Org Issues and Improvements

I would like to second everything posted by gollum and Glenn, AARs in particular really need to stay in their own subforums, i.e. the Main Hall, Sword Dojo, Colosseum, etc. Having them in a separate forum is counter intuitive.

I would also like to see these "Single Player" and "Multiplayer" forums done away with as they make those forums much less visible and are actually to all intents and purposes quite pointless.

:bow:

Why can't we have both?

AAR's in the SP subforum of the game they're based on AND a copy of the AAR in the TreasAARy? That way, the AAR gets the attention it deserves during the "hot" period of a new game and it will be easily available later on, for people who like reading AAR's but don't want to go through the hassle of looking for them all over the fora (assuming this possible, of course).

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Originally posted by Andres
Why can't we have both? AAR's in the SP subforum of the game they're based on AND a copy of the AAR in the TreasAARy?

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Nonwithstanding any potential admin issues (server space etc) that i can't know of, that would be ideal imo.

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Originally Posted by Andres

Why can't we have both?

AAR's in the SP subforum of the game they're based on AND a copy of the AAR in the TreasAARy? That way, the AAR gets the attention it deserves during the "hot" period of a new game and it will be easily available later on, for people who like reading AAR's but don't want to go through the hassle of looking for them all over the fora (assuming this possible, of course).

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I second this idea, I find it useful especially for the new members. :yes:

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Originally Posted by gollum

Nonwithstanding any potential admin issues (server space etc) that i can't know of, that would be ideal imo.

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The Org is a macho-sever. We have unlimited storage space and unlimited bandwidth. We laugh at puny servers who have limits. Org knows no limits!

I think we should rename the tavern. I know that it took me forever to find the off topic forum here. Indeed, it was not until I read in the EB forum that the tavern was the off topic forum that ever found it. New members doubtlessly will have the exact same issue. The tavern should be renamed to something that is more indicative ofnits purpose.

The Steam-feature is really really great, well done guys!
That was highly needed and will make many things a lot easier in the future!

One question, if you can add single player with the "playernumber-ID", how about steamgroups? I saw it at frontpage, that you got the: totalwar.org grp somehow in.
It might be a good idea to create a "clan-page" where you could add different steam-clan-gps.

Thank you brother Gollum and brother Nagamasa, you have said all that need be said.

I agree entirely with Andres - if the staff can afford to spend time organising and adding to the TreasAARy, then it will be a fine tribute to the continued creative output of all authors within all games if a copy of each AAR created should be posted within the TreasAARy. I think that this responsibility should rest with the staff however as not all authors will follow such protocol, and again, some will be too humble to think their work worthy of the place.
The question of whether to place individual sub-fora for AARs within game fora however must remain individual for each game. I believe it was brother Caravel or perhaps brother bamff who first decided to remove the AARs of bamff and myself outside the 'Pics & History' thread into the Main Hall with threads of their own, and this has worked wonders. Authors with a more extensive work post in the Hall, those who just want to share campaigns more informally post in the stickied thread.

This would not have worked with EB in its time, as nearly two pages would have been filled with active AARs.

And let me add - if the main reason the Main Hall has survived is the AAR, then it is because unlike in the RTW forum, if a brother wishes to play XL, MedMod, PMTW, HTW, ATW, NTW or Caravel Mod, it does not matter, his AAR will still be found in the Main Hall. In the RTW forum, an AAR will most likely be in a modded game, and therefore in the mod forum. The few AARs which are created in vanilla go into the TreasAARy, and thus the Colosseum is bled dry. Imagine if all those many mods including EB had their AARs published in the Colosseum or a sub-forum there. That is the secret to the Main Hall's longevity.

Now if all viruses (viri?) have been cleaned from this computer, perhaps I can get on with some of this writing today instead of just writing about writing!

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And what do the staff say regarding the first point I made - that is - regarding the confusing system of empty forums leading into the main discussion fora (Which are actually subfora)?

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Originally Posted by Glenn

And what do the staff say regarding the first point I made - that is - regarding the confusing system of empty forums leading into the main discussion fora (Which are actually subfora)?

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I'm not convinced by this. The SP/MP categories cannot possible be more clearly marked than they are. Yes, it does require an extra click to get to the actual discussion forum if you click on the category forum itself, but removing the category means promoting the discussion forum up to the top level. In order to prevent confusion, that would then require us to rename the discussion forums to something descriptive like 'Single Player' or 'Multiplayer.' It's Org tradition to give interesting and thematic names to the forums, and it would be a real shame to lose that. It would be the equivalent of the Org losing part of its soul. Plus, this system never caused problems when the Org was more active. The extra click required the first time someone visits the forums (after the first time, they will know where to go from the index) doesn't make the difference between gaining a regular user and losing one. That is decided by the quality of the content and services provided by the Org as a whole.

We are very keen on improving the Org and growing the active user base, but that does not mean we should throw away that which makes the Org unique in the process.

I never meant - as was shown in my first post - to dispose of such names as the Main Hall or the Colosseum. My idea was just the opposite rather, to do away with 'Singleplayer' and 'Multiplayer' empty fora and if necessary suffix 'Singleplayer' to the Main Hall - but in any case to promote the Main Hall to the top level.

I think that we want the same thing here.

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Originally Posted by TinCow

I'm not convinced by this. The SP/MP categories cannot possible be more clearly marked than they are. Yes, it does require an extra click to get to the actual discussion forum if you click on the category forum itself, but removing the category means promoting the discussion forum up to the top level. In order to prevent confusion, that would then require us to rename the discussion forums to something descriptive like 'Single Player' or 'Multiplayer.' It's Org tradition to give interesting and thematic names to the forums, and it would be a real shame to lose that. It would be the equivalent of the Org losing part of its soul.

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The Main Hall was not always under the "Single Player" forum, it used to be out in the open like the Sword Dojo still is. This was only changed a few years ago when the AAR links were added. This caused quite a few of us to get our knickers in a twist and I'm sure that at the time Martok asked Tosa about changing it back, but not sure what came of that.

If the Main Hall were on the top level, this arguably may cause some confusion, but on the other hand it's description would also be immediately visible:

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Forum for discussion on the single-player aspect of Medieval Total War and the exansion pack: Viking Invasion.

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The "interesting and thematic name" would also be much more visible. IMHO it can only be a good thing and will increase the visibility of the fora and remove the "generic" look that the single/multiplayer forums create.

:bow:

We are looking into ways of customising the forum index, which might well side step this issue.

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Originally Posted by Glenn

Thank you brother Gollum and brother Nagamasa, you have said all that need be said.

I agree entirely with Andres - if the staff can afford to spend time organising and adding to the TreasAARy, then it will be a fine tribute to the continued creative output of all authors within all games if a copy of each AAR created should be posted within the TreasAARy. I think that this responsibility should rest with the staff however as not all authors will follow such protocol, and again, some will be too humble to think their work worthy of the place.
The question of whether to place individual sub-fora for AARs within game fora however must remain individual for each game. I believe it was brother Caravel or perhaps brother bamff who first decided to remove the AARs of bamff and myself outside the 'Pics & History' thread into the Main Hall with threads of their own, and this has worked wonders. Authors with a more extensive work post in the Hall, those who just want to share campaigns more informally post in the stickied thread.

This would not have worked with EB in its time, as nearly two pages would have been filled with active AARs.

And let me add - if the main reason the Main Hall has survived is the AAR, then it is because unlike in the RTW forum, if a brother wishes to play XL, MedMod, PMTW, HTW, ATW, NTW or Caravel Mod, it does not matter, his AAR will still be found in the Main Hall. In the RTW forum, an AAR will most likely be in a modded game, and therefore in the mod forum. The few AARs which are created in vanilla go into the TreasAARy, and thus the Colosseum is bled dry. Imagine if all those many mods including EB had their AARs published in the Colosseum or a sub-forum there. That is the secret to the Main Hall's longevity.

Now if all viruses (viri?) have been cleaned from this computer, perhaps I can get on with some of this writing today instead of just writing about writing!

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I'd like you guys to know we're taking your suggestions to heart. You guys made some good points and I have to admit the current system just isn't ideal for our current situation. :bow:

Zim and phonicsmonkey have been doing a "duel to the death" TWS2 MP campaign for a while now, and they're posting their updates both in the Throne Room and in the Tea House.

In this same spirit, I've also began posting an AAR in the Tea house, with a copy being co-posted in the TreasAARy. I feel this will be the best of both worlds, utilizing the TreasAARy as the ONE place to go for everything, while still allowing people to post their campaign stuff in the "hot" forums. Still thinking of ways to "get the word out," but I just thought you guys would be interested to know we are listening, very much so. :2thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by Asai Nagamasa

If the Main Hall were on the top level, this arguably may cause some confusion, but on the other hand it's description would also be immediately visible:

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Hmm... I had forgotten about the descriptions. I didn't like the idea of changing the name to something like Tea House (Single Player), but the description is indeed visible for the top level. Do you really think that would be enough to allay any confusion?

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Originally Posted by TinCow

Hmm... I had forgotten about the descriptions. I didn't like the idea of changing the name to something like Tea House (Single Player), but the description is indeed visible for the top level. Do you really think that would be enough to allay any confusion?

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I think so, it works for the Sword Dojo, but if needed the text size of the description could be increased and the description reworded to make it more obvious, e.g.

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Single Player discussion forum for Medieval Total War and the exansion pack: Viking Invasion.

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//edit: the Sword Dojo description could use updating as well.

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Discussion about the current playable version of STW (also includes Warlord Edition and the Mongol Invasion expansion pack); including strategy, tactics, and tips.

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e.g.

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Single Player discussion forum for Shogun Total War (also includes Warlord Edition, Mongol Invasion and Gold Edition).

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//edit:

The Colloseum's description is pretty desperate and the same applies to that regarding visibility.

First off: I did not put the guys up to this. ~D

For the older titles (STW/MTW), the traffic is low enough that I think AARs in the main SP forum help to add traffic and conversation of the game as a whole. From a technical standpoint, is there a way to link threads, as opposed to linking forums? So we could have an AAR forum, and the mods could tag the AAR threads and have them show in the TreasAARy?

Thank you Monk, it was your enthusiasm which inspired me to take the time to post what I thought would benefit the Org here.
If you wish, I can start posting whatever AARs I begin in the TreasAARy also, and the staff have my permission (If that is necessary) to copy the 'Purpled Edge', 'Ireland My Sireland' and 'Memorabiliae Regnorum Caravelis' (to be found in the Main Hall) in that forum.
I have played the next installments of both 'current' (Haven't been updated for two months! Gargh!) AARs and there is little reason why these will not appear soon, so they can still be counted active.

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If all generic titles such as Singleplayer were removed from the main titles within the forum and restricted to descriptions, with forum titles for MTW etc remaining to guide the interest of members, then I believe the unique properties of the Org would be much enhanced. People will read the descriptions if lost, and very quickly find their way.

I don't think there will be any confusion, since people generally realise that there will be two main fora within a game's area (One for SP, other for MP) and I only suggested a title such as 'Main Hall - Singleplayer' if it was absolutely essential to keep 'Singleplayer' within the main title.

Thank you for your interest, TinCow.

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Originally Posted by Glenn

Thank you Monk, it was your enthusiasm which inspired me to take the time to post what I thought would benefit the Org here.

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:bow:

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If you wish, I can start posting whatever AARs I begin in the TreasAARy also, and the staff have my permission (If that is necessary) to copy the 'Purpled Edge', 'Ireland My Sireland' and 'Memorabiliae Regnorum Caravelis' (to be found in the Main Hall) in that forum.
I have played the next installments of both 'current' (Haven't been updated for two months! Gargh!) AARs and there is little reason why these will not appear soon, so they can still be counted active

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I'm unsure on how we'll proceed, it needs more input from my other blues before I'm happy with anything. For now though please feel free to create copies of what you post in the Main Hall in the TreasAARy, as this provides a good short-term compromise, and possible long-term solution, until we have a chance to put our heads together.

The Science and Graveyard of Empire subforums, in the Frontroom and Backroom respectively, are doing nothing more than taking up space. Perhaps they could be relegated to the Attic.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

1. When trying to find a person's posts in a specific thread, by clicking on the number of posts in that thread from the sub-forum the thread is in, I can get the number of posts and by whom, but when I click on their number across from their name, it does not consistently return a search of just their posts in just that thread. Often times it returns all their posts. That search function has been broken for.... almost a year now. For me, anyway.

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Can someone please confirm if this problem still exists? I cannot replicate it myself, that search function appears to work fine when I test it.

I'm sure this has been beaten to death, but I'd love to be able to upload my own avatar.

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Originally Posted by Scienter

I'm sure this has been beaten to death, but I'd love to be able to upload my own avatar.

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You can upload a profile picture, which can be seen in your posts by those that turn on that particular option. The Dude abides. :yes:

To set it, Settings->Edit Profile Picture
To see them, Settings->GeneralSetting: Display Profile Picture in Forum Posts->On

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Originally Posted by drone

You can upload a profile picture, which can be seen in your posts by those that turn on that particular option. The Dude abides. :yes:

To set it, Settings->Edit Profile Picture
To see them, Settings->GeneralSetting: Display Profile Picture in Forum Posts->On

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Thanks! I didn't know I could do that. I felt naked without my hypnotoad avatar.

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Originally Posted by TinCow

Can someone please confirm if this problem still exists? I cannot replicate it myself, that search function appears to work fine when I test it.

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Tested on random threads in the watchtower, main hall and frontroom, cannot reproduce.

Specifics would be good, i.e. what forum is it happening in and which thread and member?

I was wondering whether we could make a sort of University or an article library just like the TWC has, this is a very good idea of content generation and availability.

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Originally Posted by Glenn

This is very minor, and perhaps unnecessary, but the first issue which springs to mind in using the forums (Especially as a new member).

Is there a reason why forums such as the MTW Singleplayer need to include an empty, unused 'Singleplayer' forum with the 'Main Hall' (Which is the real singleplayer forum) as a sub-forum to that?

Surely, new members will not all realise that the Main Hall (And I use the MTW fora as an example, this setup is also elsewhere) is the Singleplayer discussion, but this can't this be remedied with a subtitle or annotation (e.g. 'Main Hall - Singleplayer')?

I realise that other fora such as ETW and NTW are merged equals and so require this system, but new members clicking on MTW Singleplayer are currently met with the vast, empty void, and must search for the more obscure 'Main Hall' title beyond this.

It's all about convenience and first impressions - and titles such as the Main Hall lead members (Especially those dedicated to one area) to become a family of their own within the Org. It shouldn't be known that there is just a Singleplayer MTW discussion on the Org, people should rather acknowledge 'The Main Hall of the Org' as a sanctuary of our favourite passtime.

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Originally Posted by Asai Nagamasa

I would also like to see these "Single Player" and "Multiplayer" forums done away with as they make those forums much less visible and are actually to all intents and purposes quite pointless.

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Implemented

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Originally Posted by TinCow

Implemented

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A huge improvement, very well done.

:bow:

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Originally Posted by TinCow

Can someone please confirm if this problem still exists? I cannot replicate it myself, that search function appears to work fine when I test it.

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This problem appears to have been fixed now that I've checked. Wasn't working for me for the longest time. Will report if it happens again.

Shouldn't the Content Managers give up their positions as Moderators to other people?
I have no problems if a CM is also a regular moderator in a forum/subforum. However, I thought that the position of CM was created so that they could create new content/tournaments/etc and wouldn't have to bother themselves doing the everyday job of a Moderator.

Well done, TC and the Staff!

Our cultural titles now have the attention they deserve!

Thank you very much for your consideration of all suggestions (I have been watching the thread with interest)!

This calls for a toast!