Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Could that mean they are making them more "historic", or just adding things like facepaint to them? I guess we shall see http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/gc-huh2.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
Printable View
Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Could that mean they are making them more "historic", or just adding things like facepaint to them? I guess we shall see http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/gc-huh2.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
ROFL, they already got faceopaints http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg.../gc-happy2.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
This is an invaluable time to conduct the research. They are already in a period of reformulation so we can influence the game to a great extent
I thought you guys might appreciate this.
A couple of images of Celtic artifacts that prove that these guys were capable of producing very high quality artifacts
http://www.romans-in-britain.org.uk/...rc_norfolk.jpg
The Above is a gold torc that was found in Norfolk. This would have been worn by a high ranking member of the (Iceni) tribe's noblity.
http://www.romans-in-britain.org.uk/...up_germany.jpg
A gold cup of Germanic origin.
Are we doing the Iberian Celts? If so I'll go research it, they make up an important part of Hannibal's army as well.
The faction list is slightly above the thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Hi guys, here is a breakdown of Julius Caesar's observations of the Celts in Britain.
First impressions of the Celts in Britain are recorded (5.12)
'The population is enormous (he actually says 'infinite'). Buildings are very close together, and in style virtually identical with those in Gaul'. They use as coinage bronze or gold coins, and iron tokens of a standard weight. Tin is mined inland, iron near the coast,' (he seems to have been wrong about this) 'but only in small quantities; the bronze they use is imported. As in Gaul there is wood of every kind available, except beech and pine' - (wrong again). 'The meat of hare, chicken and goose is taboo to them, though they keep them for sport or as pets. The climate is more temperate than in Gaul, with less pronounced cold-spells.' (He obviously hit a patch of our better weather)
Battle tactics (4.33)
In battle they must have been formidable opponents. The account reads;
'This is their method of chariot-warfare. First they drive their horses all over the place, throw weapons, and by means of sheer fear of the horses and the noise of the wheels create confusion in the ranks. Then, when they have broken through the troops of the cavalry, they jump down from their chariots and do battle on foot. Meanwhile their charioteers withdraw gradually from the fighting, and position the chariots so that if the warriors are outnumbered by the enemy they can conveniently beat a hasty retreat and rejoin their own men. Such is the manoeverability of their chariots as a result of daily training, (which also explains the reliability of their infantry in battle), that they are capable of controlling their teams at full gallop down a steep, even precipitous slope, and stopping or turning them on a coin; they are also in the habit of running along the pole, standing on the yoke, and regaining the safety of the chariot again at top speed.'
As Caesar comments himself, 'novel'
Body-painting. (5.14)
Their initial impression in battle must have been made the more alarming by the Celts' use of 'woad'. Having mentioned that those who lived away from the coastal areas clothed themselves in animal skins, Caesar goes on to say that: -
'all Britons paint themselves with woad, which turns the skin a bluish-green colour; hence their appearance is all the more horrific in battle. They grow their hair long, and shave every part of their body except the top of the head and the upper lip.'
The Druids. (6.13 ff)
In the course of his account of the Gallic (i.e continental) tribes, Caesar has a good deal to say about the Druids, and early on in the passage he mentions that 'it is thought that their Rule of life was first found in Britain, and then taken across to Gaul; nowadays, those who wish to enquire into it more closely travel there in orde to find out more about it.'
Regarding Druidic training he says 'The Druids usually take no part in was, and do not pay the same taxes as everyone else. They are exempt from military service, and indeed are excused from all such obligations. These advantages prove a considerable attraction; there is no shortage of volunteers for training, and others are even sent off by parents and relatives.
With regard to the Bardic tradition of the Druids Caesar says 'Once there they are said to have to learn by heart a great deal of poetry; indeed many stay on in training for twenty years. They consider it wrong to commit all these things to writing, though in other matters, indeed both in public and private documents they use the Greek alphabet. Presumably they do this for two reasons; first, because they do not want the details of their training to become common knowledge; and secondly, because they feel that once these details were written down those undegoing training would be less inclined to develop their memory.
It should be noted that Stonehenge predates the Celts by a number of centuries, however the religion of the Druids is suspected to be based on much older rituals.
The Druids would finally meet their end on the Island of Mona. (Angelssy) The source for the following is from Tacitus...
[The Druids at Mona Island]
On the opposite shore stood the Britons, close embodied, and prepared for action. Women were seen running through the ranks in wild disorder; their apparel funeral; their hair loose to the wind, in their hands flaming torches, and their whole appearance resembling the frantic rage of the Furies. The Druids were ranged in order, with hands uplifted, invoking the gods, and pouring forth horrible imprecations. The novelty of the fight struck the Romans with awe and terror. They stood in stupid amazement, as if their limbs were benumbed, riveted to one spot, a mark for the enemy. The exhortations of the general diffused new vigour through the ranks, and the men, by mutual reproaches, inflamed each other to deeds of valour. They felt the disgrace of yielding to a troop of women, and a band of fanatic priests; they advanced their standards, and rushed on to the attack with impetuous fury.
The Britons perished in the flames, which they themselves had kindled. The island fell, and a garrison was established to retain it in subjection. The religious groves, dedicated to superstition and barbarous rites, were levelled to the ground. In those recesses, the natives [stained] their altars with the blood of their prisoners, and in the entrails of men explored the will of the gods. While Suetonius was employed in making his arrangements to secure the island, he received intelligence that Britain had revolted, and that the whole province was up in arms. (Boudicca)
Sadly we rely on the Romans for a great deal of information about the British Celts because they did not write, instead they passed down their knowledge by word of mouth.
We must allow for exaggeration on the part of the roman authors... History is after all written by the victors
As for Human Sacrifice, there is no real knowledge of what the rituals of the Druids actually were, but it is thought that they didn't practice human sacrifice.
Wow Cebei, you and Emporer are putting a lot of effort into this, great work http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...c-thumbsup.gif
Let's hit em while they're down Yeah http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...-2thumbsup.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
No Celtic or Germanic people practised human Sacrifice, smashed down Enemys were usally "Sacered" by the fighters to their preffered God (Similar like Crusaders held prayers to thank God for their Victories). This was done in the imagination that the defeated Enemy would then become a servant of this God, expecially in Germanic Areas this was done in form of the Walhalla-Cult.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Buuuuuuuuuáááááááááááááhhhhhhhhhhhhhh http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/mecry.gif Nowake is making fun of me http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/gc-cry.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
Joke http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg.../gc-jester.gif
I didn't know you had joined http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...gc-shocked.gif
But I did read it all... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...gc-stunned.gif
Something slipped by http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...nquisitive.gif
BTW, great post, Nowake http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...c-thumbsup.gif
Just to avoid confusion:
Who will do the Celtic Briton research?
The_Emperor
Big King Sanctaphrax
frogbeastegg
Who will do the Celtic Gaul research?
PSHYCO
...
Who will do the Germanic research?
Stefan the Berserker
Monk
Who will do the Dacian research?
Revenant69
Nowake
Who will do the Celti-Iberian research?
Parmenio
Aymar de Bois Mauri
Game accuracy information:
Cebei
Runes
Tacitus in Germania, chapter X (date, AD 98):
Auspicia sortesque ut qui maxime observant. Sortium consuetudo simplex: virgam frugiferae arbori decisam in surculos amputant eosque notis quibusdam discretos super candidam vestem temere ac fortuito spargunt; mox, si publice consultetur, sacerdos civitat is, sin privatim, ipse pater familiae precatus deos caelumque suspiciens ter singulos tollit, sublatos secundum impressam ante notam interpretatur.
They, more than anyone, attend to omens and divination. Their custom with regards to divination is simple: They cut down a branch from a fruit-bearing tree, and chop it into twigs; they mark these with certain signs, and sprinkle them randomly upon a w hite cloth. Thereupon, the priest of the community, if it is a public matter, or the head of the household, if it is a private one, having called upon the gods, looks up to the sky and takes up three of the twigs, one after another, and interprets them ac cording to the signs previously carved on them.
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...unengorig.htmlQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
------
The Runes are reported by Tacitus in 71 A.D. and in 200 A.D. in southern Norway the first artifact with Runic-Signs was found.
The Runes were a Script used by the Germanics in adoption of northern Etruscian Script, a proove for that theory is the Harigasthelmet from 600 B.C., which has the germanic Name "Harigast" written on it in etrusican Script.
http://www.khm.at/system2.html?/static/page1583.html
It was only logical if Runes appeared in RTW by putting them on Army-Banners or on Shields...
A good Font can be found here:
ftp://archaeologie-online.de/fonts/runettf.zip
Nowake will do the research for the gauls along with Psycho, if everyone agrees.
Nowake will have a material by next week about the dacians, also.
And this brings me to the next point of discussion:
I don't want to be the one to criticise or anything, but I have to ask you Teutonic: what will CA do with those photos depicting celtic art or whatever?
Or with the text that so generally depict the celtic way of living (both on this page)??
Because let me tell you, I saw those materials on more than one occasion. It may seem odd to you, but I think it's better if we are going to write the material, not take it from the internet. Even if you have a good source, take the material and work with it. Say what you want to have in the game, how is it possible to implement it and then back it up with historical information. And don't post just bits and pieces, find all the known flaws of a faction, then write all the solutions for it, make a cohesive text, and then post it. Or else people will not take us seriously
This is the way we can really do something, not through copy and paste and "hey, look, I can use google" kind of stuff.
Revenant69, I got your pm, as soon as I'll have something that I can post, I'll mail it to you (probably nexy week, I must go through multiple sources and make it worth reading). You shall do the same I hope.
I have found a lot of information about fortifications used by the Celtic Britons, and some info on battle gear.
I will post it later on when I am back home from work.
In response to what Nowake was sayingI was planning to produce a summary report when I had finished collating stuff in this thread... I will use that to explain my vision of how the Celtic tribes of Britons could be in the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
I'll join Cebei and help look at overall accuracy (as best I can) if he doesn't mind http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/gc-beam.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-book2.gif
I am still looking for what exactly I can do for this project. Until now we got a faction list, and a "to-be-updated" unit information.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Now things to do:
1-Check whether the faction list in the pic CA provided is historically accurate. List BS or missing factions.
2-Comment on the current units. Check which one are incorrect and AFTER THE FACTION LIST IS FULLY COMPLETE fill in the gaps.
3-A reminder: Quoting from official RTW site.
The timeframe covers approximately 264BC (the start of the 1st Punic War) to around 14AD (the death of Emperor Augustus). The main campaign will be the rise and eventual death of the Republic, including Civil Wars and the various reforms of the Roman army. The most important of these reforms, under Marius, changed the whole Roman 'way of war', and the game reflects these changes. There's loads of juicy stuff in the period: the Punic Wars, Hannibal, Spartacus, Pompey, Caesar in Gaul, the conquest of Spain, the rise of Roman 'Imperial' pretensions in the leading families, and finally the seizure of power by the Imperators... That's a lot of gameplay and history We will be including a couple of smaller campaigns and a selection of tasty and exciting historical battles for those who want a snack rather than a full-on Roman feast :)
So this is basically the timeframe we are going to work on.
Well honestly I was expecting someone else would do that and I would research the historical accuracy, while I am sitting next to the largest library in the Balkans and the Middle East. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-book2.gif Anywayz...Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
To Nowake:
quoting from myself:Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
I think we will receive a similar criticism from anybody, who is willing to put effort in this. Cant we just organize for a second please?Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Nowake, you can find the faction and unit info slightly above the thread.
You are joking right?... Of course Welcome aboard, though I dont have any better source than the totalwar.com http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...nquisitive.gif We gotta find reliable "insider" information. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/gc-lost.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
Structures and Fortifications used by the Britons.
During the Iron Age, different structures were used, however large, thatched roundhouses seem to be the most common structure used by most of the Tribes. They were made of wood
It is likely that the house would have been divided into different areas for eating, sleeping and communal activities. The fire is stationed in the very heart of the home providing the heat and light required by all.
The remains of stone-built houses called duns have also been found in central Scotland, Argyll and Galloway.
Hill Forts, Brochs and Crannogs
The Tribes of Britons were nearly always at war with one another, and as a result impressive fortifications were constructed as a response to the raids and incursions by other Tribes, they also reflected the power and status of the tribe that built them.
Hill Forts were made up of collections of Roundhouses, and varied considerably in size and complexity. Some are less than half the size of a Football pitch with very few buildings. Others encompass whole communities on a defendable hilltop, surrounded by ditches and steep banks.
The hill fort of Maiden Castle in Dorset is a great example.
Even today the ditches and banks of Maiden Castle Hill Fort are a spectacular impression in the British landscape. Covering an area of over 45 Acres The site is largely Iron Age construction. There are literally hundreds of such sites in Britain but most are a lot smaller than Maiden Castle, it is in fact the largest Iron Age Hill Fort in Europe.
http://www.historic-uk.com/Destinati...dencastle4.jpg
“some ramparts rising to a height of 6 metres (20 feet). “ (I wouldn’t like to have assaulted that)
Scotland boasts some truly impressive defences, built as an effect of fighting among its tribes. (This may help to explain why it was never fully subdued by the Romans).
In the North and the West of Scotland where there were very few trees the settlements were built of stone, but they were still built to the same design. Often they built Brochs beside their huts into which they would retreat if they came under attack. These were huge circular, stone constructions, much wider at the base with a tiny entrance.
People could herd their livestock into the Brochs if necessary, as these were kept stocked with supplies of food. Water supplies, or even a well inside, ensured the survival of a tribe when under threat.
http://netmedia.co.uk/history/week-3/broch.jpg
(Check out the thickness of those walls guys) http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...gc-stunned.gif
Also in Scotland the Celts built settlements called Crannogs, which were floating wooden settlements on lochs and moors. A floating platform would be built from wood and upon this floating platform they would build a round hut approximately fifteen metres in diameter. Around the timber walls of the crannogs, there was a walkway, and on the side looking over the loch access for a harbour. A narrow causeway reached the shore. The people who lived here planted crops in nearby fields, and could withdraw to their Crannogs should danger threaten
http://netmedia.co.uk/history/week-3/crannog.gif
Alright guys, that’s about it for my bit on fortifications.
Equipment
After checking at numerous sites I have found out that the Spear was the main weapon of the time, Practically every warrior would have one no matter his level in society.
In addition the Javelin was also very common among, presumably the spear and Javelin were the easiest weapons to make and get your hands on.
Sword were used by warriors of high station within the Tribes, this would be used with the Shield in regular combat they were around 70CM in length, Sword development was an artwork at the time so their use was more limited.
The very elite of Celtic Society could have possession of Armoured Helmets and some Chain mail, however these were extremely rare and were reserved by Chieftans and the Nobility of the Tribe.
No Evidence of Archery being used either for hunting or for warfare has been found from this period, and in fact the Sling was a more common weapon to shoot stones at enemies. In one Hill Fort some 20,000 stones were found, which indicates that it was a very widespread weapon at the time and especially used to defend the Hill Forts from attack. (presumably this is one of the reasons why the Celts lost, because the Roman Shields would offer good protection)
Axes do not seem to be the mainstay of the Celtic armies, but it can be assumed that during a time of crisis anything that would work as a weapon will do for those at the bottom end of the social ladder… As such they could have been used, but they were not the mainstay weapon in the Armies of Britons (Contrary to what we currently seem to have).
I hope you guys enjoyed reading this.
who would you like me to kll? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-grin2.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
what exactly are we looking for in the way of "inside information"? With my pushy personality and your booksmarts we should accomplish much http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-grin2.gif
We have to find ANY CA staff. They must know that the fans are preparing a study. There MUST be a staff here in the forum.. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...gc-builder.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
I will hunt them to the end of the earth http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...c-glasses2.gif
They often post in the Colosseum, so a thread with a link in it could be handy. (Or maybe moving it)Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-rifle.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
Who are they? Any nicks? And perhaps it is a good idea to move the thread into the colloseum..Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
well off the top of my head I can think of
Captain Fishpants
EatColdSteel
(these spellings are not entirely correct)
Intrepid Sidekick
Captain Fishpants
JeromeGrasdyke
Are three that I know of... there are others.
Well, after what I though we should work out complete Texts and combine them in an Portofilo to be sent by Post to CA's Development-Department.
Anotherthing we can do is to use the Results of our Research for produceing a Mod based on Viking Invasions, with which we can show exactly what we think that should be done...
We might be able to ge a Mod to sticky a Link leading here in the Colloseum saying something like "CA please read this".
The staff who read the forums do go where it says "read this ect." just throwing an idea out there http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-book2.gif
Cebei wrote:
Sure What faction? With that library, if you have the time, you can do that too http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...c-thumbsup.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
I think you all of you are finding great info at lightning pace http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg.../gc-dizzy2.gif
I'll try to catch up... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/gc-lost.gif
The groups so far:
Who will do the Celtic Briton research?
The_Emperor
Big King Sanctaphrax
frogbeastegg
Who will do the Celtic Gaul research?
PSHYCO
Nowake
Who will do the Germanic research?
Stefan the Berserker
Monk
Who will do the Dacian research?
Revenant69
Nowake
Who will do the Celti-Iberian research?
Parmenio
Aymar de Bois Mauri
Game accuracy information:
Cebei
Teutonic Knight
But like Nowake, Cebei and Teutonic Knight said, we really should try to coordinate ourselves. I'm getting lost http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...c-confused.gif
As for Rosacrux:
I agree that we should make something about that. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/gc-yes.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
But I didn't start this group. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/gc-cry.gif
If everyone agrees, why not? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...c-thumbsup.gif
Do you really want to make it a separate group?Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Wouldn't it be beneficial to the workload if it was the same?
You could do the research until someone else is available to help you. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-book2.gif
Let's see if I can catch up to you guys... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-wink2.gif
What does "Viriato" mean?
Viriato (pronounced: Vi-rah-'ta)
Portuguese male's name ' Viriato':
from the Latin male's name Viriathus or Viriatus',
from the Latin noun Viriae',
from the Continental Celtic noun for 'arm ornament or bracelet'.
Sources:
viriae: n, Latin derived from Celtic, for a kind of ornament for the arm, armlets, bracelets. 1
viriâtus: a, um, adj. [viriae], adorned with bracelets. 2
Viriâthus or Viriâtus: i, m., a celebrated leader of the Lusitans in the war against the Romans. 3
Biography of Viriato
For nearly 200 years, the Roman Empire waged an episodic war attempting to colonize the Iberian peninsula in western Europe. The most difficult fighting was encountered in the western areas of the peninsula - the home of the tribal confederation known as the Lusitans.
Viriato lived in the Mons Herminus hills (modern day eastern Portugal). He was famous for his physical prowess and stamina, his sobriety and his disregard for personal wealth. The historian, Diodorus writes of Viriato's wedding, to the daughter of a rich landowner whom he regarded with some reserve because of his father-in-law's support of Roman ways. Remaining unmoved by the display of gold, silver and expensive fabrics at his wedding feast, Viriato refused pressing invitations to take a place of honor. He remained standing, leaning on his spear and took only a little bread and meat, which he shared with his companions. When the bride was brought before him, he offered sacrifice in the Lusitan manner, set her on the cropper of his horse and rode away into the hills to his hideout.
Pre-dating the birth of Viriato, the Lusitans had traditionally raided lands to their east and south, taking livestock from their neighboring tribes. The Lusitans had seen the Roman presence (started around 198 b.c.), become progressively more domineering in the region, and sought to check their colonization by raiding Roman settlements and army camps. Subsequently the Romans branded these Lusitans barbaric brigands and sought to exterminate them.
Leading up to 146 b.c., Viriato initially lived as a pastoral goat herder, then engaged in Lusitan raids on Roman settlements as a source of wealth.
In 146 b.c. Viriato was elected Chieftain after he lead the survivors of a massacre out of a Roman deathtrap. His ingenious guerrilla tactics and success at taking the battle to the Romans, kept the Romans out of Lusitan tribal lands, curtailed their advances into other parts of the Iberian Peninsula and sparked "rebellions" with other tribes under Roman control.
In 141 b.c., Viriato, allowed a defeated and prostrate Roman army to return to Rome, requesting only that the borders of the Lusitans be respected and that the Lusitans be granted the status of 'amici populi Romani ' - 'friends of the Roman people'. These peace terms were actually ratified by the Roman Senate.
During the next two years the Romans broke this and other treaties they made with the Lusitans. In 139 b.c. the Roman general bribed 3 lieutenants of Viriato to kill him, they assassinated Viriato in his sleep.
It was not until 19 b.c. that the Roman Empire including legions under the command of Julius Caesar and Augustus, had waged war on the Lusitans that they were defeated, enslaved, and all of their lands annexed into the Roman Empire.
For the next 250 years, history begins to keep a more descriptive record of Roman expansion in Europe. From this history we find many more accounts of the wars in later-day France, Germany, England and the rest of Europe, and the names of other great tribal leaders who fought to remain free against Imperial Rome.
Lusitan Culture and History
Megalithic Age:
Monuments on Lusitan tribal lands, (in central/northern Portugal and southern Galiza).
1. Antas do Barrocal
2. Cromlech dos Almendras
3. Cromlech dos Almendras
4. Dolmen de Arca
5. Menhir y Cromelach do Xarez
6. Orca de Pendile
Bronze and Iron Ages:
Before the Greeks and Romans stumbled over:
"It is believed that the Lusitans had arrived in the Iberian peninsula more recently than their neighbors the Turdetans and the Celtici of Cuneus.
They probably came about the same time as the Celtiberians in the valley of the Ebro River and the mesetas of the hinterland, sometime before 700 b.c.
One can safely say that they belonged to the great Celtic confederation which invaded the Iberian peninsula about seven centuries before the birth of Christ, and collided with the Gallic peoples and those belonging to the Euskarian and Indo-Scythian races who had occupied the peninsula for an unknown number of centuries, ever since the first migrations of the Asiatic hordes into the West.
The Lusones, who in the opinion of Strabo, lived near the sources of the Tagus, and who were members of the Celtiberian nation, were probably only an offshoot of the Lusitans, who remained on the highlands of the Ibubeda.
Their name could well have been the original name of the Lusitans, who, in successive waves of conquest, came down from the sources of the river, where they had first settled, as far as its lower reaches and it's mouth, the broad and deep body of water which flows into the Atlantic Ocean."
Greek and Roman writings:
"All the men dress in black, for the most part in coarse cloaks, in which they sleep, on their beds of litter. But the women always go clad in long mantles and gay colored gowns.
Instead of coined money the people, at least those who live deep in the interior, employ barter, or else cut off pieces of beaten silver metal and pass them as money.
They marry in the manner of the Greeks. Their sick they expose upon the streets, in the same way as the Egyptians did in ancient times, for the sake of getting suggestions from those who have experienced the disease.
All the mountaineers lead a simple life, are water-drinkers, sleep on the ground, and let their hair stream down in thick masses after the manner of women, though before going into battle they bind their hair about the forehead. They eat goat meat mostly. They also hold contests, for light-armed and heavy armed soldiers and cavalry, in boxing, in running, in skirmishing, and in fighting by squads.
And the mountaineers, for two-thirds of the year eat acorns, which they have first dried and crushed, and then ground up and made into a bread that may be stored away for a long time. They also drink beer; but they are scarce of wine, and what wine they made they speedily drink up in merry feastings with their kinfolk; and instead of olive-oil they use butter. Again, they dine sitting down, for they have stationary seats built around the walls of the room, they sit themselves forward according to age and rank. The dinner is passed round and amid their cups they dance to flute and trumpet, dancing in chorus, but also leaping up and crouching low.
The Lusitans are given to laying ambush, given to spying out, are quick nimble and good at deploying troops. They have a small shield two feet in diameter, concave in front, and suspended from the shoulder by means of thongs, for it has neither arm rings or handles. Besides these shields they have a dirk or butchers' knife. Most of them wear linen cuirasses; a few wear chain-wrought cuirasses and helmets with three crests, but the rest wear helmets made of sinews. The foot-soldiers wear greaves also, and each soldier has several javelins; and some also make use of spears, and the spears have bronze heads.
The Lusitanians offer sacrifices, and they inspect the vitals, without cutting them out. Besides, they also inspect the veins on the side of the victim; and they divine by the tokens of touch too. They prophesy through means of the vitals of human beings also, prisoners of war, whom they first cover with course clocks, and then, when the victim has been struck beneath the vitals by the diviner, they draw their first auguries from the fall of the victim. And they cut off the right hands of captives and set them up as an offering for their gods."
An account of a confrontation with Roman general Fabius Maximus Servilianus and his army of 18,000 troops and 1600 cavalry near Itucca - "Viriato, at the head of 6000 troops, attacked him with loud shouts and barbaric clamor, his men wearing the long hair which in battles they are accustomed to shake in order to terrify their enemies."
The modern "Galego-Portugues" language descends from the Latinized Lusitanian tongue.
Larger than life sculptures, carved out of a single piece of granite, the ancient 'guerreiro' sculptures, have been damaged from being purposely tipped over, causing the head and feet to be broken off, done initially by the Romans, but also later by others seeking to destroy veneration of Lusitan culture. "Restorations" done over the centuries, do not always do justice to the sculptures:
References
1. Pliny 33, 3, 12, 40; Tert. Pall. 4 mde.; Ambros. Abrah. 1, 9 88. Ancient texts.
2. Lucil. ap. Non. p. 186, 30; Varr. ib. p. 187, 14. Ancient texts.
3. Liv. Epit. 52; 54; Vell. 2, 1, 3; 2, 90, 3; Flor. 2, 17 fin.; Cic. Off. 2, 11, 40; Val. Max. 6, 4,2; Sil. 4, 354; 10, 219. Ancient Texts.
4. Appian. Appian's Roman History, Book 6, The Wars in Spain, Chapters 10-12. Cambridge, Massachusetts, Harvard University Press,1932.
5. Rafael Trevino and Angus McBride. Rome's Enemies, Group 4, Spanish Armies, Great Britain, Reed International Books Ltd., 1986.
6. Martin Almagro-Gorbea and, Gonzalo Ruiz Zapatero. Paleoenthnology of Iberian Peninsula: State of Knowledge and Future Perspectives.
7. Antonio Atturbius. The Stones Speak.
8. Strabo. Geography, 3.3.6. ancient text.
9. Appian. Appian's Roman History Book 6, The Wars in Spain, Chapter 12, Cambridge, Massachusetts, Harvard University Press, 1932.
Maps and further pictures and information is on this site:
Viriato: Warrior-Chieftain of the Lusitans
Aymar, I don't think that we should split our forces so soon. Lets focus in our primary goal and only after that think of something else.
So Egypt, Greece etc. can wait. My opinion. Of course, it depends on what the others have to say.
Also, about Viriato. What exactly do you want to have in the game close to this? Lusitans? Specify, comment the text, show what should be changed, underline the importance of the lusitans etc.
Aymar, thanks for the support lad, I was joking when saying to form a new group (you can tell that by the names I have proposed for the "new group" http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-smile.gif )
I really don't think there should be several "movements" (one for the barbarian, another for the Greeks, a third shall come up with requests for the Romans - "dump the Gladiators" - and someone surely shall bicker about the Easteners at some point - not to mention those who are going berserk about wardogs, flaming pigs, Xena, Hercules, DareDevil, Spiderman, Asterix or whoever else CA shall include in the game to "appeal to a broader audience).
If all of us longing for at least some level of historical accuracy in RTW, get together, we might just pull a rabbit or two out of this hat. If we don't... well, we'll have Hyksos chariots and 3rd Dynasty footmen for Egypt, not to mention Dacian Falxmen http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...nquisitive.gif and Chosen Ones http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-grin2.gif for the Celts.
Nowake, it's not a matter of "splitting forces", if there are some people willing to do the research for the respective faction, they would propably be others than those who already have gotten their feet wet with the "Barbarians".
Of course if you people decide on taking up the greater task, you should think of changing the name of the Movement... but then again it's up to you.
Cheers http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...c-thumbsup.gif
I am sure some people remembered we had created a same 'movement' for linguistic accuracy (still CA is insinsting on using 'accented' english though) in RTW for hellenes and romans. I agree with Rosacrux that we should stay united. We should pursue our goals if we do not want RTW to go horribly wrong...
Ok, don't bite my head off. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/gc-sad2.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
I was too eager to post something interesting. A childish aproach. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...c-rolleyes.gif
I'll be more specific in the future.
In fact, only today can I really start getting info.
Well, I wasn't aware. I didn't traslate the Latin... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...embarassed.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
Yeap, that's what I said. Extra people...Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Sorry but, what could go more horribly wrong than now? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...nquisitive.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
Well, thinking about it...
Asterix? Obélix? Ideafix raging packs?
OK, I shouldn't have asked http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-grin2.gif