Medmod IV v3.14 Update

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wave.gif Wes~

and I'll get 3.15 befor I read about it in the forums, right? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif

I'm still thinking about writing CA concerning the GA aspect.

Anyone ever wrote to CA directly and got some sort of responce?


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It was really a huge oversight by CA leaving out moddable GA's. For the game Universal Europa 2, there's a ton of modders constantly releasing new GA style events and missions for it. As far as I know they won't be patching MTW anymore unfortunately, but let's hope they get the message to allow EVERYTHING to be easily moddable for RTW... Oh, and keep up the good work Wes http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif

Beelzebub, You've prolly hit the most 'fire me up' topic on the org/dungeons, lol

All things considered, I (personally) don't blame the CA coders for any failing vis MTW:VI , eh?

Gil Jaysmith, ECS etc from CA have offered insites when and if they could ever since they realized that .Org existed.

Remember that the org isn't a CA sponsored site, and that the CA boyz aren't getting payed for answering our questions. That any answers come at all is better support than 'some' other games get, especially concerning 'modding' the game.

In the 'old' days, 'modding' would be described as 'hacking' the game, and considering what recently happened to Valve's source-code, I wouldn't expect any more openings to source than goes into the 'game editor' for a new game, eh?

Remains to be seen how much 'code' gets recycled into RTW, as we can see a lot of S:TW code still extant in the M:TW txts. RTW is 'sposed to have a new engine....if so, it's possible that parts of the 'hard-code/source-code' won't be valuable anymore, and might get even get 'released'. Don't hold your breath, as any engine code is still worth something to lower-level game makers, so as long as a buck is to made, as the guys that do this need to make thier rent payments too, eh?

PS: something about release dates comes to mind- http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif
MTW is getting a bit 'long-in-the-tooth' considering it's original release date,eh?



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Yeah exactly. Like I said, I don't have any hopes for them to make it possible, At this point they consider MTW/VI finished, with no more patching. No more resources for it, all towards RTW.

It's kind of a moot point, but companies won't shy away from encouraging modding because of the HL2 debacle. The problem there was some real hackers used a security flaw in MS outlook express and went into some Valve guy's computer and basically just grabbed the files sitting on it. Doesn't have anything to do with the amount of modder access to the game, just means companies need to be more careful where they leave their code lying around heh.

Generally it's in their best interest to support mods though, one just needs to point out half life as the ultimate example of how mods can extend the lifetime of a game, which means more $$$ for the companies. So it does indeed pay off for them to answer our questions (and in the future, make RTW fully moddable). For example, if it wasn't for MedMod, I wouldn't be playing this anymore. Because of MedMod, I do have interest still, and I even recommend the game to other people.

Re: the HRE getting G-B'd.

Has anyone tried replacing HRE with a new Catholic faction?

If there's something hardcoded about HRE, then a newly created faction filling the HRE space should solve this problem.

You could rename most of the HRE files so wouldn't require a huge amount of work, well I imagine it wouldn't - but that's easy for me sitting here commenting and not modding http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif

Cheers
B Otis

Could the HRE as target situation be related to other factions having GA goals that include regions conrolled by the GRE?

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Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Basil Otis @ Dec. 16 2003,17:26)]Re: the HRE getting G-B'd.

Has anyone tried replacing HRE with a new Catholic faction?

If there's something hardcoded about HRE, then a newly created faction filling the HRE space should solve this problem.

You could rename most of the HRE files so wouldn't require a huge amount of work, well I imagine it wouldn't - but that's easy for me sitting here commenting and not modding http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif

Cheers
B Otis

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That's a very good idea, something that, say, a mod-maker should have thought of immediately... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/rolleyes.gif
I "think" it would be straight-forward to check out, but I just don't have the time to do it at the moment, so a few of you guys who are interested need to see about this in the next few days and report so I can get it in the update if it works.
The way CA links special faction properties like emergence (Mongols) or no-princesses (Muslims) is either by
1)name (Mongols) or
2)position in the faction list (Muslims). FYI, it was the switching around of some factions in one of these lists that caused the diplomacy bug in VI, the one where you would tell your diplomat to propose to one faction, but the treaty would get made with someone else.

1)Thus you should be able to simply change the name German_HRE someway, say add a character in the middle of German. Use the ctrl+H function to change all the entries in the campaign text, choose High for example in campmap\startpos. Then Search the MTW folder for texts containing the faction name in them, such as the units and buildings texts (you only need change the ones used by the Medmod, I believe), along with the files in the Loc\eng folder.
All you have to do is open the files from the Search list, use the ctrl+h function and select "replace all", and you can change the whole file in an instant. It should only take you 4 or 5 seconds per file.
I scanned the MTW folder and sub-folders manually, and I don't "think" there are any graphics that you'll have to change.

2)The problem here is that the factions are listed several times each in a number of files, and I don't know which one is the key. I have never been able to figure out what I did to make all factions start producing princesses.
I forget now; do the Mongols have princesses? I have got to start playing the game again...

BTW, has anyone tested out the proposed fix to the artillery units always being chosen first for field battles?

Here is the unit text entry for Chinese Mangonels (now called Mortars). The proposal was to change the section towards the bottom that begins with "SKIRMISH(0),..." to set to zero any designations that might affect unit placement in open battles. I would actually set all of them to zero and observe any effects, then, if it works, set the castle_assault_cover back to 2 and see if this puts the artillery in the first sixteen in a castle assault, where they ought to be.

ChineseMangonels ARTILLERY 150 6 1 0 10 10 2 DISCOURAGED MONG_RAIDERS(-2) "POVERTY_STRICKEN(5), DESPERATE_DEFENCE(1), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST(80.8), CATHOLIC_NAVAL_EXPANSIONIST(80.8), CATHOLIC_TRADER(101), CATHOLIC_CRUSADER_TRADER(101), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST_CRUSADER(80.8), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE_CRUSADER(121.2), POPE(151.5), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE(121.2), CATHOLIC_ISOLATIONIST(151.5), ORTHODOX_DEFENSIVE(121.2), ORTHODOX_EXPANSIONIST(80.8), ORTHODOX_STAGNANT(101), MUSLIM_PEACEFUL(101), MUSLIM_EXPANSIONIST(80.8), MUSLIM_DEVOUT(80.8), BARBARIAN_RAIDER(90.4), REBELS(101), CLOSE_TO_SUPPORT_LIMIT(0)" {SIEGE_ENGINEER} "MISSILE,CASTLE_DEFENDER" -2 "HIGH,LATE" NO "HEIGHT( 85 ), RADIUS( 25 ), SCALE( 120 ), PROJECTILE_TYPE( MORTAR ), SAMURAI( NO ), MARCH_SPEED( 6 ), RUN_SPEED( 10 ), CHARGE_SPEED( 11 ), MIN_TURNSPEED( 2 ), MAX_TURNSPEED( 8 ), TURN_TO_MOTION_SPEED( 8 ), MAX_INMOTION_TURN( 96 ), FORMATION_WIDTH_SPACING( 60 ), FORMATION_LENGTH_SPACING( 60 ), ENGAGEMENT_THRESHOLD( 1500 ), CHARGE_BONUS( 1 ), MELEE_BONUS( 0 ), DEFENCE_BONUS( -2 ), ARMOUR_LEVEL( 1 ), HONOUR_LEVEL( 2 ), AMMO( 40 ), FORMATIONS_PREFERRED_NUM_ROWS( 2 )" NO "own_unit_tooltip1, own_unit_tooltip2, other_unit_tooltip1, other_unit_tooltip2" "PEASANT, YES, YES" FN_GOLDEN_HORDE "Missile, Shocktroop, Spear, Cavalry" "SKIRMISH(0), ADVANCE_PARTY(1),
OUTFLANKING_FORCE(0), MAIN_BODY(2), HOLD_TERRAIN(0), RESERVE(1), REINFORCEMENT(1), ASSAULT(0), ASSAULT_COVER(0), ASSAULT_COVER_CASTLE_ATTACK(2), COVER(0)" 0 NONE YES 1 NO 0 0 PAGAN(2) SWORD FN_GOLDEN_HORDE

Before, I said that you needed to wait until the AI attacked you with more than 16 units, including artillery, but I now believe that this is incorrect. These same settings are used to make the initial placement of the player's units as well, which is why you always have to manually remove the artillery from your lineup in the battle preview screen.
Thus, you can start a campaign and put your own force together of 17 or more units, and see where the artillery are placed in the preview screen.

So guys, here is your chance to step up and make some significant contributions not only to this mod, but to everything being developed at the Org.

Myself, I have come across a couple of things that might fix other fundamental problems with the game, and I'll be testing those out.

I keep my mod notes on 6"x 8" notepads, about two dozen lines per page, and I have four pages full of individual changes and unit lineups that I have made out for this update. It's definitely the biggest since the public release.

I have the -ian extension activated for my game.

What is the faction number for the Swiss?

I started my game with them and then cycled through the other factions assigning governors and initial builds. I have been doing this for ages and it helps the AI immeasurably. It was especially helpful in vanilla when the AI used to assign titles with command stars to the highest ranking generals and so the Byz would make their 1 star, 0 Acumen Varangian Guards the governor of Constantinople. They would often do other stupid crap like make a 5 Acumen Trebizond Archer the Patriach of Constantinople but not assign a governorship. I saw this many times with all titles and all factions. Every now and then I go through and 'fix' some of the AI units, repairing General units with 1 man, disbanding 0 Acumen governors etc.

But I couldn't get back to my Swiss faction so how do you do it?

Wes
While going through and updating my build sheets these points came up. I have finished sheets for 3.14 the same as I sent you. I had to do it by hand as I haven't been able to work out a way to link the sheets.

The Swedes have a faction advantage for Rogatina Infantry but can’t build them.

The Swedes campmap colour is different in Early than in High and Late. The Early one is much more distinguishable and (to me) likeable.

Teutonic Sergeants have a valour bonus in Livonia but can’t be built there.

Pronaioi Allagion dismount to Paramonai. Imperial Kavallaroi dismount to Imperial Skutatoi. Should this be the other way around?

The Sicilians have 2 units designated as their Royal Bodyguards in the Late Era, Sicilian Chivalric Knights and Italian Heavy Infantry.
Starting a Late game shows they get the Italian Heavy Infantry then, but what about if the Sicilians survive into the Late era from an earlier one?

The Jihad Cavalry have no Unit Class labels.

The Burgundians (or Crusaders) can’t build the Baronial Estate (Court4) so they can’t build Compagnies d’Ordonnance. I think this has been covered already.

The French can’t build Outremer Templars or Outremer Hospitallers?

Italian Light Infantry has only 60 men and a preferred number of rows of 5. This means it can’t hold much of a place in a line being only 12 men wide.

Almughavars can now only be built in Cordoba and Provence.

Shouldn’t the peasant bonuses be extended to cover the other cultures so that Muslim factions will rebuild farmland in captured Catholic territory and vice versa?
There is some overlap but not much.

Charge/Attack/Defence/Armour/Morale

AUM 3/4/2/2/2, $: 262, Up: 75, [Watch3, Sword2, Armourer]
Arab Inf 4/4/1/1/2, Elite, $ 275, Up: 65, [Sword]
These seem a little unbalanced. That’s a lot of extra infrastructure for 1 defence and 1 armour. Drop the Arab attack by 1? it is higher than any other early melee unit.

Varangian Guards 4/3*/3/4/2, Elite, Disciplined, $: 400, Up: 75, [Spear3]
Paramonai 5/3*/4/4/2, Elite, Disciplined, $: 525, Up: 97, [Spear4, Armourer2]
These also seem a little unbalanced. That’s a lot of extra infrastructure, cost and upkeep for 1 defence.

Should the Steppe units be limited to the Byzantines, Hungarians, Polish and Russians? The Russians gain the least advantage because many of the steppes are also their homelands but the other 3 have a huge advantage. Barely any, if any, of their homelands overlap the steppes, so the steppes act as a second homeland that allows them to recruit some excellent cavalry forces without sacrificing production of their other unique units. The steppe units are all very good cavalry:
Steppe Cavalry: Superfast light strike and chase cavalry, bonus in Volga-Bulgaria
Khazar Royal Cavalry: Fast medium cavalry, bonus in Khazar
Avar Nobles: Elite, Disciplined heavy cavalry, bonus in Chernigov
Steppe Heavy Cavalry: Faster and cheaper than Boyars with the same stats (-1 armour), bonus in Ryazan.

and maybe ...

The Crusader Kingdoms should also have a Naptha unit, the Holy Handgrenaders of Antioch.
Build requirements could be a Gunsmith + Swordsmith Workshop + Armourer + Reliquary + Antioch.
Men: 12 (disciples), Ch: 4, Att: 4, Def: 3, Arm: 3, Mor: 6, Ammo: 3 (2 is to few, 4 is too many and 5 is right out…)

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Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]The Crusader Kingdoms should also have a Naptha unit, the Holy Handgrenaders of Antioch.

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I'm sorry, that's just going to make me laugh every time I see it in the unit box http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif

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Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Teutonic Knight @ Dec. 17 2003,23:53)]

Quote:

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Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]The Crusader Kingdoms should also have a Naptha unit, the Holy Handgrenaders of Antioch.

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I'm sorry, that's just going to make me laugh every time I see it in the unit box http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif

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'Consult the book of armaments...' http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif

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Good idea on the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif. It can only be used against small white rabbits http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif .

But on the subject of the Crusader Kingdoms, I started a game as the Egyptians and decided not to attack them at all to see how they do. Well so far I have secured an alliance wit them, and I have expanded to Turkey/Constantinople/Granada (borders of my empire). They have a big navy, have the best income, and used to have the largest armies. They and the Swedes were the ones to beat back the Horde, leaving Poland untouched. They have Greece, parts of Hungary/Asia/Balkans, and ships in every med. sea region. I salute them

Can't wait for the next version, like most of us.

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Well to finish what I started before, here's how the game is progressing. The Burgundians controlled the seas, had massive armies, and were the richest nation. They had the Balkans, parts of Russia, Antioch, Tripoli, and some other random provinces. The Italians had the second biggest empire, although land-based rather than controllng the seas, although they did have a navy. I, the Egyptians, had the entire Holy Land except what was in the Crusader's possessions, North Africa, and a random Balkans province. My king was middle-rate, 4-star conquering southern Spain. The Italians got excommunicated and had two massive civil wars, but still they hold on. The Germans re-appeared in Switzerland, nibbling at the Polish. The Polish have become the most powerful army-wise. The Danes I have seen holdoing parts of Spain; the Swedes have parts of Northern Russia. Recently I have seen the English in Northen Russia, a surprise to be sure, especially since the French are still alive. I had many jihads ready, (about 7) I was ready to finally tke on the Crusader Kingdoms. I launched my jihads at places I once held in present-Crusader territory. I took Antioch, Tripoli, Hungary, Greece, Wallacha, Khazar, and the Crimea by the second year of the war. Their navies crushed mine, but they had nearly no troops to attack me with. Some generals took this time, when my king died, to revolt in a civil war. Although easily defeated it was a small annoyance since they held Egypt and I had to destroy some good buildings to take it back over.

As it stands now, Italy isn't superpowered but is powerful, Sicily rivals Italy and the two are constantly bickering over the Pope's lands. Poland is scary, with its current holdings including Germany, Poland, parts of France and Russia. Spain is weak. The Almos were defeated. The Byzantines died, re-appeared, the turn they re-appeared their king died, and later re-appeared but their king died in battle. Hungary re-appeared. In Armenia, the Turks re-appeared with all-catapults, leading me to believe that it's one of those glitchy-provinces.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif

Good report, Clownmite http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wave.gif

This 'artty' question is gonna turn out to be a major bitch, as far as I can see........

Disallow it from the build-tree and a player-active faction cant build 'em........

Allow it, and the AI factions go overboard.

Noticed the Mongel AI overdoing it in 3.13 myself, Wes. Perhaps something about the build tree in terms of the 'desired' settings? Perhaps make it a serious minus integer as 'to build', instead of just disallowed?

Note to ALL: if the next version of MedMod includes 'special castle maps', any players will need artty, as will the AI (tho making the AI work well has always been the problem, eh?).

We're all remembering that this is a beta, eh? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/bigthumb.gif

Wes;

Concerning the HRE gang-bang:

Tried all configurations of HRE king attributes yet? Something about low 'influence' comes to mind.... Reset HRE king to +5 influence at start instead of the 3 influence, and possibly the poor old bugger can make a deal, eh?

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Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Quokka @ Dec. 17 2003,03:19)]I have the -ian extension activated for my game.

What is the faction number for the Swiss?

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Quokka~~

So far as I know, using the 1~0, and shift/1~0, we're only going to have access to 20 factions (unless CA comes out with another hot-key that works, lol). Considering the 32 faction possibility, methinx we're just screwed on this one

The only work-around I've found is to change the 'declared factions' around in order of appearence to allow for the factions you really want to see..........Not sure that this is a good idea for the later campaigns, but can work for early, eh?

Test drive this, let me know if it works for you, eh?

The 'saving grace' would be the existance of another 'hot-key'.

How 'bout it CA? Another trigger, plz?

Actually, methinx that these are hard-coded into the debug part of the source-code, tho I sure would like to be proven wrong, eh?

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wave.gif

(time to petition CA again, sigh&#33http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif

Was wondering if the wes.apolyton site is currently down? I am really looking forward to tring Wesw's mod, however I havnt been able to access your site the past couple days. I clicked on the 3.13 link provided on this site which leads to the 3d downloads website, however this appears to be the text only portion? Upon loading MTW I get an error as follows: ChineseMongonels has been declared as GENERIC, PAGON, CATHOLIC, ORTHODOX, MUSLIM, CHRISTIAN, but its IMAGETYPE_ICONIC was requested from campmap\review_panel\generic\ and is not present there or in the root directory. Assuming this error is because I dont have the graphics portion installed, is there anyone that can provide a link to the graphics download other than the wes.apolyton.net website?

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Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]
BTW, has anyone tested out the proposed fix to the artillery units always being chosen first for field battles?

Here is the unit text entry for Chinese Mangonels (now called Mortars). The proposal was to change the section towards the bottom that begins with "SKIRMISH(0),..." to set to zero any designations that might affect unit placement in open battles. I would actually set all of them to zero and observe any effects, then, if it works, set the castle_assault_cover back to 2 and see if this puts the artillery in the first sixteen in a castle assault, where they ought to be.

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Did some tests, as you suggested. I made two huge armies in Northumbria and Scotland in the EARLY startpos file. I then made changes to the ballista, followed by starting the game and invading Scotland, then repeating the process. The results are not very promising... To make a long story short; no matter what I changed(including doing some changes on other units in the army) the result was always the same, all artillery units was in the "first battle" lineup. The only exception I could find was if there was 16 or more ballistas, the general unit(royal knights) would be chosen rather than the last artillery unit.

My guess is that this is hardcoded, and that the AI lack the ability to recognize what kind of battle it is about to enter. If the AI could recognize if it was to embark on a siege, defensive or attacking battle, it would have been relativly easy to make selection priority lists that made use of artillery in sieges but not in open battles.

EDIT: BTW, I used the original VI 2.01 files for this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] ]My guess is that this is hardcoded, and that the AI lack the ability to recognize what kind of battle it is about to enter. If the AI could recognize if it was to embark on a siege, defensive or attacking battle, it would have been relativly easy to make selection priority lists that made use of artillery in sieges but not in open battles.

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The reason why the AI deploys artillery as its first units it's pretty logical.

Artillery cannot move so how could use it after all other units would have been deployed and the battle already started? It couldn't enter the map and move around at will, so it is needed to be deployed first.

A smarter approach would have been not to include artillery in attacking armies and I don't know if there is a way to accomplish it.

I just managed to almost completely remove artillery from the rebel armies setting blank the unit_prod file AI "Rebelling troop mixes" column.

BTW, if you put a negative value there you will have for sure that unit in the army. Fanatics have just a "Crusade(-10)" entry so they'll appear FOR SURE just in Crusades.

I think the goal could be almost accomplished raising the cost of artillery units. Actually they're too cheap, not reflecting the reality. Ccannons were so damn expensive that they were "named": when my city, Bologna, had to fight against the french army, allied to the Pope Giulio II, they brought down a bronze statue of Giulio II (made by Michelangelo, http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif) from the Cathedral facade, they melt it and made with the melted bronze a bombard called "The Giulia". My city was rich but not enough to allow to buy the bronze needed for a new bombard.

Other siege engines like trebuchets and mangonels were destroyed after the siege because the wood needed was too useful for other porpouses and they couldn't be transported in a different place where they were built because of the size (no trucks in 1200 http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif). Plus the new lord of the city didn't like to have siege engines out his newly conquered walls, ready to be used by some loyalist forces.

Geez... I'm always writing too much... I'm a pedantic one http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif

I just updated to 3.14 from a couple of versions back.

Did this version update the docs/stats? I seem to still have the old ones.

Great update btw

well i decided to start a campaign as the germans...and as everyone else has pointed out it seems that when you load the game up you must immediately grab your ankles. rape only begins to describe the first few turns. after restarting several times, i am now in the mid-1100s with a growing empire. the trick appears to be limited but quick offensives against your neighbours. i started with the french, and then the italians. the poles and hungarians are shaky allies...im waiting for them to get storm into my virtually undefended eastern provinces. but so far so good. no excomms yet, but it has been costly losing hundreds of men storming castles to avoid the two-year warning. nonetheless, this has been by far the best game ive played in the med mod series.

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Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (L`zard @ Dec. 18 2003,23:31)]Good report, Clownmite http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wave.gif

This 'artty' question is gonna turn out to be a major bitch, as far as I can see........

Disallow it from the build-tree and a player-active faction cant build 'em........

Allow it, and the AI factions go overboard.

Noticed the Mongel AI overdoing it in 3.13 myself, Wes. Perhaps something about the build tree in terms of the 'desired' settings? Perhaps make it a serious minus integer as 'to build', instead of just disallowed?

Note to ALL: if the next version of MedMod includes 'special castle maps', any players will need artty, as will the AI (tho making the AI work well has always been the problem, eh?).

We're all remembering that this is a beta, eh? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/bigthumb.gif

Wes;

Concerning the HRE gang-bang:

Tried all configurations of HRE king attributes yet? Something about low 'influence' comes to mind.... Reset HRE king to +5 influence at start instead of the 3 influence, and possibly the poor old bugger can make a deal, eh?

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That's a good idea regarding the HRE king. If you can find something simple like this it always works out better than something complicated.

Special castle maps? Do you know something I don't?

I don't want this next update to be considered a beta, but there are going to be some new concepts debuting in it, so there is always the possibility that one of them will become a serious flaw with the initial settings.

I really want this update to be the final, ultimate edition of version three.
I have actually spent hours and hours figuring out how to present the unit stats in an easier to remember way in the Faction Descriptions doc. I also went through all the units in a Custom Battle and noted all of them that needed new pics to show their altered features. I then set up the original files in the un-install feature to take it all back out if the player wishes.
I have gone through all the readmes and updated them, including an expanded and totally re-worked section on how to view and use the readmes themselves to maximum effect.

A new guy has come in and figured out what to do to keep the game from crashing when you click on one of the mod-enabled factions, and if L'zard here can get me the regowner table, you'll be able to play the conquest version of the Glory Goals based upon the mod's Homelands.

I was thinking of keeping this a little "Christmas" present, but I'll go ahead and say that I have implemented names for the Muslim princesses. And thanks to the guy who sent them for me to work into the files.
I went through them all, well over a hundred I'm sure, and picked out around 15 or so each for the Turks and Arabs (Egyptians and Almohads). I tried to choose all the ones that have become common among Christians over the years, like Melody and Jasmine, and I think you are going to find them as interesting as I did.
If someone wanted to find and send in some portraits to match I would be happy to see if I couldn't implement them into the mod as well. They are simply targa (tga) files, not bifs.

If we can find something to help the Hre, that would be a significant breakthrough in and of itself.

If the suggestion works for the artillery, it would also be big.

Myself, I noticed last week that this setting in the units text file, for which I had never been able to figure out the use, might hold the simple key to preventing missile troops from skirmishing: ENGAGEMENT_THRESHOLD( 1500 ). However, setting it to zero had no effect on the troops, meaning that they still began retreating like always.
I reviewed the original CA spreadsheets, and I think that this value determines the range from the opponent at which the unit goes into attack, or charge, mode.

I also found out for sure that there can be no more than 256 entries in the units text, which is a few less than I would have liked. It took some doing, but I finally figured out how to create all the units that we need, without neighboring factions sharing units.
The Faction descriptions doc has changed so much that some factions are barely recognizable, but I can tell you that it's going to be great to play; more fun and historically accurate than ever.
To solve the huge brain-teaser on how to make do with the 256 limit, I was forced to make some detailed decisions on the unit lineup for some of the new factions to be added in version four, and I have included those at the bottom of the factions desc doc for those of you interested.

Finally, L'zard informed me that Microsoft was discontinuing its links to the Word and Excel viewers. Players who can't view the Readmes and the spreadsheet are obviously not going to be able to enjoy the mod to anything like its fullest extent, if they can even figure out what all is going on. So, if any of you know another place to get these readers, please let me know. If need-be, I will post them on my site, provided that they aren't just huge.

That's all for today. Ron, thanks for the units text review. I have gone over it and corrected the mistakes that were still present after all the changes this week, and I'll address your questions in my next post.
I am going to send the mod out to you, L'zard and the other guys once I get it finished to check for bugs and such, which I guess is the beta L'zard referred to earlier. After we give it a good going over, then I'll release it.

Re: excell and word 'readers': This is really just a rumor at this point, but my understanding is that like the 'usual' decommisions of old proggies, the readers are the next in line, along with 98/98se OS'es to be no longer supported as of the new year.

Probably a good idea to grab both readers, and anything else Microshaft is offering, and archieve it, eh?

Wes: the readers are small, so I'll keep these in archieve myself, eh?

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Castle maps? Holy Horse Hockey, ModMan Guess I didn't bring that issue up yet, OOPS 'twas just an idea concerning the Constantinople 1 year takeover issue, nevermind~

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http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/santa.gif is gonna bring me a new set of mod files to work with

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/read.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/read.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/read.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/read.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/read.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/read.gif

(sets point-defence to anti-air; alerts periphery to set defcon 2....)

C'mon Santa, We're waiting for you http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif

I tried a few games over the weekend without much success.

First off I tried the HRE twice (Early/Expert) to check out the gang-bang. Wow the chessmen from History of the World couldn't have done it better.

In the first game England invaded Friesland in 1089 after sinking my ships in 1088. I withdrew to the castle but couldn't break the seige next year. I did however trigger the Pope's warning, so have to wait 10 years. Not really, France attacked in 1092, then the Italians, Hungarians, Polish and the Danish in 1094. I lost 5 provinces that turn and went into civil war splitting 3 and 3. I chose the loyalist but they could only build Spearmen in their provinces, so game over.

In the second, France and Italy invaded in 1090. My counterattack into Lorraine trigger the Papal warning. I got alliances with Hungary and the Danish. I managed to get enough troops along the Italian border to stop further loss of provinces but they still kept attacking. I thought I had made it past the bump until 1102 when the English sank my ships. They invaded Friesland and Saxony next turn. The Polish and Hungarians also invaded, Bohemia and Austria respectively. I managed to hang on until 1120 when I ran out of money and had a negative income and was fighting fresh and better troops.

The only oddity in this game is that in 1094 Pomerania rebelled against the Poles and the rebels were Mongol Warriors 240 of them.

On sunday I played the Sicilians and was having a great time until 1149. Then the game just crashed. I reloaded and changed moves, factions, attacks, build orders, alliances..... I couldn't get 1150 to roll around. Anyone else had that problem?

I have a question:

Where did the MM Viking era go? I was just about to go and see what kind of wondrous changes Wes made to the vikings, and then it's not there A pity http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/frown.gif

Is it coming back in 3.15? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/wacko.gif

edit: *ahem* excuses if this question has already been asked. *bows humbly*

Great mod Wes, but I have a question...

I'm playing as the Italians, and I noticed the Papal land's titles for governor. Well, Florence is in Tuscany, no? Also, The Pope himself is the Bishop of Rome.

If it's at all possible, it'd be interesting to have the Papacy have their own provincial titles (like the Muslims have Amir instead of Duke). I could complile a list of every diocese, archdiocese, and see if you're interested.

I think in relation to the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch thing, that Antioch should recieve a +1 valour for Naptha throwers... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wave.gif

Quote:

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Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (metatron @ Dec. 21 2003,15:52)]Great mod Wes, but I have a question...

I'm playing as the Italians, and I noticed the Papal land's titles for governor. Well, Florence is in Tuscany, no? Also, The Pope himself is the Bishop of Rome.

If it's at all possible, it'd be interesting to have the Papacy have their own provincial titles (like the Muslims have Amir instead of Duke). I could complile a list of every diocese, archdiocese, and see if you're interested.

---

I was reading this morning from my comp's Encarta Encyclopedia about how the HRE/Papacy war was largely because the Pope had claimed sole power to place bishops, when they had been picked by the rulers historically.

If there are any inaccuracies in the mod's settings, I would certainly appreciate being set straight about them, but the game won't do what you are proposing. I don't understand everything about how CA set up the system, because there are bits and pieces seemingly scattered everywhere, but basically there is just one name for the provincial governorships. Each faction has its own name for the titles derived from the palaces, but that's it.

Wizzy, you need to un-install version 3 and install version 2.04 if you want to play the Viking Camp.

Ron, I haven't heard of any unexplained crashes, except for a couple of guys over at the .com site, right when the public release first came out. With them, it happened pretty early in the game, and involved the Spanish and attacking Valencia, I believe. I checked out what I could, but didn't find anything, and since no one else reported it I just let it go.

L'zard, mail me those readers so I can post them. That will be better than the link in the readme anyhow.

Norseman, try removing the Castle_defender designation from the artillery units. That is something unique to them, and I would think that their "has" to be something in the units text which tells the computer to place them before everything else but the general. Unless it's somehow tied to their projectile type, and I don't know what to do about that if it's the case. That would be something else to check if the castle_defender isn't the key- change their projectile types to sbow, and see if that has an effect. If you can find it, at least we'll know what our options are.

And finally, the reason I have been absent for the last week or so is because I spent Monday and Tuesday trying to figure out what the hell was wrong with my computer, and the rest of the week reformatting my harddrive and trying to get everything re-installed. I'm still not done yet, but at least I have learned a good bit about my system, and it's set up somewhat better than it was before.

With the way that this update has grown, I am reversing myself and designating it as the first beta of the next mod version, 4. It's going to be a few more days, maybe the end of the week the way things are going, before I'll even have it ready to send to the beta-testers, and I'm thinking a week at least to test and discuss all the changes before releasing it publicly.

So, are there any bugs in this version that are major? This thread started so long ago that I can't remember. If so, I'll fix those and post a patch for this version so you guys can have a good version to play for the next few weeks. If there are, I'm sure you can go over the first couple of pages of this thread and paste them in here. Myself, I'm going to bed right now. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/frown.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wave.gif

Wes:

Better that you should google for the downloads and copy those to the site, eh?

You not having broadband is almost sure to make your isp mail-server gak as we're talking almost 8mb of zip files.

Just google for 'word reader', 'excell reader', and 'powerpoint reader', eh?

At the moment, I'm not 100% sure that the support for these readers is about to discontinue, it's something I read, so stands as only a rumor, eh? I'll check this out more, as I'd hate to start a tempest in a tea cup, LOL http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif

Wes:i managed to try you mod,but there is a problem,i can understand having ghazis in a jihad,BUT Faris are not religiously tied,the faris existed well before christianity,and religion played a really minor role,as Magnus Lindgren qoutes it:

"Arabian chivalry evolved and emerged from the arid dunes of the harsh desert.People in this primitive culture live in a highly advanced moral and ethical structure with no influence from religion or punishment imposed by God like powers."

but you could rename them Al Rabata"the Brotherhood" these were the first religious "order" of Knights that are connected to islam.A qoute by the same author:

"With the passing of time, Islam came to play more and more of an effective role in the realm of chivalry. By 1115 A.D., 508 A.H., the first religious order of knights was created. This religious order was called, Al Rabata which is Arabic for “The Brotherhood".[24] The order had the basic Arab chivalry code at its heart but added to it the allegiance to Islam and the brotherhood. The knights lived in semi-isolation, devoting themselves to the cause of Islam and the brotherhood. Al Rabata is very similar to Western religious orders, which were still evolving during this period.

Not only was this the first religious order but the first ‘order’ as such. Before the creation of this order chivalry was simply a social institution with a well-defined code but no actual legislating body or organization. The ruler could knight the warriors but it was not necessary. Therefore, this brotherhood marked the first actual full legislation of the Arabian chivalric code in paper and law format."

hope you put that in consideartion http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif

One more thing: I'm playing an Almohad campaign right now, and have noticed I'm unable to build ships in the northern sea area. This makes the conquest of England and Ireland a bit troublesome for me... Unless I could somehow unearth a million trillion billion florins to buy their armies. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/mecry.gif

torsoboy

All Muslim factions can build their boats in the Atlantic section of the map from Brittany northwards along the coast and Scandinavia. They can't be built in the British Isles.

The same is true for the Italians/Sicilians and the Byzantines/Russians.