The incredible evil plot of the evil beersalesmen [Concluded]

All right, fine. I've made my defense. If you lynch me, your loss.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pevergreen

I think the role is "Travel Agent" so watch out for more of that kind of thing in the future.

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Possible...

You sound quite (100%) positive you've been vigilante killed though... :inquisitive: why is that? You are so confident, in fact, as to seriously propose the name of the role? :inquisitive:

It's just, for someone who was night-killed you're not sounding very pro-town.

I'd say the circumstances behind your kill are uncertain at best.

Also, GH was talking about the short posts attached to the votes for you, I believe.

I've read through the thread a few times just to catch up on what I missed. From what I've seen it's basically GH vs khaan. GH's defense is lack luster, which isn't like him when he's mafia. My gut tells me khaan, so that's what I'm going with.

Vote:khaan

Hmmm, that ties it up at 4 a piece. My gut tells me they are both innocent, but my gut seems to always be wrong...

The evidence against GH is strong. I am also interested in his saying this:

Quote:

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In my skimming, I saw pever's votes accompanied by short posts. Short posts + subsequent order = bandwagoning to me.

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He seems to be attacking Short posting. He hasn't had a long post on this page. With my hatred of hypocrasy, I shall:

Vote: GeneralHankerchief

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Andres

On the other hand, in this game it is possible to convert players. So maybe the mafia didn't really want to kill Sigurd or me, but to convert one of us.

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hmm... This is true.
Ok. So the mafia's agenda is to convert players. Too bad this will be their bane.

We have a tie between GH and greaterkhaan (4 and 4).
Are they our candidates for this round? If so, I believe GH would have been my choice.
Is there some reason we should keep you alive GH?

[edit]: Recent voting has put GH in the lead

Tally:

GH: 5 (Andres, Beefy, Count A, Faust, gkhaan)
gkhaan: 4 (GH, Ichigo, Prole, Shlin)

not voting: 10 (Dutch guy, GvI, Lorenzo, Omanes, Roadkill, Sasaki, Tran, TBlade, WarmasterH, Xdeath)

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Originally Posted by Ichigo

I've read through the thread a few times just to catch up on what I missed. From what I've seen it's basically GH vs khaan. GH's defense is lack luster, which isn't like him when he's mafia. My gut tells me khaan, so that's what I'm going with.

Vote:khaan

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And that, coupled with Khaan's first post after the killings (135), is more reason for me to vote Khaan, than to do GenH.

Vote:greaterkhaan

:balloon2:

Quote:

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Can the mafia request that beer is made no reference to in the kill?

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Since they are Heineken salesmen they kill by making you drink Heineken.

Therefore i was vigilante killed

:bow:
Why travel agent? Because i got an offer to go on a cruise...

Vote: greaterkhaan

What he's done seems like typical mafia tactics. Using the kills to manipulate a vote on somebody.

I think pevergreen was a mafioso. The number of kills decreased by one on the night of his death. Was this coincidental or not?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Omanes Alexandrapolites

Vote: greaterkhaan

What he's done seems like typical mafia tactics. Using the kills to manipulate a vote on somebody.

I think pevergreen was a mafioso. The number of kills decreased by one on the night of his death. Was this coincidental or not?

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I know I am entering the domain of WIFOM here, but would GK be so obvious about it?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Omanes Alexandrapolites

I think pevergreen was a mafioso. The number of kills decreased by one on the night of his death. Was this coincidental or not?

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:laugh4: ...

I am not laughing at your suggestion as it is highly probable. Way to go whomever sent pever away. :2thumbsup:
Yes this must be it, pever was going to do one of the kills and he was blocked and expelled in one go.

As for greaterkhaan... I know he can do better. He fooled me in Kung Fu and his reckless behaviour in this game suggests that he has nothing to loose. It is a typical change in behaviour from that game.

Until I hear what GH has to say I think he should be our candidate today
Maybe we should look for other candidates too ?
Anyone picking up wibes, gut feeling ... etc.

Not really. But after this round ends, I'd like to hear more from:


RoadKill 4
CountArach 4
Beefy187 4
Xdeathfire 3
Twilightblade 2
Tran 2
Lorenzo_H 1

(the number behind their names is the number of posts they made thus far).

Lorenzo appears to be inactive. PM him to bounce him back in here, I say. Unless Stig already did it.

Tally:


greaterkhaan : 6 (GH, Ichigo, Shlin, Prole, Dutch, Omanes)
GeneralHankerchief: 5 (GK, Faust, Andres, Beefy, CA)

Lorenzo is inactive (he hasn't even recieved the role PM) ... after this day fase I will ask for a replacement. If I don't get a replacement before the end of the next night fase it's WoG

I don't think the case against either of them is particularly strong. They've both defended themselves well. I suspect it's too close to deadline to change anything though.

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Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro

I don't think the case against either of them is particularly strong. They've both defended themselves well. I suspect it's too close to deadline to change anything though.

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:inquisitive: one unvote and their both saved. I'm just crazy enough to do it.

Oh right, stig's tie rules.

vote:GH

Tied at 6.

Well if you want to, see this as a notifier you still have 1.5 hours.

Also for the people who don't vote and/or post

Lazy Sasaki :no:

Tally

greaterkhaan : 6 (GH, Ichigo, Shlin, Prole, Dutch, Omanes)
GeneralHankerchief: 6 (GK, Faust, Andres, Beefy, CA, Sasaki)

Are we not going to lynch GeneralHankerchief?

:bigcry:

Can't I vote twice?

I'm not lazy ~:confused:

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Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro

I'm not lazy ~:confused:

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You forgot the vote tally :whip:

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Originally Posted by Andres

Lazy Sasaki :no:

Tally

greaterkhaan : 6 (GH, Ichigo, Shlin, Prole, Dutch, Omanes)
GeneralHankerchief: 6 (GK, Faust, Andres, Beefy, CA, Sasaki)

Are we not going to lynch GeneralHankerchief?

:bigcry:

Can't I vote twice?

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I don't see why GH is a better choice to lynch. :inquisitive: You're acting kinda strange Andres...

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Originally Posted by Sasaki

I'm not lazy

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Your extremely lazy:beam:

Day 2 is over, Night 3 has begun

The barman of the Red Lion spoke:
"People, people, you disappoint me. Again you can't decide who to kick out of town, surely you know that there are three Heineken Salesmen amongst you. Don't you want them to leave or what?"

GH: 6 (Andres, Beefy, Count A, Faust, gkhaan, Sasaki)
gkhaan: 6 (GH, Ichigo, Prole, Shlin, DG, Omanes)

not voting: 7 (GvI, Lorenzo, Roadkill, Tran, TBlade, WarmasterH, Xdeath)

Too late, I guess, but if it changes anything...

Vote:GH


Ah well...

hmm that's interesting

Eh? What is? That I voted GH? The guy I voted before? Is it strange that I wanted someone lynched?

EDIT: Or is it strange that I tried to vote then at 19h15? Because if you want to know, I was talking to my best friend I hadn't seen in 11 months for about a half-hour before his train left.

Once again, sorry guys!

The attempt at voting right before deadline I thought was interesting. Breaking the tie I don't find suspicious.

See the edit.

Also, his train left at 18h30, and the train station is about 15 min from home. Then I had a shower. Ten minutes after finishing it, and doing some work of my own, I thought of the Org. That line of thought brought me back to this.

Wow, that's a really detailed explanation for something I didn't even push you hard on.

That's me.

Sorry WM but you were mostlikely about 30 seconds late

A bit late, I know, but:

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Is there some reason we should keep you alive GH?

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Aside from the fact that I'm innocent, not really.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Warmaster Horus

Eh? What is? That I voted GH? The guy I voted before? Is it strange that I wanted someone lynched?

EDIT: Or is it strange that I tried to vote then at 19h15? Because if you want to know, I was talking to my best friend I hadn't seen in 11 months for about a half-hour before his train left.

Once again, sorry guys!

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Wow, that was one of the most blatantly backfooted defensive posted I have seen on these boards. FoS: Warmaster

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Warmaster Horus

Eh? What is? That I voted GH? The guy I voted before? Is it strange that I wanted someone lynched?

EDIT: Or is it strange that I tried to vote then at 19h15? Because if you want to know, I was talking to my best friend I hadn't seen in 11 months for about a half-hour before his train left.

Once again, sorry guys!

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You seem to be panicing a lot trying to draw suspicion off urself, but only making it worse.

Well, you see, the fact is that our goodbye was rather too quick for me, because I suddenly was sick (vomited), so I was trying to make me feel better.

Of course, but even still you would know it is gonna drawn huge suspicion to vote at the last second so either you are a really bad mafia, or just being really dumb

Or a really unfortunate townie?

EDIT: You know, right now I don't care if I look suspicious, because at least that will permit a lynching. You know, 2 days have gone, and not one lynched person. If I am to be lynched, so be it. I voted after the last minute because it's better to lynch someone.

And, by the way, where were you? Haven't voted this turn, I think, hmm?

Night 3 has ended, Day 3 has started:

Faust was walking along a dark alley when he suddenly saw a bright light coming towards him. Blinded as he became he walked into every direction and bumped into multiple walls, he then fell into a hole into the ground, unconscious he lay there on something hard.
That morning villagers came walking down the street and saw the hole, when they looked down they saw Faust, sleeping on multiple crates of Heineken.
"OUT OF TOWN WITH FAUST, WE DON'T WANT ANY HEINEKEN DRINKERS!!!"
Faust was taken to the edge of town and symbolically kicked out.

Dutch Guy was sleeping in the park as he always did after a long night with the boys, as his wife didn't like him when he was drunk. We was fast asleep when a couple of young boys came walking towards the place where he was sleeping.
"Those men wanted us to construct the beerfort around this bench, but someone is sleeping here."
"Ah well, if we don't do it we don't get our 100 dollars, let's start building."
That morning DG woke up in a fort made of beer. When he walked out he saw twenty villagers, looking rather angry.
As fast as he could he ran towards the exit of the park, down Main Street and out of town.


Still alive:
Beefy
Andres
Xdeathfire
Caius (aka mr. difficult name)
Prole
Sasaki
Tran
Shlin
Omanes
GH
Ichigo
Khaan
CA
Twilightblade
Roadkill
WM

"Killed:"
Sigurd
Seamus
Pevergreen
DG
Faust

WoG:
Lorenzo

For right now I think GH is scummy. Perhaps Sasaki or Ichigo too. Don't know for sure, though.

Vote: Warmaster Horus

I find it interesting that he votes for me in essentially the same way WHY he voted for me.

Vote:Prole cause I can't remember seeing any of her post's.

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For right now I think GH is scummy. Perhaps Sasaki or Ichigo too. Don't know for sure, though.

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:huh: Is that a gut feeling?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Vote: Warmaster Horus

I find it interesting that he votes for me in essentially the same way WHY he voted for me.

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:inquisitive:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ichigo

Vote:Prole cause I can't remember seeing any of her post's.



:huh: Is that a gut feeling?

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No, a guess. I'm not sure, as I said before.

Vote TwilightBlade

Isn't very active is he... we need to get rid of the lurkers quickly, because they could be
a) they could be mafia, and we could get rid of them early
b) or not mafia, but since they don't post they dont help us anyway, and by lynching them we get better odds next time of lynching a mafia.

Dutch_guy's "death" seemed like a Heineken kill, but the important word was not there. According to Andres, Stig would never call Heineken beer.
I am thinking this is a Heineken kill since there was a reference to the angry villagers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Faust|

No, a guess. I'm not sure, as I said before.

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Oh I missed the last part of your statement.:wall:

I'm confident both were heineken kills. I'm sure Stig will clearly distinguish between a mafia kill of a townie and anything else.

GH, I explained that enough. And, at least I didn't miss anything. My "way of voting you" was lack of time, and I hadn't missed anything. I didn't have a vote/unvote/oops performance.

Now, will we get more or less the same result as last time? This time, we must lynch someone.

Vote:GH
I think we know why.

I agree, Warmaster. GH has been acting scummy through this whole thing, and Sasaki looks scummy whether he's the detective, beer man, game moderator, trash man, whatever role.

Lynch: GH

But I've got a hunch about Sasaki as well.

Vote: Proletariat

One post so far, and that was a Bandwagon.

Check the replies total.

I have 6 posts, the same amount as you, Count.

Fair enough then.

Unvote: Proletariat

This is going downhill fast.

Vote: GH

he wasnt supposed to live last round. and we seriously need to lynch someone

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Beefy187

Vote: GH

he wasnt supposed to live last round. and we seriously need to lynch someone

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Nice reasoning.:wall:

Ichigo is correct here, Beefy.

GH is not acting/posting unusually at all. The only unusual thing is that the mafia hasn't killed him already and he's still active 3 rounds in -- our dear founder gets "deaded" all too quickly in most games.:cheesy: This isn't conclusive, of course, but I think Sasaki was correct when he said that GH just doesn't "feel" mafia. I would not want a lynch on GH without more proof.

My choice for lurker mafia -- if I hadn't succumbed to the evil of "H" -- would be Roadkill. Shlin is voting regularly, and a mafia lurker would miss votes or vote irrelevancies -- say like RK's first round abstain and 2nd round absence -- and try not to go on record so much. Prole is usually a low-count poster. In fact, it is only when her post count rises above 2 per page (at 40 per page) that I begin to see her as having an active role. Gal actually has a life, so she's not in the Gameroom 24-7.

So what's the deal RK? You're not just skating under the radar, you're denying any and all forms of information to evaluate you. Care to comment?

if u say so
Unvote:GH Vote:Roadkill

thanks for your advice Seamus

At least, use your own reasoning.

Vote:Beefy182

Bandwagon + no own reasoning.

Unvote: Warmaster Horus
Vote: RoadKill

Half a "prodding" vote, half a "save my skin" vote.

Seamus has made the most sense here, if GH was innocent, he'dve been killed by now.

Unvote: GH
Vote: Roadkill

its not a bandwagon if i was the first one to vote

and we need to start lynching someone if we really want to win.

btw its 187 not 182

Alright then.

Unvote:prole
Vote:Roadkill

Bandwagon hoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ichigo

Alright then.

Unvote:prole
Vote:Roadkill

Bandwagon hoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

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Why not? ~;)

Vote: Roadkill

Bandwaggoning won't help anybody. It's the guaranteed way to lynch a towniee very quickly.

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Originally Posted by Omanes Alexandrapolites

Bandwaggoning won't help anybody. It's the guaranteed way to lynch a towniee very quickly.

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Then what do you think Omanes? I'de like to hear what you have to say.

Quote:

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Seamus has made the most sense here, if GH was innocent, he'dve been killed by now.

Unvote: GH
Vote: Roadkill

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Uhh, I'm sorry? From what I understand, your first sentence more or less marks GH as mafia, and then you unvote him?

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Originally Posted by Warmaster Horus

Uhh, I'm sorry? From what I understand, your first sentence more or less marks GH as mafia, and then you unvote him?

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Yeah I know I thought that was weird https://i211.photobucket.com/albums/...Texas-Flag.gif

One more post till 1000 Congrats!

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Originally Posted by Proletariat

Seamus has made the most sense here, if GH was innocent, he'dve been killed by now.

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I agree with Warmaster on his comment.
However, Prole got it right. GH is one of the prime candidates for this lynch.

I too respect the advice of Seamus as he is one of our best Mafia catchers.
He uses some of the same parameters that Kommodus uses in his tools.

I think we should put GH up again together with Roadkill as candidates for this lynch.
Roadkill should be heard though. :shame:

Unvote
Vote GH

Quote:

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Seamus has made the most sense here, if GH was innocent, he'dve been killed by now.

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By Prole's reasoning GH must be mafia, and so therefore he must be lynched!

Day 3 has ended, Night 4 starts

"Well well people, you finally made up your mind about who to lynch. It took some time but you'll get there eventually. Roadkill, come forward."
"He isn't here."
"What do you mean he isn't here?"
"Well he hasn't voted he's still at home."
"All, to the house of Roadkill!!!"
The angry mob marched out of the pub and onto Roadkills house, when Roadkill saw them coming he grabbed his stuff and ran out the backdoor, he jumped 12 fences and ran through multiple fields before he looked back. He never saw that no-one bothered to follow him.

Tally:
Roadkill 5 (Tran, Ichigo, GH, Prole, Beefy)
GH 2 (Shlin, WM)
Beefy 1 (Caius)
Not voting 6 (Andres, Xdeathfire, Sasaki, Omanes, CA, Khaan, Twilightblade Roadkill)

WoG bait: Xdeathfire, Twilighblade (Tran saved himself)

It's night, send your pm's, a little more participation in the thread would be nice.

Well, finally a lynch. Perhaps not the best choice, but a lynch all the same.
Now, I'd like to ask Prole why did you unvote GH after saying that he was mafia?

Sorry, about my lack of participation here, seems like summer vacation is even busier than school, but I'll try to be more active.

Also, that previous lynch seemed like a really fast bandwagon. You should at least give someone a chance to say something or to see if they were even on the forums recently before bandwagoning on him. His last post on the forums was before day 3 has started, 2 days ago so he might just be busy in real life.

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Originally Posted by Xdeathfire

His last post on the forums was before day 3 has started, 2 days ago so he might just be busy in real life.

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Indeed. A simple click on his name and the option "find more posts by Roadkill" would have revealed that.

A pity nobody took the effort to do this before he got lynched...

Sorry guys, I'm gonna be a bit sparse arond here. Mu internet got capped at Dial-up speed because I broke the Download limit (No it wasn't Pr0n, don't even say it). I may still be here, but less often.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Warmaster Horus

Now, I'd like to ask Prole why did you unvote GH after saying that he was mafia?

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I said Seamus changed my mind. What he said about GH makes more sense than accusing GH of being mafia for a deadline-voting snafu. If I was mafia, I'd be trying very hard to get him or Sasaki lynched because of how well they play this game. Do you still think GH is scum, Warmaster?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Proletariat

I said Seamus changed my mind. What he said about GH makes more sense than accusing GH of being mafia for a deadline-voting snafu. If I was mafia, I'd be trying very hard to get him or Sasaki lynched because of how well they play this game. Do you still think GH is scum, Warmaster?

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Quote:

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Seamus has made the most sense here, if GH was innocent, he'dve been killed by now.

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:inquisitive:

Come on guys, I got a job. I basiclly spend my whole day working at an amusment park, from 12pm - 10pm, and i usualyl come back extremely tired, but one word of advice you guys made a bad lynch, and i would be concerned about seamus, I can tell hes pushing eveyr spec of suspicion on someone else, but you guys dont need to believe me.

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Originally Posted by RoadKill

Come on guys, I got a job. I basiclly spend my whole day working at an amusment park, from 12pm - 10pm, and i usualyl come back extremely tired, but one word of advice you guys made a bad lynch, and i would be concerned about seamus, I can tell hes pushing eveyr spec of suspicion on someone else, but you guys dont need to believe me.

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Seamus was killed I believe.

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Originally Posted by Omanes Alexandrapolites

Bandwaggoning won't help anybody. It's the guaranteed way to lynch a towniee very quickly.

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So, as a mafia-hunting strategy you would prefer…

1) Waiting for the detective to find a Mafioso and then reveal same? Of course, the detective has to live long enough and avoid being discredited. We also might be waiting a good while as the detective checks each name in turn.

2) Waiting for a Mafioso to declare her or himself or make an obvious and conclusive gaffe that reveals their identity? I’ll admit it does happen. I’ll even admit it happens more frequently than blue moons…but only just.


Bad Answer. There will virtually NEVER be conclusive evidence against anyone in the early or mid-game (all the analytical tools used only work over time), so by your rationale the town would NEVER lynch and would almost certainly lose therefore – unless the detective (if any) gets lucky AND lives to tell of it.


Band-wagoning is the ONLY proven strategy for hunting mafia. People, forced to defend themselves from such wagons, provide responses that in detail and tone are distinctive. It is this detail, and inconsistencies between earlier responses and later responses, that allow us to catch Mafiosi. Without the pressure of being lynched, most folk will just toss out a few thoughts or questions – and provide little or no evidence for later analysis.

It is also necessary to narrow the field of potential mafia so that the focus of suspicion can turn up the heat on the narrowed field. If nobody gets lynched, it takes a long time to narrow this field and the mafia who have all of the advantage. As Sigurd noted, it is occasionally to the town’s advantage to slow down the lynching in the end-game – so that the mafia doesn’t get the win too quickly – but in the early game you should thin out the crowd. You don't win the breach without a forlorn hope taking the chop for the rest of you -- thus too in mafia gaming.

This will always appear to be yielding a mafia runaway in the early phases, but as most Mafiosi would confirm, the real thorny part of their plots begins around day 5….unless no lynches have occurred, in which case you are effectively giving them an extra night or two for killing – which by the way means you actually have saved NOBODY, but have guaranteed that ONLY the innocent will die with zero chance of a dead mafioso.

Example: 25 players including 3 mafia (with 2 kills) and 1 detective (with 1 search).

3 rounds with no lynches leave: 19 players including 3 mafia and more than 1 chance in 4 that the detective has died. There is a 20% chance that one Mafioso has been investigated by the detective.

3 round with lynches leave: 16 players with about a 10% chance of one dead mafia, about a 30% chance of a dead detective (assuming no reveal). The chance that a mafioso was spotted remains the same.

SASAKI IS RIGHT! Bandwagons rock! SASAKI IS RIGHT!