The Siskinies

So far in my Pro-Classical era game with the Athenians The Lydians are very rich and hold many lands, they completely wiped out the Persians in only 4-5 years() from what I could tell with my spying. I had a little dispute with them over some rebel land and easily defeated one of thier armies. Strangely the general of the army was a Persian chariot unit. Is that supposed to happen? I guess he was bribed?

Meanwhile the Thesselians are holding the Lydians off at Byzantine but I doubt they will last much longer with the Tracians at thier backs unless I do something to get the Lydians attention.

I had several storms come up with the message "curragh storm" "could not translate" these have happened in nearly every sea.


In conclusion is that the way you wanted the Persians to be wiped out so fast by the Lydians?

[B]Just installed latest version
Played chaeronea in historical Campaigns it states [U]win at all coastes
should be cost http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/gc-book2.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/barrel.gif

I haven't got much of a chance to test the new version, as my bloody comp took a while to install it correctly. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/mecry.gif
Getting on it now.

@BrianBBJ
I like long posts

I also didnt have much time to test the new version yet.
But a quick first impression:
Startet twice with Thracians on hard and both times the Peonians immediately attacked one of my western provinces.
Also the Macedonians immediately conquerd the rebel province of Myg?? to the southwest.
I tried to fight the Macedonians once, b ut found out that I didnt realy have any units able to hurt the armored Ptolemiste, even though the AI didnt use his units very effectivly.
That said I think playing the Thracians will now be a little more challenging and interresting as I wont be able to grab the rebel provinces around me anymore, before going to war with the peoninas.

Quick question:
I assume the error with the "Thrasian" unit names will fixed, but are the Dasians supposed to be called this way?
On the campaign map the province is also written an Dasia.

Persians:
Damn it, I keep playign and I cant finish a campaign till a new version comes out... So far Ive had no technical problems at ALL with the persians, simply encountered a lot of spelling errors....

Flip:
Sorry for the delay, my internet's been down for a few days. I sent the pics to CZoF and here are the figures you wanted:

walk
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
run
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
stand
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
die
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
charge
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
fight
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
fight2
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
standing_shoot
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
standing_reload
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254
253 253 252 252 254 254

Zanderpants, the file is correct, so I'll wait for CZoF pic and see what is happening.

Thanks,

Is the problem still there with the new beta?

rrraa
This is driving me crazy I'm playing as the Corinthians in the geometric age on normal, fighting a battle aginst the Lakedemonians, and their polemistes are chewing up my hoplites like they're nothing I also have a better general, better ground and more men plus armor and weapon upgrades that the Lakedemonians don't have
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/gc-wall.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...c-furious3.gif

thats sounds very veird..... poleimistes killing hoplites.....and out numbered and outgeared....

Zanderpants please try this:
Start a custom battle in the same era and difficulty. and now try again. 1 Polimiste vs 1. hoplite unit and also change the sides, so that you play the Polimistes.
does this give the same result???

BrianBBJ: I'll check
Flip: I'll check on a custom battle

I have just tryed it.

One hoplits beat one polemiste. but not two at the same time
One Geometric Hoplite cost 525
and one Polemiste cost 325 (2 cost 650).

Så two polemist should beat one Hoplite, and i must say that the Polemiste are taking heavy casualtys also, and when i tested both polemiste had used all there javalins on the hoplite units, weakening it a little.
so game balance wise there should be no problems.
i would love to get your save game to try that battle out.

-----------

now for something completely different.....
I LOVE POLEMISTE units. why can't i keep them in Pro-classic and classic? they are the perfect flank defenders for the hoplites. those Peltasts amateur stick throwers are clowns in comparison.

Well..... i can't have everything.....

I think it could be cool for one of the greek faction, who don't got special hoplite units, to be able to keep the Polemiste units also in Pro-classic, just to make more differences in the greek factions.
Could one of the culture´s(factions) historical vice have this? or saying in another word, could the known history support this in anyway?

Hi Brianbbj,

Since the late Mycenaean age and as there power was growing the Greeks changed there way of fighting concentrating to the heavy armoured troops. These troops were named Promahi meaning first line troops. After the Dorian descent these Promahi became the standard troop type. There evolution were the early Hoplites.
These Promahi are the Polemiste unit in the game (Polemiste means warriors so it is rather generic term for a unit) and the Dark age hoplites are direct descendants of the Polemiste unit done by the Argian king Fidon and quickly were adopted by all Greek city states.
That is why you don’t have them in later ages. If I could I would generate an event of First Hoplitic unit forming and after 20 years all Polemiste would be upgraded to Hoplites and you would be able to built hoplites. During that period the Argians would be the only one having them. But I can’t. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/frown.gif

There are techniques to bit the hoplites and have to do with the number of heavy missile troops you have and the number of Hoplites in the enemy. Basically use the Polemiste and two rows all in attack. While the first engages the enemy the other cuts them down with javelins and then flanks so a 2 to 1 combination is the best.

Not realy a bug report but a reading recomendation for everyone interrested in the period:
Im currently rereading the The History of Herodotus
LINK and it deals exactly with the the Geometric and Pro Classic Timeperiods in HTW.
Im currently at the point where Herodotus describes how Croesus lost his Lydian Empire to Cyrus and the Persians.

Also there is a brief account on the pre Trojan period in which Heodotus describes the Coastal Greeks living as seafaring raiders, so the Viking Greeks in Troy might not be so far of http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif

The best thing is that I can now look at the HTW map and actualy see were then people and places are that Herodotus writes about. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...-2thumbsup.gif

Dear Beta Testers

If you can be so kind, I'd love to hear comments on the relative difficulty of each starting position/faction. I have re-read the faction descriptions and I think the best thing would be to amend the descriptions (at least the lead) to fit in the particular timeframe (era) and tactical situation (starting position) for each faction.

I can't possibly play all factions, so I was wondering if you could help me with this task, by providing some comments on how you are fairing with the starting point of the faction you've chosen, how relatively easy or hard it is to grow strong, if you face imminent threats and which etc.

Thank you Your help will be highly appreciated http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/bigthumb.gif

I find that the Corinthians are an interesting faction to play as. In the beginning, you have to work very hard to get on top of the Argians and Lakedemonians, and it's quiet hard. However, if you're able to defeat them both and gain rich island provinces to the west of your starting position, then you're pretty much set. With a large trade income, you can basically turn the southern area of Greece into a large fortress. The Corinthians have no special units http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/mecry.gif ,which makes it a bit difficult to survive in the later time periods because of all of the faction specific units on the map. However, with a good commander, they can still win battles against the other Greek factions, it just takes a bit more thought. I found that it was absolutely vital to defeat the Lakedemonians in the Geometric period, before they got their mighty Spartans. I let them survive in one campaign until the Archaic age and they just trashed me with their special units. It would be nice to see a Corinthian-specific unit though...... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg.../gc-jester.gif

Rosacrux

Argians

Geometric - Probably the best faction of the era. Start off with 3 provinces which means that you have more troops than the other surrounding factions. A quick war with Sparta is easy & then you only have to deal with the Corinthians in the Peloponnese. The Argian over sea colony is in an excellent position for further expansion. The kings & heir units are DA_hoplites instead of polmieste.

Proclassical - Good starting position with plenty of troops. You control some of the richest islands & Argolis has a very good title. Argian hoplites need only fear Spartan hoplites & a war with Sparta is imminent. Once Sparta has been dealt with the Corinthians shouldn't be to much trouble.

Classical - Weak starting position, few troops & your provinces are disconnected by 3-4 sea zones. Sparta attacks first turn most of the time & while they can be beaten back its costly. Even when successful its very hard to go on the offensive due to your lack of troops, sieges & loss of sea control(big spartan fleets). Its impossible to reinforce from your other province early on(when you most need it).

Rosacrux
Aetolians

Classical era
You have a steady income, build up your troops quickly and look to the north ,easy expansion is possible overcome the Illyrians, increase your taxes and trade, now is the time to spread eastward conquer the Corinthian’s and then the Thessalians ,but always watch and build your sea power .
You now have a vast supply of trade and man power use it wisely and you will sit the crown upon your head, foolishly waste your resources and you will kneel at your foes feet.

Geometric Era
You start with a well defended position good trade and warriors
Easy pickings surround you use quick expansion, increase your resources and pool of troops, don’t sit back and wait,
Safe guard your outpost states look north for the Illyrians eastward for the Thessalians who you must treat with respect.
Only a fool sits and waits for his foe to grow stronger, take confidence in your quick early conquests and rise the Aetolian flag over Greece.

I found the Histophor Hippis a bit of a let down it costs 1425 F for these warriors; they didn’t perform much better than the Hippis at 775 F, in one flanking movement the Histophor hippis where cut down by the foes hippis, from their description I was expecting more from these elite horse warriors.
I haven’t found any more major bugs,
The maps are great not unlike Greece itself ,but just one comment in a series of battles I fought the Illyrians over a bridge ,not very exciting I held the bridge against 2000 Illyrians to a lost of 300 Greeks, it would of made the battle better if I had to defend more than one crossing.
Archers still seemed to have to much ammo and men
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/barrel.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/cool.gif

No one up for a online test http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/bigthumb.gif

Rosacrux

Thessalians...

Geometric: Very hard, but not impossible. I've yet to finish a campaign, but if you focus on building emissaries, bribing rebels and acquiring rebel provinces, you'll be tough enough to defend yourself by the time the Aetolians or the Thracians attack you. Make alliances, etc.

Proclassic: Very, very hard. I've rarely gotten past a hundred years or so. At first it's fairly simple, with a lineup of tough battles; the Thracians or the Aetolians attack almost immediately, and the only solution is to go completely on the offensive, attacking their provinces even when you don't think you can hold them. You keep some that way, and stop them from getting a chance to attack your main provinces. Once you finally get peace with them, build up fleets, etc. Lydians generally ally themselves with me and help wipe out the Thracians, which leaves me with most of their provinces until the Lydians decide they want my Asia minor provinces, too, and attack. Game over.

Classic: I'll admit, I haven't played too much in this period, as I've been fascinated with attempting to win in the Proclassic period. First impressions were that it might or might not be easier than the Proclassic period, but definitely not as easy as Geomatric is.

Very informative lads http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/bigthumb.gif

Keep 'em coming http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg.../gc-juggle.gif

Just noticed, the support cost for Armed slave rebels is 780 per unit http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...-surprised.gif

When I build an agora, the buulding completed message says it's a drinking hall.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Zanderpants @ June 10 2004,19:57)]Just noticed, the support cost for Armed slave rebels is 780 per unit http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...-surprised.gif

When I build an agora, the buulding completed message says it's a drinking hall.

---

The rebelling citizen is even more costly at 800 a year. I've seen the Persians get slave rebels as part of their faction reappearance & they also get them from rebel provinces that join their cause. Can't be very good for the cause with that kinda upkeep.
On another note, i'm getting near the end of a Proclassical Argian campaign. The Lydians wiped out Persians in the first few years then started invading the northern part of the map. Then all the AI factions attacked them & Persians came back & wiped out Lydians, then the Lydians came back & with the help of the Aetolians have wiped out the Persians. At the moment the Lyndians & Aetolians are at war & the Persians have just come back http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg.../gc-dizzy2.gif
In all my campaigns the Aetolians always become one of the top factions & thats in all eras. Maybe they have to many resources compared to most of the other Greek city states & a much more enviable position.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (youone @ June 10 2004,00:49)]I found the Histophor Hippis a bit of a let down it costs 1425 F for these warriors; they didn’t perform much better than the Hippis at 775 F, in one flanking movement the Histophor hippis where cut down by the foes hippis, from their description I was expecting more from these elite horse warriors.

---

I agree, these guys suck compared to hippis especially since hippis can be produced at 2 valour in 1 turn compared to 1 valour in 2 turns for Xistophoroi_hippis. The Macedonian Companions are even worse value even though they have good stats but 1,850 & 3 years to build is a bit much.

edit: The main difference I noticed is when you dismount them the Xistophoroi_hippis & Companions dismount to late Hoplites but the Hippis dismount to Cl_Hoplites with no shields. Theres no difference between these 2 hoplites yet the dismounted hippi has a much weaker defence than the dismounted Xistophoroi_hippis or Companions.

When i was picked for the beta testa for the Aetolians
I knew from v 2.1 when I played with the same state that conquest was in my hands. Yes you may be right
insolent1
They may have to much resources It's like the I found the Histophor Hippis a bit of a let down it costs 1425 F for these warriors[I]
When I beta test I don't look at or alter any game files
I just report what I find I Know as much about Greek history as the next player so I don't know what the game designer want's The aetolians may have had a strong position at this stage in history and the designer has got it right YES the Aetolians are one of the easiest states to play with, I myself find Athens alot harder
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/barrel.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wave.gif

Rosacrux
Can I e-mail some of these great shots to you the rest of the following will just drop when they see these pics
you deserve a big hand shake for all the work the mod team have done

Loaded

Revolt in Chalcidice
no preview

Also assaulting Scupi castle dosen't have a preview

Hi all beta testers,
Apparently I forgot to add the Events file in the original deployment of the beta I have sent it to Zimoa so you will stop seeing errors in event. BUT in case they don’t stop please can you make a list of all translation (from tags to text) you can find.

Thanks

To all betatesters:


If you have a new test version: Please don´t copy it simply over the old test version.
Also: Don´t use the uninstall function and copy the new version over the old testversion.

Use always a new install of MTW+VI for it.

If not, then some type of files could be too many or too less in your HTW install.

I als have some missing map previews when fighting in the north east of the map

Have you used a fresh new install for the new testversion?


btw: When do you have this missing map previews?: While attacking a province or while attacking a castle?

I guess with a castle? right?
And I also guess that you should install the new test version again over a really new MTW+VI install, if you havn´t.
Then all should work fine.

NEVER install it simply over the older testversion(s)

That you don´t get some mapimages is because we deleted castlehilly08 and its mapimages.
It was a mistake, that it was in the older testversions.
There were no mapimages for temperate for it.
So if you got no mapimage then I guess you will get this castle.
But if you install all over a new fresh MTW+VI install, then this castle is not a problem anymore.

Check if you have castlehilly08 in your maps folder (battle/maps): If so, delete all castlehilly08 files there.


Cheers:

Antalis http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/barrel.gif