Sorry - TRIPLE post.... another one of those days :no:
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Sorry - TRIPLE post.... another one of those days :no:
the only thing im having troubles is that when i install your mod to the MTW VI gold eddition directory. it like i think overwrites the source info of the e.e so that it doesn't recognise the cd-rom..
i been playing samuari warlords MTW mod andMTW XL so it not a issuse of tech diff. i think you mod is not total war era's friendly. ohh well next version maybe.
ah...no
this mod does not alter or edit the executable in any way shape or form,
if you are having DVD issues they are not caused by HTW
ok i installed.
gold eddition for MTW VI already patched to 2.01 cause its gold..
then installed MTW XL then patched to 2.1
then installed Hellenic Total War
and i still get the message that correct cd rom needs to be in there.
meanwhile it is still the MTW VI Gold cd is still int eh cd drive....
i know it works if i just figure this out.
cause Samuari warlords and MTW XL still works for me in copied MTW VI 2.01
other folders...
ok i got it figured out.
the hellnic patch overwrites the mtw VI exe and requirs another cd-rom other then the cd rom i had in there it was probably lookin for an older version of the cd-roms. so whati did was over-write it with a previous exe tha ti took from the XL mod exe folder.
i now have. 3
samuari mod
xl mod
and hellnic mod.
i don't wanna rain on oyur parade bro. but somthing came ot my attention that must be fixed as because of time line and wars through the world.
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the first WAR to reach the 5,000 + were in japan with shogun total war.even int he history books when eourpe started dukign things out with lil over 2-3,00 with the crusades thats per battle leading there.
so your unit size's in HTW and bronze age well there not historicaly correct. there a wet dream of pamela at night if i may say..
not to mention having such huge armys .. comptly utterly invite CTD's
reccomend units size no greater then 100..
but thats just my opion.
No offense man, but you might want to look back over your history books. I may not be a history buff when it comes to the bronze age time period, but i know if you move on to the hellenic period the persians had armies of more than 100,000 men. The shogun total war period is far past what this mod is about, so what does that have to do with this time period? Oh and I think the unit sizes are fine, at least based on the limited knowledge i have on this time period.
Hi. Regarding the Sea Peoples:
Have you considered having the Sea Peoples launch crusades to simulate their migrations?
The Fall of Rome mod uses the crusade function to simulate the barbarian invasions... and it works quite well. As long as the Sea Peoples are "Catholic", and the target areas are "Orthodox", "Muslim", or "Pagan" it should work. You could make the Anatolian/Middle Eastern cultures Orthodox and Muslim... and the Western/Northern European culture "Catholic". That would channel the Sea Peoples in the appropriate direction.
In Fall of Rome, the barbarians seem to target the high value Roman provinces when they launch their crusades. If you made Egypt, Hatti, etc. particularly high value provinces, I believe you could direct the Sea Peoples towards those provinces.
You can also play with the strength level of crusades so they would be an appropriate threat.
While it seems logical, using the pagan Viking faction slot probably won't achieve what you're looking for because it's just too undirected.
Crusades!
to respond to you ..Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Lord
what i mean is. the most ppl on the field in was the japanese. the persians came in waves.
im tlaking total war. against 1 faction vs another. you think the persians and the greek were the only ones going at it.
take a look at the expansion map of the persian empire. in the bronze age you will notice they didn't have everything.
i will admit they came close. but the history books state
that the most ppl to go all out war. not still traveling not mobilizing im talking battle all in the same day.. not how big the army is in waiting.
im talking engaged in battle the most i have ever red was in japan. when armies starting reaching the 3-5,000
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100,000 men you say i think you took that from 300. anyways to tell you the truth about the war of sparta VS the persian. IT WAS GUERILLA war fare
HOLLYWOOD likes to exagerate films.
(sooo back to topic of war)
the most arimes to be ENGAGED IN BATTLE. was by the japanes in the segjoku dai era<-- sory for mispelling.. when the entire country was in civil war.
also would like to say that in response if your gonna say troy VS sparta.
that war lasted so long the death toll was in the 10,000 but it came no where near the 1,000 mark of the most men duking it out.
im sure the greeks had 10,000 but it wasn't all out battle.
inthe segjokudai era.. is when the portugese and the english began there gunpowder and christian missionary's in japan. so if therefor the most men to be engaged in battle. was in the japan
anyways i think i'll just stop piping about the unit size and just lower the units myself.
@iron lord
but i will say this. Sparta and Persia was just guerilla war fare..btw. the history bookstate many things about that war.
they say 300 spartans held of 1 million persians it also says they held off 100,000 for that matter they couold have said 1 billion. all we know is that its advertiseing at its best to get the interest of the ppl.
but i will say this one last time. the most ppl to be in engage in sword to sword spear to sword etc fighting at the same time. was in japan way lafter after the roman empire after the crusades.
@Aurelian: interesting idea about "Crusades" for the Sea Peoples. I shall think about it a bit, as I'm not 100% sure about how to deal with the presence of the Pope, and, to be honest, changing all the cultures sounds ... daunting :laugh4:
I have made a few more tweaks, and the Sea Peoples are getting their act together a bit more, but they do have that annoying MTW habit of going for rebels first...
Later...
... cont.
As for the size of armies in the Late Bronze Age, most respectable near-eastern kingdoms could field somewhere in the region of 1,000 chariots (any less and there was no point even turning up for the battle), and typically infantry support was around ten times this. At Kadesh the Hittite forces amounted to either 17,000 or 37,000 depending on how you translate some ambiguous Egyptian hieroglyphs, and the Hittites had contingents from quite a number of allied/vassal states, which each contributed between 100 and 1000 chariots apiece plus infantry, according to Hittite records, indicating that Kadesh must have seen anywhere from 30,000 to 50,000 men on the field. Of course the majority of the infantry did not engage on the Hittite side, and only two out of four Egyptian divisions engaged. Chariots operated in groups of ten, and a "squadron" typically was composed of 50 chariots (5 smaller units under one officer).
As for the Hellenic era (and HTW is a totally separate mod by the way), one thing we do know is that the Persian "Immortals" were maintained at 10,000 men. That's how the regiment got its name. And that was just the elite. Other regiments were nominally organised in units of 10,000 (or "chilia", I believe) though not always kept up to strength like the Immortals. Quite a few records of battles from the Peleponesian (sp?) War indicate numbers of hoplites alone in the 10,000 range PLUS a similar number of skirmishers when an alliance of "city-states" took to the field.
And thats how it is :2thumbsup:
:2thumbsup: hell yes. goood job bro. nice.
Some more new units added:
* the Egyptian nakhtu-aa infantry are done, with a dsimountable version with throwing spears
* "Lukka pirates" added, ALL_FACTIONS in Nicaea only (so initially for the Sea Peoples :2thumbsup: ). They're a melee-capable archer unit, with compound bows + swords, but quite small units (80-man)
I'll be taking Saturday off work so hope to get the rest of the new units and factions sorted over the weekend, and try for the next Patch / Beta v2 in time for next week.
cool mate
you led me know if i cane do somme :2thumbsup:
Well, it didn't like the Ligurians much, and I can't see anything wrong with the new faction. I may have corrupted the startpos file, so will have to do it over again. Hate to go to bed on a CTD, as that means I have to start the next session with debugging :no: That's the joy of MTW, it always has something new in store :laugh4:
It's possible it didn't like having FN_21 without an FN_20, so I guess that's where I have to start looking. FN_20 is going to be Ugarit, so might as well get that one in place as well, see if that sorts the CTD :inquisitive:
Good news - now that Ugarit is in there, the Ligurians work as well.... mostly! For some reason they cannot have tribal chariots :inquisitive: What I mean is that they work on the campaign map, can recruit them etc, but every time I try a batttle with them, I get a CTD every time I hit "1 - do battle personally" (or rather at the end of the laoding screen)..... MOST frustrating. I've ruled out most combinations of what can be wrong: same with different faction colours/ shields; same when the chariots are not the royal unit; same whether the Ligurians are human or AI controlled. Same when the same animation is used under a different name. BUT every other faction can use this animation no problem :wall: :wall:
In the end I have invented "Ligurian chariots" using a different chariot animation, and that works fine :2thumbsup:
I think this problem relates to another little bug I've spotted - the tribal chariots and the hittite light chariots (which use the same animation) often have an MTW flag superimposed on the "aim" frames, and it's a different flag for each faction. I don't know where these come from - possibly the old "faction shields" from MTW/XL (it doesn't happen in HTW so far as I can see). So I suspect when this bug is sorted, the Ligurian chariot issue may be sorted too. Meanwhile they have a slightly different chariot to other barbarians ~D
Ugarit works quite well, with a mix of Hittite and Syrian units:
* Hittite Heavy Chariots (BG unit)
* Light chariots
* Tower shield spearmen
* Eastern archers
* Hittite javelinmen
* Eastern swordsmen
* Slingers (of course :beam: )
And also the "all faction" troops in various homeland provinces are available (Lukka pirates, Cretan archers, Aramaean camels, Sherdan mercenaries etc)
I got so engaged "testing" this faction I've played nearly 100yrs of the campaign! Which gave me a chance to watch the rest of the map on God mode. With the Ligurians in place, everything seems remarkably stable in Europe - no faction has been wiped out except the ones I've killed off as Ugarit, most of them still have their original capital/homelands, and no giant steamrollers are evident anywhere. Rebellions are quite common, so holding down a large empire appears quite challenging. The AI is using agents a lot, and the rebels are building ships! So much so I've had to raid a few rebel provinces around the Med and Black Sea just to destroy the shipyards. I also found that the AI is RETRAINING units (another piece of MTW received wisdom shattered!) The proof is that a rebel stack was progressively upgraded for weapons over a few years. One thing that doesn't happen though, is the understrength unit was not brought up to strength when it was retrained, it only got the upgrade.
In this campaign, it seems the strongest AI faction is the Cimmerians, who have taken most of the steppe provinces, and the weakest is the Balts, who did expand but then got pushed back and now hang on miserably in Finland. The Sea Peoples continue to disappoint, and are lurking in their islands nursing a huge overdraft, having lost their entire navy somehow :laugh4: But in the previous campaign they rampaged over over most of Western Europe (though this was before the Ligurians were introduced and ship ranges reduced). Generally though the various territories have ebbed and flowed quite nicely. Switching between factions has produced some interesting insights though. Instead of the usual "spamfest" that AI factions go in for with huge stacks of poor quality troops, quite a few factions have smallish armies of maximally teched-up troops and quite substantial treasuries, so if they did suddenly decide to expand aggressively, they could easily do so...
Hi Macsen
I had similar with the Romans in Fall of Rome Mod. Everyone else could use ballistas, but if they had them and I played personally, CTD every time. Never did find out what caused it I'm afraid - I just went your route and made ballistas unavailable to them.
I wonder if Ligurians actually had chariots....? Pretty hilly round there today, but I guess their territory used to be much larger!
Hi mate s
Yes i think they got chariots and even horses but i am not shure yet
Here s a link : http://pirate.shu.edu/~vigorimi/gene...lenium_BC.html
http://www.angelfire.com/nm/massimol...i/prerome.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chariot
:2thumbsup:
@Western: glad I'm not the only one with picky factions, choosing what units they want :laugh4: AFAIK the modern day "Liguria" is only a tiny fraction of the lands once occupied by "Ligurians", being just the Italian part. Seems Ligurian culture spread out at least to Provence, as that's who the Greeks encountered when settling Massilia. As to whether they had chariots, well, I'm guessing they did, but shall go have a look at Axel's links shortly :2thumbsup: They seem to be pretty widespread around Indo-European peoples.
That's the problem with all these illiterate barbarian factions, they didn't leave us much to go on ~D
Hmmm, may need to rethink some of the Italian factions - there's a lot of disagreement between sources over who came from where. I'd always understood Ligurians to be an offshoot of western IE, from a common Celto-Ligurian root, but now I see references to them being related to Iberians (West med group, not IE at all!) And as for Estruscans, well certainly not IE as their language attests, but were they really Aegean immigrants or relict West Med types? If the Aegean myth is true, then they should be removed until the Late era of the mod..... ho hum.... maybe should replace them with Villanovans for early and high?? I need to find the most up to date scholarly opinion on that one ~D
if only we still had the libary of alaxndros still in modren day human lives.
then we would be able to historcialy correct info down to the very Capital T.
So true ~:mecry:Quote:
if only we still had the libary of alaxndros still in modren day human lives.
Even then there were myths around - it's ironic that we probably know more (through archaeology) about Mycenae than Homer ever did, and yet people still think he's a reliable source....
i blame thoes damn arabic+ Persian bastards for burning..
if it wasn't for them we would never know. if homer was right or not.
Hi macsen
I hade my first CTD but it did nt show me a message so i have no info of it i am sry mate i started again at the same time where i hade my CTD and then the game played perfect again ill keep you inform mate
Hi Axel - tnx for the info - are you still playing the Mycenaeans? Anyway, I guess if it reloaded and continued it's probably just one of those random MTW CTDs :laugh4:
Not quite so much progress this week, I've had a pretty lousy week at work, and haven't really been in the mood for modding - just killing lots of Bronze Age sprites :skull: (I've just wiped out the Hittites and Ugarit with my hordes of Sea Peoples, and Egypt will be next :2thumbsup: )
Even so, there are some new units and a few other tweaks. The Etruscans have their own names now, I've added "Ahhiyawan" heavy infantry for the Sea Peoples (and other barbarians), some other units renamed.
I'll probably add an "Armorican" faction in Brittany and Normandy, then the High Era should be pretty much complete and I can start to sort out the new files for a patch. And I guess I'll put the new factions into the Early startpos as well so it all works.
Then I can look at the Late Era, which will have quite a few differences for unit rosters and yet more new factions etc.
i was wonderif you have need of another modder to step up and hel put.
i'f only good at editing text files. graphicsuch as animations and pics incorperated in the game im totaly clueless but when it comes to editing text files. it comes natrul to me.
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after words i was wondering if you would be willing to help me witha hudge project after wards. PM or reply
What I really need, Bonfire, is feedback from play-testers - but as I hope to get the next patch out soon, maybe after that :2thumbsup: Then we can get people testing out the High era as well, whilst I start on the Late.
I've still got huge stacks of research stuff to read through (mostly thanks to Axel :2thumbsup: ), and a couple of books on their way from Amazon I'm waiting for. A few new animations would be nice, but I don't really have the tools or the time for that myself. When this one is done, I'll probably put my feet up, complete a campaign or two, and then catch up with all the housework :laugh4: My lawn's not been mown for a month :shame:
hmm maybe if you released a beta JUst for custom battle not campaign..
i'll give it a try. and give you major feed back
For some reason custom battles don't work at all :inquisitive:
Hi mate
yes i still are playing the Mycenaeans ill be starting a new campain tonight and i am going to play 2 campains ill be back:2thumbsup:
ok.. send me the link and i will download andplay the campagin beta you got. and give ya feed back or are you talking about your bronze age for htw. not the xl. cause i got the htw. already and xl. but im assuming feed back oyu need is from the htw bronze for xl .. in which cause i do have the mod.
It's the stand-alone "Ancient" mod for XL (not the HTW BA scenario) where I need the feedback, and if anyone needs a link, get it here :2thumbsup:
Ancient TW beta install
I guess "Bronze Age" isn't too great a name for the new mod, as a) it causes confusion with the HTW BA scenario, and b) only the early era is truly the (Late) Bronze Age. From High era onwards we're really in the early iron age (at least as far as the Near East is concerned) ~D
BUT there will be a new version out, with the High Era - I still need to go back and tweak the Early era to work with the same prod files, and then should be able to release both a new install, and a patch to upgrade from the original install above.
Version 2 will include: new units, new factions, new tech tree, and a new era.
now i have somthing to do instead of twiddling my thumbs eat and smoke cigs while reaosionf my lore on lord of the rings instaed i can be haelping oyu beta.....
lord of the rings beta 2.0 for alexanders hould be out very soon.
this will keep my preocupied until then.
keep up the good work. and for less DL time. the next thing should just be a patch. with the included facitons.
well its close ot 300 MB i geus iw ill go make dinner. i'll reply ina couple days when i had the chance to play the map fully.
some of the things i notice right off the bat..
seeing how you want ppls opion being it your first beta.
1. you didn't make it into a install wizard.exe
2. the assyrian tribe last time i check were hannibals and ther fortress i mean walls were made out of wood and impaled corpse they ate.. its also why the hitties invaded them cause they were feeding off the colonies around there empire.
3 they also had seige equipment along with everybody else... you didn't include a battering ram for custom play.. this seriosuly limits game play to only non castle defences.
i'll get more back to you as i see it.
your instalation method won't work because. when you copy and past the content within the folder all it does is overwrite the folders. not the files within it. and that will mes up your MTW contect and cause CTD..
did you jsut want me to test the custom play . or the campaign cause i did the method you told me about in yor read me but there is a file mising. load_table somthing 0_0000 error
Hi Bonfire - don't see why it gave you a missing file error - there are a few other folks out there have installed it okay (and I tested it myself as a fresh install on my own machine.) Are you fully patched up on MTW VI and XL? XL version I use is 2.1 Lite (ie no music pack). Windows will overwrite any files in directories that have the same name. Do you have the EXACT error message it gives, might be a clue in there?
Quite true - I haven't done an installer :beam: Maybe when it's finished, but not top of my list.
I don't know where you were reading about the Assyrians being cannibals (I assume you mean cannibals?) but that's the first time I've heard that one. Sounds like Hittite or possibly Israelite-captivity propaganda. Either way in the era they were amongst the most advanced, not least advanced, peoples.
There is no siege equipment because it hadn't been invented yet. The game ends 700BC approx, battering rams not attested before 600BC approx, and these were Assyrian - still I might put them in for the Late Era, even if they are a little bit anachronistic (some sources suggest something rudimentary in the 900 or 800s BC, but not conclusively). Before that there were only siege towers and ladders, neither of which MTW can do, and undermining - so I might make a "mining team" as Cegorach used in PMTW, though, as one way of dealing with stone walls.
As mentioned earlier in the thread custom battles DON'T WORK! If you could find out why, that would be a help. (Personally I never play custom battles, if it's not part of a campaign the battle means nothing to me ~D But I appreciate some folks like one-off battles, so it would be nice to get custom battles functioning :2thumbsup: )
one thing i notice while playing the gernamic tried. after about 40-50 years go by the armies began to grow and there were no rebel lands well.
lets jsut say this. make a rebel unit to 120 only recruitable by rebels. and all it takes is a castle not castle1-castle9 what ever.. only recruitable by rebels.
reduce all the unit size of all factions by 50% beside the rebel unit.. in the rebel build prod have them focus more on this unit.. if they have a castle/fort
this way nations take longer to expand. unless there adjacent border is that of another tribe.
i pretty much finished testing the gernamic tried i have completle control ofte sea regions in the north and brittania is under my control/including ireland.
after taking over it the faction under me (would be russians)
have so much military power due to the expense in which unts can be produced i had no way to fend off there attacks.
maybe raising the units that factions are allowed to be made by an extra 100 and lil higher support cost..so they don't raise so many troops..
man i hate not being able to edit my post..
anyways.. its either lower the income production or higher the support cost to reduce such large forces.
in all of it comes down to ..
lower unit size-higher support
rebels have unique unit only they can make. make it 100 or 120 give it also 2 morale starting. to prevent expansion of all factions..
alter the rebels so they don't expand but only defend.
reduce all faction unit size to disable such fast expansions..
reduce farm and income production to way lower numbers.
increase unit cost. and support so factions don't expand as fast.
create new unit for all factions that are specificaly there kings-prince
not just same unit as regular solidary. give them one morale apon training.
aand 3 years to create.. i.e greeks have a hoplite specifacly for there kings pricne along with all factions..
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mess with the nations offices to give minmal 3-4 acum so you can put the tital to the right officer incharge of that nation.. so you can get the best money/income production by the use of strategy.....
your farm production rate is too much even without the title/office
lowering income and having the titles increase income is better balance.. and forces players to save certain units for better income..
see if you can't mess with the ship production's and bring all the ships from the orignal hellic total war.
no ships form MTW -viking ships weren't used tell after the dark ages/middle roman empire.....
some of the building produciton pics apon trainin only have a black box for pic..
if i think of any more i'll let you know im gonan try playing the greek nation next... and give oyu feed back...
Hi:
I remember, that making HTW was an exciting and wonderful time. I have tried your mod and I like it. Its nice to see that our work is alife in your mod: Like units, landscapes.
I wish you good luck with your mod. :balloon2:
Hi Antalis - thanks for that :bow:
HTW was the first mod I ever tried and at the time it blew my socks off, as well as giving me the impetus to have a go at some modding myself. I still think the HTW maps are the best I've seen for MTW, by the way. Are you still in touch with Komninos? I've tried to PM him, but guess he doesn't visit any more. Anyway, it's great fun setting the HTW BA warriors loose on a larger scene :2thumbsup:
@Bonfire - thanks for the ideas - some of the factors I've already addressed, so the next version is better on the economy side already, and also with some more factions there are fewer rebel provinces to worry about (and you'll also find it a bit harder to take Britain with the Prytani in place, forcing the Germanics to tackle their continental rivals sooner...). The farming has been reduced, and I have a couple of trade tweaks to do as well (making tin more valuable than copper, for one). Some of the factions do find the cash pretty tight now, so have to concentrate on development rather than armies in the early game. Actually I usually play on hard or expert, so the starting cash is lower as well - perhaps I'll reduce that, force some choices of priority to be made early on.
The "MTW" ships do need some new graphics and descriptions, but I will keep the choices limited, as most of the HTW types are too "futuristic" for the era. I'm looking for something usable like the Ulu Burun or Cape Gelidonya wreck types. Also evidence points to Nordic ships being very similar to the Mycenaean ones, but I'm still researching that one.
As for the titles, there's not a lot of change from the XL defaults yet, I've changed a few, but mostly names rather than the stats - there's more to do, as I still have things like "Censor of Genoa" in there :no: . The barbarians get quite a good "office" from the pagan sacrifical shrine, which makes it well worth giving to the governor of the best province :beam:
And yes, the little black squares on the building completed parchments. I haven't found where they live yet, so all the new buildings get the little black square until I do. I usually play with the "non-critical messages" turned off, so I don't normally see these (I find it really irritating if a parchment pops up for every single building completed in that year, not to mention the sound effect :no: ) I shall keep looking for these and once they're found, I can add the new ones in there!
Thank you. ~:cheers:Quote:
Originally Posted by macsen rufus
No, sorry. Its quite a long time ago since I was in contact with komninos.
Antalis
the pics of building are in campmap/reveiwpannel
there is tga. and there diffrent folders for the diffrent relgion/culture.
as for your reply awsome but seriosuly i beg ya get workin on the proncie title so the person you assign it too gets more Acum so you don't disband or use that guy in war.
also in the start money of the campagin have easy 4k then 3k then 2k then 1k.
Hi Bonfire
The campmap/reviewpanel graphics are for the training/building panel. These are all in place, likewise the campmap infopics are also all in place. I will keep looking for the others ..... :magnify:
I don't want to go overboard on province titles - that was one area in HTW I wasn't totally happy with, as by the time you'd given out the titles, all your governers had nine feathers straight away and the economy was booming. I want more of a struggle in Ancient. You shouldn't be able to start with anything "maxed out" IMHO. So I might do some selective improvements for titles, and/or add more offices (I'm going to have "Chariot master" office for the eastern kingdoms, at least).
I will turn down the starting cash, the one exception being the Sea Peoples, as they have quite a few ships they can get bankrupted too easily for the AI to use them properly, but it's a good faction for the player, who can role play a bit better :beam: I think maybe the eastern kingdoms should have a slightly bigger pot to start with as well.
Right, I better get on and do some work now, that's the propblem with only having internet access at work :oops:
Yay! I found the missing infopics, they are in campmap/infopics/coloured folder, so now there are a lot fewer little black squares, but I still have a few more to do. I also overhauled the frontend, so Ancient:TW now has it's own splash screen, and a few other bits tweaked to add to the atmosphere.
Added miners now, for undermining those walls, trainable -- surprisingly enough -- only at mines, with a valour bonus from a mine complex (and also in Algarve). This should keep their numbers low as they won't be available everywhere, and most factions will have some sort of mine somewhere in their homeland (though not all of them).
In the process of testing the miners I launched another Alisyan campaign (cos they start the game with a mine already in place), and I had a terrible time with acumen - I'd trained over 30 units, and got to my second king before I had a single unit with 4 feathers (my usual minimum for governors). I don't think I've ever seen such a dimwitted faction before :laugh4:
rofl.
yeah the one faction i just don't like playing period is the danes there acum problem is the worst. i went through 20 units before i got acum 3. maybe it was just my bad luck but anyways.
Dimwits they may be, but my Alisyans have just trashed the Egyptian empire. Nothing personal, it's just that they kept sinking our ships, and they had a nice big castle for my miners to practice on :laugh4: I spent quite a while tweaking them, and I think the next thing is to reduce the unit size a bit, or their "ammo", just to make it a bit more touch and go as to whether they can succeed and give the defenders more of a chance. I've been trying to make their operation "unsafe" (ie like an exploding gun) but it doesn't seem to work if there is no model with the unit - and if there was a model they wouldn't be able to move, so it looks like a busted flush. I had plans to relabel the "Your gun has exploded" message to "Your tunnel has collapsed". The other alternative is to try making a model like the one used in RTW assaults and increase the range of the miners (so they can be deployed), but that would probably be a bit naff, especially with some of the new maps and double-walled castles.
so your still workin on the next version. lets hope this time its in a single install.
try to have it include all the xl working too a full beta version so one doesn't need to install xl or the xl patch.
your install will include it already.
Hey Bonfire, Macsen isn't on a wage for doing this. How about we thank the man for not keeping this to himself? :2thumbsup: And if he wants to focus effort on the creative side, moving a few files to install isn't so hard.
But like you, I'm itching to see what is in the next release. Hope it's all going smoothly:yes:
western he knows full well that im gratefull for his hard work. after all it is his mod.
but if thanks are in order alright.
hascun your the shit. seriosuly if i wasn't going to jail possibly on the 25th i would go to your house with stripers and beer. seriosuly.
(your welcome for the semi sarcastic praising)
hey mascen im here to inform you that i could possible be in jail for 2-3 mths for probathion violation and that im to apear in court tommorrow may 25th and if i don't come back here tommorrow evening to reply that i won't be back for 2-3 mths i had fun with your mod and i was looking forward to your next reaslse but i geus i will miss it. later buddy .
Hi all - sorry no updates for a while - been catching up on some research and fielding interruptions from real-life. (and I admit I took a little excursion into a Lithuanian XL campaign for light relief :shame: ) Ok Bonfire, hope to see you back sooner rather than later, anyway, so keep safe :2thumbsup: .
I'll be getting on the update/new install next, I'm about at a point where that makes sense to do. (Gotta keep drip-feeding the fanbase, after all ~D) then I'll move on to doing the Late Era and make a few more tweaks. Which would take us on to Beta 3. Anyway, it'll be worth the wait and I hope you like the front-end changes, the whole look is a lot more "bronzey" now :book:
More next week :charge:
Hi Macsen
ill be waithing :2thumbsup:
Bonfire good luck i know the feeling
im a free man as of 11 am may 25th im not on probation anymore
for my probation violation all i have left is 3 days alternative jail time and my fine as for that i can drink and party woohoo...
Hi Macsen
You know you had that business with the Ligurians - a unit wouldn't work for them that worked for everyone else? I've got the same issue on Fall of Rome - SarmatianCav crash the Mod for the Romans faction only. Byzantines fine, everyone else fine, fight battle as the Romans - crash. Did you have/find any ideas as to what makes this happen for just one faction??:dizzy2:
Awesome, just awesome. I've always wanted to play an ancient world mod, Hellenic was great, but it was on a way too small a scale, this is perfect. Downloading your mod right now, i'll tell you how it goes. I never thought that i would play MTW again after Rome, but after checking the mtw boards again, i don't know why really, i found your thread and couldn't wait to try out this mod.
Anyways, thanks for your excellent work on this.
Morning all - I now have a patch and a version 2 install together, and I should be able to get them posted up tomorrow. I just have a little bit more testing to do to make sure everything is in there! I was up til 1am last night pinning down a CTD, so didn't have time to burn the CD before getting to work today (yes, working on a Bank Holiday sucks, so my revenge is more time on the Org ~D )
Most of it worked fine, but the Egyptian campaign crashed before opening, and .matteosartori. crashed from the camp map, but I could play a few years no problems away from the south-east of the map. Eventually, playing with spies and ships etc, I worked out it was when Libyan territory was in view. Then it twigged I had missed out the Libyan castle flag.... put that back in and no more CTDs :2thumbsup: Then I went to bed :laugh4: So I'm 99% sure the patch and version 2 installs are now complete, but should be 100% tonight.
Just to be sure: the patch (approx 15Mb uncompressed) will upgrade the last release to version 2, but I will also release a new full install v2 which will do the whole job from scratch (ie a clean install of XL).
@Western, no I didn't get to the bottom of the Ligurian chariot problem, in the end I just went for the work-around, used a different animation and made a new unit for them. So basically the problem is not solved (one of my wise old bosses once told me that a problem is never solved until its cause is known, and those words have stuck with me for years since :2thumbsup: ) I'm fairly sure it has something to do with flags, and the bug relating to MTW flags showing up in the animation frame, but how, why, where, I really don't know!
And Bonfire, good to see you back, you must have said something right and been nice to the man :2thumbsup:
And welcome Inuyasha, thanks for the kind words, hope you enjoy the mod! Look forward to your feedback.
So fingers crossed, links to the new release tomorrow :charge:
Yihaaaaa gg mate ill downloading tomorow
from 8 am to 4 in the afternoon i will be doing community service from tuesday to thursday thne on friday will be my full time off but i need that day to prepare further for tommorrow saturday im having a bonfire in celebreation of my conquering of the government....
so sunday is lookin like i will have time to play it i do know that i will Dl the version 2 tommorrow after i get back from community service.
great job mascun and i will hand you a beer drink up and relax you deserve it.
:beam: :beam: cheers :beam: :beam:
:balloon2: :balloon2: :balloon2: The Patch is Ready! :balloon2: :balloon2: :balloon2:
Okay folks, get your modems warmed up! The patch is now ready, to convert your Ancient TW beta 1 into Ancient TW beta 2.
Get it here (10Mb)
Unfortunately there is NOT a complete new install at present as the zip file was too big for my file server with all the new stuff in it, so you will have to patch the original install for now, until I either take some (spare) stuff out or get a paid fileserver account for larger files.
Here's the contents of the readme file:
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Hi Macsen
The good news - patch dowloaded and installed fine. Looks great.
The bad news - I've had 2 CTDs on the Catastrophe, each a different year but within 10 turns of starting, one as Ugarit and one as Assyria. No clues offered - occurred in normal campaign play at end year, not on transition to battle. Most frequent cause I have encountered in the past is errors concerning borders/neighbours, but since you have re-used the XL map, it shouldn't be that. I have made no changes at all to the download, so it shouldn't be me either!
I wait to see if others report the same problems - and I will keep on playing to see if any clues emerge.
From what I've seen up to now, the look and play of the Mod seem really good. I want this CTD dead!!:skull:
Hi mate
i am glad the patch is reddy but again i got the same problem downloading like the first time lol ill try to download tomorow mate :2thumbsup:
@Western - thanks for that - oops! Don't know where that might be, then.
I'm currently doing a Sea Peoples campaign in my Install 2 version, and have just managed to wipe out Ugarit, and went to bed when the Assyrians attacked, as I didn't have time to fight the battle last night. So we're in the same region. I'll see if anything crops up.
Can you do a quick test for me, and .matteosartori. the campmap? I suspect it might be because you are seeing something for the first time after the 10yrs or so - if so the reveal should cause a crash too. Unfortunately, if it crashes you can't tell what it is you've just seen ~D. It will probably relate to a faction piece or a region at a guess. Any chance you recall what you were building and training at the time? And maybe try sending an emissary on a tour of your neighbours' provinces, see if he causes it to crash.
Meanwhile I shall do a fresh install from the patch alone (I used my "full" v2 install that is too big to get online, so it's possible there's a difference in some file or another....:oops: )
Macsen
Here's a quick update. Matteosartori doesn't crash it. I discovered one small bug - no infopic for Hittite spearmen. I corrected that and had one crash subsequent at 211, when as Ugarit I was sitting at home churning out tower spearmen and building stables I think - don't think either of those caused the crash because I've done the same lots of times without ill effects.
The good news is that still as Ugarit, I've played twice to 230 without a crash. Also once as Egypt. No faction seems to have disappeared early in those games, which might have led one to suspect they were the problem faction if they had.
So it's a bit of a puzzle. 3 crashes in 6 games, none after 211. One small bug found, but that can't be the culprit. Investigation continues:inquisitive:
I think I may have the answer for your CTD, Western. I've just taken a quick look at the patch I re-downloaded, and there are a couple of bits missing for Hittite spearmen. So I will need to re-upload those bits in a new patch tomorrow, but for now I suggest you try the following:
* campmap/Info_Pics/Units: copy/rename "spearmen.bif" --> "Hit_spear.bif"
* Battle/UnitIcons: copy/rename "spearmen.lbm" --> "Hit_spear.lbm"
I reckon that should fix it. But to confirm that, find a Hittite spear unit you can see (Hittites have them as starting garrisons) and right-click on it. This should cause a CTD as the info_pic is missing. And of course if you try to go to battle against any Hittite spears, that will also crash. Did you get into battle with the Hittites for any of the crashes?
EDIT: aha, I see we were writing posts at the same time! Hope you're enjoying Ugarit, it's one of my favourite factions at the moment :beam:
Hi Macsen
It's a great fun Mod, well balanced and demanding - but I'm still getting crashes despite fixing the Hit_spear thing. I've had 3 more as Ugarit - 205, 207 and 224. If you reload, they will repeat, so it isn't just a random thing. All have occurred when the pieces are sliding round the map at end turn. But like I said before, if this is unchanged XL map, it shouldn't be a neighbours/borders error. Any ideas?? It occurs even when matteosartori isn't on, so doesn't that mean it is localised to the factions you can see, which are basically just the middle east ones? Could it have anything to do with emissary movement, which goes further afield?~:confused:
hi mate
i cant download the patch it only give s me a empty file 7.4 kb ?? help me :help:
I'm now uploading a fresh copy of the patch with the Hittite spearmen corrections. Same file name so should still work from the original link.
@Western, yeah, I managed to recreate your CTD as well. I tried yet another new install (you don't really want to know how many copies of MTW/VI/XL/Mods there are on my hard-drive :beam: ) and copied in the original ancient install, plus the patch (as corrected above) and launched a Ugarit campaign. Unlike many people I always do a quicksave at the end of every year, it's become an autoamtic series of keystrokes for me (ctrl-S, space, enter....)
In about year 205 I had a CTD, same as you, whilst the pieces were moving around. All I could "see" at this point was just what the Ugarit watch-towers revealed. I'm pretty sure that the last thing that happened before I was interrupted by my wallpaper was a rebel stack from Syria started moving towards me, as though they were about to invade. Now rebel attacks are rare as hen's teeth, so I could be wrong, it was just an impression of movement at a part of the screen I wasn't quite looking at..... By this point I had turned .matteosartori. on and off, so it was nothing "permanent" on the campmap causing it. Generally, on the campmap, if you can't see it, it can't hurt you :beam:
When I reloaded and tried again (without changing anything), it worked okay and the game continued. But the rebel stack did not move - but that is often the case, a quick-save will delay AI invasions in some instances. Since then I've taken Syria (fighting the very army that would have invaded, if it had continued, so I don't think it was the army which caused it after all) and I've now gone past 211 (no thanks to the Alisyans :furious3: ) and so far no further crashes. I strongly suspect Syria is at the root of the regional instability, and like you I'm thinking along the lines of agents (I'll try to refrain from backroomish comments, here ~D).
I can't help wondering if I made any changes to agents since the first install, but really don't recall anything. Except required buildings for emissaries, hmmmmmm..............
I shall have another look tonight, anyway.
@Axel -- maybe mydatabus.com just doesn't like you :laugh4: I think last time it was down to bandwidth, so it could be again, as I see there's been a bit of activity overnight (more complete installs been downloaded as well as a few patches). We're now on to a new day's bandwidth "ration" so give it another go.
EDIT: yes, I've just checked my email and there is a bandwidth limit warning in there....
Hi Macsen
While poking around, I spotted one thing (sadly not crash related). GR_Dendra don't have a weapon. I copied Myc_Chariot weapon and that seemed to work fine.
Good luck with the CTD. I'll keep snooping around too.
Sea peoples seem nicely aggressive, so you obviously got on top of that issue.
:oops: I think that's something I changed in my working copy but forgot to carry across to the update....Quote:
GR_Dendra don't have a weapon.
... or maybe the power of the epetis lies in the way the warriors wave their arms around at the enemy :laugh4:
Glad the Sea Peoples are putting up bit of a fight - now they have the "Viking" slot they have bucked up their ideas a bit, and I also gave them discounts on quite a few unit types. True to form they do tend to raze provinces to the ground once they invade.
Hi mate
still cant get it :embarassed:
@Axel -- I'm mystified - it does look like it's just you, once again :embarassed: It has been downloading for others okay. So, do you have any pop-up blockers, download managers, or an unusual internet browser?
All I can suggest for now is keep trying, like last time. (I've just remade the link as the "new" patch hadn't replaced the "old" patch properly, so anyone who tried to get the Hittite spear corrections will need to try again, sorry folks...)
@ Western: I'm getting more confused by this CTD - I had one in the Assyrian campaign, too, so actually made a savegame for the previous turn, then have been switching factions etc to test it from different angles. Unfortunately I can't switch across to Ugarit as the FN number is too high for -ian to work, but found that it crashes with the Cimmerians, Assyrians, and SOMETIMES the Hittites, but is fine for all other factions. Which seems like it might take the blame away from Syria and drop it on the Hittites instead (obviously when I switch factions they don't do what the AI was going to do that move....)
What really throws me though, is that carrying the savegame across to my development copy ALSO results in a CTD. And I've never had a CTD from any campaign started in that copy of the mod.... :inquisitive: I haven't finished testing all the factions around the CTD in the development copy, so not 100% sure yet.
More later, must go do some work :clown:
EDIT: I've put the download links in a sticky so you don't have to trawl the whole thread to find them now :beam:
Hi mate
I still cant download i tryed right click and save i even put off my pop up killer and norton ??? dont know why this happens i never did have problems downloading anything at all mate ill keep trying :dizzy2:
Hi Axel -- could still be bandwidth - there's been a surprising surge in activity :beam: . But I also tried from the links in the new thread - right-click/save-as doesn't work - it will just give you a page from the mydatabus.com site, which is about 8kB. You need to use the left-click. I guess you've probably already tried this, though.
I'm still trying to pin down the cause of the CTDs, and it's very difficult finding any differences in the two installs I have. There are a quite a few 'original' files and folders which I've deleted from my development copy that still remain from a clean install, though, so I wonder if there may be some sort of clash arising.
I don't think this is the cause, but in my new install, I have just deleted the campmap/reviewpanel/agents/Pagan folder as the pagan factions were getting the XL graphics for agents. Since then I've gone nearly 50 years as Ugarit without a hint of a CTD - but this is probably pure coincidence of course!
Hi Macsen
Here's something that may narrow your search a bit.:beam: I had one crash after receiving message that "sea peoples have decided that they cannot win the battle and are retreating". That made me think could be unitprod related (since moves were completed and it was possibly the effort to muster an army of rebels that was causing crash). Tried deleting the "rebelling troop mixes" entries for the post-patch units. Still got crashes. So then I tried importing the unitprod file from the pre-patch version. Since then 4 Catastrophe campaigns (3 Ugarit, 1 Assyria) and no crashes.
If crashes have stopped, therefore seems to be related to having a unitprod file without post-patch units. I don't understand how - previously crashes seemed to occur most often after an Egyptian stack moved into rebel territory, but I'm not sure either that there is a rebel connection or how that would work:dizzy2:
Could be that I'm counting chickens too soon - I'll let you know. But I thought I'd give you these clues at least in the hope that they are helpful.:yes:
Hi Western,
That's interesting - though I must admit I don't see how you can use the old unitprod without it crashing right out, as there'll be quite a few units in the startpos that are from the latest unitprod (Sea Peoples start with Lukka Pirates, for example), so I guess you've removed these units from the startpos :inquisitive:
IIRC all the new units are: Hittite spears, Nakhtu-aa heavy inf (+ jav throwing equivalent), Lukka Pirates, Ahhiyawan foot, miners, tribal hunters, Cimmerian spears, Cimmerian archers, Cimmerian warband, Ligurian chariots and Libyan spears.
I'll certainly have a close look at the "rebel troop mix" columns as well, as you probably guess a lot are just cut and pasted, so maybe the figures don't all add up.... and it's not something I've really spent much time on so far.
Anyway, it all helps to narrow it down :2thumbsup: The other thing that seems to be a constant in the crashes seems to be having the area around Cilicia/Ugarit visible, and I don't think I've seen any after the rebel provinces have all be taken by factions, either.
Another thing that confuses me is that the development copy doesn't crash at all (except when I copied a game over from the patched install). Obviously this means it has to be some element which goes into the savegame data, as well. I'd have thought by now we'd have enough patterns to find where they overlap, but they all seem to be pointing in different directions!
The one BIG difference between my dev and re-installed copies is that I cleaned out a lot of "old stuff" from the dev copy (like the XL pagan shaman bits etc). Which means the solution might be to get an installer package which can do some deletions before the install. For the life of me I can't remember which package HTW uses, that worked well, and I think it was the same one Cegorach used for PMTW. I shall try and get hold of it and maybe that would help us get a cleaner install done (and maybe even get the full package down below 250Mb again ~D) Hmmmmmmmm...
Anyway, thanks for the insights, and keep it coming :2thumbsup:
Hi mate
still cant download it yet really dont know wot the problem is??? it downloads everything else on total war forum:wall:
is it possible for you to mail it to me??? please
Hi Axel - all I can suggest is keep trying, there's still lots of activity - my daily bandwidth has been exceeded every day since the patch went up. I don't think I can send 10Mb emails, unfortunately, but if you PM me your address I'll give it a go, or maybe do it as a few smaller ones.
Regarding the CTDs, I have done yet another new install, this time removing LOADS of old MTW and XL files first (I only found one that I had to put back in ~D). In this latest version I've managed 71 years of the Ugarit campaign without a single CTD. So fingers crossed.... I shall continue testing this and post up a list of files to be removed, so if nothing else works, a fresh install should do the trick.
EDIT:
I've added the list of files to be removed into the sticky with the download links. I've now played over 100years of the Ugarit campaign without crashes on this install, so it looks like it might be stable at last. I'm not 100% sure WHY this has worked (if it really has!) but maybe it's to do with the XL pagan pieces/infopics/reviewpanel graphics???
I'll have a go with Assyria as well, and if that holds up too, I'll carry on with more "creative" stuff (more units, titles, buildings etc) :2thumbsup:
Another quick update: since the re-install by the new method (see the sticky) I've also played 50yrs of Assyria without CTD, and about 40 of Thrace. So I'd definitely suggest everyone does a re-install, and compare notes from that.
Meanwhile I'm progressing with a few new bits again :2thumbsup:
- rebels have "regional" names now ("Brian of Aramaea" just looked WRONG outside a Monty Python context :laugh4: )
- some changes to titles/offices to increase variety
- minor startpos changes so factions don't have start units they can't retrain (come in, Hittite spearmen of Ugarit, your time is up ~D)
Forthcoming changes:
- some changes the the mineral distribution to take account of real Bronze Age mining centres
- Assyrian army will get some reforms with units to be dvided between "sab sharri" (militia/conscript level), "kisir sharuti" (standing army) and "qurubti sa shepe" (royal bodyguard/elite units), with varying homelands
- more faction-specific buildings to allow "foreign" troops away from homelands (but not too many...)
- more region-specific units to add some incentive to take certain provinces (Kaskan mountaineers, Chaldean skirmishers, Carpathian swordsmen (to replace current Tribal Swords province bonus), Steppe Chariots etc etc). I still want more variety in mainland Europe, as the pagan factions still seem pretty similar.
- I'm about ready to start on the Late Era (roughly corresponds to Greek Geometric period, so the Greeks will get some interesting changes in unit roster) which should see some quite large changes on the campmap starting positions, with new factions, changed "homelands" etc.
Finally, Axel has reported a CTD from a right-click on Assyrian archers. Has anyone else had a similar problem?
I've started on the Late scenario now, but there'll be quite a bit to do, so maybe something to show for it in a week or two. I'm importing more HTW units, and building new factions now.
Meanwhile I've changed the unit roster for the Illyrians, added a "Nordic halberdier" for the Germanics (based on a Bronze Age hoard - the weapon isn't much like the halberds we all know and love from later eras, but that's what the archaeologists call it anyway ~D), Carpathian swordsmen kick some butt, Chaldean skirmishers are in, the Etruscans have been beefed up, and a few changes have been made to homelands and levels of development. A few more province names have been changed to something less modern....
I've also found the source of the installer used by so many other mods, so should be a smaller download and a simpler install in the future.
More news as it comes in.... :charge: