Well then.....
Is there siege artillery in this era?
Will it be available generally, or constructed for sieges only?
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Well then.....
Is there siege artillery in this era?
Will it be available generally, or constructed for sieges only?
You may have misunderstood me. The onager has superior range and power to the ballista, due to the sling-motion involved. There are no benefits of using the ballista over the onager, other than the fact that it's easier to aim with (higher initial accuracy).Quote:
Originally Posted by Wigferth Ironwall
Yes, as you could see in my last post. Though arrow projectors have little use in the game as it is. You see, arrow projectors' main purpose was to provide covering fire for regular siege operations. If "covering fire" doesn't make the enemy cower, then it's not technically providing "covering fire". Historically, the first ever catapult was made for this purpose, at the siege of Motya when the Syracusans attacked the Carthaginian main base on Sicilia, Motya.Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh
I see that stoneprojectors will naturally still have a clearcut role, but it's different with the arrow projectors. I am not sure how this could ever be reflected in any way. Supressive fire cannot be reflected without having access to the sourcecode. They were particularly useful in Caesar's sieges for hindering repair-efforts on enemy walls. The Gaul wooden wall had caught fire at a point, and the Gauls started dousing the fire with water. Caesar directed many or all of his scorpios to that part of the wall, killing the Gauls as they came with the bucket of water.
Ideally, we'd have greek machines initially: Oxybeles (arrow projector), Lithobolos (stone projector)
Only buildable by the Greek and Carthaginian factions.
Almost everyone else (barbs, romans etc, NOT persians) would at this stage have to capture siege artillery manufactured by the enemy. We will script this..
It's also possible to make some of them mercenaries, since these engineers sold their services to the highest bidder often.
Later, the Romani will get the much improved Catapulta (arrow projector) and Ballista (stone projector), which are perfections of the Greek designs. This will require a high MIC and academia to reflect the time it took for the Romani to get started in the field of belopoiika..
As to your question of whether or not it will be built in general or before a siege.. I don't even think it's possible to build it before a siege. I think we are forced to use the system as it is. Hardcoded. So I think it'll be "in general". It is a bit ridiculous to bring a giant Lithobolos to a battlefield, but that's just something we'll have to live with I guess.
Oh, ok. I could have sworn the onager was inferior, pound for pound. Well never mind, I'll put Roman artillery on my to-read list.
wouldn't it be a good idea to have less provinces, when i first found out that there were less in BI i was annoyed, but now ive tried it it is actually more fun, you end up fighting more battles in the field which is more fun and realistic then siege after siege against huge stone walls you could use forts to represent smaller settlements, after all historically many conqusts happened by taking the capital.
I think you forgot about "bullet" path - onager one is flying much higher and trus it's less likely to hit wall, but could destroy buildings insde city. Ballista "bullet" is flying low (or at least it could) so it is better in crushing walls.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shigawire
You can actually make art buildable during siege - the tower is armed so you could replace arrow projector "inside tower" with balista or lithobolos creating sth like Helepolis.
this will probably be a problem as you want to make art slower spreading and siege towers are the same in every culture.
Will this in field art slowdown army carrying them, like in vanilia?
I think they shouldn't as those were either carried in parts or build in place so art should move on camp map as fast as infantry.
This is incorrect. Firstly, the Onager is mural artillery. It is made to take down walls, and does it quite well. Nobody develops artillery in this era for the purpose of destroying regular buildings. Secondly, both the ballistae/lithoboloi and onagri can be adjusted a great deal and can achieve the same AOA. Although the Ballista is truly easier to adjust in order to fire at low angles of 5-10 degrees.Quote:
Originally Posted by O'ETAIPOS
Thirdly, the default Exit AOA (Angle Of Attack) is almost identical between the Ballista and Onager. The optimum AOA for a stone-projector is 43.5°, for maximum range of 420 meters with a 30-mina stone-projector (13kg).
Unsurprisingly, the Onager uses the exact same optimum AOA of around 43.5°.
Besides. It doesn't matter, because in either case it's adjustable. On the onager, it is adjustable by the crossbar as well as by adjusting/replacing the sling, while on the palintonon/ballista it's adjustable by tilting the entire syrinx/diostra as well as the daktyl.
Then sorry. I was not aware that onager could be so easily adjusted.
What about my other questions?
Could you give lithobolos and balistae parameter that makes them less powerful in rain?
Well, the onager cannot "easily" be adjusted. Nor can the ballista/palintonon be easily adjusted. It takes a lot of effort on both. ~:)
I hope so, but I'm not sure.Quote:
Originally Posted by O'ETAIPOS