Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
I might yet get it. Just not until it gets a price drop or two. While not the greatest it wasn't bad either. I haven't finished my Dark Crusade IG campagin yet. Which while miles better than any other RTS campagin feels like 6 campaginesque missions interceded by ramdom map games. Still the Commander upgrading is nice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by econ21
But I doubt either can compete with M2TW or NWN2 for my gaming time right now.
Ain't that the truth. I'm not even going to bother with the expansion for Star Wars: empire at war (Forces of corruption) until post christmas cash spending.
11-25-2006, 10:31
Ciaran
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
I can see that, but of course both games really owe their debt to classic tabletop minatures wargames. Warhammer is such a beast. And I gather the core CA designers were wargamers who, in their youth, when they were not pushing counters over hexes, were pushing minatures over tablecloths.
Playing both Warhammer tabletop and TW, I can testify to how much better the computer is than the tabletop for such a game. For the rather anti-social, like myself, it gives you an opponent in the AI. And for everyone, it gets rid of the big fat rule book and, even better, the rules lawyers.
Not to mention the collecting and painting issue. But you´re right, I think that, in principle, the TW games are tabletops come to life. That is why I am so very sad that the Warhammer mod never got beyond beta stage. Maybe it wouldn´t have been able to simulate all of Warhammers bells and whistles, with the impossibility to simulate flying units or heroes, but still...
11-25-2006, 13:21
econ21
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ciaran
Not to mention the collecting and painting issue... That is why I am so very sad that the Warhammer mod never got beyond beta stage.
Ironically, the collecting and painting issue is the one area where Warhammer scores with me. I have a young son and those aspects are really fun to share with him. It's a common interest and there is a certain pride almost in having a full, nicely painted warhammer army. It's absurdly expensive, of course, but he's got to spend his pocket/birthday/Christmas money on something - and quite frankly most kids toys are boring by comparison. We may get more into the gaming side as he enters his teens.
BTW, what happened with the Warhammer mod - was it just another mod team collapsing or did GW stop it because of copyright issues?
11-25-2006, 22:59
CountArach
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
was it just another mod team collapsing or did GW stop it because of copyright issues?
The team just collapsed due to a lot of them not being active at allf or an extended period of time. I was really looking forward to it as well, because I am a huge Warhammer Fantasy fanatic.
11-26-2006, 11:27
Meneldil
Re : Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ciaran
Not to mention the collecting and painting issue.
Well, I spent much more time collecting and painting my W40K Eldars or WAB Wood Elves than actually playing with them, and although that may seem odd, I don't regret it.
Most of the time, playing Warhammer TT ends up in being a real frustration, either because you play against a real 15 year old lawyer (No, you *can't* do that if you don't roll a 18, as explained on the page 458 of the Warhammer rules compendium for 3rd edition), or against someone who use loopholes or exploits to just wtfpwn everyone else (Yeah, I can field an army composed of a huge dragon and 10 ogres that will kill half your army in one turn, there's *nothing* in the rules against it). I'm not even speaking about people who get crazy mad when they lose a game.
So, when I saw that tournaments with random people were crappy as hell, I ended up playing from times to times with the same 2 friends.
11-26-2006, 11:44
Watchman
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
"The biggest problem in playing Vampire: The Masquerade is that you'll have to interact with the kinds of people who play it."
- Penny-Arcade
11-27-2006, 15:46
econ21
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Watchman
"The biggest problem in playing Vampire: The Masquerade is that you'll have to interact with the kinds of people who play it."
- Penny-Arcade
Totally off-topic, but I just have to plug the Vampire Bloodlines computer game. I can imagine playing a pen and paper version would be excruciating for the reason Watchman indicates. But on the computer, it was one of most immersive gaming experiences I've ever had. Only System Shock 2 has rivalled it. It's kind of what you might imagine good pen and paper role-playing should be, without the embarassment.
11-27-2006, 18:08
drone
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
Originally Posted by econ21
I tried the full game - not got very far with it, yet, of course. So far, I am not enamoured of it - for a start, I can't find a "pause" button, which is a biggie for me. Also can't find how to slow down the scroll speeds, so the battles all feel rather out of control. Maybe I'll get use to it (M2TW also took a while).
I haven't played yet, but the lack of a tactical pause was a big issue on the forums. The Pause/Break key supposedly pauses the game, but you cannot issue orders while paused (yet).
Quote:
Originally Posted by econ21
I can see that, but of course both games really owe their debt to classic tabletop minatures wargames. Warhammer is such a beast. And I gather the core CA designers were wargamers who, in their youth, when they were not pushing counters over hexes, were pushing minatures over tablecloths.
In a thread a while back, Captain Fishpants mentioned that he was part of the team that wrote Rogue Trader, the 40K first edition rules.
I haven't installed the game yet. I need to get a new PC to cope with the graphics for MoC, M2TW, NWN2, and all the other goodness getting ready to come out. I am also going to wait a few months until they patch the game up properly. The game was definitely rushed for Christmas, and I don't feel like going through a beta-test cycle for a couple of months. Dark Omen was a pretty good game at the time, maybe I'll just re-install that to get my fix for a while.
12-02-2006, 15:15
Ciaran
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Watchman
"The biggest problem in playing Vampire: The Masquerade is that you'll have to interact with the kinds of people who play it."
- Penny-Arcade
Quoted for the truth of it. Much the same applies for me as far as Multiplayer is concerned. The until-recently lack of a decent I-Net connection aside, that is.
Back to the topic of Warhammer, browsing the net a bit in the last few days, I´ve stumbled over Warhammers little (or big :inquisitive: ) brother Warmaster, which I find to hold a lot more appeal to me. The rules seem to me a lot more streamlined, it´s mostly about deployment and command, and less about actually fighting. Oh, and the rulebook is free on the net: http://www.specialist-games.com/warmaster/default.asp
12-02-2006, 17:33
monkian
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
Originally Posted by econ21
Totally off-topic, but I just have to plug the Vampire Bloodlines computer game. I can imagine playing a pen and paper version would be excruciating for the reason Watchman indicates. But on the computer, it was one of most immersive gaming experiences I've ever had. Only System Shock 2 has rivalled it. It's kind of what you might imagine good pen and paper role-playing should be, without the embarassment.
I really liked Bloodlines but it was bugy as hell and there was very little after sale support for it :wall:
And System Shock 2 still 0wnz j00 :2thumbsup:
12-07-2006, 12:30
JFC
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
Originally Posted by econ21
BTW, what happened with the Warhammer mod - was it just another mod team collapsing or did GW stop it because of copyright issues?
Originally Posted by Games Workshop
MODIFICATIONS, TOTAL CONVERSIONS, AND GAMES
We want people to express their enjoyment of our games with as little interference from us as possible, as long as they behave reasonably with our IP and follow any reasonable requests that we may make. We are not inherently opposed to hobbyists creating games or mods using our IP, in fact we are flattered that people want to spend so much time creating games and mods in the GW universes.
If you want to make a game, TC or a mod using our IP you must adhere to the following (in addition to the general principles as outlined above):
* Any game or mod must be a "total conversion." In other words, you must not use our intellectual property (logos, images, names etc.) in relation to the worlds, names, logos, or images of any other company. For example, you cannot place our Space Marines in a Disney total conversion using the Unreal engine, but you could make a TC solely using Space Marines with the Unreal engine. This is, of course, assuming that you have permission to use the Unreal engine.
* Please bear in mind that we may require you to remove the game or mod from any public forum at any time so that we can comply with any licenses that we may have with computer game publishers/developers. Be aware that we may even have to insist that the mod be destroyed. Please take very careful note of this statement, as we would not want you to feel unfairly treated at a later date.
* The game or mod must be strictly non-commercial – this includes any web site that the mod or game is hosted on. You also cannot pay a printing company to publilsh copies of it onto CD. It may also mean that you cannot get sponsorship.
* It must be made clear on any readme files, splash/intro screens and accompanying material that the game or mod is unofficial and the origins of the intellectual property must be made obvious (e.g., your mod might say �Battletoes � a total conversion for XXXX (insert game name) using intellectual property owned by Games Workshop. Used without permission...etc." See the relevant disclaimer on the following page.).
* The game or mod must not devalue any Games Workshop product in any way.
* Any distribution (zipped or otherwise) of the whole, or any part, of the mod or game must be accompanied with the appropriate disclaimers and must also follow these guidelines.
* The functionality, atmosphere, and parameters of any mod or game must be consistent with the relevant IP.
I think from that Gamesworkshop are pretty easy going.
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Yes, Episolatory Richard pointed that out to me a while back. I am not sure I would describe it as easy going:
Quote:
Originally Posted by GW
Please bear in mind that we may require you to remove the game or mod from any public forum at any time so that we can comply with any licenses that we may have with computer game publishers/developers. Be aware that we may even have to insist that the mod be destroyed. Please take very careful note of this statement, as we would not want you to feel unfairly treated at a later date.
Given that clause, if I was a modder working on a Warhammer themed mod, I think I would spend every day of my life living in fear. :sweatdrop:
That's why I asked about the mod, because with Mark of Chaos being released, I could see that clause being invoked. Glad to infer that it has not. :2thumbsup: Let's hope GW keep being easy going.
12-12-2006, 00:37
Slyspy
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
GW are historically anything but easy going when it comes to their intellectual property. They may be more relaxed these days due to the difficulty of policing the internet, but I doubt it. I certainly wouldn't work on a mod using GW IP. Even if their lawyers don't get you for minor infringements you might find host sites, service providers etc become less than helpful.
But that is because I'm a coward. I would love to see a Warhammer TC for any of the TW games because Mark of Chaos is absolute rubbish. Really, really bad when you consider that the game's natual competition are the table top originals and, of course, the TW series.
12-12-2006, 00:43
lars573
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Also their mod disclaimer is worded in such a way that creating Warhammer skins for a none warhammer game is a violantion of the IP.
12-12-2006, 16:13
Bob the Insane
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
I have read over this thread a couple of times and to one thing I think it is missing is a formum member's review of the actual game... :laugh4:
Does anyone actually have it?
12-12-2006, 16:25
econ21
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
But I confess, I am not in hurry to go back to it. M2TW, EB v0.8, NNW2 and DoW:MC are all higher up my "to play" list. As are the Warhammer and 40k tabletop games, to be honest.
12-12-2006, 16:43
drone
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
But I confess, I am not in hurry to go back to it. M2TW, EB v0.8, NNW2 and DoW:MC are all higher up my "to play" list. As are the Warhammer and 40k tabletop games, to be honest.
I own it as well, but I haven't installed it yet. From what I can gather at Namco's forum, it needs a few patches, so I'm waiting for that to settle out before I play it. There are some balance issues, and it's appears to have been rushed to release.
My recommendation is wait.
12-14-2006, 20:57
Slyspy
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
The official forums are an empty wasteland, a fact which should tell you something about the game.
I confess to only having tried the demo. It was terrible. As I said, it simply cannot compete with the alternatives, which are essentially the TW series for computer gamers and the TT games for hobbyists. I certainly wouldn't waste my money on it. Even if I got it for free I wouldn't play it.
12-14-2006, 21:53
econ21
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slyspy
The official forums are an empty wasteland, a fact which should tell you something about the game.
Interesting - that's a great way to assess a game; read the official or some fan forums. I hope I remember that next time I have an impulse to buy a strange game. Finding the Org was one thing that convinced me the TW series had real depth. Similarly, reading the many GW TT sites shows there is a lot to the game even if it ultimately loses out to TW as a wargame, IMO.
01-23-2007, 14:44
pevergreen
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Bought the game today. Very fun, the battles are better than M2TW atm.
Spec'ing your hero for one duty is so awsome.
2 bad points:
1. Set money values only
2. Limited Units
01-23-2007, 17:11
drone
Re: Warhammer: Mark of Chaos (and Warhammer general)
Quote:
Originally Posted by pevergreen
Bought the game today. Very fun, the battles are better than M2TW atm.
Spec'ing your hero for one duty is so awsome.
2 bad points:
1. Set money values only
2. Limited Units
Did they add friendly fire to the latest patch? That was one of my biggest issues with the game as released.
