Gemma's Favorite Music Mafia

iyam stuff like "x would be more aggressive/agendaed" as a wolf doesnt really work in org games (not sure how much they work in general tbh) as it would stick out as a sore thumb, esp d1


just a random thought



@Sunbae i am curious about your artic/visor reads if u have time to explain them

to me artic most notable post was this:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Arctic

meh i'm really not seeing the visor townreads guys >.<

the post about annika felt like verbalized in a way such that he was trying to get townread and he doesn't have other reads with that same level of depth of thought which i feel lends credence to what i'm saying, and people even recognize that his push on stett didn't feel great which is the main thing i'm suspicious of - not just the detached comparison to lissa's game, but more the way he was sort of sewing the seeds there in a shady way

i think he is the wolfiest person amongst active posters. i feel like ender got a tiny bit towny but i'm not sure

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but cant really say it made me lean 1 way or the other, just found it interesting

nvm i figured it out

yall ever type out a sentence and you read it back and strictly speaking all of it is grammatically correct but is so structurally deranged that it really ought not to? because that's me reading back too many of my posts in quotes here tbh

editors note: I've been writing out posts in tabs, then going back into hte thread and reading then opening new tabs, then gluing all those tabs together to put out posts, and when seeing how this one leads into the next leads me to realize that this is really frickin dumb. Am I going to stop? Absolutely not.

editors note part 2: to be clear i figured it out before lissa explicitly told me in the thread IM SMART AND CAN REVESRE LETTERS

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sunbae

If I said:

my village reads atm are didistetter, neb, pzelda, and ladd

my "i'll leave them be due to people finding them towney" list was waza and lissa

my active concern list was Visor, Maple, annika (but not both maple and annika), and arctic


how similar would our reads be and which ones are we most off on

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(hi we haevnt really talked muich yet cause well i just have nt been around yet but hiiii!!!! (okay the difference between when im trying to be articulate in my writing and im just writing shit is staggering wtf is this LMAO))

I think I could take your general v list, if not based on my own or sheeped convictions, but just off of not exactly disagreeing. I don't really have much of a rational but I feel in my soul that ender is a villager here, and rankly im too eepy to substantiate it in this post. I'm freeballing v reads on nl, waza and -- let's say for the sake of argument -- Taffy. I'm generally null on Lissa here, she hasn't really bitten into the game much atp, but her vibes have been good (I feel like I should be a lissa reading specalist atp tho lol)

I'm not sure what the remaining playerlist looks like tbh and no other reads immedietly sprung to mind.

Reading lissa's response to you, I see how she feels that way. I think generally people itg have been posting ~well enough. Which is sorta problematic in it's own way lol

Honestly, I've gotten this far into this post and im not really sure what the point is LMAO

Quote:

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Originally Posted by annika

I thought the fact that he townread Stett and immediately rescinded it was kinda townie lol

tbh I don't know why he TRs me but he's right that it seems like TMI on first impression so it might be something he avoids as a wolf

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i don't particularly like this line in retrospect. to steal a line waza used about me and stett: i understand she and waza have a dynamic, but the latter part of this second sentence seems too uncritical to me? perhaps this is nitpicky but if annika is aware of this dynamic they have (which she obviously is) why isn't she a bit more suspicious that he would emulate it as a wolf to gain favor? its almost like the read waza made and how annika responds to it here is more about how annika is perceived as a result of it, moreso how she perceives waza for making it? shrugze

Quote:

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Originally Posted by annika

i kind of want to say waza is v already for getting the ball rolling

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i also thought this was kinda weak and part of why i prodded her but i don't think its terrible by itself i forget why i multiquotd this

Quote:

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Originally Posted by annika

doesn't this imply you didn't rand v this game XD

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by annika

well just like



if the last game you randed town in was pokemash then that means you didn't rand town in this game

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i know ladd said these posts were explainable as 'a thought' annika had -- and sure -- but she has a few posts like this where I don't really buy she has an interest or lack of knowledge with some of the questions she's asking (another example being the "why do you think ben will eb n1'd" post to ladd). like these are superbly nitpicky in ways that ping me for annika's wolf game. ack that happy mentioned he's seen her do this as town, i'm sure i have too, but there's just like, a dearth of towniness in lots of these to me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by annika

atm I'm comfortable townleaning Waza/Ben/Lissa/Sunbae

I can't really articulate why for Ben, I guess I just like how he's playing so far xD maybe that's silly but it's fine for rn

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there's something to this reads list and her later reads list where i'm removed from the core in place of visor. that's fine--i don't need to be on the top town list for someone i was actively sussing at the time. very reasonable to move me down, but i also kinda wonder if it was strategically done (future reads list lost in the multiquote)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sunbae

i'd hold off on the Waza one personally because I think "give read -> immediately flip read as a second thought" is smack dab in his wolf range. By that I mean I view it as something more likely to be done to be viewed as villagery than a thought process about stett. Not lock or anything just initial feels but I squinted at it

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annika's response to this post in particular felt super rough. basically a 'oh, noted' type thing (multiquote lost again) and given her awareness of waza's game that just doesn't ring as a real response to someone telling her to beware of waza's range.

i also sorta dislike her later townread on stett even if i think the tr on stett is right a decent chunk of the time

wow i dislike annika a lot

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nebjiamn

i'm not really vibing with anyone's view on the game state so far and even when I do start to lean into a certain realm i regress and hate it. basically a lack of a cohesive feel on the current game state.

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honestly im not really sure how to coalesce my thoughts here into an actionable question for you but like.... i guess what *range* of reads list do you think you would be happy with? In your eyes, how could we come together and create a cohesive picture of the game, basically. And is such a worldview incompatible with the reads of those that you would hypothetically call village?

I do think I generally understand the feeling you're talking about here. I've had times where I can look at someone and think "this person is either a wolf, or someone who is INCREDIBLY important for me to find, because our reads combined can filter into something approaching a good solve, if I were to trust on a few key pieces". Which is probably *different*, strictly speaking, but I hope you get what I mean.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nebjiamn

i know ladd said these posts were explainable as 'a thought' annika had -- and sure -- but she has a few posts like this where I don't really buy she has an interest or lack of knowledge with some of the questions she's asking (another example being the "why do you think ben will eb n1'd" post to ladd). like these are superbly nitpicky in ways that ping me for annika's wolf game. ack that happy mentioned he's seen her do this as town, i'm sure i have too, but there's just like, a dearth of towniness in lots of these to me.

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you dont need to answer to this post but i dont think that was me who said that fwiw (think it was visor). I agree with you that their posts to manti arent good but u said it first in 1 of your early posts and i didnt wanna repeat stuff



as a side note i do think stett should be a villager now

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Maple

honestly im not really sure how to coalesce my thoughts here into an actionable question for you but like.... i guess what *range* of reads list do you think you would be happy with? In your eyes, how could we come together and create a cohesive picture of the game, basically. And is such a worldview incompatible with the reads of those that you would hypothetically call village?

I do think I generally understand the feeling you're talking about here. I've had times where I can look at someone and think "this person is either a wolf, or someone who is INCREDIBLY important for me to find, because our reads combined can filter into something approaching a good solve, if I were to trust on a few key pieces". Which is probably *different*, strictly speaking, but I hope you get what I mean.

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opining philosophical for a bit, but i realized recently that i am someone who struggles immensely when there are unknowns on the table (e.g. 0 posters or near it). this has never really mattered much when I mashed because that's very much a pick and choose type thing, but i really have a tough time parsing turbos for example when there are 0 posters, to the point that i kind of feel like how i'm sort of feeling now (but on a longform scale).

so part of it is just time and seeing everyone join in. when we have all 15 or 17 or whatever people in thread and posting content i'll feel a bit better. part of my annoyance has been alleviated just by some people posting more content since i've complained (or me catching up on content i skipped over while at work). ideally I could withhold a good chunk of my content until everyone has checked in at some level, because one of my humongous pet peeves is creating thread narratives before everyone has a chance to give input on what they want thread narrative to be, but also have an annoyingly unwitting desire to just spam and blurt shit out so sucks to be me

ladd
benneh
pzelda
lissa
stett
waza
ender
sunbae
visor
_________________________________

maple
rask
dya
annika
taffy
arctic



no particular order, this is how i'd yolo divide the playerlist. some thin villa reads in the top tier and some people are null in the second tier


also not sure what annika odds are of being a wolf if waza is a villager cause he seemed very sure of his read there. prolly pretty low eheh



i'll be back after work. adieu

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ladd

iyam stuff like "x would be more aggressive/agendaed" as a wolf doesnt really work in org games (not sure how much they work in general tbh) as it would stick out as a sore thumb, esp d1


just a random thought



@Sunbae i am curious about your artic/visor reads if u have time to explain them

to me artic most notable post was this:



but cant really say it made me lean 1 way or the other, just found it interesting

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yeah I'm not really talking aggressive re: arctic just like confident but it's possibly still a situational thing regardless

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Maple

nvm i figured it out

yall ever type out a sentence and you read it back and strictly speaking all of it is grammatically correct but is so structurally deranged that it really ought not to? because that's me reading back too many of my posts in quotes here tbh

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oh abso freakin lutely lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Maple

(I feel like I should be a lissa reading specalist atp tho lol)

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i also feel the same in reverse and yet

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nebjiamn

i don't particularly like this line in retrospect. to steal a line waza used about me and stett: i understand she and waza have a dynamic, but the latter part of this second sentence seems too uncritical to me? perhaps this is nitpicky but if annika is aware of this dynamic they have (which she obviously is) why isn't she a bit more suspicious that he would emulate it as a wolf to gain favor? its almost like the read waza made and how annika responds to it here is more about how annika is perceived as a result of it, moreso how she perceives waza for making it? shrugze



i also thought this was kinda weak and part of why i prodded her but i don't think its terrible by itself i forget why i multiquotd this





i know ladd said these posts were explainable as 'a thought' annika had -- and sure -- but she has a few posts like this where I don't really buy she has an interest or lack of knowledge with some of the questions she's asking (another example being the "why do you think ben will eb n1'd" post to ladd). like these are superbly nitpicky in ways that ping me for annika's wolf game. ack that happy mentioned he's seen her do this as town, i'm sure i have too, but there's just like, a dearth of towniness in lots of these to me.



there's something to this reads list and her later reads list where i'm removed from the core in place of visor. that's fine--i don't need to be on the top town list for someone i was actively sussing at the time. very reasonable to move me down, but i also kinda wonder if it was strategically done (future reads list lost in the multiquote)



annika's response to this post in particular felt super rough. basically a 'oh, noted' type thing (multiquote lost again) and given her awareness of waza's game that just doesn't ring as a real response to someone telling her to beware of waza's range.

i also sorta dislike her later townread on stett even if i think the tr on stett is right a decent chunk of the time

wow i dislike annika a lot

---

it is possibly ~tmi about them being v/v who will both become obvious in time tbh

it would explain why she handled them in the way she did as a wolf, you're kinda right that it is weirdly uncritical

reading those posts over again i like them significantly less

the "last game i randed v" thing re maple was definitely like

idk, did she REALLY think that? like it's pretty standard stuff/language/wording for what maple was saying, i was confused at her reaction

ye i think that makes sense. you can create games with that unknown aspect being the entire central gimmick (for example, games which rand from a deck, or ones where you have alignment neutral flex slots) in general i try to get a general feel for things in that if on average people seem *good*, that means the lurkers are on average *bad*. Does that work well in reverse? eh...

idk if its just me but i ALREADY feel like the deadline is looming and it feels like i really ought to have a much better grip on the game atp especially if i wanna be able to coordinate anything resembling an effective wagon lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nebjiamn

opining philosophical for a bit, but i realized recently that i am someone who struggles immensely when there are unknowns on the table (e.g. 0 posters or near it). this has never really mattered much when I mashed because that's very much a pick and choose type thing, but i really have a tough time parsing turbos for example when there are 0 posters, to the point that i kind of feel like how i'm sort of feeling now (but on a longform scale).

so part of it is just time and seeing everyone join in. when we have all 15 or 17 or whatever people in thread and posting content i'll feel a bit better. part of my annoyance has been alleviated just by some people posting more content since i've complained (or me catching up on content i skipped over while at work). ideally I could withhold a good chunk of my content until everyone has checked in at some level, because one of my humongous pet peeves is creating thread narratives before everyone has a chance to give input on what they want thread narrative to be, but also have an annoyingly unwitting desire to just spam and blurt shit out so sucks to be me

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yeah i get it, kind of an incomplete picture that's impossible to complete i suppose

it is definitely a bit awkward this game because i think a LOT of people are villagery so like whether dya and rask each come in and post really villagery or not is something i'd really like to like. know, because it will really impact my view of the game atp i think

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lissa

yeah I'm not really talking aggressive re: arctic just like confident but it's possibly still a situational thing regardless



oh abso freakin lutely lol



i also feel the same in reverse and yet



it is possibly ~tmi about them being v/v who will both become obvious in time tbh

it would explain why she handled them in the way she did as a wolf, you're kinda right that it is weirdly uncritical

reading those posts over again i like them significantly less

the "last game i randed v" thing re maple was definitely like

idk, did she REALLY think that? like it's pretty standard stuff/language/wording for what maple was saying, i was confused at her reaction

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turning it around, if I worded it "last time i randed wolf before this game" or something to that effect, I think it'd be seen as like *overly conscious* of having not randed village in *this* game. Anyway, that's the pedant in me talking. I don't particularly feel like it's worth the effort to drink the wine over what may or may not be someone's stream of consciousness, but rather that there was a followup reiterating or elaborating at all.

anyway

it warms my heart that zelda remembers my wolf play as being hotdog posting, that's the sort of legacy i wanna leave

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Maple

anyway

it warms my heart that zelda remembers my wolf play as being hotdog posting, that's the sort of legacy i wanna leave

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that was one of the posts of all time for sure

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSAq2oJB53E

:bow:Turby Org Vote Counter v1.0:bow:
Day 1 - Votes from post 1 through 333

Votes	Target	Voters (Posts in Phase)
2	EnderWiggin	didistetter (24), nebjiamn (41)
2	Totally not Taffy	ladd (18), pzelda (14)
1	didistetter	Visor (24)
1	Raskolnikov	waza (49)
1	Arctic	EnderWiggin (25)
1	nebjiamn	Totally not Taffy (10)
8	Not Voting	Arctic (19), Lissa (35), Maple (25), Raskolnikov (0), Sunbae (19), Totally not Taffy (10), annika (22), dyachei (0)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by waza

If you’re doing it specifically so I have something to respond to don’t bother because I’m not going to respond to it, I think ur town and wasting both of our times and I’m not going to further indulge it by responding to your case

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good news is i've been fading in an out of consciousness so i haven't been working on this.

@ladd can you unpack your tr on waza a bit for me? he was kinda appealing to your read on him earlier and i'm curious like.. how confident you are in reading him

Vote: annika

i think i'm spiritually ok with a yeet on taffy. i'd vote there atp but i also wana vote annika.

if ender's town he could be right on arctic, especially if i'm wrong on annika (i'm not sure why but my brain is parsing arcy/annika as somewhat of a diff check). arctic is, for lack of a better word, a bit LACKING, in comparison to some of his other org games but meh. some of his posting is alright too.

gn little meow meows ily

stett carry me tomorrow pls ty

oh ive got some team building thing tomorrow and also a customer happy hour so good chance ill miss eod. i should be able to check in the morning a bit and early afternoon though

ill use those 6 posts wisely :bow:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ladd

as a side note i do think stett should be a villager now

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@ladd what was your process here

or was it just giving into thread consensus

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by didistetter

@ladd can you unpack your tr on waza a bit for me? he was kinda appealing to your read on him earlier and i'm curious like.. how confident you are in reading him

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i have got him right most/all of the non mashes we played together but he has never been a wolf so saying i can read him or that i am particularly good at reading him would be silly, I have no doubts he could fool me as a wolf. I do think there is some games where he genuinely just cleared himself to me tho


in this game he just feels like normal villa waza to me? lots of reads and world building, some a bit weird, but not really playing to be villaread - just to solve the game. His approach to me is also what i'd expect from him as a villager



but also if u think he is a wolf, go ahead lol he is a big boi and can defend himself...i mean i guess i'll defend him today if it comes to it cause he has only 1 post left but ya

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by didistetter

@ladd what was your process here

or was it just giving into thread consensus

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mostly a gamestate thing, it just doesnt feel like u are gonna flip wolf. I also partially wanted to reward u for not going OMGUSing like it generally happens to me lol but mostly just a feeling that u are not gonna flip wolf given how the game is evolving/people reads are shaping up

i'm not actually sure i've ever seen waza wolf

other than lost wolf @Maple

if i have i can't really remember it

Vote: Annika

i still think taffy's posts are fine, and i don't particular follow the line of thought from ladd/visor than benneh gelled with. If its "meta read w!taffy likes to push top town" then i'll take it with a grain of salt and look into that in the morning.

i wouldn't be giga suprised if the AFKs have a wolf just off thread vibes, but voting there gives us nothing and is useless so hopefully they show up and show out tomorrow or d1.

The timing of kinda insta pivoting off me is noted. A leeeeeeeetle weird but dunno. Realistically i thought the worst read on my slot was ladd's but both lissa, arctic, and ben liked his points so i'm probs self biased.

Mostly mentally chewing on the ladd/waza dynamic rn. Some stuff isn't landing right for me at all, but everyone else seems to be reading them both town, so i need to unpack that a bit mentally.

I'm still not vibing with ender's reads, but it feels like both he and taffy are in a flux state of needing to sink their teeth in a bit, so i'm willing to be patient. His general tone and demeanor feels kinda townily lighthearted but that's weak. Ender's one "arctic's read on me was premature and NAGL" struck me as slightly towny lol even tho i think archie is town.


NGL ladd i'm p sure i omgus more as town than wolf lol. the only like... omgus worthy push on me is visor tho and idt he feels particularly wolf or agendad so that'd be a waste of posts

@annika i'd appreciate it a lot if you could try to vocalize your reads on some of your higher town. Don't need walls but the more explanation the better. I need to see your processing more visibly to be able to find you here i think :jarswim:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by didistetter

i still think taffy's posts are fine, and i don't particular follow the line of thought from ladd/visor than benneh gelled with. If its "meta read w!taffy likes to push top town" then i'll take it with a grain of salt and look into that in the morning.

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nah it's more - I ask myself "Would a villager genuinely find these benneh posts wolfy for those reasons?" and i land more in the "no"


(there is also a bit of meta involved in that i feel the toan and sorta aggressive start lines up more with taffy wolf meta than village in my limited experience)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arctic

oknvm you are wolf BYE

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Don't really get the stetr villager reads

Someone explain it to me, sil vous plait?

not caught up at all but I'm here

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by didistetter

@annika i'd appreciate it a lot if you could try to vocalize your reads on some of your higher town. Don't need walls but the more explanation the better. I need to see your processing more visibly to be able to find you here i think :jarswim:

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um… what reads cutie? @didistetter I’m pretty sure I have explained all of my townreads already

off the first 2 pages I'm thinking annika might be town

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Totally not Taffy

And then this
which also doesn't jive with everything else
if you yourself are just trying to get the ball rolling, why get annoyed at the other ppl who are doing the same
why so adamant about not having reads yet while asking Annika to explain her read

It just doesn't rhyme

Taffy (5)

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@Totally not Taffy can you talk to me about what your thought process was behind the benneh read? imo, this isn't a "call out" but is ben trying to understand annika's mindset. What about this makes you think: "he's annoyed town are finding each other" instead of "he's trying to understand annika's motivations?"

Also you spend this post mostly just talking about ben, without really carring about the people he's discussing or prodding.

I'm curious—now that day has progressed and ben's actively voting there, what are your thoughts on annika? on her entrace and treatment of waza?

You say benneh is annoyed, but all your posts except this one and the sunbae shade express some form of frustration or annoyance, including annoyance at ben for having "zero chill at SoD".

tldr how is any of what you're citing as reason to vote ben wolfy?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dyachei

off the first 2 pages I'm thinking annika might be town

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could u explain that out a lil bit pls :3

which sod posts did you like?

vote: annika

i am going to bed now so won't be around until fairly close to eod

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lissa

vote: annika

i am going to bed now so won't be around until fairly close to eod

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Going to bed at 5am lmao?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by didistetter

could u explain that out a lil bit pls :3

which sod posts did you like?

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yeah, i felt like she didn't feel very stiff in her posts, but also kind of liked the call out on manti. I mean she can do it as a wolf, which is why I'm not confident, but that's where I lean and I'm maybe 6 pages into the thread now (but really need to take a break to do some work)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Visor

Going to bed at 5am lmao?

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her sleep schedule is majorly fucked recently

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by didistetter

@Totally not Taffy can you talk to me about what your thought process was behind the benneh read? imo, this isn't a "call out" but is ben trying to understand annika's mindset. What about this makes you think: "he's annoyed town are finding each other" instead of "he's trying to understand annika's motivations?"

Also you spend this post mostly just talking about ben, without really carring about the people he's discussing or prodding.

I'm curious—now that day has progressed and ben's actively voting there, what are your thoughts on annika? on her entrace and treatment of waza?

You say benneh is annoyed, but all your posts except this one and the sunbae shade express some form of frustration or annoyance, including annoyance at ben for having "zero chill at SoD".

tldr how is any of what you're citing as reason to vote ben wolfy?

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yeah it was def a weird interpretstion of bens posts in a lot of ways

at first i thought it was like weird in a ?villagery? way probably but others' comments re her meta etc. have altered my take on that

also curious for this to be answered

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by annika

Taffy seems townie for how she talked about Ben and her reasons for squinting a bit at Sunbae

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start with this one please @annika

in general, ig i'm just asking for like... a short paragraph on a couple slots. Maybe arctic and waza? I'm used to finding you through your analytical hedginess where you ovetthink and hedge but deliver really towny process and show how you're thinking through stuff.

And there isn't any of that so far this game :(

closest post was 165 which...... ngl it really doesn't feel like the quality of reads i'm used to from v!annika

not trying to say you're not towny enough to be town annika, god knows those reads are annoying, more so that you're assigning towncred to stuff I'm not used to you finding towny in wa way that feels more like retroactive justification that reflective of live thoughts

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Visor

Going to bed at 5am lmao?

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indeed lmao

I'm gonna drop the Annika v read at this point

I think the points raised against her are fair and I think what I had was a reach there

I'll admit that I am still not convinced re stett but happy to let it go for today

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nebjiamn

i know ladd said these posts were explainable as 'a thought' annika had -- and sure -- but she has a few posts like this where I don't really buy she has an interest or lack of knowledge with some of the questions she's asking (another example being the "why do you think ben will eb n1'd" post to ladd). like these are superbly nitpicky in ways that ping me for annika's wolf game. ack that happy mentioned he's seen her do this as town, i'm sure i have too, but there's just like, a dearth of towniness in lots of these to me.

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this entire post is way more nitpicky than anything I've posted today. your read on my comment on Maple is completely overblown considering it was one offhanded comment that I never even pursued

saying that's nitpicky is completely making mountains out of molehills

same thing for asking Ladd why he thought you'd be N1'd—like what is your problem with that exactly? how is that wolfie at all? it feels youre seeing me towntell and blanket calling it a wolf thing, it's so strange

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nebjiamn

there's something to this reads list and her later reads list where i'm removed from the core in place of visor. that's fine--i don't need to be on the top town list for someone i was actively sussing at the time. very reasonable to move me down, but i also kinda wonder if it was strategically done (future reads list lost in the multiquote)

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it's the same for this; I'm confused why you find this wolfie? like what does strategically even mean in this post aha
(and ftr yeah I'm moving you down now)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dyachei

yeah, i felt like she didn't feel very stiff in her posts, but also kind of liked the call out on manti. I mean she can do it as a wolf, which is why I'm not confident, but that's where I lean and I'm maybe 6 pages into the thread now (but really need to take a break to do some work)

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the... call out in 59 ?

uhm.

say more please

cuz... :gah:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by didistetter

the... call out in 59 ?

uhm.

say more please

cuz... :gah:

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yeah, it looked like she was trying to get a "gotcha" which tends to be more villagery than not. No, it's not a good post on it's own, but I liked the intent there.

sue me

waza seems unapologetically villager here. that's a strong read

ok but I don't like annika's post 226.

Quote:

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I didn't mean that as a scumlean on you or anything eheh. I do think you're townie tbh
but also, what do you dislike about me towning Sunbae specifically?

---

this part to benneh feels like a wolfy walk back

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by didistetter

start with this one please @annika

in general, ig i'm just asking for like... a short paragraph on a couple slots. Maybe arctic and waza? I'm used to finding you through your analytical hedginess where you ovetthink and hedge but deliver really towny process and show how you're thinking through stuff.

And there isn't any of that so far this game :(

closest post was 165 which...... ngl it really doesn't feel like the quality of reads i'm used to from v!annika

not trying to say you're not towny enough to be town annika, god knows those reads are annoying, more so that you're assigning towncred to stuff I'm not used to you finding towny in wa way that feels more like retroactive justification that reflective of live thoughts

---

I'm not actually townreading Arctic yet :3

for Waza it's just 165 which you already linked. on another note his angle on Rask is really fuckin townie lol, like actively wolfreading someone who's 0 posting is really unorthodox to the point where I don't think he does it as mafia

for Taffy I just really liked her opening posts, her read on Ben was pretty against the grain at the time and it seemed like she had a good worldview. her read on Sunbae felt good to me too bc it was kinda like, "I didn't read this the same way as you did which makes me feel weird" which is just inherently a villagery process. idt I'd vote her today

you shouldn't really be expecting more analysis from me in a light game. also you shouldn't meta read me lol, people SUCK at meta reading me unless it's literally "she killed a wolf? town". just trust Waza's read bb~

A grasshopper walk into a bar.
The barman looks at him and says,
“Did you know there’s a drink named after you?”
“Really?”, says the grasshopper. “You’ve got a drink named Taffy?”

A cat walks into a bar.
The bartender says, "what'll you have?"
The cat says, "A shot of tequila."
The bartender pours the cat their drink.
The cat slowly pushes the shot off the table. "Another."

A bee flies into a bar;
The barkeep says “Wow bee, uh what can I get you?”
The bee orders a half drop of mead.
The barkeep finds an eye dropper and dispenses her order.
Full of curiosity the barkeep asks “So do bees drink a lot?”
The bee replies, “No… just enough to get a buzz on”


A bee, a cat, and a grasshopper walk into an italian bar.
The barkeep says: "Wait are you the mafia?"
The trio says: "Shots all round!!!!"
~:cheers::hmg:

Id need to see benneh murder someone in front of my eyes to ever believe he is a wolf this game.


@Visor get on taffy :curtain:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ladd

Id need to see benneh murder someone in front of my eyes to ever believe he is a wolf this game.


@Visor get on taffy :curtain:

---

vote: taffy smh

town's looking something like:

Lissa
Stett
Waza

Ben

concerns:
sunbae

not sure where to put: taffy, annika

i keep seeing sus on taffy but i'll be honest, I didn't get much from the posts

I'm gonna go back and read them now

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by annika

just trust Waza's read bb~

---

why would you think i would trust waza's read when i demonstrably don't even trust waza?

i'm not asking why you tr arctic, ik you don't have an expressed tr on him. i'm asking if you could walk through your thoughts/reactions to arctic's initial burst of posting

"waza's opener was wolfie which i thought was towny b/c wolves dont want to sound wolfie" isn't moving the needle for me.

From what i can tell your reasoning for your tr on waza is:
1. he tr me (stett) then immediately rescinded it
2. his opener was wolfy
3. He voted/pushed/wolfread a 0 poster
4. He's too "unorthodox"/is playing in a way mafia would avoid.


Dunno.

Doesn't rlly feel like how town make reads on town to me

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dyachei

i keep seeing sus on taffy but i'll be honest, I didn't get much from the posts

I'm gonna go back and read them now

---

I can see why taffy is getting voted I just don't feel strongly about it

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ladd

Id need to see benneh murder someone in front of my eyes to ever believe he is a wolf this game.

@Visor get on taffy :curtain:

---

hmm
he's kinda wolfie tho imo

not really just for his scumread on me—specifically saying he thinks Arctic and I are a diff check in 336 doesn't track for me when Arctic and I haven't interacted at all and... should pretty easily be partners from his PoV

he says he's not sure why he thinks that, which is fair, but it's still odd to me

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by didistetter

why would you think i would trust waza's read when i demonstrably don't even trust waza?

i'm not asking why you tr arctic, ik you don't have an expressed tr on him. i'm asking if you could walk through your thoughts/reactions to arctic's initial burst of posting

"waza's opener was wolfie which i thought was towny b/c wolves dont want to sound wolfie" isn't moving the needle for me.

From what i can tell your reasoning for your tr on waza is:
1. he tr me (stett) then immediately rescinded it
2. his opener was wolfy
3. He voted/pushed/wolfread a 0 poster
4. He's too "unorthodox"/is playing in a way mafia would avoid.


Dunno.

Doesn't rlly feel like how town make reads on town to me

---

I don't have many thoughts. I don't agree on Visor but idk his reasoning is like okay, maybe very lightly villagery but I'm not including him on a town list just for what he's posted so far

it is how a town makes reads on town. I've made this type of read before and been right :3 also it's not just that but his expectation to be townread that feels townie to me lol

I'm actually going to go a step further and ask you to trust me on Waza, I think I can read him pretty well in normal games (maybe idk XD)

vote: nebjiamn

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by annika

vote: nebjiamn

---

why?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by annika

hmm
he's kinda wolfie tho imo

not really just for his scumread on me—specifically saying he thinks Arctic and I are a diff check in 336 doesn't track for me when Arctic and I haven't interacted at all and... should pretty easily be partners from his PoV

he says he's not sure why he thinks that, which is fair, but it's still odd to me

---

That seems like pretty micro stuff (he said he doesnt know why but he thinks u/artic are a difference check) compared to how villagery he has been in like...all of his posts and he had a ton of them and a ton of content

I just reread Arctic's posts and eh yeah just erase the smol town lean I had, he's completely null

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arctic

meh i'm really not seeing the visor townreads guys >.<

the post about annika felt like verbalized in a way such that he was trying to get townread and he doesn't have other reads with that same level of depth of thought which i feel lends credence to what i'm saying, and people even recognize that his push on stett didn't feel great which is the main thing i'm suspicious of - not just the detached comparison to lissa's game, but more the way he was sort of sewing the seeds there in a shady way

i think he is the wolfiest person amongst active posters. i feel like ender got a tiny bit towny but i'm not sure

---

@Arctic how does that lend credence to what you're saying? you think Visor went "I'm only going to towntell once. after that I will stop trying to towntell. peak wolfing"? isn't it kinda the opposite? xD

also @didistetter considering you don't like my reasons for TRing Waza, what do you think of this post?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arctic

i think annika townread waza for the correct reason on page 1

i think he made too many reads too early for not great reasons in a way that wolf him would generally avoid

i'm townreading them both for this but mainly waza

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dyachei

why?

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ladd

That seems like pretty micro stuff (he said he doesnt know why but he thinks u/artic are a difference check) compared to how villagery he has been in like...all of his posts and he had a ton of them and a ton of content

---

if I TR him it's mostly for his body of work and general activity yeah

truthfully since the start of the game he's been the TR I've felt the worst about, even more than Sunbae who I just townread for one pure post basically eheh

and I really couldn't put my finger on why, something just felt off—maybe just a silly feeling but it kind of...kept me from including him on lists ig even though I couldn't really explain it

the diff check thing kinda helps me put words to an otherwise inexplicable scumlean since it's something tangible that I dislike. I recognise it's kind of a micro thing yeah

oh also sorry for not acking this earlier, but I saw your response to my Q about Ben being the N1 o7
you seem lightly townie maybe

@Arctic sorry for the double ping but I'd like some thoughts on beanneh when you get the chance :3

I like Visor's read on me and that's my main reason for TRing him atm, but also I think he dropped his townread on me at a reasonable time for a villager and it doesn't really feel opportunistic to me

(my 2c on your Visor WR)

Dya seems light v too based on how they're catching up, I think the way they read Taffy and I makes sense given both of our thread positions. like they don't really understand the suspicion but they're hesitant to solidify a read on either of us

so I'm at

Townreads:
Waza/Stett/pzelda/Taffy

Townleans:
Dya/Ladd/Lissa/Visor/Sunbae

PoE:
Ben/Maple/Arctic (<- this is my current guess for the team atm) /Rask/Ender

honestly this feels pretty good to me, I probably don't have the exact team lol but it does feel like these 5 names prob have at least 2 wolves?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by annika

Dya seems light v too based on how they're catching up, I think the way they read Taffy and I makes sense given both of our thread positions. like they don't really understand the suspicion but they're hesitant to solidify a read on either of us

so I'm at

Townreads:
Waza/Stett/pzelda/Taffy

Townleans:
Dya/Ladd/Lissa/Visor/Sunbae

PoE:
Ben/Maple/Arctic (<- this is my current guess for the team atm) /Rask/Ender

honestly this feels pretty good to me, I probably don't have the exact team lol but it does feel like these 5 names prob have at least 2 wolves?

---

honestly, I think you need to move ben up. idk about maple, arctic (I always want him to be wolf), rask or ender, but I think you're wrong on ben and I can't really express why

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dyachei

honestly, I think you need to move ben up. idk about maple, arctic (I always want him to be wolf), rask or ender, but I think you're wrong on ben and I can't really express why

---

I'll unvote for now
vote: Maple

Ok, just checking in, I should be more active in 3 hours. I quite like Lissa now, but I also admit I skipped some of her posts. I think I quite like dya. Other than that the last few hours feel like mostly towns talking and wolves being mostly quiet.. like max 1 wolf in the active conversation and towns trying to solve.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by annika

this entire post is way more nitpicky than anything I've posted today. your read on my comment on Maple is completely overblown considering it was one offhanded comment that I never even pursued

saying that's nitpicky is completely making mountains out of molehills

---

for the record, i don't think me calling out your post on manti as nitpicky is making mountains out of molehills. that post is demonstrably and objectively nitpicky. you were overly critical of a grammatical error that was relatively easily explained if you put a second of thought to it.

if you want to say that the basis for my wolfread is what 'making mountains out of molehills' is that might be that could be more fair fypov, but those posts are just how i was trying to express why i found you wolfy, but its not all encompassing.

Quote:

---

same thing for asking Ladd why he thought you'd be N1'd—like what is your problem with that exactly? how is that wolfie at all? it feels youre seeing me towntell and blanket calling it a wolf thing, it's so strange

---

i don't find that to be a townie question borne out of curiosity, and i'm really confused with this second sentence because i quite literally haven't seen you towntell? that's why I wrote the post in question--i had to illicit my read on you into some form of digestible content for others because if the posts I quoted weren't snadwiched between a bunch of things i town tell, i probably wouldn't be picking nits, but as it was like, most of your content up to that point i felt it was worth putting on paper.

Quote:

---

it's the same for this; I'm confused why you find this wolfie? like what does strategically even mean in this post aha
(and ftr yeah I'm moving you down now)

---

tbf this is a gamestate read highly likely to be confbiased, but the placement and timing just feels sus to me

(and fair enough)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunbae

Re: Benneh, I think benneh is only a wolf if I am and, well, I am not so he should be a villager (that is a real read not a joke)

---

what was the thought process here

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sunbae

If I said:

my village reads atm are didistetter, neb, pzelda, and ladd

my "i'll leave them be due to people finding them towney" list was waza and lissa

my active concern list was Visor, Maple, annika (but not both maple and annika), and arctic


how similar would our reads be and which ones are we most off on

---

why are you townreading ladd?

i'm intrigued by how you are the only other person suspecting visor rn but you aren't alarmed by the gamestate sort of handing him out townreads for free

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by annika

I'll unvote for now
vote: Maple

---

I don't think you've really talked about me at all, really. What are you feeling?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nebjiamn

Vote: annika

i think i'm spiritually ok with a yeet on taffy. i'd vote there atp but i also wana vote annika.

if ender's town he could be right on arctic, especially if i'm wrong on annika (i'm not sure why but my brain is parsing arcy/annika as somewhat of a diff check). arctic is, for lack of a better word, a bit LACKING, in comparison to some of his other org games but meh. some of his posting is alright too.

gn little meow meows ily

stett carry me tomorrow pls ty

---

i don't really think annika is a wolf and i don't think taffy is either

i really don't like the direction this game is going in

i may be lacking because i want to be more of a support player and just go along with whatever people are doing, but i feel myself getting pulled back into my incessant need to take charge because i think wolves are easily in people like ladd/visor (ladd dropped a poe which, taking out the 0 posters, i think has a good chance of having 0-1 wolves) and maybe you/annika (but i kinda think you are v/v). and i'm torn on whether or not to act on those feelings because if i'm wrong i don't want to completely derail the game, but it's getting increasingly hard to just sit on my hands here

i also think annika posted a team which is 0/3 unless you're a wolf - i really don't think it's maple - so i'm not sure what to do with that. but her posts just sound honest to me. i don't really think it's her.

last post, idk if ill be here for sod since i'll be working but yeah ill keep this short and sweet

i felt in a similar position to where lissa was last couple of pages but much earlier, where most of the thread seemed towny enough and there were still 2 zero posters. so that usually means 1 of 2 things. the first being a zero poster has a wolf or two, or that ive already miscleared due to being too rash. so i figured, lets rule out the first possibility

so i decide to just loltunnel rask. rask from my experience has been a fairly easy read, and i think in particular the way he responds to pushes i would be able to get something very AI off it. and i figured that town!rask opening the thread to see me tunneling him before he gets into the game would respond quite differently than wolf!rask. ive used stuff like this on people like creature before and it works out quite well. well enough and its much quicker than waiiting for a late comer to adjust themselves into the game and slowly backread everything. this is short and quick and gets me results within minutes, so i like it. but rask has been away for too long that its useless now and maybe even rand v sadly that they arent here but lets not get into that, i wont reward it anyways and would gladly vote them out even if they are in rand v territory now. this sequence leads into some thoughts i have on ben and lissa but ill come back to that

Sunbae

i wanna talk about this first since its probs one of my best guesses for a wolf atm. (im probs never voting here d1 anyways because i love sunbae and wanna play with them since ive never gotten to play longform with them so im happy for them to stick around even if i think theyre a wolf lol)

so like if i didnt know any better and briefly looked at sunbaes posts id say there is towny nuance, theres nothing that stands out as wolfy, and no shitposting. and ironically this is part of what makes sunbae a wolf. because if they were town it would be the opposite imo, atleast from turbos in what i seen i expect more shitposts, and much less towny nuance this early. so then i decided to have a deeper look and then i could see the wolf angle too.

taffy already brought up some concerns there so i wont double up on the stuff taffy said in regards to sunbaes comments to lissa. which yeah are wolfy because yeah the implication was fairly straight forward and if taffy who wasnt in the mash felt the same then that takes away credence from it being something that only the mash players would have gotten.

anyways: lets look at something sunbae said

"This is going to be one of those things where I don't know whats happening and get cleared for it but why does it never happen when I rand wolf :wall: "

i actually dont find this thought to be something that fits in what was actually happening at the time. go back to the page and post for yourselves and read the context in which it was said.

it just simply doesnt fit and feels out of place (similar to their post about ben only being a wolf if sunbae is a wolf because it doesnt make sense. they havent played partnery at all, in fact ben has slightly sussed sunbae and i doubt he would do that as w/w imo they probs would just shield and buddy and powerwolf together)

and like it has the mindset of thinking about things that will clear them which is something that i more often see leak into their posting from wolves

and ironically enough sunbae accused me of playing to be trd in something i said what my stett reversal but imo this post and their play in general fits that much more

because sunbae gets trd for this ....and then just dips

they dont really stick around or banter the same way i see them do as town, their posting patterns just feel like something who is playing to be townread, and i dont seee a villagery interest in trying to parse others or interact with them as much

their reads list they gave later also felt wolf shaped but i cant articulate why, just that some of the standings felt somewhat arbitrary and almost feels a bit too fleshed out relative to how much they have been here and their relative output into the thread

Taffy


errr this isnt my second top sr, so dont take this as ordered. i just felt like talking about them second

well their sr on ben felt forced, i already said that in the thread. it felt like they were approaching the read with the destination in mind and just working in every way they could to make sure they reach that goal.

and then they say

"Damn I thought there were ppl here when I started posting and nobody's commented or asked me anything

See you later I guess "


and in a vacuum its maybe towny but at the same time it puts off the idea that they were keen to interact with others but that feels somewhat juxtaposed with them going straight into their benneh push.

errr its a minor point but it just felt odd

though to their credit they were the first to call out sunbae so maybeeeeeeeeee not partners but id be shocked if both are v

Ben and Lissa

im pooling them both together because they both did something that was incredibly strange

so ill preface this by saying that if i ignore everything else then ben has been super villagery. i do think 99/100 times someone approach the game the way ben has this game theyre just town.

BUT

in a world where me annika and stett are all town i am pinged by the fact that he hasnt managed to find any of us 3 this game given he has a really good read on all 3 of us. the caveat is i think annika and stett are defs sandbagging somewhat and im being weird so maybeeeeeeee its excusable but idk

ANYWAYS

what i really didnt like was when he hypothesized my play only makes sense if im in a hood with rask.

which is just absurd.

i mean absurd things like these are generally rand>>>>v

but cmon that seriously cant be the only scenario in which u would think i would act this way. esp since u and lissa have seen me do this before. ben even saw me do it to santy 2 mashes back (santy was wolf vig so i sniped him hehe get rekd santy) and lissa saw me play a game last mash where i call out zero posters. so both of them know first hand i will do stuff like this, so for them to be so confused and taken back by it didnt sit right

BUT

for ben i can somewhat rationalise it. i think ben is trying to force himself to be annoyed at my gameplay. okay maybe forced isnt the right word, i think he probs is annoyed at it. and hes trying to find reasons to justify to himself to vote me because deep down he knows my play isnt wolfy. but he wants to convince himself its okay to vote me, so he tells himself that the only way my play is acceptable is that if im in a hood with rask, so if im not then he can justify himself that its okay to policy me for my play. ive caught myself doing that to others before, and i think that in of itself makes ben reallllllly towny if thats the case, but even if it is he may not realise it so yeah ill never really know

tldr bens theory was really off

but then lissa sees the same theory and agrees that its the only possible explanation.

and i think thats much worse from lissas end because its harder for me to justify for her to come to that conclusion

and lissa has fanned the flames on people catching heat in times where i think a wolf would

like shes shaded me a bunch when i think a wolf would, she did the same to ender, kinda did the same to stett and annika. idk she just seems to piggyback off people shading others at times i expect a wolf to do so. but i do think shes more holistically townier than the game i saw her wolf in. and maybe she just is that kind of player thats plays off others so ill just sit and watch for now



THE REST


Ladd could be the evil counterpart to me that lissa is to ben

in that yeah maybe there is a non zero chance that if im wolfsiding and being a bad villa that ladd is capitalizing off it as a wolf in the same way that i think lissa may be if shes a wolf and ben is town

but thats mostly conjecture so ill leave it be and i do think ladd has done everything id expect from town!him to do even if im sure that if he really wanted to he could emulate that to fool me

arctic is okay, idk i can see him being a wolf. just havent had any aha this is defs a villa moments. i dont like he automatically dismissed what i had to say about visor by implying i dont know visors wolf game without first asking me what experience i have with wolf!visor. i dont like that hes waffly on stett, if his main sr is visor then stett should be a freebie tr for him since shes obv not with visor. so yeah that doesnt sit right. him having me as town was pingy too but i think he knows i get paranoid of him when he trs me so maybe him being wild enough to say im his top town is like too outrageous for him to say as a wolf. i kinda liked his reaction to enders omgus

zelda we all know is town but may get voted later anyways if game is hard and people start doing dumb stuff because they dont know what to do. maybe id be one of them heh

annika has been naughty. but not in a wolfy way. shes still town, but has been playing lazy and hence naughty for it. ill give some free meta on her - or a snippet. lazy annika is always town annika, shes never lazy as a wolf.

err ender i could be wrong on but i wanna yolo him v. will re-eval if i have to

stett i regret my reaction to her saying she would case me. in hindsight id like to have seen the case because i think i would be able to undeniably lock her town for it if the case was bad but believable enough lol. i know ive lock towned her a bunch already but i keep flip flopping right after i say it, i think partly of it is because it feels like most of her solving has to do with me or asking everyone their read on me when she interacts. hard to believe shes that tunneled but if i look outside her play around me and her sod dip i do think shes been towny and would say shes town >90% of the time here

maple i think im biased this game because they keep randing wolf to the point where i dont want them to get away with it this game if theyre a wolf, so i imagine i would be quite hard on them if i were to read them. so i havent done so much, but errrr they feel lost in a towny way if i had to force a read

visor i liked his reactions to things. doesnt seem forced. could be someone i cleared easily but for now im treating him ladd annika stett ben zelda and maybeeeeee ender as town and seeing where that gets me

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dyachei

town's looking something like:

Lissa
Stett
Waza

Ben

concerns:
sunbae

not sure where to put: taffy, annika

---

Whats your concerns about sunbae?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by annika

I just reread Arctic's posts and eh yeah just erase the smol town lean I had, he's completely null



@Arctic how does that lend credence to what you're saying? you think Visor went "I'm only going to towntell once. after that I will stop trying to towntell. peak wolfing"? isn't it kinda the opposite? xD

also @didistetter considering you don't like my reasons for TRing Waza, what do you think of this post?

---

it's not that he would elect to stop posting towny things as wolf, but more the fact it hasn't been a consistent trend is the concern because if he was a villager who genuinely came up with towny thoughts like that i would expect to see more of them being naturally formed and posted by now

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by annika

@Arctic sorry for the double ping but I'd like some thoughts on beanneh when you get the chance :3

I like Visor's read on me and that's my main reason for TRing him atm, but also I think he dropped his townread on me at a reasonable time for a villager and it doesn't really feel opportunistic to me

(my 2c on your Visor WR)

---

...wdym it's not opportunistic?? i squinted hard at that lmao. like this take feels so silly to me. it's the type of read that you'd look at in post game and go "how was i so silly to townread a wolf for that". i'm kinda dumbfounded by this. i don't know if it's wilful ignorance but like. i think you're pushing villagers and townreading wolves

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by annika

hmm
he's kinda wolfie tho imo

not really just for his scumread on me—specifically saying he thinks Arctic and I are a diff check in 336 doesn't track for me when Arctic and I haven't interacted at all and... should pretty easily be partners from his PoV

he says he's not sure why he thinks that, which is fair, but it's still odd to me

---

another game state read, and not one i feel particularly confident about on a macro level, but with how the game is shaping up, it feels like there's a contingent of strong trs on slots that fall into my poe that i'm going to be clearly wrong about, but if/as some of that happens, arctic falls into a place where I could see that working if, for example, i'm wrong on you.

this doesn't really apply to a few others in my poe for various reasons that i probably put into words well, but its not just "haha theyre a diff check"

Quote:

---

and I haven't interacted at all and... should pretty easily be partners from his PoV

---

i'm not discounting yall being partners entirely, but to your point, yall dont have pairing interactions so its not something i actively considered. i probably worded that poorly. again, moreso just gamestate wise, I could see arctic being a hit if i'm wrong with you--it just feels kinda right with how the game is is being blended in my brain at the moment. "parsing the game somewhat as a diff check" - somewhat was doing heavy lifting there, but it was more meant to display the world in which we flipped you first and you came around town, my next target for investigation would have been arctic. if arctic got flipped here and was wolf, i don't think i'd have cleared you (barring you being a part of his push).


ftr annika i don't really hate your poe overall -- there's a decent chance a good chunk of it is correct and i think that's viewable by the thread consensus starting to gel around a core of maple/arctic/rask as a main POE group with you/taffy/ender kinda filling the gaps depending on whos making the read

we're only really boned if that has like 1 wolf max but shruze

---

dya seems decently townie. them having some conviction and breadth in their reads right away feels like a good entry

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this feels like a good place to say i don't super townread ladd here, but i don't scumlean him either. i kinda just hope he's right on taffy since he's got some conviction there. this is not me saying we judge him solely off their flip--just that it'd be nice for me to not have to parse him after that.

also i'm back on just thinking pzelda is town. i rescinded that tr earlier because i didn't want to do it on the basis of "new player make big poast" but after letting things settle a bit I just come out of their posts feeling good with them. i know this isn't like revelatory for anyone but ya


i will prob move my vote to taffy shortly--i don't come out of this string of posts tring annika but she's given me enough content to wana parse through and let simmer a bit and see what happens this morning. also i'm a bit weirded out the wagon on annika actually took off -- which sucks cause i thnk i'm tring both of the players that joined me? problems for another version of me maybe

I'm eepy and need more sleep idk when eod is but I'm sure I'll be awake before it

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this feels like a good place to say i don't super townread ladd here, but i don't scumlean him either.

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Seems fair enuf


Not sure i agree on dya with you but its still early we will see

i see the rest of your wall waza and ill pprocess it in a bit, but this part:

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in a world where me annika and stett are all town i am pinged by the fact that he hasnt managed to find any of us 3 this game given he has a really good read on all 3 of us. the caveat is i think annika and stett are defs sandbagging somewhat and im being weird so maybeeeeeeee its excusable but idk

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i have stett as town and you as probly town atp. i've said as much im pretty sure re: stett, but she def has some weird sequences that have given me pause

i haven't said it abotu you because honestly the fact that i ended up having you as prob town is kinda boring. part of it is a sheep, part of it is your content gelled better. but i just don't have a ton to back and forth with you about, especially cause of our mutual high-posting, and also you aren't in any kind of danger. and yea, also, your play was annoying me initially lol.

i also think there is/was value to letting e.g. stett build her case on you so i can see it and read her, read others off it, etc, so that's why i didn't step in to be like "hey he's town now let him cook leave it alone"

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Originally Posted by ladd

Whats your concerns about sunbae?

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well, his tone feels off to me. that's the long and short of it. He had some stuff around not understanding lissa that other people thought might be weird, but I don't think sunbae generally thinks along game starts/ends meaning people can be more free so i think that's pretty NAI. I'm also not seeing a ton of content from him and he's usually pretty free flowing with that.

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Originally Posted by Arctic

meh i'm really not seeing the visor townreads guys >.<

the post about annika felt like verbalized in a way such that he was trying to get townread and he doesn't have other reads with that same level of depth of thought which i feel lends credence to what i'm saying, and people even recognize that his push on stett didn't feel great which is the main thing i'm suspicious of - not just the detached comparison to lissa's game, but more the way he was sort of sewing the seeds there in a shady way

i think he is the wolfiest person amongst active posters. i feel like ender got a tiny bit towny but i'm not sure

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This is a Wolfy post

Not because he is pushing me, but because of his framing of the stett push

I don't think anyone has said my push on stett didn't feel great

There are people who don't agree with the dead, sure and find stett villagery

But no one is actually out here saying those things about my read re stett (unless I've forgotten something)

The hedge on ender is meh too, but the phrasing around stett being slimy is what is problematic here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYKgOqRS6KI

:bow: Turby Org Vote Counter v1.0 :bow:
Day 1 - Votes from post 1 through 386

Votes	Target	Voters (Posts in Phase)
3	annika	Lissa (39), didistetter (34), nebjiamn (46)
3	Totally not Taffy	Visor (28), ladd (24), pzelda (15)
1	Raskolnikov	waza (50)
1	Arctic	EnderWiggin (25)
1	Maple	annika (33)
1	nebjiamn	Totally not Taffy (10)
6	Not Voting	Arctic (21), Maple (26), Raskolnikov (0), Sunbae (19), dyachei (12)

waza i agree on sunbae, he is probably my second guess for a wolf rn based on what you described there, better than i could - but i got pinged by the kinda arbitrary read list too and lack of connections explored from there

idk why you are pinged by me townreading you. i'm pretty good at reading you. i think you are clearly town lol, i haven't seen you wolf in long form so if you think i should know better then well.. i don't. egg on my face if this is wrong, but i am not getting there for a while especially not after this wall

i should probably clarify that i'm not wolfreading stett, actually i'll just make my full read list now

town:

waza
pzelda
lissa
stett
maple
annika
taffy
benneh

poe:

dya
rask
ladd
sunbae
visor

i recognize that i can have 2 more people in my poe lol. and i also recognize that this is a hard world to reconcile because it assumes a bunch of v/v/v violence in waza/annika/stett/benneh. so i'm not ruling out that benneh/annika could have a wolf. but i think sunbae/ladd/visor are all just more likely hits. i don't townread anything from ladd and i have expressed concerns with sunbae and visor. if taffy is a wolf, then maybe i'm wrong on ladd, but i don't really see it. i just think the way taffy made those pushes is town

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Originally Posted by Arctic

waza i agree on sunbae, he is probably my second guess for a wolf rn based on what you described there, better than i could - but i got pinged by the kinda arbitrary read list too and lack of connections explored from there

idk why you are pinged by me townreading you. i'm pretty good at reading you. i think you are clearly town lol, i haven't seen you wolf in long form so if you think i should know better then well.. i don't. egg on my face if this is wrong, but i am not getting there for a while especially not after this wall

i should probably clarify that i'm not wolfreading stett, actually i'll just make my full read list now

town:

waza
pzelda
lissa
stett
maple
annika
taffy
benneh

poe:

dya
rask
ladd
sunbae
visor

i recognize that i can have 2 more people in my poe lol. and i also recognize that this is a hard world to reconcile because it assumes a bunch of v/v/v violence in waza/annika/stett/benneh. so i'm not ruling out that benneh/annika could have a wolf. but i think sunbae/ladd/visor are all just more likely hits. i don't townread anything from ladd and i have expressed concerns with sunbae and visor. if taffy is a wolf, then maybe i'm wrong on ladd, but i don't really see it. i just think the way taffy made those pushes is town

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oops, ender is in my poe too

ugh I am not at all a fan of me/maple/annika being thrown around as the poe when I think this is easily 0 wolves

normally I'd wolfread someone who talks a lot about their process in place of utilising said process, but i think given Maple's existential crisis in mafia (as benneh described earlier) - i think it tracks, and, quoting from waza too, he feels kinda lost in a villagery way and struggling to make stances in a way that wolf him wouldn't be here given the discussion we related to about how wolfing is a lot easier

annika i could be wrong on but i think her push on benneh just sounds like. she is a girlboss and knows she is town. idk. i'm aware girlbossing is a staple of her wolf game, but it didn't.. really feel like a cat scrambling around kinda defence. i think she believes it. i think she can easily defer to Taffy or me as a wolf here but maple is a kinda novel push here (even tho i think it's wrong) which i'd give points to

i'm trying to put words to two reads which are inherently intuitive so i understand if this doesn't convince anyone, but it's how i feel so >.<