When the Crusaders reach there crusade target, then I think either the Commanding General should govern the settlement, or the most experinced.
And at I guess, once we have conquered our target, we look to expanding more in the Holy Land?
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When the Crusaders reach there crusade target, then I think either the Commanding General should govern the settlement, or the most experinced.
And at I guess, once we have conquered our target, we look to expanding more in the Holy Land?
OOC:
After discussion in the OOC thread and with econ21, I propose
OOC Charter Amendment 6.2:
Medifix will no longer be used and in its stead, FactionHeir's trait and ancillary fixes will be implemented. He will also take full responsibility of any issues regarding these files, however unlikely these may be after extensive testing.
If you want more information on those or a copy beforehand, that can be arranged.
IC: So the diet is officially open, yes?
I would like to remind all Electors that in accordance with Charter Amendment 5.2:, only 1 Edict or Amendment is permitted per Elector. If you wish to propose more than one, you must get the permission of your Duke to use one of the three Household edict slots. Remember that each of the Household edicts must be pre-seconded by two members of your Household.
Consider carefully any Edicts that you are about to propose. A poorly written and ill-conceived Edict will simply waste your time and could prevent you from proposing any more.
Prinz Henry: After some reflection, I have decided to stand for Chancellor. This is with some reluctance, as there are other men - Dietrich, Otto and indeed Maximillan who has served us so well - who I would prefer to see as the next Chancellor. But these fine men have indicated a desire not to stand and so I feel obliged to do so in their stead.
The last Chancellorship, through no fault of the incumbent, saw the will of the Diet usurped by the machinations of my father. He plunged us into a state of crisis, excommunicated for our action in taking Rome. This creates two challenges for the Reich: to endure and to atone.
Enduring will not be easy. What we have seen so far is the calm before the storm. The Chancellor has reported significant French, Hungarian and Venetian armies on or in our borders. Electors, these are but the vanguard. As we speak, the Catholic kings are using all their powers to raise extra revenue to fund holy wars against us. The non-Catholics do likewise, sensing the threat that our nascent crusade poses to them. We have voted to restrain our own expansion during the coming years. This was wise, as surely much of our efforts will be devoted to restraining the expansion of others.
I believe I am well equipped to safeguard our Empire during this difficult period. It was I who conceived of the idea of Household Armies. I believe these forces will be instrumental in safeguarding our frontiers. I will strive to modernise these forces - using the fortresses of Staufen and Thorn to provide dismounted feudal knights and pavisse crossbowmen to upgrade our capacity. Electors, you will recall I was criticised at the start of the last Chancellorship for wishing to pour vast amounts of money into the creating a fortress at Staufen. Now, gentlemen, you will see how I will repay that investment.
But enduring is not enough. We have committed ourselves to atone for our actions in taking Rome by embarking on a great crusade. Shepherding that crusade towards the Holy Land will be the main enterprises of the Reich in the years to come. I submit that it will be most efficiently executed by electing a crusader as Chancellor. Only a man fully committed to this enterprise can be trusted to make sure it is well funded and well coordinated. We have already seen what can be done if an unscrupulous figure bends laws to further their own agenda. We cannot have a repeat of such discord and division. We must work together, harmonising the dual goals of saving our Reich and saving our souls. Committing the task of guarding the Reich and guiding the Crusade to one and the same person is the best way to achieve this.
There are those who question whether a crusader can govern the Reich. Such men would have you believe that Jerusalem is on the moon! If the Romans could govern Jerusalem, could not a man in Jerusalem govern Rome? Good lines of communication will be created - our sourthern navy rebuilt to ensure them - and I will appoint a functionary who will represent me in the Diet. But Electors, I say this in all humility: if elected Chancellor, I will not rule over you. I will act as a facilitator - ensuring the smooth execution of the wishes of the Houses and the Council of Crusaders. I will liase and inform; I will endeavour to chart a smooth passage over the troubled waters that lie ahead - for both the homelands and the crusade.
There is one other issue that may concern the Electors - what if my father should pass on while I am Chancellor? In such an event, I swear that if elected, I would not use my Royal perogative to take the next Chancellorship as well. I recognise that having one man in power for too long is undesirable. I will reserve my perogative for a later time, perhaps when some new crisis befalls us and once again I feel obliged to serve you.
I second the Kiaser's propisitionas i belive that only a gerneral in the Reich, can truly contral the Reich...Quote:
Charter Amendment 6.1: Electors are not allowed to hold the office of Chancellor if they are in a province that is separated from Imperial territory by over two provinces.
alsoi must say that has not the Roman Empire fallen into ruins?... and historicly... has not Judea been the most secsesful of the revolts agianst Rome?... Distance makes every hardship multiply.Quote:
If the Romans could govern Jerusalem, could not a man in Jerusalem govern Rome?
I will refrain from commenting on the election and proposed Amendments until others have had a chance to speak. However, there is one issue I feel strongly about. Accordingly, I shall use my personal Edict to propose the following:
Charter Amendment 6.3: Dukes may bestow the title of Count on Electors without avatars.
There are many in this Diet who have given great services to their Houses. *Mandorf nods respectfully to some members of the Austrian delegation.* Yet these men are deprived of land and title due to the nature of our laws. We must change this so that those who demonstrate great loyalty and aptitude may be rewarded by their Dukes.
Fourth Elector of Swabia stands up clapping
I vehemently support Prinz Henry's decision to run for Chancellor. He has been a strong leader for the House of Swabia for many years now and have lead us to nothing but success and will no doubt do the same for the Empire should he be elected.
The Kaiser's proposition however is troublesome. As our empire grows, our war fronts will be farther and farther away from the heartland of the Empire. How could we have a competent Chancellor if they are oblivious to our war efforts and sits safely in our capital throwing orders around. It is rather better to have a Chancellor that comes from the fringes of our Empire as he will have a better perspective regarding the situations at our borders and know how to deal with external problems.
Kaiser Heinrich:
I have but one response to Henry's comments.
Good Electors, let me throw out a number here:Quote:
He plunged us into a state of crisis, excommunicated for our action in taking Rome.
Zero.
That is the number of new wars we have been involved in since my "despicable" actions got us excommunicated. That is the number of territories we have lost since we have been excommunicated. Hell, that is the number of settlements that have been threatened aside from those that the Papacy have.
Life has gone on as usual since Rome has been taken, Good Electors! The noble houses of Franconia and Austria have continued to make progress against their longtime enemies, just as they have before the excommunication! All that has been lost in this situation is a man in a position of power who was unfriendly to us.
Good Electors, Prinz Henry speaks of nonexistent threats. He is using the actions of his evil, unholy, despicable father (me) as a campaign platform, promising change. Well, maybe change isn't good! After all, look at how much excommunication has hurt us! Don't forget, thanks to my doings we will soon have a Pope that will give us carte blanche.
And finally, I forgot. Please excuse my old age, but I have one more comment to respond to.
The difference is, Henry, that all of the land between Jerusalem and Rome was Roman.Quote:
If the Romans could govern Jerusalem, could not a man in Jerusalem govern Rome?
Prinz Henry, you are simply not qualified for the position of Chancellor. You have not the stomach for it. Unfortunately, the Reich will automatically be subject to a term of your Chancellorship due to your God-given power as incoming Kaiser. Please spare them from a second term.
Otto's gaze travels between the Kaiser and the Prinz. He rubs the scar on the right side of his face as he looks down at a small note in his hand. The Duke rises to speak.
I will second Charter Amendments 6.2 and 6.3.
Otto moves to sit, but turns to speak to the Emperor.
Mein Kaiser, if you wish to run for Chancellor, I will support you. If not, I will support your eldest son. Next time, please send your men to my study. I would not have Elsebeth disturbed while she is sleeping.
Otto bows to Heinrich. Heels clicking together as he comes to attention, he pivots crisply and returns to his seat.
*Maximillian Mandorf raises an eyebrow when the Kaiser begins speaking. After the first few lines, he chuckles slightly.*
Zero wars? Do you not consider our conflict with the Papal States to be a war? I suppose your battles at Rome and Genoa were simply 'keeping order'? Since this is not a war, was your recent unwillingness to face Pope Accattus on the field due to his odor?
Zero territories lost? I suppose Pope Gregory was merely touring the wonderous sites of Genoa for a few years. I must admit, he was rather more energetic than I would expect for a Bishop of Rome. The festivities he threw must have been truely extravagant, for he left the entire city something of a mess. I would hate to imagine what would have happened had Pope Gregory decided to actually take the city.
Yes, my Kaiser. Thank you for all the good you have done for us lately. We are all immensely grateful for your selfless acts. By the way, do you know if Pope Accattus is planning a party in Rome? I hear he takes after his predecessor in some respects.
Mein Prinz do you not think that being Chancellor would burden your prior commitments like the Crusade? I believe that should be your first priority, not matters at home since you will be far from the Reich. Since my Duke will be accompanying you on the Crusade I would rather your full attention be focused on that.
Fifth Elector of Franconia, as you know the Crusade will be governed by a five man Council of equals, of which I am but one. A key issue for the Crusade will be liasing with the Chancellor, to make sure it is informed by the latest intelligence and well supported by Imperial resources. Electing a crusader to the post will minimise the chance of delays, misunderstandings and lack of coordination.
As to my father's reference to imaginary threats, we will see. I will wager that Hungary and Denmark will strike against us soon; perhaps Sicily too. Such events will particularly challenge the two Houses my father has identified as having made progress: Franconia and Austria.
Dietrich Von Saxony
"Mein Prinz, just as you stated.Houses of Franconia and Austria will be in most danger after we have left. And becouse of that i think the Chancellor should come from other of those houses. My opinion stands that the Chancellor should be in Germany and i dont see a better man in the Reich,for the next Chancellor as Duke Leopold of Austria,if he decides to run."
Mein Kaiser, Dukes, Electors!
It has not been long since we last met in this hall to discuss the proceedings of our Empire. A far-reaching decision has been made by this august body to assemble a host and march East. A Crusade it should be, without the consent of the Pope, and a Crusade it will be by the power of this Assembly. You all know my opinion on these matter through the Edict I have proposed during the Emergency Diet. Of course I would have preferred that course of action, but I have full respect for the decision made and will follow it. This leaves me no choice but to stay behind. Our borders will be threatened and I will be needed to defend the Reich against it's enemies. Like a shield I will stand before any intruders trying to advance on the lands of Austria, and I offer you to stand like a shield before anyone trying to harm the Empire in the upcoming times. I offer myself for the post of Chancellor, if you so accept me.
As you know I hail from a border-country and know of the perils that lay at the fringes of our Empire. I have proven in the past that I am capable of keeping our enemies at bay. Time and time again have I defended my lands against the Venetian merchantmen and my army is ready to strike at their capital of Venice as we speak. I assure you that I am well capable of delivering the same feat upon anyone daring to attack our lands, to ravage our countryside and slaughter our people!
But what would endless war, but even more war breed?
Therefore I will dedicate my Chancellorship to securing our borders, and building up our infrastructure. The Ducal armies of Swabia and Bavaria need to be brought to full strength so that our Western border may be as secure as our Eastern border has become. We will be spread thin and troubled times lie ahead of us. I promise to give to those remaining all the support necessary to defend our Reich from its enemies on all sides. We shall crush any armies entering our territories and send out emissaries to commission peace. It will not be a peace of weakness, but a peace of strength, dictated by us to our satisfaction. If our enemies won't accept, let them come and we shall break their attacks, like the rocks crush the surf!
I appreciate Prince Henry's commitment to also stand for Chancellor. There will be troublesome times ahead for him and those pious and noble men that have chosen to accompany him, too. Hardships will await them on their journey beyond the imagination of most men present here, travelling through the lands of he heathens will face these men with many challenges, and only the bravest, strongest, and mightiest will prevail. I will give those men, the troops and support they need to carry out their enormous task. I will help you plot the best course through the treacherous lands of our enemies and follow any orders given by the Crusader Council to the letter to assure that your journey will be successful. Let my first help be my candidacy for Chancellorship. It will be an honour for me to relieve my brother Prince Henry of this burden, so that he may focus all his attentions towards the success of your mission. We all know that full dedication will be needed and any distraction could spell disaster for the whole enterprise.
It is vital for our Crusade to succeed to be welcomed back in the family of our Christian neighbours. This will make peace an option in our future. Either way it will take years to do this and my Chancellorship will probably not see the end of your journey, meaning that it will take a long time until any Pope will recognize and appreciate the success and rightfulness of our actions.
This brings me to the next point, concerning our current excommunication. I don't know how long our Kaiser and Pope Attacus intend to play hound and hare in the vicinity of Rome, but this has to end. I will send emissaries to Attacus in an attempt to end the current situation. I have already mentioned in the last Diet what steps could be undertaken by those responsible for our current situation to remedy it. If you would but agree then I promise you we could be reconciled by the end of the next turn. Currently excommunication puts a major strain on our tax revenues through the unrest it is causing among our populace and will incite our neighbours to attack us.
Don't think that any amendations to the Papacy now will be permanently. Once the Pope has Jerusalem he will joyfully give back the temporal home we have given to him. If not, I would not be opposed to a forceful persuasion. I'm sure he will thank us for it generously once he arrives in Jerusalem.
This concludes my aims should I become Chancellor. I will reside by the rulings of this Council and hope that you will find me worthy of leading us through these troubled times.
He bows deeply in front of the Diet.
I will second all Charter Amendments proposed thus far.
Kaiser Heinrich:
Since the Prinz only addresses one of my comments directed at him, I assume that he agrees with the other statements I have made.
As for Mandorf, do not deny that every settlement in our possession before excommunication is in our possession now.
I wholeheartedly support Duke Leopold's bid for Chancellorship in this upcoming election, and I encourage all others, especially those whom I've helped out in the past, to do so as well.
Prinz Henry: Father, as usual you presume too much. I doubt there is anything you could say in this Diet which you could assume I agree with. Were you to say that you have ten toes, I would ask you to remove your boots before I concurred.
stands up into the heat of a family fued
Kiaser, Prinz... will you excuse me
I would like to propose an Edict, Edict 6.1 I belive? ... anyways excuse my numbering if i am wrong
Edict 6.1 If, during the course of the crusade, Hungary Declares War upon the Reich in anyway, the Reich will strick back by taking Budapest. This shall take into account Papel relations, and will not be used if Excuminication insues
I Belive that Budapest would be a great addition to the Eastern Front, and will surely power the Reich in many glorious campaigns to come.
sits
Kaiser Heinrich:
And yet, you still do not respond to these comments. At least make an effort to do something aside from attack me.
Duke Leopold, at the last election it was obvious that you were nothing more than a tool of the Kaiser. Why is that no longer the case? You are a very capable military commander and I do not doubt your management abilities, but I have not forgotten where you stood during the last election. It is clear that the Kaiser remains delusional and self-righteous. He does not see any error in what he has done and he thinks there have been no consequences of importance. I will not see an ally of the Kaiser in the Chancellor's office.
I for one do not find it prudent if a crusader takes the post of Chancellor. Even one as competent as our very own Prince Henry. Who knows what may happen out in the east, and we need stability and certainty now more than ever. Especially since we 'll be losing tons of troops and half a dozen noble generals to a crusade to the Holy land.
I find that a Chancellor such as Leopold, of the noble house of Austria, would be best for the Reich. Not only has he shown, numerous times I might add, how to make our enemies suffer, but he also knows how it is to defend. Austria is much like Franconia, it is never quite safe.
:balloon2:
Kaiser Heinrich:
Self-righteous? Delusional?! I do not think that there have been any consequences of importance because there have been no consequences of importance.
Our greatest enemy is removed. Soon Pope Accattus will be dead and we will have Otterbach on the Papal seat. Once again, none of the other great Catholic powers of Europe, save for the Papacy itself, have declared war on us. None. The Reich is still humming along financially. As a matter of fact, we are so secure in our position that we are about to send thousands of troops and several of our best generals on a Crusade to far-away Jerusalem. Good Electors, these are things we would not do if we were "crippled" by my horrid actions.
So, my Kaiser, is it no consequence that the only way we have been able to maintain order in nearly all of our cities has been to reduce taxes to the minimum level? Even at that level, Milan appears to be decending into rioting once again. The Imperial Treasury is losing many thousands of florins a year due to reduced taxes alone. Perhaps the Kings of Rome can defecate precious metals, but the rest of us mortal men have to secure incomes from our lands.
well... i must say that this diet has definatly desended into a group of men... defecating... insults at one another... in other... more bussiness like... and less insulting news... i support my Dukes, non-Kaiser, related bid for Chanclership.
Ah Count Mandorf, do I need to remind you that I have been one of the most outspoken critics of the Kaiser's actions in this Diet? I have alway opposed Excommunication and have already mentioned that I will do everything in my power to redeem the current situation, if those responsible give me the means to do it.
Speaking of the Kaiser's tools you don't even have to look beyond your own House to find one, I believe. I did what I did for the good of the House of Austria. Those dealings lie in the past and just because I returned Heinrich a favour that doesn't mean I succumbed to being his pawn, like others present here. Instead I remain independent as befits a Duke. If I get elected Chancellor I will follow no other agenda than the one outlined in my previous speech.
I did not intend disrespect by my question, Duke Leopold, and I apologize if that is how it was perceived. Indeed, I simply wished to hear from your own mouth that you are your own man and beholden to no one.
Von Mahren grins and, in a stage whisper, says to von Saxony, "You know what worries me the most about us going on a crusade? Never mind the dangers we will undoubtedly face, but I fear the Diet will soon descend into a bar brawl without the few level-headed nobles such as yourself and the Prinz to keep a minimum of order. I'll bet you 200 florins the building will be on fire when we return"
Ahem... Perhaps if the Kaiser still sees a need to justify his actions, he could do it elsewhere, without disrupting the Diet? If he believes there is nothing to discuss, why does he keep trying to discuss it?
And while I am sure this royal vendetta between father and son will be amusing to watch unfold, this is not the place for it.
Let us keep our minds on the business at hand. And let us try to remember that we are the leaders of the finest nation in Europe, not a group of thugs and barbarians. Let's have some order here, and treatour fellow electors with a minimum of courtesy, even if we disagree with their actions.
I believe the Prinz would make an excellent chancellor. He has shown his worth before, and I have no doubt he would be a good choice. Nevertheless, he is embarking on a crusade, and, let's face it, may not return alive. And if he does, it won't be for many years. At the moment, the Reich needs a Chancellor whose focus is on our homelands, and who is not thousands of miles away. Perhaps after the Crusade, he can take up the position as Chancellor.
I will support Duke Leopold in the coming election.
Elector von Mahren, this being my city and my Diet, I will decide what is and is not proper, thank you. I simply want the Prinz to toughen up and act like a man, not the version of Henry that is more like his two sisters than a Prinz that we have seen.Quote:
Perhaps if the Kaiser still sees a need to justify his actions, he could do it elsewhere, without disrupting the Diet? If he believes there is nothing to discuss, why does he keep trying to discuss it?
And while I am sure this royal vendetta between father and son will be amusing to watch unfold, this is not the place for it.
Mandorf - this situation will be resolved as soon as Otterbach is elevated to the Papacy.
Kaiser Heinrich:
Upon further deliberation, have it your way, Mandorf.
Edict 6.2: This Edict hereby instructs the Chancellor to have Kaiser Heinrich, reinforced with the full garrison of Rome, attack Pope Accattus so that the Reich may be reconciled more quickly.
I believe that will ease our public order problem, will it not?
Mein Kaiser, Regarding Edict 6.2 may require an amendment to say attack the current Pope and beyond to future office holders until the Kaiser's choice is elected. We do not have enough votes in the College nor enough influence to persuade the other Cardinals to vote for the honourable Otterbach. It may take several elections before we have the true Pope.
Kaiser Heinrich:
The Pope and the Danish Cardinal currently in the preferati are both quite old and in poor health. If the Danish Cardinal dies before the Pope does, then Otterbach will be elevated to the preferati. If the Pope dies before the Danish Cardinal, then I will simply ensure that that Danish Cardinal gets elected.