil evil man!!!! J/K. Yes, I was at the docs for hip problem. I did have the chance to post 3rd last night, but wanted to do detailed post now. Next time KK.... I'll get you! :laugh4:

Chapter 10 – Before the battle

The whole night through the King of Bohemia was wandering around and wondering about the deployment for the next morning. At dawn, he called the military leaders into his tent and told them his decision:
“My friends and allies, you know today is the day of battle, the day of decision. We are stronger than our opponent and we will attack him. I have been thinking about our deployment and this is my plan. We will form three groups. The first group, which opens the battle, will be formed by you, Ekkehardt, with your knights. At your side will be the Duke of Poznan and the Duke of Breslau. In total you will command 2,900 knights.
The second wave will attack the enemy as soon as it is tied by Ekkehardt and his men. You should bring the decision. This group will be lead by Wladislaw, who will be supported by the Duke of Oppeln-Ratibor and his knights as well as 1,000 Bohemian knights. The second wave will be formed by 1,600 knights.
Our camp will be guarded by the peasants, which will immediately begin to build obstacles against a potential Kuman raid.
Behind the camp will be the reserve, 1,200 Bohemian knights and Heinrich with his Silesian knights, in total 2,000. We will build an ambush, in case the Kumans attack our camp. Questions?”
For a moment it was quiet, but then Heinrich asked: “Why do you put the reserve so far away from the battlefield. Do you want to fight Rudolf on the battlefield or lure him into our camp? Did I misconceive, you will stay with the reserve behind the camp? Does that mean that you do not want to lead the battle? Who then will be the commander of our army?”
Before Ottokar was able to answer Ekkehardt shouted out: “This is your quarrel with Rudolf, and we promised to support you. Well, now it seems as if you do not want us to fight with you – you just want us to fight for you. Anyway, we came a long way to fight against Rudolf and I swear we will do it. You may hide behind the camp and wait for us bringing you the Emperor’s head!”
The other dukes seemed also not to agree with Ottokar’s plan. Everybody asked or made proposals. Heinrich suggested making the first wave weaker, maybe 2,000 knights with the majority of light armed knights. They would be pushed back by the Imperial army, which could be knocked out by a stronger second wave with 2,500 heavy knights.
Wladoslaw made a different proposal. His advice was to increase the number of heavy armed knights in the two first groups and to increase the number of light knights in the reserve. So the two waves would be more powerful and the light knights of the reserve could fight well against the fast Kumans and could also be used chasing the enemy once he begins to route. “Maybe”; Wladislaw said”; we could set up a special squad to chase Rudolf and to – err – arrest him.”
The discussion ended when Paltram entered the tent.
“Milord, I just returned from the reconnaissance mission you sent me on. And I bring you news about the enemy. Rudolf’s army is already deploying between Waidendorf and the River March. I could see two parallel lines of knights, each line may consist of 1,500 knights. As far as I could see, most of the knights in the first line wear only light armors. The second line is some hundred meters behind the first line. I could not see if the Imperial camp, as the ground declines behind the second line. The Kumans are on the left side, right at the river.”
“Did you see Rudolf?”
“No, but I saw his banner in the middle of the first line.”
“So Rudolf has 3,000 knights and 4,000 Kumans?” asked Ottokar.
“As far as I could see, yes!”
“Maybe he left the rest behind his camp!” scoffed Ekkehardt.
Ottokar pretended that he had not heard this shout: “Alright, then it is time to beat him. Get ready for combat, lords!”
The Dukes went to their troops. Ottokar left alone in his tent. Now it was time to meet his fate. He heard the men mounting their horses. He knew that unity was surely not the strength of his army, but loyalty had to suffice to keep it together. He left the tent and walked in front of the men, which waited for his final order to leave the camp. In the light of the reportedly anathema he renounced to celebrate mess. Instead he now asked his allies to repeat the vow of fidelity. All military leaders took the oath and the common knights followed.
Now it was time to give the sign for departure. Ottokar hesitated one moment. Should he change his orders? Was there anything he forgot to do?

3000 knights and 4000 cumans is awfully small amount for their entire army. The numbers for Rudolph army sound real enough, but in the historical battle the Hungarians had 18 000 men with them, so we are missing almost the entire Hungarian army, so we can prepare to be flanked or attacked on our rear. About the ambush my intention was never to deploy our personal force behind our camp, but between the battle and our camp. To be honest i dont like where we are heading one bit, but we cant turn back any more as our army would probably disintegrate at that point.

As we dont have a map of the battle area.What really is the distance between Rudolph´s army and our camp? Do we have any idea about any other enemy formations moving into our direction, on our flanks or our rear,anything? If Rudolph really is alone on this side of the river with mere 3000 knights. We should crush him first. Without the Kaiser the morale of his army would surely collapse. If he has foolishly divided his army so.Our two first contingents should tie him up and our third contingent should strike him at the flank and rear. Still i dont think thats the case. Kaiser has studied the ground, hid part of his army from us and at the right moment he will flank or strike us to the rear. Or maybe the rest of his army is on that downward slope behind him, which we cant see, waiting that we will run out of steam.I cant see now other options other then to drop our visors and fight and most likely loose.

I wont comment on the micromanagement much. Its obvius that by putting his more light knights in front Rudoph wants to absorb our first strike and then countercharge with his own heavy ones., but if our reserve will be light armed.We dont stand a chance against a flanking force with superior numbers. Maybe our only real chance is killing the Kaiser by striking him with all we have, like i explained earlier. In a prolonged battle our changes are most likely to falter.

We need our knights at the battlefield, not at the camp. Simply, if we kill Rudolf, we will win the battle. Rudolf has some forces hidden somewhere and we need a reserve close by to counter it. Most likely his plan is to feign weakness, give up ground initially, suck us in and then launch an ambush with a hidden force to crush us.

I would suggest this alternative plan:

The two first lines: We deploy our heavier knights almost exclusively at the right side, while the lighter knights are deployed on the left against the Cumans. Both lines will have a similar division. This means that we will surely be able to crush their right and roll their flank towards the river, pinning them against the river. If all goes well this will pin the Cumans towards the river, neutralising their threat, as well. I don't think we need to adjust the sizes of the two lines, as even our second line is larger than their second. We just need to watch the inevitable ambush.

The reserve will be divided in such a way that Heinrich will be in the center, with his 800 to counter-attack the enemy flank when the lighter knights start giving away ground on the left or if the left is doing well, support the right. Ottokar with his Bohemians will be posted on the right flank, with the task to follow the two lines closely and counter the coming enemy ambush when it emerges. In addition he needs to actively scout the terrain on the right, because I have a feeling we might stumble on to the enemy. This is a battle that we can win, provided that we play our cards well.

I skimmed throught the thread and it would seem we are missing only about 1500 knights and 1000 cumans from the Imperial host, so the Hungarian host seems weaker then it was in reality. I think your plan is solid Ducky and i support it in the light of these figures.

Does this mean I am the third poster!? If so.... HAHAHAHAHA King Kurt! :laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:


Uh hum, Anyhow.....


I support Ducky's plan in it's entirley, however, I believe we should at least keep a few hundred light knights at the camp to ambush any Kumans that foolishly decides to raid the camp, then afterwards let them take part in the battle?

:pimp::mad::smg::hmg:

We need all the knights we have at the decisive spot. The battle will not be decided at the camp and if the Cumans feel like fighting our peasants in the camp, then that means they are not participating in the decisive battle. A few hundred knights can make or break us here, so we can ill afford to disperse our forces to protect something of questionable value for the battle itself. So Warman, I urge you to reconsider.

I agree with Ducky. Once the imperials will launch atleast those 1500 knights, 1000 horse archers and possible further Alsacian reinforcements against us at some point.We will be needing every man we can muster. Now that our only possibility is to go to offensive tactically. It is better to smash the Kaiser with iron fist, rather then slap him with open hand. I was wrong in my tactic of trying to lure the enemy to attack us as he simply will not do that.Not operationally nor tactically.The enemy is too smart to fall for that, so we have to defeat him by using our own strengths as he doesnt allow himself to be defeated by making a critical error.

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Originally Posted by AggonyDuck

We need all the knights we have at the decisive spot. The battle will not be decided at the camp and if the Cumans feel like fighting our peasants in the camp, then that means they are not participating in the decisive battle. A few hundred knights can make or break us here, so we can ill afford to disperse our forces to protect something of questionable value for the battle itself. So Warman, I urge you to reconsider.

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Napoleon once said something about leaving no regiment out of a fight when you need every man you got. But you see, I am just worried that if they attack our camp, they could potentially outflank us.


But I will go with your proposal Ducky anyhow. May we achieve victory with your plan and our mighty troops.

Luckily, attacking our camp and flanking us are two different things. If they attack our camp, it will most likely tie up parts of their forces that could have participated in the decisive engagement.

Chapter 10 – The fighting begins

On the spur of the moment Ottokar changed his mind: “Messengers, to me!”
Several riders popped up.
“You, bring my message to Ekkehardt, and you, bring it to Wladislaw. Tell them to strengthen their right side. They shall shift heavy armored knights to this side and leave the left side to the lights. Try to break through at the right flank and do not with the left one. If the Kumans break through – leave this to me. If you manage to break the enemy on the right side, push to the river! That is all, now hurry!”
The messengers shot off and soon the groups of Ekkehardt and Wladislaw changed their orders. Finally, Ottokar gave the sign for departure.
Long columns moved out of the camp. The reserve was the last group, leaving only the peasants behind.
“Heinrich, I changed my mind. We will not hide behind the camp, we will look after a position closer at the battle field instead. I want you to go with your men to the left. In case our left side is torn apart, I want you to come into action. If our men will hold the fort, wait until I call you! I will stay on the right side. I will protect our flank and be ready to support the right flank. If everything goes well, we will break through on the right, then press the imperials against the river and annihilate them. However, I fear that Richard has something in mind. He must have some hidden reserve and we have to be aware that he is going to play some tricks.”
It was about one hour ante meridiem when the forces of the Iron King took their positions. The first group trotted towards the enemy followed by the second group. The Wladislaw gave the order to stop, Ekkehardts men were moving forward.
From his lookout point Ottokar could overview the maneuvers of his forces, and he also saw how the enemy on the left side disgorged a swarm of riders. Even Ottokar could hear the shrill screams of the Kumans. At first it seemed as if this would not affect Ekkehardt’s group, but then there were signs of disorder on the left and Ottokar saw single riders falling to the ground. Then Ekkehardt raised his sword and his force began to gallop. 3,000 horses made a sound like an approaching thunder storm. Ekkehardt’s men were now covered by dust and Ottokar could hardly see what was going on. But it looked as if the Kumans went back behind their lines and yes, Richard’s first force began to move and the two forces galloped towards each other. The sound of the drumming hooves ended with a loud bang when the two forces collided and then Ottokar heard something else – a sound he had heard on every battle field and which haunted him in his dreams – the cries of wounded and dying horses.
Now that the combat began, the combatants were wrapped up in dust. Ottokar became nervous, because he could not see what was going on. At this moment we wished he was on top of his men. Anything was better than to wait behind the lines.
Minutes passed but it was as if time was standing still. Nothing seemed to happen, at least from Ottokar’s lookout he could not observe any movement. Wladislaw, what was he waiting for. The right moment for the second wave was now, now that Richard’s men were pinned in close combat. But Wladislaw did not move. Ottokar tried to catch his eyes by waving the banner, but Wladislaw did not look at his king. Then Ottokar saw Richard's second line set in motion. It stormed forward and disappeared in the cloud of dust. The sound of beating metal and the crying was getting louder. Still Wladislaw hesitated. Ottokar called for a messenger when he finally raised his arm and his group began to storm forward. Like the opponents before, Wladislaw and the second wave disappeared in the cloud of dust and noise.
“All Saints!” Ottokar shouted. Still he could not discover which side was gaining upper hand. But now he felt the sweat running down under his armor. It was hot, one of the hottest days of the year. Ottokar took off his helmet.
“Sire, you should not do that. Think of the mounted archers!” said a knight of his personal guard.
“Mind your own business” Ottokar flied into his face. “Hurry back and bring me my tent!”
Two hours were gone since the beginning of the battle. From his position Ottokar could see several men leaving the cloud. Some of them going, some riding and some carried.
Ottokar looked at a group of men which came slowly closer to his position. He saw that two men carried the young Heinrich IV, Duke of Breslau, on a stretcher. Ottokar beckoned them over: "Heinrich, what happened?"
Heinrich raised his head and Ottokar saw by the expression in his face, that the mind of the duke was still caught in combat.
"How is the battle going, Heinrich?"
"It is just like hell"; Heinrich answered croaky. "Do you have something to drink?"
A servant brought some wine.
"Now, Heinrich, tell me what is going on!"
"Err - we marched against Rudolf, when the Kumans attacked us. We were covered with arrows, I heard four of them banging against my corselet, but I came through. However, many of the light knights were wounded, especially on our right. We lost more than 100 men, I guess, before we even got in contact with the enemy. And we lost even more horses."
"Alright, but then you hit Richard's knights."
"Yes, and they hit us. The clash was awful, many brave men fell from their horses. And then close combat began immediately."
"And how was it going then?"
"Have I already told you that it was hell? The imperials fought good. They did not have strong armors, but they are more agile. We were hammering as good as possible, but it was pure chaos. Everyone tried to find an enemy which he fought with. Although I guess we were more numerous, this was no advantage. We were pressed together and I could hardly use my sword. All around were dead horses and knights on foot and more men were pressing from behind. This would have been the right moment for the second wave, but we waited in vain. Suddenly I saw Ekkehardt trying to call me. Together with Przemysl and me he wanted to break through on the right side. We called some of our best men and united we attacked the enemy again. It was then when Ekkehardt saw Richard's banner. The Habsburgian moved from the center to the right side, as if he had the same idea as we had. Ekkehardt shouted out loud and galloped to get to the Emperor and we shouted too and followed him. Yet, Rudolf's guard threw itself between and intercepted us. It was as if we stormed a brick wall. Enemies surrounded us, we had to beat in all directions and it was so hot and dusty. I was hit three times, but that did not stop me. Richard's guard pushed us to the side, but we kept on attacking and finally we made it, we broke through their lines. Immediately something was drumming at armor and when I turned around, I saw the horse archers. I did not care, I did my best to follow Ekkehardt who tried to get to Richard's back. Then Ekkehardt disappeared and I did not see him again. And honestly I had to do my best to save my skin. I had not realized that Rudolf's second line charged until something hit the flank of my horse. I flew from the saddle and must have had a black out. It must have been only a couple of moments, but when I woke up again, I lay on the ground beside the corpus of a horse. My head was aching and I had lost my sword. I was surrounded by enemies. I tried to get up, but my leg must be broken. So I lay there quite helpless. For heaven's sake Wladislaw arrived in time. Our second wave drove the enemy back and so I was rescued. That is all."
"And how is the battle going now?!
"I do not know."
"Which enemies did you fight?"
"Most of them were Hungarian knights, I assume. Brave men, indeed, but most of them only with light armors. And Rudolf's guard, of course."
"Who is commanding our army now? Is it Wladislaw, and what about Przemysl."
" I do not know. If you want to know, you have to go there to find out. But please, give me a horse, I have to go back to my men!"
Ottokar was wondering if Heinrich already had temperature.
"No, bring him to the camp."
The Bohemian King turned and looked to the battle. He saw men leaving the battle, some went just a couple of yard, then they laid down, others went westwards and disappeared in the woods. Ottokar could not recognize if those men were friends or enemies.
Ottokar felt that he had to do something. This was the right moment. Maybe Richard's line were ready to fall. He had already four and a half thousand knights in combat, enough. It seemed as if there was enough crush. A flanking maneuver would be the right thing, but how? Ottokar was wondering if it was really impossible to bypass the enemy in the west.
At this moment he saw Heinrich von Schlesien coming.
"Ottokar, we must do something. Let me charge with my men. I promise to bring you Rudolf's head!"
Ottokar was uncertain. He knew he had several options and hesitate, because he feared to make the wrong decision.

A) Do nothing - it is too early to use the reserves
B) Allow Heinrich to assault and to attack Richard
C) Leave Heinrich as a reserve and try to bypass the enemy in the west.
D) Wait, but send a patrol to recon the western area.
E) Take the whole reserve and charge. Then you can decide this battle at once.
F) something else!

d) Hold steady but sending patrols to recon would be a wise move. The enemy reserve is somewhere and we have to find out where. The numbers are on our side in the current battle and we should not commit our reserve untill enemy does so.

F) Allow Heinrich to assault and to attack Rudolf, but also send out a patrol to recon the western area.

From the sound of it our left is holding up and the fighting is concentrated to the right. Our first line has taken quite a beating, but the second line seems to have the advantage. Killing Rudolf is paramount to winning this battle and this seems like an occasion to commit a part of our reserve to take him out. In addition to this, we need to scout out the western area, to find out what is there.

F) Allow Heinrich to assault and to attack Richard, but also send out a patrol to recon the western area.


Agreed with Ducky on the recon part. Attack Ricard now, and crush him and his force.

So now our right or left will face the onslaught of 2500 enemies while we have reserve of 1200 our own men. Too hasty decision i think.Please reconsider Warman, once we have crushed the enemy reserve´s attack we have all the men in the world to take out Kaiser. In real history the Bohemian king did just what you are now doing, but Rudolph survived even partly because of luck and then his reserves decided the day for him.

With second thought, Kage might be correct here.

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Originally Posted by Kagemusha

So now our right or left will face the onslaught of 2500 enemies while we have reserve of 1200 our own men. Too hasty decision i think.Please reconsider Warman, once we have crushed the enemy reserve´s attack we have all the men in the world to take out Kaiser. In real history the Bohemian king did just what you are now doing, but Rudolph survived even partly because of luck and then his reserves decided the day for him.

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You should be happy I'm not going to go with E like I was very tempted to. We can't keep our reserves out forever. You can yell at me and call me stupid if my move doesn't go though and if it does, you owe me a cheesecake.

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Originally Posted by AntiKingWarmanCake88

You should be happy I'm not going to go with E like I was very tempted to. We can't keep our reserves out forever. You can yell at me and call me stupid if my move doesn't go though and if it does, you owe me a cheesecake.

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Im not calling you a stupid at all.What i am asking is to reconsider. Dont get carried away by the momentum, but keep a cool head. Reserves are for desicive moments and such has not yet to come.Once we commit our reserves we can hardly recall them back anymore. We need to force the Kaiser to commit his first as currently the numbers are on our side.

I think the Wladislaw's troops are still fresh and for now we should not bother with reinforcements. I agree that D is the best option for now. The area is already overcrowded with our knights and additional reinforcement won't have an effect.

Chapter 11: In the Heat of the Battle

Ottokar looked at the battle in front of him. The dust over the battle ground settled and he could see more details. More and more men on both sides stood some yards aside, leaned on their banners or swords. Others left the fighting and slowly walked back to the camp. Ottokar could see Wladislaw’s banner in the middle of the crowd. Most of the knights had lost their horses. Behind the fighting men there were mounted archers and again and again Kuman riders penetrated the formations and charged the Ottokar’s exhausted men. Ottokar also saw, that a b large group of Kumans gathered at the river to charge his left flank.
Heinrich was right – it was time to do something and some 800 fresh knights could bring the decision. So he turned to Heinrich and said: “Right, son, now it is up to you! Make the decisive charge and bring me Rudolf. Heinrich, our fate is in your hands.”
The Silesian duke put spurs to his horse and galloped to his men. Minutes later the charge of the Silesian knights began.
The Bohemian King gave orders to send a patrol to the west. Then he could not stand his impatience. He ordered his men to get ready for combat but to wait for his orders, and then he set on his horse and rode closer to the battle.
In the meanwhile, Kumans had overrun his left side. They swarmed out to intercept Heinrich. The Silesian knights drove their horses and soon Heinrich and his men arrived on the battle field. The Imperial knights could not resist their new enemies. Heinrich went straight for the banner of Rudolf, who was surrounded by his guard. Yet, the young Heinrich seemed to be irresistible and invulnerable. With a huge dart he came right in the middle of the guard, saw Richard and rammed his lance into the horse of the Emperor. The 60 year old Habsburgian fell to the ground. Heinrich pulled his sword to finish this fight. However, a young Swiss knight, Heinrich Walter von Ramschwag, threw himself between his emperor and the offender. The rest of the guard attacked Heinrich, who had to fight for his life, and when the rest of his knights closed ranks, Rudolf had already left the battle. Heinrich and his men shook the rest of the Imperial guard off and broke through the line of the enemy. They also pushed through the Kuman archers. Heinrich wanted to chase Richard, but he saw himself confronted with 1,500 Imperial knights moving to the battle.
Heinrich did not hesitate one moment. He rushed against the new enemy and his knights followed.
Ottokar was still watching, he saw Richard’s fall and the arrival of fresh Imperial troops. It was time for him to join in. He turned his horse over to get back to his men. Then he saw men appearing from a copse in the rear of his reserve, 50, 60 knights, roaring and yelling. They jumped at the retreating Bohemians and massacred them.

Ottokar reached his men, which were only waiting for him to enter the battle.

A) Lead your men south to help Heinrich against the Imperial reserve.
B) Turn north to defeat the Imperials there and then turn south.
C) Divide your troops. Make 100 of your men turn northwest, so that they can attack the northern enemy from the rear and lead the rest south to join Heinrich.

C) Destroy the diversion force in our rear with 100 knights and defeat the the Imperial reserve with the rest. We cant leave that diversion force be, or the morale of our army might collapse.1100 best of our Bohemian knights together with Heinrichs men will defeat the Imperial reserve. The Kaiser has retired from battle, which will diminish their morale, specially when Iron King himself will be charging the enemy in front of his elite knights.What i have counted for they have now every man from their force on the field. Lets decide this battle here and now.

C) As well, we need to divide our troops at this point. According to my counting, Rudolf brought around 4,700 knights to the battle, meaning that with three lines of 1,500 knights, the ambush force could have up to 200 Knights. Thus I'd send 200 knights to counter that threat.

C.

Great, we all agree! 200 Knights sound good.

A bit late, but I would go with C as well. looks like we don't have to long to go now - we are in danger of finishing an IH - I had better have a lie down!!!

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Originally Posted by King Kurt

A bit late, but I would go with C as well. looks like we don't have to long to go now - we are in danger of finishing an IH - I had better have a lie down!!!

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The end is near! :skull:
:laugh4:

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!