XCOM Mafia [Concluded]

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Noting that there is a new note noted in my notes.

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Well that's ominous, and certainly not boosting my confidence that you are town. Also, go to bed.

ATPG delirious, man how beautiful. This can only become more glorious.

Anyone around? Thoughts on the game so far/ the arguments against me?

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

General game-related question to all:

Can you find two townies besides yourself yet, and who are they, if you want to share it?

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Manasi and Champ as of this post

with a big disclaimer that those are both pretty thin

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Originally Posted by Montmorency

DP town.

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vote:monty for this and followup

was not super fond, felt like took advantage of longish dp post, not hugely natural feeling

/shrug

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Originally Posted by Logic

And since I don't have any strong scum leans, I'm going to vote the Miller claimant. Every time.

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you

you do realize 7% is squarely below rand

csargo, pizza, jowy all town

cs excellent tone, reads i agree with, feels right during discussion with atpg

pizza fairly similar, agree with csargo that i disagree with pizza on barto

jowy a nice free-flowing game BUT going in the right directions, has a mildly cocksure aura to him that i like

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Originally Posted by Cuthillius

csargo, pizza, jowy all town

cs excellent tone, reads i agree with, feels right during discussion with atpg

pizza fairly similar, agree with csargo that i disagree with pizza on barto

jowy a nice free-flowing game BUT going in the right directions, has a mildly cocksure aura to him that i like

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Let me guess, you scumread me too?

HOWEVER

i also kinda think dp is town

i think he's being pushed for bad reasons, and i like his responses

he's reacting in a towny way, exactly like i'd expect, i think he'd be a bit more deflecting contrasted with some aggressive posts

here it just feels pretty natural

with that in mind i'm not putting aside the option of something like pizza scum ?maybe csargo? in there and possibly another person i townread

as of right now again i do like all of the listed

would most like to lynch monty, curious what you people, including dp, have to say about him

struggling a little to find wolves as of right now which is why i'm sideeying my townreads

but eh we'll see

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Originally Posted by Dp101

Let me guess, you scumread me too?

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no, but i'm fairly confident i saw the same things they saw that led up to the point where you were being scumread

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Originally Posted by Cuthillius

HOWEVER

i also kinda think dp is town

i think he's being pushed for bad reasons, and i like his responses

he's reacting in a towny way, exactly like i'd expect, i think he'd be a bit more deflecting contrasted with some aggressive posts

here it just feels pretty natural

with that in mind i'm not putting aside the option of something like pizza scum ?maybe csargo? in there and possibly another person i townread

as of right now again i do like all of the listed

would most like to lynch monty, curious what you people, including dp, have to say about him

struggling a little to find wolves as of right now which is why i'm sideeying my townreads

but eh we'll see

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Monty really needs to post more before I can get a good read on him. How does one even read him?

Cuth, what are your thoughts on El Barto in more detail?

Also, I'd probably not call me cs, if that's what you were referring to. That's mildly confusing with a Csargo in the game.

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Originally Posted by Cuthillius

HOWEVER

i also kinda think dp is town

i think he's being pushed for bad reasons, and i like his responses

he's reacting in a towny way, exactly like i'd expect, i think he'd be a bit more deflecting contrasted with some aggressive posts

here it just feels pretty natural

with that in mind i'm not putting aside the option of something like pizza scum ?maybe csargo? in there and possibly another person i townread

as of right now again i do like all of the listed

would most like to lynch monty, curious what you people, including dp, have to say about him

struggling a little to find wolves as of right now which is why i'm sideeying my townreads

but eh we'll see

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Monty is entirely nonexistent this game so far, so I'd say that's scummy for him. Decent lynch, I wouldn't be sad to see him go, but still think Dp is a better candidate though.

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Originally Posted by crimson_snow

Cuth, what are your thoughts on El Barto in more detail?

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since i said that pivoted a little

i don't know exactly how to feel about him

i'm not a HUGE fan of the dp vote from him, buut at the same time it's gutsy as scum

i have no real idea how to read him in general though

so imo wait until some people around interactions with him flip

or something

and i was actually talking about csargo, not you

sorry

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Originally Posted by crimson_snow

Also, I'd probably not call me cs, if that's what you were referring to. That's mildly confusing with a Csargo in the game.

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Aww, I thought he thought I had excellent tone. Now I know the truth. :bigcry:

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Monty is entirely nonexistent this game so far, so I'd say that's scummy for him. Decent lynch, I wouldn't be sad to see him go, but still think Dp is a better candidate though.

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talk to me about dp's posts during and since the interaction with pizza

i'm not seeing what you're seeing, evidently

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Originally Posted by Cuthillius

talk to me about dp's posts during and since the interaction with pizza

i'm not seeing what you're seeing, evidently

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He's been better since like partway through the interaction with pizza, but a lot of his earlier posts pinged me as scummy. The spam argument, question to me, early back and forth with Pizza were all questionable. Think the latter part of his iso is better, but that doesn't make me want to move my vote. I wouldn't put Monty, C_S, or anyone else are more scummy than Dp101 at this point in the game. Could be that I'm just wrong though, wouldn't be the first time. The feeling in my gut is strong Cuth, real strong.

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Originally Posted by Csargo

He's been better since like partway through the interaction with pizza, but a lot of his earlier posts pinged me as scummy. The spam argument, question to me, early back and forth with Pizza were all questionable. Think the latter part of his iso is better, but that doesn't make me want to move my vote. I wouldn't put Monty, C_S, or anyone else as more scummy than Dp101 at this point in the game. Could be that I'm just wrong though, wouldn't be the first time. The feeling in my gut is strong Cuth, real strong.

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I can't grammar

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Originally Posted by Csargo

He's been better since like partway through the interaction with pizza, but a lot of his earlier posts pinged me as scummy. The spam argument, question to me, early back and forth with Pizza were all questionable. Think the latter part of his iso is better, but that doesn't make me want to move my vote. I wouldn't put Monty, C_S, or anyone else are more scummy than Dp101 at this point in the game. Could be that I'm just wrong though, wouldn't be the first time. The feeling in my gut is strong Cuth, real strong.

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i agree with the first bit

but i do feel like i'd rather leave him until tomorrow unless something changes

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Originally Posted by Cuthillius

i agree with the first bit

but i do feel like i'd rather leave him until tomorrow unless something changes

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Give me someone scummier, and I'll be more than happy to switch. No one pings me quite as hard itt, but Dp has been better, so maybe that trend will continue. I just don't see anyone who comes close to Dp101 so far. That could change in the morning.

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Give me someone scummier, and I'll be more than happy to switch. No one pings me quite as hard itt, but Dp has been better, so maybe that trend will continue. I just don't see anyone who comes close to Dp101 so far. That could change in the morning.

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seems like kinda a strong reaction for d1 and what we've seen

i personally am not at all fond of monty's calling dp town and then making a joke instead of giving reasons

it seems a bit easy

a bit forced

This is how far the multiquoting limit let me go for this post. Halfway through the thread I think.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Logic town and not grasping the subtleties of the force.

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I think I agree.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

If anyone tries to lynch you or Champ this game, wipe them out. All of them.

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"You" here is Jowy, right? Oh, reading on, it's referring to Logic. Meh. I think Jowy is townier tbh.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

He barged in here without reading everything, some things but obviously not everything, and began posting.

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Oh, interesting that you did have an actual reason for that read. I was wondering what it could be.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

He's also active and engaged, for him, by comparison to the previous game on here.

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Maybe, but he promised in the signup thread that he would do better. Actually he'd probably be more inclined to follow up on that promise as scum than as town.

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Originally Posted by Jowy

Btw I'm liking the play from csargo and crimson. Ya'll can join my town core.

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Not impressed by Csargo, see below, but I really like Crimson's style.

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Originally Posted by Dp101

This is finals week for me, I don't have much energy. I'll go and reread the thread and post something more conclusive in a minute. If you were looking for more opinions from me though, here's one: you are town.

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Not being able to produce any reads except townreading your accuser is a red flag.
After following Dp's day 1 mafia play in the championship game I've lost some faith in my ability to tone read him. I'd like to think he should be an easy read eventually though.

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Originally Posted by Dp101

He's (Pizza) basically always like this, as both alignments, fwiw.

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I disagree. He changes up his style and tends to be very active, but he doesn't play the helpful townie much. PIS?

I thought I had a quote on Csargo saying Dp101 was the strongest scum read by far so far, to which my kneejerk reaction was "no way". Although after gathering my thoughts so far, it's not such an outrageous statement.

I'll continue catching up in a bit, need to get some work done also.

Okay I read the rest of the thread. I kind of agree that Dp wasn't given much room to breathe there and Crimson pretty much nailed it with his "he could be scum, but it's hard to tell" comment.

To answer Pizza's question from earlier my current top town reads are Crimson and Jowy. Jowy has his normal cocksure persona, as Cuth called it (I think "independent thinker" is a better way to put it), and Crimson just reads townie both in tone and process, really. When someone towns so effortlessly as him you put him in your town list and worry about him being an excellent scum player later.

Notes to self:
Cuth's angle on Monty seems interesting, I should reread that.
Also reread Champ's entrance to the thread to see if Pizza's read makes sense.

So in a game with Self-meta analysis, meta analysis, and analysis of one's self meta. I'm just kind of trying to muddle through the white noise. It's probably very useful to those here.

That being said a couple of things did stand out.

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Originally Posted by Dp101

Oh, I forgot about something critical. Vote: Csargo. It really looks like you are trying to powerwolf from my perspective, and while I may end up voting a townie who just wants to try hard, hit a scum, soar high, and then get shot down by scum, I feel like this kind of early aggressive pushing is more commonly seen from scum on this forum.

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In a vacuum that I currently find myself in this has been the scummiest single post I've seen so far. I know it was addressed later as DP trying to say that he was trying to prove that he was thinking about it and was pre-thinking of arguments and counter points, which I still think is a bad explanation for the post. If he just stopped with the discussion about him being a powerwolf, and the forum meta read, I would have been fine. Maybe attributing to what I think when I'm scum is unfair, but pre planning answers to arguments is not something I tend to do if my intentions are good. Also a pre-emptive NK analysis seems suspect too.

In the end it did feel like DP put a lot of thought into this post, but more thought then was necessary.

Here's something to break up the post and to separate the thoughts.

https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-st...10468754-2.gif

The second thing that stands out to me is Barto's pressure of me and subsequent ignorance of it, even after I addressed it in a non-commital, half confrontational way. Early pressure and votes seem to be a rather important part of the meta here. So I kind of have a question that i hope doesn't get lost in this wall of text that's forming. With new players, how likely is a null read lynch likely to happen? Is it kind of a courtesy policy to not lynch a new player in that situation?

If the answer is yes to this question, would a town not reroll for pressure? Further if Bart is scum, it's an easy vote to place knowing it won't get much traction and likely little information, but still appears like he's participating by deliberately picking a weak vote on a not likely to be lynched target.

If he kept pressuring me after my response I'd feel better about this interaction. Playing the helpful townie explaining how the pressure works here, asking if I'm just not going to respond to pressure, are just two options I would have liked to have seen among many. There's a precedent for players not responding to early pressure that has already been stated in thread, but with no meta to read on me there's no way he'd know this. Instead of pushing more, he ignores the interaction entirely then votes for low hanging fruit with some built-in cover. (The Cover being CSARGO and ASTPG who I have slight town reads for different reasons...ASTPG mainly for his insistence that he was going to bed and then not actually going to bed and still posting in thread).

SOOOOOOO

Vote: El Barto

With Bart voting for him, I think DP is likely telling the truth about being unable to participate and just made a bad post (from my perspective), and Barto is trying to cash in on the opportunity to get in some low information participation votes early.

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Originally Posted by Fredwood

So I kind of have a question that i hope doesn't get lost in this wall of text that's forming. With new players, how likely is a null read lynch likely to happen? Is it kind of a courtesy policy to not lynch a new player in that situation?

If the answer is yes to this question, would a town not reroll for pressure?

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I'm not that at home on this forum, but I would venture that the answer is "sort of". It's like on most forums I guess, in that people try to give the new guy a chance, but when it comes down to it they end up as the default lynch anyway. That's how it is on RealmsBeyond at least, where I've played most of my games.

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Originally Posted by Cuthillius

i personally am not at all fond of monty's calling dp town and then making a joke instead of giving reasons

it seems a bit easy

a bit forced

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Fact checking, that's not what he did, though?

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Originally Posted by Montmorency

DP town.

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Originally Posted by Dp101

Why? Just tone?

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Originally Posted by Montmorency

It's all we got, babe.

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He gives a reason, namely tone - which is all we've got at this point, according to him. Where's the joke?

Pizza's read on Champ checks out. Champ did start posting immediately and then commented on the night posting rule afterwards.

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Originally Posted by Champ

Henlo xcom
you stinky humans
go get flanked, ugly

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Originally Posted by Champ

posting at night Attachment 19707

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I'm going to Vote: Cuthilius for that misrepresentation of Monty, for lack of better ideas.

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Originally Posted by novice

This is how far the multiquoting limit let me go for this post. Halfway through the thread I think.


I think I agree.


"You" here is Jowy, right? Oh, reading on, it's referring to Logic. Meh. I think Jowy is townier tbh.


Oh, interesting that you did have an actual reason for that read. I was wondering what it could be.


Maybe, but he promised in the signup thread that he would do better. Actually he'd probably be more inclined to follow up on that promise as scum than as town.


Not impressed by Csargo, see below, but I really like Crimson's style.


Not being able to produce any reads except townreading your accuser is a red flag.
After following Dp's day 1 mafia play in the championship game I've lost some faith in my ability to tone read him. I'd like to think he should be an easy read eventually though.


I disagree. He changes up his style and tends to be very active, but he doesn't play the helpful townie much. PIS?

I thought I had a quote on Csargo saying Dp101 was the strongest scum read by far so far, to which my kneejerk reaction was "no way". Although after gathering my thoughts so far, it's not such an outrageous statement.

I'll continue catching up in a bit, need to get some work done also.

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https://i.imgur.com/tJfxytj.gif

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Originally Posted by novice

I'm not that at home on this forum, but I would venture that the answer is "sort of". It's like on most forums I guess, in that people try to give the new guy a chance, but when it comes down to it they end up as the default lynch anyway. That's how it is on RealmsBeyond at least, where I've played most of my games.

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So as the basis for my read, does him rolling a random new guy for pressure give you any useful information? Do you think the answer is enough for me to reassess my read?

As for Cuth: I'm a stickler for misrepresentation usually but Cut's post didn't ping me as misrepresentation when I read it. I'll grant that I didn't look back at Monty and DP's interaction though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lx1VtDAsVbI

Sup.

Ok after sleep and a quick re-read of the whole game, these are my contrarian thoughts.

What is so towny about Jowy? Help me out here. I'm not seeing it. Lot of people saying Jowy is townie but I didn't see anything alignment indicative to me. So someone knows something about Jowy that I don't. Sell me if you're selling.

My feeling about csargo was that I liked his methods and style and risk-taking this game, but I cannot say he's especially towny.

In fact, if dp101 is town especially, I feel like csargo could be taking advantage of my friendly posture towards him in recent games, knowing that I am a csargo fan and want to see him town well.

At least, that's the unspoken vibe I'm getting.

I don't have a specifically scum read on him, no case, I just feel a bit taken for a ride, as a good possibility.

Feel better about Cuth but no strong lean yet. He's not out of any zone.

Monty, no bet. His process and reads across games seem ass-backwards to me, and he's not revealing a lot about himself this game.

So, he'll always be tough to read. But I don't have a scum lean there.

Not comfortable with Novice, not comfortable with Fredwood. Will re-read both.

Not going to get on Winston's case yet or Sooh's or Auto's or BSmith's for not posting much yet.

This game and this site too casual to press on that kind of thing, so enjoy your free round. I want to see a process I can understand, and 4 townies and a scum lean by midday D2 from each of you. 2 townies a day is not hard to find.

individual isos now. Free talk whenever I'm done, leave questions for me. No one's here anyway.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

My feeling about csargo was that I liked his methods and style and risk-taking this game, but I cannot say he's especially towny.

In fact, if dp101 is town especially, I feel like csargo could be taking advantage of my friendly posture towards him in recent games, knowing that I am a csargo fan and want to see him town well.

At least, that's the unspoken vibe I'm getting.

I don't have a specifically scum read on him, no case, I just feel a bit taken for a ride, as a good possibility.

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I genuinely think Dp is scum, so I make no apologies for pushing/voting him. If I'm wrong, then so be it, but I don't think I am. I also hate the theories pushed by C_S/novice just fyi. This is D1, and the pressure Dp has been under is moderate, but not terribly severe I don't think. Not enough to make a townie post poorly imo, so those arguments make me sad.

Enjoy the paranoia about me though, that's always nice. Gearing up to lynch me tomorrow, or maybe today ATPG? I won't go gently into that good night, so just be warned. Do you see any parallels between this game and the Pokemon one ATPG from me? I don't understand why you're trying to throw shade on me right now, considering in this game, you've got the most experience playing with me. I just find it terribly odd. If you come after me though, at least it'll be fun.

I hope you enjoy the ride ATPG :)

https://i.imgur.com/zF4gpzc.gif

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Ok after sleep and a quick re-read of the whole game, these are my contrarian thoughts.

What is so towny about Jowy? Help me out here. I'm not seeing it. Lot of people saying Jowy is townie but I didn't see anything alignment indicative to me. So someone knows something about Jowy that I don't. Sell me if you're selling.

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I think I actually agree with this statement. I only gave him a single town point for keeping to his meta, which really doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things, and I would like to see more from him at this stage.

Tally as of post 360:

Lynch votes
3 votes: Dp101 (Csargo, Askthepizzaguy, El Barto)
2 votes: El Barto (crimson_snow, Fredwood)
1 votes: Autolycus (Jowy)
1 votes: Manasi (Champ)
1 votes: Novice (autolycus)
1 votes: Winston Hughes (Logic)
1 votes: Champ (Manasi)
1 votes: Sooh (BSmith)
1 votes: No Lynch (Montmorency)
1 votes: Csargo (Dp101)
1 votes: monty (Cuthillius)
1 votes: Cuthilius (novice)

Voting history:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

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Originally Posted by Champ

Manasi

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Manasi

Champ

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Montmorency

No Lynch

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by El Barto

Fredwood

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Dp101

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by crimson_snow

No Lynch

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Askthepizzaguy

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

crimson_snow

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by crimson_snow

Askthepizzaguy

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Novice

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by autolycus

Novice

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Originally Posted by Logic

Winston Hughes

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jowy

Autolycus

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Originally Posted by BSmith

Sooh

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Manasi

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

El barto

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Csargo

ATPG

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Dp101

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

dp101

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by crimson_snow

Cuthillius

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by crimson_snow

El Barto

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by El Barto

Dp101

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dp101

Csargo

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cuthillius

monty

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fredwood

El Barto

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by novice

Cuthilius

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Csargo

I genuinely think Dp is scum, so I make no apologies for pushing/voting him. If I'm wrong, then so be it, but I don't think I am. I also hate the theories pushed by C_S/novice just fyi. This is D1, and the pressure Dp has been under is moderate, but not terribly severe I don't think. Not enough to make a townie post poorly imo, so those arguments make me sad.

Enjoy the paranoia about me though, that's always nice. Gearing up to lynch me tomorrow, or maybe today ATPG? I won't go gently into that good night, so just be warned. Do you see any parallels between this game and the Pokemon one ATPG from me? I don't understand why you're trying to throw shade on me right now, considering in this game, you've got the most experience playing with me. I just find it terribly odd. If you come after me though, at least it'll be fun.

I hope you enjoy the ride ATPG :)

https://i.imgur.com/zF4gpzc.gif

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The second paragraph here feels very scummy to me, but I also can't explain why. I just can't come up with a single reason for scum to ever actually post it, in this situation, but the tone of it is horrible regardless.

Sorry for quotewalls, on mobile.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Not comfortable with Novice, not comfortable with Fredwood. Will re-read both.

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Fredwood I understand, but why Novice?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dp101

The second paragraph here feels very scummy to me, but I also can't explain why. I just can't come up with a single reason for scum to ever actually post it, in this situation, but the tone of it is horrible regardless.

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I continue to be your biggest fan.

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Originally Posted by Csargo

I continue to be your biggest fan.

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Thx bby

Not done with isos but this is important for me to get out sooner rather than later

@Logic

I have you as a solid town lean, but here is my one complaint with your iso. Your footprint is very small, focused on one person for very straightforward reasons, and you mentioned you're willing to vote the no lynchers (at the time).

I want to lock you townie. I need more from you because the footprint is too small. Give me as many reads on the individual players and game state as possible. I think I can put you away as lock town on day one if you do, but I'd need to see it first.

most important is why you feel that way. I may / may not care about or agree with the leans themselves.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Csargo

I genuinely think Dp is scum, so I make no apologies for pushing/voting him. If I'm wrong, then so be it, but I don't think I am. I also hate the theories pushed by C_S/novice just fyi. This is D1, and the pressure Dp has been under is moderate, but not terribly severe I don't think. Not enough to make a townie post poorly imo, so those arguments make me sad.

Enjoy the paranoia about me though, that's always nice. Gearing up to lynch me tomorrow, or maybe today ATPG? I won't go gently into that good night, so just be warned. Do you see any parallels between this game and the Pokemon one ATPG from me? I don't understand why you're trying to throw shade on me right now, considering in this game, you've got the most experience playing with me. I just find it terribly odd. If you come after me though, at least it'll be fun.

I hope you enjoy the ride ATPG :)

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Almost done with all isos, wanted to respond to this.

No, I don't think I'm considering you for a lynch until near final-whatever. Looking over your iso, I saw much townie-ness that I wasn't feeling in real time because I was focusing my attention elsewhere, and then felt sudden paranoia about you being a power wolf.

The iso is really solid though. Maybe your best town game I've seen in ages.

One thing though, I have a lot of experience playing with you, but I've never been comfortable reading your alignment confidently because you were, for most of those games, a 1 or few post a round player and your footprint is small and your thoughts are focused on few people at a time. You also don't rustle or really react to pressure, so I have no idea how to forcibly read you without your cooperation in most games.

I need a long vote history from you and a chance to "read the room" and see others' attitudes toward you to read you.

Here, after just your d1 iso, I feel confident again. And I don't think I've ever felt that way before.

Not moving my vote on dp. That said it's mercy rule time- I've said what I feel and why and will lynch him today if nothing better. I will talk to him as if I'm considering both universes, but I won't push him with words, just my vote. I also didn't re-iso him because what little he posted since I logged off last wasn't enough to town read him.

In any case, this is the new list, after re-read of whole game, plus isos on everyone.

Sorted leans with changes.

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--------------------Lock
Askthepizzaguy
--------------------Town
Logic near lock
crimson_snow 85
Csargo- best iso 80 <----moved way up
Cuthillius- 75 <----moved up
--------------------Townish
El Barto- 55 <----moved up
Manasi- 50
--------------------Maybe not scum
Montmorency- neutral
Champ- not wolfy (read of town is thinner compared to better info/stronger reads.)
--------------------Null range
Winston Hughes- null
Sooh- null
autolycus- null
BSmith- null
--------------------Bit wolfy
novice- mixed, bit wolfy. <---down
Fredwood- not great <---down
--------------------Wolfy
Jowy <---down
Dp101 <---no improvement
--------------------Must die
Not that confident yet

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dp101

Tally as of post 360:

Lynch votes
3 votes: Dp101 (Csargo, Askthepizzaguy, El Barto)
2 votes: El Barto (crimson_snow, Fredwood)
1 votes: Autolycus (Jowy)
1 votes: Manasi (Champ)
1 votes: Novice (autolycus)
1 votes: Winston Hughes (Logic)
1 votes: Champ (Manasi)
1 votes: Sooh (BSmith)
1 votes: No Lynch (Montmorency)
1 votes: Csargo (Dp101)
1 votes: monty (Cuthillius)
1 votes: Cuthilius (novice)

Voting history:

---

Votes I think should change:
The votes on El barto, the vote on Autolycus, the vote on Csargo, the vote on Cuth.

Csargo- only the posts with content that gave me any reaction.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751605
mindmeld.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751673
this is fine.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751779
good question.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751788
like the snap vote.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751790
feels good.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751811
fine
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751842
no csar-dp team.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751860
like this post
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751899
fine
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751903
fine
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751934
fair
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751967
love this post. townie.

Conclusion: Feels good, man.

Manasi- only the posts that gave me feels.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751601
mindmeld townpoints.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751657
like this post.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751659
this is fine, maybe handing out too much town cred too soon.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751661
this read is fine at the time, but will probably change. nai.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751665
I believe it.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751732
I dont' agree with jowy town read yet.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751733
no dp-manasi team.

Conclusion: feels town, but not a lock.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fredwood

So as the basis for my read, does him rolling a random new guy for pressure give you any useful information? Do you think the answer is enough for me to reassess my read?

---

Let's see: I didn't think you had much of a point because I thought you were just referring to a random opening vote, but he does indeed follow up with specifically asking you to respond to the vote, which you then brush off.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by El Barto

Oh, I do love Eddie Izzard.

I hope you have noticed that I am voting for you to be hanged from the neck until you die.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fredwood

Cake please.

Seems like a you problem not a me problem. I guess I could beg but if I get lynched day 1 in my first game, then I get lynched day 1 in my first game. The Random gods must be sated.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by El Barto

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dp101

hahahhahahahahahahaahhaahahahahahahha

---

Enough is enough.

I would have voted crimson_snow first as a matter of policy, but you do not get to do this and live.

vote: Dp101

---

So I'd say El Barto's later switch to Dp without further comment warrants an explanation from El Barto, yes. Enough for a vote? Sure, on day 1.

El barto- going from scum to town lean

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751588
iffy opening.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751597
cagey
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751731
I have mixed feelings about this post.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751773
Quasi-bookmark? Not sure about that. NAI.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751827
meh.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751833
bleh.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751838
mixed.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751840
lvl 1
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751865
I like some of his conclusions, not others. And the process feels ok. Like his feelings about Jowy. Feels still level 1 but not all bad.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751895
like this push
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751907
townish.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751917
confusing as ever but fine.

Conclusion: Mixed feelings, but I feel a lot better about his town possibilities.

Logic

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751653
fine.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751656
fine.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751656
Level 1 townie post. not grasping subtlety of Winston's post, kinda sloppy but townie process.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751743
this is townish
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751744
level 1 townie
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751756
obviously.

Conclusion: Feels pretty townie. His thought process is very straightforward. Sadly, he's not spreading out very much. That's my only complaint. I could probably lock him up as town with more investment from him.

Cuthillius- the townie

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751613
null
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751924
this is fine, maybe townie for mindmeld reasons, but weak.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751925
I am fine with this vote on monty.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751926
this is fine.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751927
This is fine for alignment and I like that he's building a town, just not sure he didn't let scums into it.
"csargo, pizza, jowy all town
cs excellent tone, reads i agree with, feels right during discussion with atpg
pizza fairly similar, agree with csargo that i disagree with pizza on barto
jowy a nice free-flowing game BUT going in the right directions, has a mildly cocksure aura to him that i like "
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751929
I like this post a lot. And his immediate walkback of the csargo town lean. Feels un-narrative driven thought process. good process in general.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751930
Nice.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751935
this is great, think Cuth is town.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751937
good pcess
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751940
this is fine
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751942
also fine.

Conclusion: Think Cuth is playing it town, no scum vibe at all.

Champ- not shining as bright as my other stars, but not wolfy yet

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751577
I like his opening and enthusiasm, maybe it's not as alignment indicative as I thought.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751578
Indicates he read the opening posts a little
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751579
But not very closely.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751581
null
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751582
null
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751592
null
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751648
null
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751688
nai, says csargo is town.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751691
pockety.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751766
null
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751772
null

Conclusion: Town read on him is a lot more null at this point.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

What is so towny about Jowy? Help me out here. I'm not seeing it. Lot of people saying Jowy is townie but I didn't see anything alignment indicative to me.

---

For me it's that he's interacting intelligently with the thread. Maybe it shouldn't be alignment indicative, but it's giving me warm fuzzy feelings.

What's so scummy about Jowy?

I have no problem telling people why I think X and Y are townies, and pushing my suspect, but that's as much of my notes and isos as I feel comfortable revealing this early.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by novice

For me it's that he's interacting intelligently with the thread. Maybe it shouldn't be alignment indicative, but it's giving me warm fuzzy feelings.

What's so scummy about Jowy?

---

He has a wolfy agenda and a small footprint. His process is also badly conflicting with his actual pushes.

Do an iso on jowy and tell me your opinions, anyone. Do you see what I saw or what townie-ness do you see? Point me at it. I've asked this before.

Monty reads not necessarily scummy but not townie either. 3p/Sk selfish non-neutral.

Some ISO'ing of my own then. Jowy just seems to the point, although I see now that he pocketed me nicely with his first few posts.

To the point:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

Claiming Miller in your first post is the right way to handle that.

Though it could still be an inside joke, I wouldn't know.

---

Pocketing me by voting my voter:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

Vote: Autolycus

Coz the vote sounds so forced even as a joke

---

Pocketing:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

Novice looking towny too though his skills to appear as such should not be underestimated. I like the questioning nevertheless.

---

To the point:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

Hey DP any reason why you didn't join the wagon if you're annoyed by the lack of content in the game?

---

To the point:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

Are you reading him as town? I don't see what's the issue if you aren't.

---

Mindmeld:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

I'm doing it anyway. (Townreading Crimson) Might be a bit level 1 if you are idd a good wolf, but it's unavoidable when most faces are new to me.

---

To the point:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

Scum-DP is a slacker. Lots of excuses in the thread for not playing the game, meanwhile he's chatting away in the scum nest ^^

---

These next two post are exactly what I would have been thinking and doing at that point if I has been awake. Well, except I wouldn't have picked Autolycus as an alternative.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

If we're done bullying poor Dp101 we could move some votes on Auto to surprise him when he comes back!

The Barto wagon could be juicy as well. You have my spiritual support on that.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

It's fair, you were stonewalling us pretty badly. Looking a bit better now that we're getting something out of you, tho don't disappear even if your wagon does.

---

To the point:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

Alright that's a bad move. When you start your wagon with an excuse for when the target flips villa, it probably won't be taking off any time soon. Oh and it's suspicious.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

He has a wolfy agenda and a small footprint. His process is also badly conflicting with his actual pushes.

---

I see what you mean about his small footprint, but it's not like he's been spamming on a single topic, the entire thread had a pretty small footprint last night. Do elaborate on the other points.

This is one of the fastest org games I've ever played sos.

Anything worth catching up on? I skimmed through ATPG isos.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Votes I think should change:
The votes on El barto, the vote on Autolycus, the vote on Csargo, the vote on Cuth.

---

I'll probably move my vote after Cuth addresses it.
I like this post by Cuth, the rest seem well within his scum range.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cuthillius

HOWEVER

i also kinda think dp is town

i think he's being pushed for bad reasons, and i like his responses

he's reacting in a towny way, exactly like i'd expect, i think he'd be a bit more deflecting contrasted with some aggressive posts

here it just feels pretty natural

with that in mind i'm not putting aside the option of something like pizza scum ?maybe csargo? in there and possibly another person i townread

as of right now again i do like all of the listed

would most like to lynch monty, curious what you people, including dp, have to say about him

struggling a little to find wolves as of right now which is why i'm sideeying my townreads

but eh we'll see

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Manasi

This is one of the fastest org games I've ever played sos.

Anything worth catching up on? I skimmed through ATPG isos.

---

Maybe looking at Csargo and how he's been weirdly aggressive in his pushing of me?

Official Tally as of #389

----

Day 1 ends in:

----


3 Dp101 (Csargo, Askthepizzaguy, El Barto)

2 El Barto (crimson_snow, Fredwood)

1 Askthepizzaguy (Montmorency)
1 autolycus (Jowy)
1 Champ (Manasi)
1 Csargo (Dp101)
1 Cuthillius (novice)
1 Manasi (Champ)
1 Montmorency (Cuth) [edit: fixed]
1 novice (autolycus)
1 Sooh (BSmith)
1 Winston Hughes (Logic)

----

Not Voting: @Sooh and @Winston Hughes -- reminder to vote before eod

Not Posting: (everyone has posted :2thumbsup:)

----

If you notice anything wrong, PM me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by novice

I see what you mean about his small footprint, but it's not like he's been spamming on a single topic, the entire thread had a pretty small footprint last night. Do elaborate on the other points.

---

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751825
meta of dp scum.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751845
taunty
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053751852
Doesn't match the above 2 posts. Bit wolfy.

Let me grab them for easier visibility.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Manasi

This is one of the fastest org games I've ever played sos.

Anything worth catching up on? I skimmed through ATPG isos.

---

tl;Dr @Manasi

Dp101 is scum, you're welcome.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dp101

Maybe looking at Csargo and how he's been weirdly aggressive in his pushing of me?

---

ngl I'm kinda into it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Manasi

This is one of the fastest org games I've ever played sos.

Anything worth catching up on? I skimmed through ATPG isos.

---

What is this you're 3rd? Join me at the top.

It's beautiful up here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

Scum-DP is a slacker. Lots of excuses in the thread for not playing the game, meanwhile he's chatting away in the scum nest ^^

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

Feeling the heat? :)

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jowy

If we're done bullying poor Dp101 we could move some votes on Auto to surprise him when he comes back!
The Barto wagon could be juicy as well. You have my spiritual support on that.

---

This is not the only place in Jowy's iso where he says one thing but does another.

The other big issue I have is he's asking Auto a ton of questions, after being told that Auto won't respond to pressure, then encourages people to pile up on him without waiting for answers.

That means he's got an agenda, and his process is for show, not something he's doing to solve the game from a zero info standpoint.

His process does not match his behavior, therefore, he's scum.

Now, beyond his superficial acting ability, I want to know where all the town reads on him came from.

Some people have better meta and experience with Jowy than me, which is all of zero.

If this read is wrong and this is how he usually is, you gotta tell me. Because he can be lynched anytime of anyday.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dp101

Maybe looking at Csargo and how he's been weirdly aggressive in his pushing of me?

---

I mean it doesn't help that your vote is a thinly veiled OMGUS. That's not the best tbh.

Any specific reason for the "not good" read? I mean Dp piled onto your vague read as well with no chance to address what's scummy.

I mean is it the reaction test, the asking a questions about the Day 1 lynch meta, my read on Bart, stating things that stood out to me? I mean, it's cool that you read me bad, but you're also not giving me a chance to say anything about what you think is bad. Or is it just vague and indefensible at this point, I mean I"m not really getting blow back on the bart thing telling me I'm wrong either, so (shrug) I guess.

I would leave Dp101 alone today and lynch somewhere else.

Barto / Logic / Champ / Montmorency out of those who have been around.