Venezuela Sends Tanks To Colombian Border

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TuffStuffMcGruff

Argh you are right on that count. My mistake.

You love Chavez though. Everybody knows it.

---

I actually remember that he said Chavez is an idiot or something along those lines...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Husar

I actually remember that he said Chavez is an idiot or something along those lines...

---

:laugh4: Everyone will agree: He's very consistent. :yes:

Quote:

---

I actually remember that he said Chavez is an idiot or something along those lines...

---

I have written that lots of times , I have also written that the main opposition in Venezuela are idiots too , and very very stupid with it .

It is very easy to make a case against Chavez that will stand up to scrutiny , one that can clearly rip apart his actions and policies rather than focusing on the nonsense rhetoric , yet so far throughout the numerous "OMG its Chavez" topics only one poster has managed that simple task , and that was Redleg .

It's over.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Evil_Maniac From Mars

It's over.

---

poor Tuff. :cry:

When the anti-terrorist units or Governments which order operations will understand that to kill the leaders is not THE solution? The Germans killed several leaders of the French Resistance and never even slow down the movement… In Iraq, did the insurgency stop after the elimination of the biggest murderer?
An other one take the rank. Number 3 becomes number 1, problem fixed.

If you want to stop a movement, stop the reason why it started. In case of Colombia, give back the land taken by the latifundia and stop to protect the rich and powerful…
To finance a resistance with drugs isn’t new: The French and the USA did it in Vietnam (Mongs, Hre, and others Mountainous Tribes). And what was about the Irangates and the Colonel Oliver North? By the way, what did happen to him?:inquisitive:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Brenus

If you want to stop a movement, stop the reason why it started. In case of Colombia, give back the land taken by the latifundia and stop to protect the rich and powerful…

---

That's true, people sometimes forget and sometimes don't even know what the real cause for insurgent movements is in Latin American. There are hundreds of groups in Argentina and Brazil only which are protesting to recover stolen land, stolen rights or stolen dignity... So far very few of them are getting any...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Big_John

poor Tuff. :cry:

---

Damn it. Thanks for all of your support. I means alot to me. I'll just wait for the next massive regional conflict.:tumbleweed:

It's days like these where you don't know if you'll ever be a whole person again...
:drama2:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TuffStuffMcGruff

Damn it. Thanks for all of your support. I means alot to me. I'll just wait for the next massive regional conflict.:tumbleweed:

It's days like these where you don't know if you'll ever be a whole person again...
:drama2:

---

a little bit of massive killing isn't much to ask for one man's happiness. cooler heads are a-holes. :thumbsdown:

Here's a short review of the fallout.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The FARC's Guardian Angel
By Jackson Diehl
Monday, March 10, 2008; Page A15
link

Latin American nations and the Bush administration spent the past week loudly arguing over what censure, if any, Colombia should face for a bombing raid that killed one of the top leaders of the FARC terrorist group at a jungle camp in Ecuador. More quietly, they are just beginning to consider a far more serious and potentially explosive question: What to do about the revelation that Venezuelan President Hugo Chávez forged a strategic alliance with the FARC aimed at Colombia's democratic government.

First reports of the documents recovered from laptops at the FARC camp spoke of promises by Chávez to deliver up to $300 million to a group renowned for kidnapping, drug trafficking and massacres of civilians; they also showed that Ecuadoran President Rafael Correa was prepared to remove from his own army officers who objected to the FARC's Ecuadoran bases.

But in their totality, the hundreds of pages of documents so far made public by Colombia paint an even more chilling picture. The raid appears to have preempted a breathtakingly ambitious "strategic plan" agreed on by Chávez and the FARC with the initial goal of gaining international recognition for a movement designated a terrorist organization by both the United States and Europe. Chávez then intended to force Colombian President Álvaro Uribe to negotiate a political settlement with the FARC, and to promote a candidate allied with Chávez and the FARC to take power from Uribe.

All this is laid out in a series of three e-mails sent in February to the FARC's top leaders by Iván Márquez and Rodrigo Granda, envoys who held a series of secret meetings with Chávez. Judging from the memos, Chávez did most of the talking: He outlined a five-stage plan for undermining Uribe's government, beginning with the release of several of the scores of hostages the FARC is holding.

The first e-mail, dated Feb. 8, discusses the money: It says that Chávez, whom they call "angel," "has the first 50 [million] available and has a plan to get us the remaining 200 in the course of the year." Chávez proposed sending the first "packet" of money "through the black market in order to avoid problems." He said more could be arranged by giving the FARC a quota of petroleum to sell abroad or gasoline to retail in Colombia or Venezuela.

Chávez then got to the plans that most interested him. He wanted the FARC to propose collecting all of its hostages in the open, possibly in Venezuela, for a proposed exchange for 500 FARC prisoners in Colombian jails. Chávez said he would travel to the area for a meeting with the FARC's top leader, Manuel Marulanda, and said the presidents of Ecuador, Nicaragua and Bolivia would accompany him. Meanwhile, Chávez said he would set up a new diplomatic group, composed of those countries and the FARC, plus Mexico, Brazil and Argentina, for the purpose of recognizing the FARC as a legitimate "belligerent" in Colombia and forcing Uribe into releasing its prisoners.

In "the early morning hours," the FARC envoys recounted in a Feb. 9 e-mail, Chávez reached the subject of whether the release of Ingrid Betancourt, a former Colombian presidential candidate who is the FARC's best-known hostage, would complicate his plan to back a pro-FARC alternative to Uribe. "He invites the FARC to participate in a few sessions of analysis he has laid out for following the Colombian political situation," the e-mail concluded.

Assuming these documents are authentic -- and it's hard to believe that the cerebral and calculating Uribe would knowingly hand over forgeries to the world media and the Organization of American States -- both the Bush administration and Latin American governments will have fateful decisions to make about Chávez. His reported actions are, first of all, a violation of U.N. Security Council Resolution 1373, passed in September 2001, which prohibits all states from providing financing or havens to terrorist organizations. More directly, the Colombian evidence would be more than enough to justify a State Department decision to cite Venezuela as a state sponsor of terrorism. Once cited, Venezuela would be subject to a number of automatic sanctions, some of which could complicate its continuing export of oil to the United States. A cutoff would temporarily inconvenience Americans -- and cripple Venezuela, which could have trouble selling its heavy oil in other markets.

For now, the Bush administration appears anxious to avoid this kind of confrontation. U.S. intelligence agencies are analyzing the Colombian evidence; officials say they will share any conclusions with key Latin American governments. Yet those governments have mostly shrunk from confronting Chávez in the past, and some have quietly urged Bush to take him on. If the president decides to ignore clear evidence that Venezuela has funded and conspired with an officially designated terrorist organization, he will flout what has been his first principle since Sept. 11, 2001.

Quote:

---

For now, the Bush administration appears anxious to avoid this kind of confrontation. U.S. intelligence agencies are analyzing the Colombian evidence; officials say they will share any conclusions with key Latin American governments. Yet those governments have mostly shrunk from confronting Chávez in the past, and some have quietly urged Bush to take him on. If the president decides to ignore clear evidence that Venezuela has funded and conspired with an officially designated terrorist organization, he will flout what has been his first principle since Sept. 11, 2001.

---

The "Bush doctrine" has already been revoked.

I'm starting to really hate caribou now.

Chavez is such a coward :(

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CountArach

Chavez is such a coward :(

---

A coward? Colombia's armed forces could have crushed Venezuela and Ecuador like flies, simultaneously, if they ever tried anything. They could bark, but not bite.

Quote:

---

Here's a short review of the fallout.

---

A short view from an American perspective ...you know America the only country(apart from Columbia of course) who accepts Uribes ever changing story , a story that he was once again called a liar over just before he publicly apologisded and signed a resolution saying he wouldn't do it again .

I do like this bit though

Quote:

---

Meanwhile, Chávez said he would set up a new diplomatic group, composed of those countries and the FARC, plus Mexico, Brazil and Argentina, for the purpose of recognizing the FARC as a legitimate "belligerent" in Colombia and forcing Uribe into releasing its prisoners.

---

I think you will find the word is "insurgent", it a long standing block in the various peace initiatives attempted by many intermediaries over the decades , the leftist groups want the same peace deal as the rightist groups got ....shocking isn't it:laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:

Quote:

---

Colombia's armed forces could have crushed Venezuela and Ecuador like flies, simultaneously, if they ever tried anything. They could bark, but not bite.

---

If they could have crushed them like flies then why have they been unable to crush the rebels for over 40 years ?
Besides which Uribe is in a weakened position , Chavez and Correa only had to bark , Uribe has crowds on the streets calling him a fascist , murdering , drug dealing , dictator and his allies in power keep on ending up on Americas wanted list , the rightist terrorists...sorry insurgents ....should have held out for a better peace deal , ensuring that international narco trafficing was included in the amnesty arrangement .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tribesman

If they could have crushed them like flies then why have they been unable to crush the rebels for over 40 years ?

---

Surely you aren't comparing combat with an insurgent, terrorist group to the militaries of neighboring countries?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tribesman

A short view from an American perspective ...you know America the only country(apart from Columbia of course) who accepts Uribes ever changing story , a story that he was once again called a liar over just before he publicly apologisded and signed a resolution saying he wouldn't do it again .

I do like this bit though

I think you will find the word is "insurgent", it a long standing block in the various peace initiatives attempted by many intermediaries over the decades , the leftist groups want the same peace deal as the rightist groups got ....shocking isn't it:laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:


If they could have crushed them like flies then why have they been unable to crush the rebels for over 40 years ?
Besides which Uribe is in a weakened position , Chavez and Correa only had to bark , Uribe has crowds on the streets calling him a fascist , murdering , drug dealing , dictator and his allies in power keep on ending up on Americas wanted list , the rightist terrorists...sorry insurgents ....should have held out for a better peace deal , ensuring that international narco trafficing was included in the amnesty arrangement .

---

His popularity seems to be going higher somehow...

one

two

I guess the United States and the Colombian people must be very stupid. Or they read popularity charts backwards - because people are rallying in the streets calling him a murderer (link?)

Quote:

---

because people are rallying in the streets calling him a murderer (link?)

---

Link ????I thought yousaid you got your info fromthe BBC , did you miss their coverage ?:laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:
Tell you what Tuff , why not type 8th of march into a search engine (or you tube for that matter) and view all you want

Oh btw you may also want to use 8de marzo for a more local perspective .

BTW tuff , did you post the wrong link ?
when I clicked on it this appearedhttp://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB131/index.htm:oops: