Prometheus, I've been arguing for your reconstruction the whole time. ~:cheers:
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Prometheus, I've been arguing for your reconstruction the whole time. ~:cheers:
Arguing means? ~:confused:
PROM:
Arguing = discutere... trying to prove your point.
~:handball:Quote:
Originally Posted by Vercingetorix
Kill?....Just happy to know your still alive matee ~D
Absolutely agreed. But it doesn't mean that we should build the house which will collapse after a week. If you build something build it to last.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
It's already built - the vanilla RTW! You are already refining it.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
Great work! Why not to keep all your other work in such "high style"!?Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
Ok, just gimme your cas'es and textures so that I can correct them.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
We're not dreaming it. We're building it. Although not many can keep your pace at creating units.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
True. I'm not arguing with that.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
I never said you were making fantasy units!!! In fact, I praised you several times for your accuracy. I was just asking for a plate to compare it to, because I had a very different idea taken from my readings.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
Yes, I know that most of them are extremelly well informed. I just need to see several examples to be convinced of their total accuracy.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
Well, didn't you understood what I've said? I never questioned the use of that helm. Of course the corinthian wasn't used in that age. My problem is more with the cuirass than the rest.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
For you. But it could be correct because it was a standard by then. The same happened with the corinthian one some 150 years before. It became a standard.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
But, as I've said before, your helm isn't the issue. I was just asking about the cuirass or linen armour.
I'm in no way criticizing your awesome efforts. I aplaude them. I just want our decisions to be perfectly justified and correct, not to run into problems later on. Just that.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
That is the point of the question. We can't be working for convinience. We must work for perfectionism. And, believe me, your work can achieve that. It already did with some other units. ~:)Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
That was for Dead Moroz, not for me, right? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
Actually U quoted parts for Deaz Moroz more than to you anyway ...here is the Secutor Wich I used to substituite the Mirmillo wich is similar to the Samnite and so I merged in the Samnite , He should use a sort of sword but the animations are with a spear so I will leave this unchanged to be changed later on since I use those units to play online too....
http://img91.exs.cx/img91/2199/aaaaaaa1.jpg
Beautifull!!! Well done, PROMETHEUS!!! :2thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
No problem. We'll change that later. Great work!!! :yes:Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
https://usera.imagecave.com/PSYCHO/symbol_gauls.jpg
OFFICERS
General :
Same model as Arverni but with bronze breastplate with ornate design, short conical helmet with vein / spike (Helvetii style) and wings, longsword
Lesser General :
Same model as Arverni but with mail vest and shoulder pieces, Conical Helmet with large cheek guards and Black Plume ..or this helmet
https://usera.imagecave.com/PSYCHO/Stdhelmet.jpg
Unit Commander :
Same model as Arverni but with mail vest and shoulder pieces, Boar helmet, long sword, round shield
Standard Bearer : (In progress)
Helm, cloak, naked torso, Boar standard, long sword
Carnyx :
Duds, long sleeve shirt, carnyx, bowl helm
LIGHT INFANTRY
Tribal Militia : (In progress)
Gallic versions of Peasants yet still better skilled in fighting than other culture equivalent
Long hair, Gallic mow, long shirt, tartan trousers, oval shield, thrusting spear
Senone Slingers :
Above Average Valour, Easily Fatigued, Dubious Morale under heavy casualties
(Long hair, Gallic moustache, torque, naked chest, trousers, shoes, Sling, Pellet pouch slung over shoulder, Short Celtic Sword, Very small buckler usually slung over back).
(Can be raised anywhere in Transalpine Gaul)
Aquitanian Archers: (In progress)
Average Valour, Easily Fatigued, Low Morale
(Long plated hair, Gallic moustache, torque, long sleave shirt to thigh over trousers and tied around waste with belt, shoes, bow, quiver of arrows hung off left hip, short Celtic sword, No Shield).
(Can be raised in Southern Transalpine Gaul)
Bodvoritus (‘Running Wrath’):
Extremely Impetuous, Extremely Undisciplined, Good Morale, Very Good Stamina, Good Attack
(Long flowing hair, naked tattooed torso, Gallic moustache, torque, armlets, chequered trousers in ‘faction colours’, shoes, arm guards, dirk and medium length (Halstatt) sword).
(Can be raised from Transalpine Gaul)
MEDIUM INFANTRY
Southern Warband: (Done)
Impetuous, Above Average Valour, Easily Fatigued.
(Shorter hair to nape of neck and spiked up with lime, Gallic moustache, torque, bangle around each wrist, naked chest, cloak fastened at right shoulder by broach, tartan trousers, shoes, throwing spears, long Celtic sword, rounded rectangular shield)
(Can be raised anywhere in Cisalpine Gaul and Celtiberia)
https://usera.imagecave.com/PSYCHO/b..._gaul_INFO.jpg
Northern Warband: (Done)
Impetuous, Above Average Valour, Easily Fatigued.
(Long hair platted, Gallic moustache, torque, naked chest, armlets, bangle around each wrist, trousers, shoes, throwing spears, long Celtic sword, oval shield)
(Can be raised anywhere in Transalpine Gaul)
https://usera.imagecave.com/PSYCHO/B...RBAND_INFO.jpg
* Thinking about giving bowl helmet. Thoughts?
Veneti Bagaudam (‘Guerrilla Fighters’):
Disciplined, Average Valour, Dubious Morale, more easily achieve ambushes, receive bonus to attack when directly from ships or at night.
(Bronze helmet with thin horns, short dark hair, Gallic moustache, torque, short sleave shirt in ‘faction colours’ with chequered borders to thigh over trousers and tied around waste with belt, short boots, spear, Celtic sword, strange squarish shield with wavy sides).
(Can be raised from Veneti (Armorica) Territory)
https://usera.imagecave.com/PSYCHO/Veneti.jpg
Dubis Dusios (‘Black Demons’):
Impetuous, Very High Valour, Good Stamina, Very High Morale, Good Attack
(Bronze bowl helmets adorned with purple crest, short dark hair, shaggy black (goatskin like) shoulder-less tunic to above knee bound by thick Iberian belt, arm guards, greaves made of the same black material wound around shins and carves, excellent quality iron short two edged swords, dirk, Celtic oval shield in ‘faction colours’).
(Can be raised from Celtiberian ‘Gaul’)
*May ditch this depending on the Celtiberian work?
Bodubatae (‘Raven Warriors’):
Excellent Discipline, Good Valour, Good Stamina, High Morale,
(Bronze Raven helmet, long hair, Gallic moustache, golden torque, golden armlets, bronze armbands, long sleeve shirt with bronze cuirass, red tartan trousers to ankles, cloak in 'faction colours’ fastened with large golden broach on right shoulder, short boots, long thrusting spear, long Celtic sword, Oval Shield).
(Can be raised from Aedui Territory / Gallic Capital)
HEAVY INFANTRY
Arverni Arjos (‘Nobles’): (Done)
Good Discipline, Low Valour, Easily Fatigued, Good Morale
(Iron ‘Gallic’ helmet, long hair, Gallic moustache, torque, wrist guards, shirt of mail over long sleeve tunic gathered by belt at waist, tartan cloak gathered on right shoulder with broach, trousers, short boots, long thrusting spears, long Celtic sword, shield).
https://usera.imagecave.com/PSYCHO/a...arjos_INFO.jpg
(Can be raised from Arverni Territory, post Marian reforms if possible)
Carnute Cingetos (‘Warriors):
High Valour, High Morale, Good attack, Cause Fear against other Gallic units, Large Additional Valour and Morale Bonus against non-Celtic factions.
(Iron helmet with forward facing horns, long hair, Gallic moustache, torque, arm guards, chain mail shirt over long sleeve tunic gathered at waist by belt, stripped trousers in ‘faction colours’, Royal Blue cloak fastened on breast, short ankle boots, Long Celtic Sword, Round Shield).
(Can be raised from Carnute Territory)
CAVALRY
Leuce Epos (‘Light Horse’):
Disciplined, Good Valour, Good Morale
(Iron bowl Helmet with tri swirl cheek guards, long hair, Gallic moustache, torque, armlets, bangle around each wrist, long sleave tunic over trousers and tied at waist by belt, shoes, round shield, throwing spears, long Celtic Sword).
(Can raise from any Celtic Area)
Brihentin (‘Elite Cavalry’):
Disciplined, Good Valour, Easily fatigued, Good Morale, Excellent Attack
(Iron ‘Gallic’ helmet with faction-coloured plume, long hair, Gallic moustache, torque, arm guards, chain mail shirt over long sleeve tunic gathered at waist by belt, trousers in ‘faction colours’, cloak fastened on right shoulder by broach, short ankle boots, medium spear / lance, long Celtic Sword, Round shield).
(Can be raised anywhere in Transalpine Gaul)
MERCENARIES
Gaesatae (‘Spearmen’):
Impetuous, High valour, Easily fatigued, Good Morale, Very Good Attack, Long spear throwing range.
(Like to see slightly larger model of warband but with beefed up muscles, no trousers, small flap at front, Iron Helmet with black horse hair trail, long hair, Gallic moustache, Long Hexagonal Shield, throwing spears, Long Celtic Sword, large golden torque, armlets, bracelets and anklets.
(Can be hired from Gallic Territory)
Ordocorii (‘Hammer Troops’):
Disciplined, Good Valour, Good Stamina, Average Morale
(Short Horned (Thames styled) helmet, Long dark flowing hair, Woaded face and arms, Gallic moustache, Golden torque, Heavy Wrist guards, Sleeveless shirt and vest of chain mail over trousers, belt at waist, Tartan cloak, shoes, heavy war hammer, round shield)
(Can be hired from any Gallic coastal province)
* I’d actually like to see an event linked to war with Rome that Britons offer their services.
Mori Gaesum (‘Sea of Spears’):
Excellent Discipline, Good Valour, Very Good Morale
(Tall spiked iron helmets, long dark hair, Gallic moustache, torque, arm guards, red tunic with chequered borders gathered with belt over trousers, cloak same colour as trousers, shoes, Pikes, long Celtic sword, large rectangular shield with rounded edges)
(Can be hired from Helvetii territory)
http://www.r-kproductions.com/products/P54133.jpg
* Like to see event where Helvetii migrate
Teutones:
Disciplined, Excellent Valour, Good Stamina, Excellent Morale
(Hair dyed red and in pony tail, full beard, naked chest, short cloak, trousers, shoes, throwing spears, small square shield)
(Can be hire from border areas with Germans / German territory)
~:)
Excellent! This weekend we have holiday in the USA (thanksgiving) so I hope to work on some more Gallic units ~:)
Are all those gallic units realistic ? I have never heard of Daemons, ravens or sea of spear units where did u took all this info? U used the Bello Gallico? or somewhere else?
since I don't remember those even in this book.... ~:confused:
Actually I deleted for error overwriting this model , so I will remake but I was undecise between this Thraex wich is close to the one CA made and instead the retiarius .... difficult task to make the net ......Quote:
Thraex Gladiator , the equvalent of CA veliti....
or may be we could add the Scissor Gladiator to replace the arcani , actually they look very similar about for the cape .... even if the Arcani where really an exhisting unit in ancienRome , they where more a secret policethan a military unit so could be used to add a fourth gladiator unit ......so a rebel army of gladiators will ave
heavy samnite-mirmillons , scissor , secutor
light thraex retiarius
Yes, to the best of our knowledge.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
All my research was posted and discussed to death at the .com about 2 years ago. Unfortunately it has been lost since, but I still have many of the books used.
The sources are from a whole myriad material, several dozen books by contemporary authors, archeological, anthropological and historical journal articles, and ancient texts including private letters. Basically anything that allows one to garner how the Gauls looked, fought etc within a geograhical context.
At work at the moment but from memory;
A) The term ‘black demons’ was garnered from a private Roman letter (describing the enemy encountered during one of the wars against the Celtiberians) and translated into Gallic. The actual description is from two books, can’t remember which ones.
B) The Raven is mentioned in just about any book one reads on the Celts. The Celtic goddess of the dead would take the form of a Raven and alight on the bodies of the fallen and cart their souls off to the after life. Hence the helmets were worn with Ravens to strike fear in their foe. The Raven Helmets are well attested in the archoelogical / historical record and scholars believe they tended to be worn by either elite troops and / or nobles.
https://usera.imagecave.com/PSYCHO/Ravenhelm.JPG
https://usera.imagecave.com/PSYCHO/Raven_Helmet.JPG
They are particularly noted around Bibracte the Aedui Capital. The Aedui were the leaders of the Northern Condeferacy from the mid 4th century BC on and pretty much represent the Gaul faction in RTW.
We know the Aedui had a special Royal guard. From memory there was a reference I found in Irish text which mentioned 'Raven Warriors' forming a special guard to protect an Irish King. So all the pieces were put together and the Aedui Royal Guard were afforded raven helms and called Bodubatae. The name is just the Gallic translation of “Raven Warriors” / plural. Highly likely that such a unit existed by this name but we can't prove it 100%
C) Same thing for the “Sea of Spears”. The Helvetii, as you would know from Caesar’s works used a form of phalanx formation. It is also attested in other fragments. They were very disciplined and well led.
The Celts, much like other native peoples tended to call things by names which had a direct meaning eg Boiorix ="king of the boii" , Eburones = "people who are protected by the yew-tree" etc etc
The Sea of Spears is the most likely Gallic name for such a formation and thus used as a unit descript.
Pyscho V is correct, the units he lists are, as best can be researched, quite verifiable. The problem with offering a huge litany of sources, is the unique nature of the various regions of Gauls, and the soldiers they offered locally. That's why the more 'common' Gallic soldiers are easy to verify, they showed up in large areas, with a great deal of regularity. However, some occured in small numbers, but with regularity, in certain regions (a good argument for 'region specific' units, actually).
I also do not mean to imply that the list is in any manner, incorrect, inasmuch as what we can know. But the Gauls did not write extensively, so we have to go off of what sources we can. Having a truly 100% accurate army, for any of the factions, is going to be impossible, But, we can come close. We will need to stretch things a bit, but believably. Even if there aren't a huge, vast number of sources, we can imply a great deal, with a good bit of accuracy, based upon digs, and descriptions. What we can assure is that what Pyscho V is offering are vastly closer to the real Gauls than the pure fantasy CA offered us. Pyscho V has used as good as sources as we'll be able to get, short of a bloody time machine. I have seen the same sources, and I'm sure some others will offer up a similar back up.
Of Mori Gaesum, have to name them something, and 'Sea of Spears' is a pretty good one. The early Irish and Welsh refered to the phalanx as a 'Sea of Spears', and such a name easily could've come from a more ancient source. It does match the kind of 'poetic' names the Gauls seemed to give things, using metaphor to convey an image of a vast number of spear heads, easily what they may have called the phalanx, and lingually proper.
Edit; For helmet for the lesser general, I'd opt for the one you've got a picture of, just because I think it's an interesting design that'll give a nice, truly unique flair to the Gallic armor.
Superb unit update from all indeed ~:thumb:
No Thracian or German Unit/model update guys ? :worried:
I'm loving the work your doing Prom, great stuff ..
...but some of those unit pics are 1.5MB. It's killing my 56K :embarassed:
Ok good you have good sources , I trust , but shouldn't we limit the Gauls to what is effectively described in the Caesar's Book? Anyway even if some of those should be more elite groups and be built only in specific regions and I guess may be some are from other celtic cultures than gauls may be briton , may be celtiberian , may be belgican , may be northItalian , may be caledonian or irish....
ok I will try to resize them more next time....
Also could some of you with good sources post some good very realistic plates about greeks at that given time , I have till the end of the Alexander empire , but is mostly on phalanxes and macedopnian armies.....
Also I hope we are going to use the naked barbarian mod since shows another reality of the celtic fighters ....
Great Gallic units!
I hope some of them are shared with the britons, because the rest of us want some unit space too ~:cool:
But seriously, great work. I'd buy all of you a guiness if you were around here! ~:cheers:
In the fall of the Roman Republic Plutarch describes Cimbrian cavalry at Vercellae as wearing helmets like gape-jawed heads of terrible beasts heghtened with tall feathers plumes, as carring white shields , two javelins and a large heavy sword, wearing iron breastplates.
The helmet with the Raven is from the Ciumesti Maramunes in Romania , it is mounted with a bronze bird whose winged wings would flam in movement.....other helmets with mounted animals do appear in Gundership Cauldron . The romanian helmet was found with bronse greaves and mail corslet......
so according to this the helmet should be from Romanian tribes of Caelts not Gauls .......
also have been considered the Galitians???
Many of those raven helmets were found in France, particularly in Normandy, Brittany, and areas around them. 'Irish' does not exist yet, Celtic Hibernia has just recently been settled by Celts in this period, who are of mixed Gaul/Briton/possibly Celtiberian extraction, but there are a few unique types of soldiers from there, one or two might be a nice regional unit for Briton/Gaul/Iberia. The units in Pyscho V's list are ALL of Gallic extraction, except for some of the mercs, and one which is Celtiberian (and I suggest we move to an Iberian unit).
The Gauls will not share units with the Britons, the Britons had a completely different military, based on tribal concerns, so mobility is more of a key for them. Gauls had steady kingdoms with large areas of land, and thus could afford themselves slower moving, but otherwise stronger forces, than one would find in Britain, which would look completely different than a Gallic military. Just because they were Celts, doesn't mean they actually had TOO much in common. A similar language, art styles, etc., maybe. But warfare was adjusted to their lifestyle, and the Britons lived a totally different life than the Gauls, so shared units would not make sense. However, we should have enough space for everyone's units. Aymar has already come up with some good ideas to cut down on the units already used, like a universal, rebel peasant unit, no one builds it, only shows up in rebellions, and cutting down, drastically, the number of siege engines by having them universal, since we can have different skins for the crews. There should be plenty of space for every faction to have a unique, interesting military, and still have room for mercs.
IMO, you shouldn't make the Retiarius. It will be very dificult to make the net, specially because we can't remake the animation. I would prefer the Thraex. But that is up to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
No. No Arcanii. No Scissor Gladiator. Only the ones that are there. Besides the Arcanii has been deleted from the files.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
Ranika is very correct when commenting on unit space. The generic units, like siege engines and peasents, will be condensed in a single unit with several faction textures. We can have 300 max units, being 268 occupied in vanilla RTW. Just from deleting ahistorical and duplicates I'll reduce occupied slots to about 230 (I'm doing that for Alpha 0.3 as I write this post). Since a lot of the units are being remade from the ground up, like PSYCHO V's warbands, a lot of the "new" units won't even ocuppy unit space. So, on an crude estimate, we'll have about 70 free slots for new units, which means that we'll be able to add several new ones per faction (depending also on the number of factions available).
I would say that for the romans should be
early legion to be redraw like the Caesar ones
the actual early legion to be named medium and the segmenta heavy since they where both used at the same time in the early empire......
http://img23.exs.cx/img23/3883/cccc2.jpg
temporary version of the Equites....
final version
http://img105.exs.cx/img105/6603/cccc.jpg
Finally some realistic looking equites! Nice job Prom!
Is it possible to thin out and reduce the height of, the helmet train..thingy on top the helmet?
The Equites look great, but should the tadh be so thick? Wouldn't it be rather stringy or thinner? (What's the English word? Is it Tadh? The hair that comes from the helmet, that thing).
OT: Pyscho V, thanks for the Briton input. Please clean out your PMs when you get a chance, and everyone interested check the Briton Group's thread for a very, very preliminary list (I expect many rewrites/removals, but have to start somewhere).
Yes sure I can reduce the tail , but my concerns where more about the shield pattern ....what should I use???
Prometheus, some changes to equites should be done.
There is pic from Osprey's book (think, you already saw it... but one more time ~:) ):
http://img96.exs.cx/img96/551/equites.jpg
There are my recommendations:
http://img96.exs.cx/img96/1226/equit.jpg
I think you don't need to change the helmet in 3d model, it's possible to represent it's proper shape just by texture.
Also maybe you can depict harness more realistically (it's almost absent in vanilla units)?
How about this for a shield pattern ~;) [IMG]http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/Images/Gazetteer/Periods/Roman/Topics/Warfare/weapons/parma*.gif[/IMG]
Seriously though, I think simple blue shield with golden umbo would suffice. There were many patterns on equites parmae, but most I could find are various golden patterns on blue, and some had no patterns at all.
(hmm, you'll have to cut&paste the url, forum engine gets confused. yes, there's an asterisk in it)
Yes I already tought to alter it in photoshop as well as add some other things like the red line.....
what u mean ?Quote:
harness more realistically (it's almost absent in vanilla units)?
I partially disagree. We aren't only doing this to correct incorrect units, we're also taking unit speed, tactics and everything else besides units which we can mod (i.e. is not hardcoded) and which is historically innacurate and making it accurate, like we believe it's supposed to be.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aymar de Bois Mauri
At least, I thought that was the goal of this project.
~Wiz
http://img95.exs.cx/img95/6603/cccc.jpg
Cretan archers......
Of course. I wasn't just refering to the units part, but, in this particular case, we were talking about units...Quote:
Originally Posted by The Wizard
They used javelins too? :stunned: I didn't know that... :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
Are you sure they looked like this? And javelins... Can you show us pictures of ancient depictions or modern reconstructions, or text describing them?Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
http://img97.exs.cx/img97/3806/harness.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
Can the bright red saddle be removed as well? Skinned to look more like leather?
The Greek and Persians at war 500 - 323 BC osprey met at arms series....
These arcers where mercenaries ans, part from the scythian archers were the only troops to be hired by Athenians as regular infantry.
They were employed in the same capacity as slingers and other light troops, either as psiloi or positionedamong the hoplite heavy infantry.
Their distinctive charateristic was the red chiton tunic.
They wore no body armour and their only protection was the small round bronze shield pelta.
As well as bow and quiver of arrows it is possible that they also carried javelins.
Does the game allow them to use both bows and javelins, though?
I think can be made , just adding the javelin skeleton , the problem is make them swithch from one to the other weapon .....
about the saddles just need time......
about my time , is now a bit reduced so expect less units , also there is a problem , I only made high cas not medium low and lowest , too boring doing them so I won't unless there is a way to make them starting by the original high cas......
Hello to everybody and congratulationsfor your fantastic job. Im comming from Greece, Im a graphic designer and great fan of ancient history.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dead Moroz
I admire your effort for true historical representation of this game. I unfortunally dont know anything about 3d modelling but i can use photoshop REALLY good. So if any question or small task comes out im here.
Now about Cretian archers.
They were the only missile unit that wasnt included in the ''psiloi'' category in the way most others were. I mean they were archers by choice and not due to economical reasons. Thus they were far more better equipped than other regional archers. They carried a small round bronze shield (wich as Xenophon writes its flashing betrayed them during an ambush), they often had swords and many times light linen armor. Sometimes they reffered to have helmets but most commonly they were wearing a head band from wich as they say the nowdays traditional headband of Crete comes. There is a relief that depicts two Cretan archers and i ll post an image when ill find it. Also there is a good Plate in osprey's ancient greeks. In conclution Cretan archers were an elite unit and not just poor people with hunting gear.
I wish i had more time so i could commit more on this project.
Im here for any advice on units or names
Im sure that the outcome of this mod will make people in CA jealous. Congratulations again for your pursue of authenticity in a time where great epics traditions and history of ancient peoples becomes hollywood chewing gums. Lets prove them that we can have fun AND learn ~:cheers:
I'm not sure about javelin/bow combination. This should be tested, I think the game engine might not allow it. Also, this would mean that archers would have no melee weapon, and it really looks silly when a unit tries to fight with a bow (I've seen badly modded slingers hitting people in the head with slings, it's not pretty). I think just the bows will be enough... also, the shield you have is nothing like a Pelta shield - it's either round or Pelta - and it should be worn on a forearm instaed of in hand. You can't shoot and hold a shield at the same time.
Thank you for your compliment. We all like to hear that the work we're doing is apreciated by the community.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahilleas
As for your skills, we always need a guy with good photoediting skills...
You can still join and contribute whenever you can.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahilleas
Care to join EB? :grin2: Maybe in your particular area of expertise? ~:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahilleas
I believe you have it the nail on the head. You're right. With the contribution of everyone dedicated to a better Historical depiction of the period, including you, we will make something we will all be proud of. To play and learn (most of us are doing this last one already :wink:).Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahilleas
I agree that there can only be one missile and one melee hability per unit. If we could have two per unit this wouldn't be a problem. But we can't. Therefore the Cretan Archers should have a bow and a sword of some kind. As for the shield, we only need to link it differently in MAX with the CAS plug-inn.Quote:
Originally Posted by eadingas
I based my reconstruction exactly on what is showed to be the Cretan archer on the Osprey plate that I wrote so if you have take a look at it , bored top scannerize right now....
OK. I believe you. But we can't have two missile habilities per unit. Only one melee and one missile.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
Curious, did the Creatan Archers use their javelins as missile or melee weapons?
Um... I assume everyone knows that there won't be any faction colors here, right?
Not on units. But we'll have to have them on flags and on the campaign map.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steppe Merc
what about the tree roman factions then?
I think those may be the exception - for certain kinds of high end units/sheilds etc.
Of course. I mean no more green haired Thracians or purple Parthians, or a million other reasons why they shouldn't be there. As for the Romans, I don't know about them, but I assume that they never had seperate colors for the families. But their would be color on any units that would have them, so for the elite Romans or the red cloaks on the Spartans, or whatever.Quote:
Not on units. But we'll have to have them on flags and on the campaign map.
Well, most of them won't need colours. The Romans will need them because they are all equal in terms of units. That's the biggest exception, because most others will have unique units. What we mean by not having faction colours is that the unit design does not have to obey to the colours of the faction, like in the case of the Parthians. They didn't dressed in pink, as such, their units shouldn't be pink. The rest can have different colours when their units can't be distinguished. Like militia hoplites or peasents. It will depend on faction and unit.Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS
I agree....
Been thinking ... dangerous I know
I think the Northern Warband may warrant a simple bowl helmet. Thoughts?
Looks good to me, the north did employ helmets more often anyway, it'd be a good nod to that.
, mmmm shouldn't have the cheeck guards?
anyway I was working on a Celtiberian skin and model , not finished it since I didn't know what unit should substituite and so to test it , I will upload here skin and model so you can take a test for me ? Or even perfectionate it?
mmm there is not a way to upload stuff here?
ok take a lookhere...
here
http://img116.exs.cx/img116/2757/a111.jpg
Prom: If that's your Alpha, it's huge step in the right direction. Nice work
Re the NW helmets. Based on the right hand side guy. The helmet was quite common in Transalpine Gaul
Thanx but what means? ~:confused:Quote:
If that's your Alpha, it's huge step in the right direction. Nice work
Oh yes now I understood it ... Alpha version ,
well I wasn't sure about
Shield form , the sleeves long or short , colours of the greaves and face also the kind of pteruges.........any other errors?
Did they have that funky goatee? Just wondering, since I have no idea. But it looks quite nice though. But their seems to be an awful lot of red sheilds. Why did people like red so much? I hate red... But excellent job, and I realy like the helmet. I wonder if you could do a Boetian helm for the Macedonians...
lol the gotee looks cool but does not seem to be very gallic. When it comes to facial hair think of these people kind of like you think of dwarves, some of the tribes did actually prize their fuzzy faces that much. Like the model though, perhaps pinch the sleeves in a little and the skirt as well from the angle you gave the ss looks kind of like it sticks out. But then your men may be fighting screeching women so there might be a reson for the skirt sticking out :).
Mmm??? what are you talking about ? didn't understood....
Anyway here is the final version.....
http://img12.exs.cx/img12/9486/a375.jpg
Gauls did not much favor beards, though they did favor mustaches. Celtiberians, I thought were similar? I actually study the Gauls/Britons/Gaels more than the Celtiberians, so I'm not sure, but I think they would perhaps favor mustaches or to be clean shaven? Gauls, Britons, and Gaels, all, for example, removed their body hair, since it kept dirt close to the body. Wouldn't Celtiberians be similar? I'm not sure, because they were clearly influenced by the indigenous Iberian populations, so I'm just asking.
PROMETHEUS
There's still some problems... try making the shield more ovular. It wasn't a romanesque oblong shield, but more of an ovular one.
The rest of the model looks damn good. Damn good.
Brilliant!
Prom, sent you a PM
..and just re the Celtiberian look. They were influenced by the Iberians and tended to do away with the Gallic mow by the mid 3rd C BC, either having the ruddy stubble look or being clean shaven. There were a few tribes of what we would regard as Celts that kept a semblance of the Boii / Insubres / 'Southern Warband' look but these were in the minority. If we are doing accurate Celtiberians, they should reside in Central / North-Western Iberia.
Preciselly. Celtiberians were a different culture from Gauls and populations beyond the Pirenees. They were of mixed ascendency but heavily influenced by Iberian culture. At this moment in time, they were mostly clean-shaven.
BTW, PROMETEUS, the shield must be straight and oval. Just like the Northern Warband shield. Not like the Romans.
Another note: I'm doing the Iberians, Lusitanians and Celtiberians. Concentrate on the others, ok?
Yeah, I sort of realized that after my post. They had been with the other Iberians for so long in only makes sense that they would've adopted, rather heavily, the indigenous customs/cultures. However, I've read about effigies to Gallic gods and such in parts of the Celtiberian regions, so that made me a bit curious about how much of the former Celtic culture they may have retained.
Prom, your PMs are full so just dropping a note here.
Further to our discussion:
I'd appreciate the help (I can't do the 3d stuff and seems I've been deserted at this point by my associates :P ). I'll still need your email to send you the files.
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Quick question to Yall:
Do we know how to make the AI build our new units? Has anyone tested the campaign to see if the AI actually uses the new units?
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Oh..and not sure if you guys heard about this. HUGE archeological find in France over the weekend! 470 objects, 5 almost complete carnyxs, 9 helmets etc etc! Shit I wish I was in France right now!
http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com...lt-382x267.jpg
Check Here
I imagine that they would, since they do in one of the other mods that I played before the internal release here. But I haven't had any access to the new units. Mabye that could be rectified... ~D
Just kidding.
Ok, sorry for those who have already replied but anyone who wants to check some of the gaul units send an email to callmepsycho@hotmail.com and I'll send you the files tonight my / EDST / 11+ UTC time (in around 8-9 hours).
Ok, guys. For unit integration in Alpha 0.3 you better start sending me the data. For completelly new units this should include the 4 3d meshes (CAS), the texture (DDS) and the unit data. For 3d and texture alterations just the CAS and DDS. For re-skins just the DDS.
Has anyone at all worked on the Scythian/Parthians/Sarmatians? I'm glad at all of this work, but their all not my kind of stuff. Sadly I can't modify things at all...
PSICO V I added you to my contacts in messenger , just open it....
Not yet. We'll get there. I'm pretty anxious because of those horse archers ridiculous look.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steppe Merc
http://img21.exs.cx/img21/4963/a308.jpg
Carthaginian Liby-Phoenician spearmen.....
~D what's messenger? You don't have email?Quote:
Originally Posted by PROMETHEUS