The Conspiracy of Everything!

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Originally Posted by Myth

Aspartame is definitely 100% proven to be safe.

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It's officially proven to not be safe. It's just that the official safe level lies around a daily consumption of slighly less than 5 liters of diet soda. I've not done some major checks but your link is including plenty of excessive dosage studies for example (aka what happens if we give 100 times above the recommended maximum?).
Of course those studies will say that it's bad.

It's depressive enough at it is without any conspiracy theories. The truth is that FDA and similar organisations can't keep up with proper checking of chemicals, so it becomes a "good enough" situation, where chemicals comes out before they're studied properly for long term, small dosage situations. In particular that cumulative effects between diffferent chemicals also occurs, but aren't really researched by the companies.

One major reason on why bromine compounds are so popular (they were even more popular, but a lot of uses are banned nowadays) is because bromine is a poisonous waste product. That poison effect seems to stick around, even in the compounds. If you don't recognize it, it's used in most flame retardants, among other uses.

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Originally Posted by Ironside

It's officially proven to not be safe.

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The poison is in the dosage, as it is with every substance known to man.

Everything is both poisonous and safe at the same time. This seems to be a fact the conspiracy theorists can't seem to wrap their heads around.

I personally think of poisonous as how much could you realistically consume to get to the toxicity point before your body can filter it out. Considering it's possible to poison yourself with potable water.

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Originally Posted by lars573

I personally think of poisonous as how much could you realistically consume to get to the toxicity point before your body can filter it out. Considering it's possible to poison yourself with potable water.

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It's also great for motivating employees.

Of course none but the most addicted neckbeards drink 5 liters of any soft drink per day. But you can find Aspartame in a lot more things we consume on a daily basis, such as chewing gum, coffee sweetener, ice tea, cakes and so on. And yes, accumulation over the years has not been tested. It's safe to say that if it doesn't kill you outright the FDA will approve it given the right incentive, and most other countries will follow (seen "FDA approved" as a valid reason to approve something here)

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Originally Posted by Myth

Of course none but the most addicted neckbeards drink 5 liters of any soft drink per day. But you can find Aspartame in a lot more things we consume on a daily basis, such as chewing gum, coffee sweetener, ice tea, cakes and so on. And yes, accumulation over the years has not been tested. It's safe to say that if it doesn't kill you outright the FDA will approve it given the right incentive, and most other countries will follow (seen "FDA approved" as a valid reason to approve something here)

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A doctor friend once told me that the problem with the stuff was when it is used in hot drinks, to cook with or when soda heats to over 80°F, that it breaks down in to more harmful components. But it still tastes sweet. She also said that, that also has an effect on the body that prevents normal weight loss. Pretty strange for a product people use to reduce weight or to cut calorie intake.

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Originally Posted by Fisherking

A doctor friend once told me that the problem with the stuff was when it is used in hot drinks, to cook with or when soda heats to over 80°F, that it breaks down in to more harmful components. But it still tastes sweet. She also said that, that also has an effect on the body that prevents normal weight loss. Pretty strange for a product people use to reduce weight or to cut calorie intake.

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Yes, that happens and those components are harmful but also occurs naturally in the body by higher concentrations (I'm going by official information here).

The wieght loss thing has to do with how the body works. Eating something sweet tells to body that sugar is on its way. Since no sugar is coming, that part of your body is going to get grumpy and wanting real sugar, increasing your sugar desire.

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Eating something sweet tells to body that sugar is on its way. Since no sugar is coming, that part of your body is going to get grumpy and wanting real sugar, increasing your sugar desire.

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The bad part about this is that insulin gets released in response to the false sugar alert. Since there is no additional sugar on the way, the excess insulin then targets any sugar it can find which usually leads to a drop in blood sugar levels which has the potential to cause some real problems for individuals who are sensitive to blood sugar levels. There should have been a warning for those who are hypoglycemic, to consume something that would provide free carbs to digest when an artificial sweetener is ingested...

I just could not resist.

Here is one of those conspiracies you never heard of.

Operation Mockingbird

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird

Now, you watch the news. Do you think it ever ended?

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Originally Posted by Fisherking

I just could not resist.

Here is one of those conspiracies you never heard of.

Operation Mockingbird

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird

Now, you watch the news. Do you think it ever ended?

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You're right. The news are full of praise for the president, and there's never, ever any criticism of the US government.

Pretty close.

What did Brzezinski say this week? That Obama’s failure to gain support was due to alternative media.

Well, damn! Sorry you might miss your favorite war.

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Originally Posted by Montmorency

But seriously, that math-thing was a real error on your part. You'll be torn apart by Horetore for it.

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I missed this gem, sorry 'bout that.

Mathematics have historically been seen as a fundamental tool for understanding the "real purpose of life", ie. the divine. Mathematical theory have been advanced by religous figures from the very start of history, from calculating star movements to determine religous festivals to its absolute rules being seen as proof of a divine creator. Pythagoras based a philsophical-religious cult on his mathematical findings, for example.

Never has it been seen as heretical by any church, but has instead been fueled and advanced in large part by religious motivation. There have been a few cases of silly opposition to mathematics, but that fits within an anti-modernist movement, not a religous one( though anti-modernist tend to be religious), like when some idiots in the state wanted to pass a law defining pi as exactly 3...

Interesting,

So you are unaware of any of the various Inquisitions targeting Alchemist, Astrologers, Numerologists, and the like and that a knowledge of mathematics by a lay person or churchman of a different order made one a suspect of The Black Friars? Why, a Mathematician was synonymous with the practice of these foul arts and who you would go to in order to acquire knowledge of them.

And their practice was wide spread. Many people, including the powerful went to great lengths to conceal their birth information.

You lost all respect when you included astrology and numerology in your list of mathematics-related subjects. That's pseudo-science, not mathematics. Burn 'em at the stake, I say.

As I have said, there have been a few instances targeting mathematics, but they are few and mostly motivated by anti-modernism. The Catholic Church have always encouraged mathematics, and in post-roman Europe was almost the only ones keeping the art alive.

As far as I know, a Catholic theology study has mandatory mathematics courses. I'm not a 100% on whether this is universal or not, someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Also, whenever a mathematicians senses danger, he simply withdraws to his community, believing there is safety in numbers.

Right, and the Church was also responsible for keeping Astrology and Numerology alive for a long time.

Interesting how you blame the messenger though. Are you sure you are not a Dominican?

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Originally Posted by Fisherking

Right, and the Church was also responsible for keeping Astrology and Numerology alive for a long time.

Interesting how you blame the messenger though. Are you sure you are not a Dominican?

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The Church is based on pseudo-science(ie. religion), so just how surprising is it that they've branched out?

Still, that has very little to do with the fact that mathematics have been and still are an integral part of all religious life.

And what messenger?

It was this part. If I am not mistaken Astrology requires quite a bit of math, when done correctly.

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Originally Posted by HoreTore

You lost all respect when you included astrology and numerology in your list of mathematics-related subjects. That's pseudo-science, not mathematics. Burn 'em at the stake, I say.

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And if you had studied to be a Dominican it would surely explain how you see heresies and heretics all around you.

But maybe that was too much Total War. :laugh4:

Astrology also requires you to lobotomize your brain, which is the reason it's counted as hogwash and not science.

And given that the end result of astrology is pure nonsense anyway, why on earth would you require any mathematics? You can just wave your fingers around to create nonsense, you don't even need to know multiplication to do that.

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Originally Posted by HoreTore

Astrology also requires you to lobotomize your brain, which is the reason it's counted as hogwash and not science.

And given that the end result of astrology is pure nonsense anyway, why on earth would you require any mathematics? You can just wave your fingers around to create nonsense, you don't even need to know multiplication to do that.

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Is that more like Freudian Psychiatry or Global Warming Computer Models?

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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube

His point was that the very old methods of astrology are steeped in calculations. Mysticism and mumbo jumbo, but also a driving force in the furthering of Math in ancient India, and other places.

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You will soon discover that it was astronomy which furthered both religion and mathematics, while astrology is and have always been the domain of the insane.

Ancient India is an unnecessary specification though, as all civilizations have invented mathematics, and they've all done it the same way: by gazing at the stars and calculated movements, and keeping track of their grain warehouses.

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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube

Are you capable of conceding a point?

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Nope.

26 years of socialist indoctrination, what do you expect?

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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube

Fair enough, I suck at it too. I'm just saying that without Astrology, we might not have math. If the other side effect of that ancient school of study is irrational superstition then that is just lovable irony.

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NO.

Without astronomy, we'd might not have math.

Astrology is something else entirely.

We invented complex math by trying to figure out the circumference of the earth and the distance to the moon - NOT by figuring out whether those born in August are happier than those born September.

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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube

If you went back in time and tried to point out the difference to an ancient babylonian, he'd call you a heretic and sacrifice you to the same gods you just said he wasn't trying to calculate the moods of. You can't separate the superstitions and the "science" of ancient peoples so easily.

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Fine - all sciences have their dirty secrets. Darwinism has Hitler, astronomy has astrology.

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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube

And the Socialist model for viewing history and human progress has its Stalin. :creep:

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Get with the times bro, most marxists today have long since rejected class struggle as a basis for history along with the dialectic nonsense...

Well, at least the sane ones have.

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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube

Its not a bad model for viewing history in a social context. History is big, and class struggles have been a defining factor in all large and impactful nations, and is likely to be a major factor in the future globalized world. I'm really not an expert on modern Socialism though.

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Yeah....... A quick "Marxism 101" would be to take what you wrote there, and then twist it into lala-land.

The struggle between the Haves and the Have-nots, peasant and lord, proletariat and capitalist, or whatever you want to call it, is undoubtedly a major feature of human history. No sign of it being less important in the future either.

The first sign of sillyness comes when the Marxist elevates this feature so high it becomes the sole method of explaining history. Remember racism, gender issues, religious differences, cultures, etc? All irrelevant to the Marxist, they are but symptoms of the class struggle, and have no independent meaning.

Then, of course, comes silly point #2: this nice theory has to fit into an arbitrary philosophical system, Dialectics. Suffice to say, when 10.000 years of history plus the future is crammed into a system with only three stages, it tends get messy....

Throw out class? The dialectic!?

I...I...I feel alienated :stare:

America Burning!
Let us not rule out aliens or intergalactic elves!

http://wonkette.com/528533/wingnuts-...ng#more-528533

On the topic of the Intelligence Community, this is a really wonderful interview:

http://www.colbertnation.com/the-col...13/philip-mudd

I think it's the first time I really, seriously disliked a guest.
We can only hope that his "hint" that his boses are/act like him is not true because he seems like a dangerous psychopath to me. :stare:

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Originally Posted by Husar

On the topic of the Intelligence Community, this is a really wonderful interview:

http://www.colbertnation.com/the-col...13/philip-mudd

I think it's the first time I really, seriously disliked a guest.
We can only hope that his "hint" that his boses are/act like him is not true because he seems like a dangerous psychopath to me. :stare:

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Just watched this.... I actually ended up disliking Colbert; he behaved like a total ass. Mudd carried himself with dignity and professionalism.