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I'd be interested to hear people's ideas on the best way to wrap up this campaign. If there is a significant difference of opinion (e.g. try to blitz it vs end it now, gracefully), we could resolve it by a vote in the end of reign Senate.
TinCow, what were your thoughts on the best way to bring the campaign to a solid conclusion?
Hi guys,
Still not 100% but getting there.
Anyway….Ending this?? Bu…wha….ya….we can’t do that!
Seriously though, let’s have a think. There are several options.
We could go for the “historical” approach and end the game when we’ve got approximately the same regions that Rome had at her height. (Europe, Asia-Minor, North Africa, Palestine)
We could go to the “insurmountable” approach and end it once we’ve reach a stage where we’re obviously the most powerful and no AI faction is a threat at all. (I’d say once we’ve taken Iberia out)
These are the two options I can see available to us at this time. I have to agree though that, judging by the sudden drop in Senate Deliberation “traffic” the campaign has lost much of its sting.
….and we’re not even using Marius units!
(I’ll go away to bed and sweat some more now…)
I don't think we necessarily need to reach a certain goal for 'victory' since the whole point of this PBM is to have fun. We've had loads of fun for six months. That's the longest Org PBM by far... this is already a 'victory' and I suspect it's just the first of a new style of PBM. I'm definitely interested in doing this again in M2TW in a few months. But, in the meantime... how to wrap this up?
Well, I think the best possible ending to this campaign is a dramatic end in the Senate. I think it would be great if the Republic fell and the Empire began. Given the past history of Numerius Aureolus and the fact that this PBM wouldn't exist without econ21, I think it would be great to see him elevated to Emperor. Of course, this would be accompanied by a lot of bloodshed in the Senate, but that's only appropriate! I think a great ending would be one that somehow made this kind of event plausible. I'm not sure what kind of strategic goals we can set that mimic that, but I'm thinking.
Well, as my video card is sorely inadequate for running M2, RTW will be my main game for a while. I suppose we could blitz the final three targets under Marcellus' reign.
Perhaps a change of goals is in order? For example, it could be revised to Take the Nile/The Iberian Peninsula/The Seleucid Capital or something along those lines.
OK - so it sounds like we still have at least 3 players who are still interested in being Consuls (Braden, GeneralHankerchief and me), plus there may be more. So I think satisfying our broad territorial goals is viable - I don't think the absence of lower house generals will be an obstacle; we can always get the Consuls to do most of the fighting and autoresolve where necessary. However, there is a risk that the campaign will lose wider interest during a prolonged blitz, so I am open to the possibility of shutting down the PBM earlier. For example, we could have a constitutional ammendment "No more conquests" that would serve as an effective vote for a shutdown.
On the Republic to Empire mechanic, I was thinking of that kind of ending a while back. I had thought about doing it surreptiously - getting enough lower House generals to agree to collude and when we had 50% of the military force, declaring a coup d'etat and installing an Empire. (I hasten to add, I was not thinking of putting Numerius on the throne - the Aemilii seemed the more likely Machiavellian dynasty). However, I never did anything about that idea and now the cat is out of the bag, it would not really work. The problem now is that the Consul can manipulate the assignment of troops to make sure his favoured gang get 50%+.
But we could work out a similar mechanic based on commands: each general with a Legion banner could be worth 1 point and a Field Army 2 points (Consular 3 points, if we ever get one again?). When a group of players has more than 50% of the total points, they can install an Emperor. We could even fiddle around with the points to reflect other factors (command stats? governors of big cities could be given some points etc). We could make commands permanent, to stop a Consul stripping them, unless the Senate agrees by a 2/3 vote.
This kind of thing might add some spice to keep the Senate bubbling over while the Consuls blitz the map.
Any thoughts?
Yes indeed, if this thing ever ends - it should be like that.Quote:
Originally Posted by TinCow
:computer:Quote:
Originally Posted by econ21
Oh man, you should have kept that to yourself !
However, it does beg the question, how would the military get rid of their adversaries - one way boat trips seems a bit like an anti-Qlimax if you ask me.
Anyway, I shall probably be picking up M2TW as soon as possible, and coupled with the fact my exams start next week, which basically means anything as time consuming as running for Consul seems out of the picture at the moment...
However, that said, I will keep on playing this in the Lower House and Rome will not be uninstalled anytime soon, but merely for the single Battle under one of our Consuls
---------
Blitzing this thing just to end it seems a bit harsh, tons of hours by a ton of players have gone up in the PBM and blitzing the map to end it as fast as possible seems inappropriate. But you probably concluded that yourself...Quote:
Originally Posted by Econ
:balloon2:
Sorry, perhaps you are right. :oops:Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch_guy
OK, I've got an idea for how to end this PBM. I am going to keep it secret for now, so let's just play along as normal and you will see things unfold. ~:smoking:
People are welcome to suggest their own ideas and I may incorporate them too if they can fit with what I have planned. :listen:
I will be keeping RTW installed as well, even after I switch to playing M2TW, so I will continue to be available to fight battles. I also don't think we need to end this immediately, but it might be wise to develop a plan for a long-term resolution.
Someone else mentioned the Marian Reforms and I think perhaps it would be good for the game if we hurried that along. Am I right in thinking that we need an Imperial Palace someplace outside of Rome to initiate the Reforms?
*very interested to see econ's ideas unfold*
I haven't been on the ride long enough to really weigh in on how it should end. I would, however, like to say that's it's been really tremendous fun to read along at some brilliant and at times hilarious discussion and reports. You all have done a superb job with this.
I am very much hoping that a parallel M2TW PBEM will come along at some point in the future.
Good idea - in practical terms, I think we need to find the biggest settlement in Italy except road and then pump it up through enslaving other towns (temporarily emptying other settlements of governors). Should be doable, provided the Senate does not rule out any further conquests.Quote:
Originally Posted by TinCow
I'd be very willing to start a m2 version of this PBEM, and I'm almost certain that we could count on most of our current players to be there too.
Econ, Tincow, Flydude, Braden, GeneralHankerchief, DutchGuy, Tamur?
I would definitely participate, but I would like to wrap this one up first before we start on a second one.
I'm up for it, sounds like a lot of fun.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucjan
However, as TinCow has said already we should make sure this PBM get's the ending it deserves.
:balloon2:
Definitely up for a M2TW PBM but if it is to be a sprawling Will of the Senate style job, I agree we should finish this one first. My idea for a conclusion should entail wrapping this one up by the end of the next Consulship - ie before the Christmas break - if people are willing to give it that long. If people want to hurry things up, that would be possible too.
I think it would be good to wait till around Christmastime to start a M2 campaign -- simply because that will give those of us under monthly budget constraints ~:) the chance to get the game and play it for a couple of weeks to get the feel of things.
Besides, rushing through an ending here would be a bit of a disservice to all that's gone on before.
Waiting until Christmas is fine by me, that gives everybody some time and we can wrap this up in a well deserved, respectable manner.
Just as a further note on the M2 idea..what would everybody think of playing the HRE? Players taking on the role of an electoral Duke, rather than a senator, and appointing the Emperor for a time, rather than the consul. Just an option.
Yes, HRE would be fine by me. Great units and an exciting central location. The elected nature of the HRE Emperor fits a Will of the Senate style game perfectly. It may be good we are waiting for Christmas - HRE were hard in MTW and we may need some solo practice beforehand to avoid getting whupped.
This is true, but getting whupped early could always be interesting too, it'd force us to really fight hard and work strong together early on to survive. I'm personally looking forward to giving the French a good beating.
We could also go for something different this time, an eastern faction for example. Like the Turks.
That way we have to fight off the Timurids and the Mongols when they appear, plus I don't seem to remember us ever starting a PBM with an eastern (muslim) faction.
:balloon2:
Or go for the real challenge, Poland. The szlachta (nobility) of Poland were all equal to each other, no man regarded as being higher than any other, and the king was elected (although this part was moreso in idealogy than actual practice, although it did occur) from amongst the szlachta to be "first among equals".
That way we've got a semi-eastern semi-western faction with a fairly difficult starting situation.
EDIT - Waiting on Braden for a battle return.
Just to say that HRE died early in my first English game - and apparently in Monarch's. The killer seems to have been the Danes. So it does look like we thought that HRE are going to be a challenging faction - which is good.
Guys, a quick question: If I were to uninstall BI, it wouldn't automatically uninstall Rome, right ?
Not too long ago I uninstalled MTW VI, and it also uninstalled MTW in the process.
:balloon2:
Wait..econ, you have the game already? O.o And I have to wait until Tuesday... grrrrr
I fear it does. I got a warning message of that kind just before I tried to uninstall it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch_guy
Yup, some initial impression here:Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucjan
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=71819
I've been playing as much as I can since Friday evening and it's growing on me. My English campaign on VH/VH is surprisingly challenging, without either repeated mass AI stacks or +7 type stat bonuses. It reminds me of STW/MTW in that regard. I'm only now about to storm Paris; the Scots have besieged Eginburgh and are about to take it back; the Poles beat my Crusade to Antioch when the shore was just in sight; the Pope hates me and fries my generals; it's all good. (Well, apart from the smell of burnt flesh, I suppose.)
What kind of bonusses does VH give to the AI in M2, have you got any idea ?Quote:
Originally Posted by econ21
:balloon2:
No, they are not very apparent. I asked but did not get much joy:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=71739
The VH campaign may help explain why the Pope hates me and I have few friends. The powerful Venetians did approach me with an alliance though.
On the battlefield, the match ups do not feel "unfair" - my units don't fare worse when facing equivalent AI units - so I suspect VH battles may be the default for experienced players.
Just to let you know I have a battle to do tonight. Sorry for the delays here, I'm just all over the place with illness....
Will play this battle tonight AND post my last battle report up tonight as well.
I've been playing M2 as well on H/VH and I haven't noticed anything that looks like AI cheating. (Before anyone comments on how I have it early, I would like to say that I pre-ordered it 3 weeks ago. They've already taken my money, so I don't feel bad getting the product.) Diplomacy has been very fair towards me and my serious problems with the Pope have been entirely of my own making. I win pretty consistently in battle, but I have had two major defeats.
The first was a combination of the second and third battles of the game, during which I expected to completely eliminate Scotland. They attacked me with two small armies to relieve the siege of Edinburgh. Even combined they were smaller than me and I had a good defensive position on a hilltop so I put my main line facing the army I thought would arrive first and put two spears to hold the other army until the first was done. Unfortunately, the AI coordinated the armies and struck at the exact same moment. On top of that the main army broke half my line in the initial charge. I eventually rallied and won, but lost half my army in the process. Still on the AI turn, Scotland moved a 3/4 stack into the attack. I could have held it off with my full army, but with the huge losses from before it was hopeless. I lost my entire northern army and it took me about 10-15 more turns to finish Scotland.
The second was assaulting rebel held Bruge. I assaulted with 5 siege towers and a ram with about 10-12 units of spears ready to climb the walls. Unfortunately, the rebels had 4-5 very decent infantry units on the walls along with crossbowmen. They burned 2 siege towers and the ram, leaving me with only 3 assault points on the walls. They moved their heavy infantry to those spots and proceeded to assault my units on the walls from both sides. I kept feeding new spears into the fight (siege tower climbing isnt slow anymore) but with heavy infantry on both sides of the assault points, it was a losing battle of attrition. I eventually withdrew with 2/3 of my army dead.
As for HRE, they're still alive and relatively stable in my game. I've been very friendly with them for most of the game. The heir to the throne recently asked me to assassinate his father so he could become King (Reward: 5000 gold and increased relations with HRE). That was easily the most unconventional mission I've been assigned yet, though I've had a few other interesting ones.
Sieges are the most incredible things I have ever seen rendered on a computer screen. There's nothing that even remotely compares to the graphical beauty of a row of trebuchet doing their work. The AI is very good on siege defense too. I've seen the AI sally with cavalry to attack two units of trebuchet I left vulnerable, VERY smart! When defending fortresses and citadels (with multiple rings of walls) they systematically withdraw to the next level of wall after each has fallen. During an assault on a French citadel (ouch those things are tough) the AI even used counter-battery fire with a pair of trebuchet of their own from inside the walls.
Complaints: France and Spain have had problems with Crusades. Both made large Crusade armies, put them on boats, and shipped them to the North Sea. They then proceeded to land and re-embark every single turn until the Crusades were done, at which point they walked back home. Also, I've noticed the passive AI bug several times. They will sometimes sit there getting slaughtered by my longbows (which are VERY decent IMO, not nerfed at all like some say) when the AI logic engine should make them assault all-out.
I can't wait until tomorrow. *Gets the game tomorrow evening* W00T! Then I have all thanksgiving week off of work to gorge myself on it. Thank you vacation days!
Ok, just to let everyone know that i have the save file but the Uploader doesnt appear to be working (either that or my net connection is timing out).
I'll upload it from work tomorrow morning
What a pain
Why do the forums look all bugged out and weird lately? I don't like it..
I would be willing to do HRE PBeM campaign. The only reason I dropped out of this one was because it wasn't that enjoyable being in the Upper House. I couldn't download all the mods, so I couldn't ever be consul, thus the fun ebbed away after the first 15 years. But it certainly is the best PBeM the Guild has ever had.
Save file uploaded (suspect issues with a slow internet connection last night at home), will post TWO battle reports tomorrow morning (will upload stuff from work as its fast and reliable at least!).
BTW – we suffered zero casualties in that last battle.
http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/251-sum-Manius1.zip
M2:TW campaign – I’d love to take part in it as a member of whatever we use as an equivalent of the Senate Upper House.
My current PC will firmly NOT play M2 in any form; and I am not adding anything to it (seeing as its still physically in “bits” but working since the last problems I had).
New PC is on the cards in about 10 months (i.e. when a loan is paid off).
So, doesn’t really matter to me what faction we play in it but I’m looking forward to it!
20+ years of LARP and RP experience in a Medieval setting means I’ll be well up for playing characters.
Just to let you guys know, I will be away from Wednesday to Sunday night
Just to let you know that I am fully up to date on battle reports now. I really must total up my kill ratio…..
I just noticed that tomorrow is the 6 month anniversary of the start of this PBM (brainstorming began on May 17th, actual play began on May 22nd). As such, here are a few interesting stats on what has been (IMHO) the most successful Org PBM ever.
Total WOTS related posts: 4,210
Percentage of all Throne Room posts related to the WOTS:37.46%
Players involved: 32
Saved Games Uploaded to the Org: 221
Actual Turns Elapsed In-Game: 118
Average # of Posts Per Turn: 35.67
Average # of Saved Games Per Turn: 1.87
Great job guys. I never thought the game would last this long.
......and still going. I fought a battle only last night!
Battle report posted up now.
.....and why doesn't Edit work!!!
No idea - is anyone else experiencing this problem? You are still showing up as a member with no warning points, so you should have an edit button. I suggest you contact the membership admin, Ser Clegane for help.Quote:
Originally Posted by Braden
PS: Congrats on the stunning run of victories. Was the last battle report really autumn, rather than summer? or is there another one to come (last savegame download is labelled autumn).
Hmmm...it may have been summer, was working from Memory but was sure of it.
No, no other battles to post at this time......
....hang on. Ok, as a habit, after I exit the battle after winning I always Hit the Advisor button to make sure that when I save it there is no corruption, and I'm sure it said it was Autumn.
Could still be wrong, my memory being shoddy at the best of times.
....and does it seem I'm running things at the moment to you as well??
....and where is the chat gone on the IC section? I've asked valid questions IC and its as if the Senate has all gone home (*sniff, sob*)
Edit button - it "could" be a cookie issue. I'll look into that first.
We're definately in autumn already, I just haven't had the time amongst everything I've been trying to accomplish at once lately to sit down and right up a consular report.
..sorry, I know, ok, I admit it, I was playing M2. lol Can you blame me? I'll get around to it most likely tomorrow morning after I get home from work.
But after autumn we've got winter and spring, and then elections. I hope everybody is ready for the next two months. This time, there will be no calm before the storm.
Regarding my IC request. The core rules do not allow retraining except for upgrades, so I thought my idea was not only more realistic but in the spirit of the rules.
Manius would get a fresh replacement unit, but the other would be moved to Italy and disbanded.
BTW - when in RTR is the Marius event set for?
Also, the RTR Forums are working again! :2thumbsup:
Disbanding valuable veterans is too hardcore for me - although I know some RTR folk have recommended doing that on historical grounds. We can't retrain, but we can "top up" depleted units with men from fresh units. That's what I do in my solo play anyway. It's kind of like real life military units receiving replacements to bring them back up to strength.
For the Marian reforms, we need an Imperial city inside Italy, but excluding Rome.
I have begun studying :book: for several Sun Certificates which will take all my free time for the next couple of months. That's why I've been so quiet lately. As such, I will have to move to the upper house. I would like my avatar to take up a governorship if possible.
On a side note, I am very interested in hearing about everyone's experiences with MTW2.
Hi DDW - I was wondering where you have got to. No problem going to the Upper House, but it would be good if Lucius could promote Marcellus's cause in the Senate.
On M2TW, most of the WoS players who have expressed an opinion seem to rate it very highly (TinCow, Lucjan, Wonderland, Tamur etc).
I don't like the feel of the battles as much as RTR: PE, for some reason - it may be the unit cohesion bug thing. But they do offer better gameplay. There's a question mark over AI passivity but otherwise, CA have managed to make VH battles fairly competitive without blatantly rigging the stats.
The campaign aspect is greatly improved - on VH as England, it is admirably tight and the AI seems as if it is actually learning how to fight. For example, I'm currently having a nice standoff with a pair of Danish stack, for example - in RTW, they would either split up or attack me peicemeal; in M2TW, they are just happily guarding Hamburg and not attacking my strong stack on a bridge. I really don't know how to end this - if I attack, I know losses would be so high, it would a pyrrhic victory if a victory at all.
I've had similar situations. Me and France sitting on opposite sides of the Rhine with equal sized armies. With the eruption of war with Venice I had no choice but to accept a French proposal of a ceasefire. Just couldn't afford to fight two wars at once at the time.
Yes indeed ! After about 80 turns I finally managed to drive the French out of Northern Europe, and re-enforce Antwerp to drive back the Danes.Quote:
Originally Posted by econ21
However, the Sicilians (who hold Dijon ?!) and the Spaniards (who hold the iberian peninsular and part of Africa) have decided they want a piece of me. And started a very, very costly war against me. Too bad for them I was finally able to have three standing armies in N-Europe. Which basically means I'm currently besieging Spanish held Bordeaux and Sicilian held Dijon. My third army is marching for Hamburg, which the Danes have held for the majority of the game.
Had they, however, decided to attack me...say...25 turn ago they would have swamped me. As by that time the French were still a major force, and the Danes were still trying to force Antwerp from me. I would have been hard put to defend against 4 major powers so early on.
Luckily for me that didn't happen.
:balloon2:
Just spent the better part of a day on M2TW and got to turn 90 in my English campaign. I experienced a lot of really good battles - some of the best ever in a TW game.
- (A cheesy one to start) The stand-off with the Danes outside Hamburg resolved itself when their double stack decided to try to storm the bridge (kudos for them attacking together, instead of sequentially as in RTW). Unfortunately, I had just read Ignoramus's post about stakes and bridges, and I could not resist. I could not put stacks on the road, but covered the sides. Then I stuck three shiltrons in the game on the road. It was sad. The Danes had lots of wonderful infantry, but lost everything for the cost of a couple of my mercenary spearmen.
- A more honorable battle followed on the 18th year of besieging Hamburg, as a Danish relief force and two smaller armies tried to save the castle. I set up a corner defence and remembered to post stakes. Then I shot to death the main Danish army and charged when out of ammo. Unfortunately, I had lost track of the two supporting armies who were hidden in the woods. They killed all my knights, although I beat them in the end.
- Had a superb mountain-side defence while besieging Bern. The map reminded me of Shinao in STW or some of the nice Italian mountains in MTW. I forgot to deploy stakes, but did not need too - the height advantage was too great and I crushed a 1:2 force of high class Milanese.
- Discovered perhaps the killer strategy in M2TW: crusades! Launched one on Milan, picking up four crusader knights and a host of sergeants. Still wondered how I would take Milan, as I had only two swords. But the Milanese immediately counterattacked, sandwiching me between two armies. Finally got to use knights in numbers and was very impressed. I am going to try to field four per stack now - they are just excellent at collapse flanks after you've expended your ammunition. They are also very useful for hunting down those annoying Milanese crossbows, if they get separated from their main force. Reached about 34000 florins for sacking Milan. I immediately tried to spam a second crusade to Genoa, but thankfully the game imposes a waiting period between crusades.
Bottomline: I take back what I said about RTR:PE battles being better. I now prefer the M2TW ones. The M2TW terrain is just beautiful and the higher kill rates make the battles feel more vivid.
I've been playing a Spanish campaign since I started the game a few days ago.
Currently on turn 68 and I have Leon, Toledo, Zaragoza, Valencia and Palermo. At war with Portugal who has Cordoba and Lisboa (and thanks to an enormous naval trade they've built, one which I simply can't match because of their naval superiority) they've actually managed to hold their own for a little while. But the loss of Palermo was a big mistake on their part and it's going to cost them the war.
Siege of Palermo - I had 4 Padded Armor Spears, 3 Mailed Knights, 1 Padded Archer against 2 mailed crossbows 2 mailed sword militia, their crown prince, and 1 dismounted feudal knights. I was intending to wait this out to the very end and hope I'd get some reinforcements there before then, but they sallied on the second turn of the siege. Their biggest mistake was committing their militia and knights to combat with my padded spears and expecting their crown prince to hold my knights with support from their crossbows. They slaughtered my infantry in melee, I lost some 240 spears, but having three mail knights to their single prince allowed me to pin their knights and then charge twice from opposite flanks. We both lost our commanding officer at exactly the same time, but I got lucky in that theirs was the prince, not just a captain, and after some coaxing by my surviving knights, they all attempted a retreat back to the castle. Hunted down and exterminated every last one of the buggers.
Bridge Battle north of Cordoba - Just had the enemy try to cross a bridge with about 5 mailed sword militia against 2 padded spears and 4 padded archers, caught them in a crossfire as they came across the bridge and while the spears pinned them in one spot, they never stood a chance. Ran them down with mail knights and ransomed the lot of them back for 2,300 florins.
Right now I've got a crusader army led by my prince marching to Jerusalem (in Northern Italy now), comprised of 4 feudal knights, the prince, 4 padded spears, 1 dismounted foot knights, 3 crusader spears, 2 crusader knights, 2 padded archers, 3 pilgrims.
And my other large armies are located in Palermo, defence against any potential French aggression, consists mainly of a buffed up army that took the city plus some extra missiles.
And a fort north of Cordoba with 2 generals, 5 mail knights, 5 padded archers and 4 padded spears.
Oh, and I forced through an election of one of my cardinals as Pope. ~:) I had three cardinals in, won the vote by having them all vote for my top cardinal and securing Englands vote through the offer of an alliance. Milan went along with it too without any extra prompting.
....erm...hate to be the one who mentions it first but....
.....danger of being seriously Off Topic guys!
M2:TW discussions on the M;TW thread please :idea2:
Let's not let M2 consume us to the point that we fail to finalise perhaps THE best and most successful (not to mention long running) PBeM on these forums.
Yeah, about that, lol, Flydude has the save file.
Good point, sorry. :embarassed:Quote:
Originally Posted by Braden
Just to let you know I'm back (and dying of boredom in Afrika ~;) )
I'm working on it. :laugh4: But I can't just move you out right this moment and have your town revolt. :shame: Next turn I hope! (Which is coming up tonight!)
Instructions received. Battle will be fought either tonight or tomorrow morning.
Off topic and I don't care....
check out the teaser trailer for "300"....you must you simply must.
http://movies.yahoo.com/movie/preview/1809721014
..ok, normal service can resume now and I'll get back into my box.
Off topic or not who cares. I saw the preview for that when I went to see Borat, and it looks absolutely spectacular. Makes me forget about my general distaste for the Greeks and be a Spartan!
why are the spartans naked? Don't they have breastplate? IMHO, it is too bad they choose to do the movie from the comic 'the 300' instead of from the book, 'the hot gates', probably for the dramatic effects present in the comics. But it makes it seem like spartans are a bunch of barbarians... :P In the book they are more cultured.
New Consular Report posted, it's an interesting read. Newest save file going to Glaucus.
Battle over and won, 97 of ours for 1287 of theirs. Of our 97 casulaties, only 15 were Romans, and only 5 from other parts of Italy. The rest were Gaullic mercenaries, no real loss. Report to be posted tomorrow. Save game passed on, I think.
I always wondered if that emergency session provision of the rules would come in useful, and here we are. This ought to make things interesting. Might even drag some of us away from MTW2 for five minutes to make a post or two.
Doing it from the comic gives them the license to do what they want without fear of criticism from "historical purists" ie, us lot.Quote:
Originally Posted by StoneCold
As for the Spartans - cultured? Ha! As my friend with his degree in Greek History said, "bunch of ******* weirdos". Over-rated as warriors too ~;)
I have to agree with Mount Suribachi on this one..
As for the new situation with Iberia. I told you Servius had one more trick up his sleeve. His initial opinion was defiance towards further eastward expansion. And when has he ever failed to get his way?
Well folks, seems my absence is warranted as I'm now dead :shame: . I checked out a save game a couple of days ago only to see I was nowhere to be found. With the latest Consular report I see why... damn pirates...
I'm sorry but it couldn't be helped. I re-loaded the save 4-5 times to see if we couldn't somehow get the AI to botch and not attack you. I know we're typically not supposed to do that, but I felt guilty after all the waiting you did when you were only 1 season from all the action getting started up in Gaul.
Maybe you should just pick up with Quintus Naevius. He's leading the legions there and currently not a taken avatar. It'll put you directly in the middle of the central conflict point.
Yes - it's a shame, Wonderland - Cornelius Saturnius was shaping up to have superb stats and traits. Please have a look at the latest savegame and take your pick of the spare avatars - the FAQ table is up to date about those that are taken (aside from poor Cornelius).
If this turn of events results in a Civil War (not that I would ever wish such a thing :creep:) it would be nice to resolve it with a multiplayer battle between the two contenders to the Imperial Throne (I mean Consulship, of course). The winner would then be able to create his or her own 'future' for Rome and writeup a WOTS ending in whatever way they saw fit. It could be an exciting ending to an exciting PBM.
Nor I, nor I.Quote:
If this turn of events results in a Civil War (not that I would ever wish such a thing)
*nods sadly, then gets out the popcorn and hopes one of them has Camtasia*
With Lucius's recent proposal of killing Servius on sight, I think we already have one of those contenders placed. Not to say we won't end up with a triumvirate or heck, maybe 4-5 contenders for the highest seat of Roman power.
But if that motion passes it should be clear that Servius has usurped total control of at least his own legion, and being that he's come to see himself as somewhat of a godsend for the republic, will not go quietly.
As of right now we're in the beginning part of my last season. I sent Wonderland a battle if he decides he wants to take Quintus Naevius, if he doesn't want him I'm autoresolving it.
EDIT - However, Servius is, if anything, a man truthful to himself, and if left to retire to Palma after the Iberian war as he has stated his intentions to be, will give the senate no more troubles and retire from public life.
We could also look at it another way. Servius has major support in the East with experienced and victorious legions there…..to me it seems that most of those opposed to him are power-based in the West and in Italy so we certainly have a East/West split already!
Manius “would” contest the leadership of the Republic (or whatever it ends up as) apart from his loyalty to Servius. Should Servius be killed though, Manius would certainly contest openly though.
Think of Manius being a “more loyal” Brutus to Servius’s Caesar.
As for multi-player games. I have to say that’s a very good idea but I’d approach it with caution mainly as I’ve never played a multi-player game, am unsure if RTR is capable of such a thing and not sure of the LAN set-up required??
So, if someone is able to steer me through all that then Manius’s Legion would certainly be present fighting alongside Servius.
It would also be interesting if it was possible to represent the type of forces each “faction” is able to field with a reasonable accuracy.
I am going to put up an "out of character" poll along with the emergency motions to gauge people's views on when they want this PBM to end.
I will present the following options:
(1) End it around the time Servius's term is due to naturally end (ie within a few turns).
(2) End it in around the mid-term of the next Consul (ie around 10 turns).
(3) End it around the end of the next Consul's term (ie around 20 turns).
(4) Keep it going beyond the reign of the next Consul
People have presented scenarios that would mean any of the above options could work, but it would be good to know people's preferences. We will try to end the PBM in a satisfying way, so whatever option people prefer, I won't just say "right, that's it - thread closed".
I guess basically it depends on people's interest - if you are losing interest (e.g. due to M2TW) and would like things wrapped up soon, vote for an early end; if you are still keen to keep going (e.g. you don't have M2TW or want to be Consul etc), vote for a longer period of closure.
Looking at the time it has taken to get through reigns, we have:
Quintus - 6 days
Lucius I - 13 days
Verginius - 18 days
Tiberius - 31 days
Lucius II - 41 days
Servius - 79 days+
Clearly, the campaign is taking longer as the Republic grows, but I think we could speed things up - maybe by setting up a "relay" system for fighting battles out each turn (lining up involved lower house generals and their time zones/availability, then getting them to pass the saves on directly).
If Numerius were elected next Consul, I would be aiming to get through a full term by Christmas. :eyebrows:
Econ21 – please can you update the Library with the current world maps and Who’s-Who with what legion etc?
Seems quite out of date for those stats and it’ll be helpful for me so I know who to PM about the current Senate stuff.
- BTW, anyone want a civil war as I "think" I may have started one :help:
:oops: :laugh4:
I will update the FAQ table tonight.
I think the out of character vote is partly to decide this. If people want closure now, we have a causus belli. If they want to play on, the current divisions could be allowed to grow and fester for a while.Quote:
Originally Posted by Braden
Both occurances work for me. Both will be just as interesting as well, thanks Econ21
I will update the Library when the current Consul term is over. It's not my fault it has taken 5-6 times as long as other terms!Quote:
Originally Posted by Braden
In some ways the game is set up nicely to finish with the Consulship of Servius - however it might end, acquital/impeachment/exile/suicide/civil war.
However, I think one more reign would leave the game in a satisfactory state - Iberia, Selecia and Ptolomy would all be crushed in 5 years time. And I think having Numerius/econ21 finish it off would be not only a nice bookend, plus he also plays really quick ~;)
Also, for selfish reasons, I don't have MTW2 yet and I would like to play a few more battles in this game (I haven't had many ~:( )
TinCow – ok, I’ll check the latest save file tonight for info I need.
End-Game : Well, I’ve voted for and would prefer if the game went as far as it possibly can. I firmly believe that we may end the game “naturally” at some point in the near future and several of the suggestions (including the Civil War scenario) are very appealing and allow us to evolve the game to these ends.
I've really taken that long? Oh, wow...sorry. It didn't seem like it at all.
Anyway. Servius's actions would be determined by the actions of the senate.
Personally, I think the civil war aspect is interesting, but so is the thought of Servius actually surviving into old age more safely. :laugh4:
This is up to the senate.
EDIT - Started the LAST TURN of my consulship today.
I've updated the FAQ table except I need to know who Wonderland is. Is he taking Quintus Naevius from Shadeswolf?
Also, FLYdude - when I sent everyone the heads-up about the vote, yours bounced back because your PM box was full.
Hey econ, sorry about not announcing who I was picking sooner. I'm gonna' go with Galerius Vatinius, who as you may recall made quite a ruckus on the hallowed senate floors some years ago. I think it's only fitting I take him up again at this end-game juncture. Not a lot of influence to weight down my votes, but meh. It seems like the right things to do.