Europa Barbarorum Status

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Originally Posted by hellenes

This is SCARY!!!
It took you 1 year to make 45% will it take another one to complete?
And with the whole:
"Its a final product, we have families to feed and boss shouting on us but we call it Open "Beta" for fun."
Should I expect the Open "Beta" to be out Christmas 2006...

Hellenes

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Actually, I've only been with EB since April, so it's taken less than 9 months to get to 45% (or about 5% per month) with the traits and ancillaries. So perhaps we can be finished with them before December 2006, if therother doesn't come up with some more features to include before then. The traits are still very much in "beta" mode, because the basic features are in, but not a lot of the bells and whistles. :san_smiley:

As for families and bosses, my family is starving and my boss is about to fire me, but my more important traits work must continue! :san_wink:

I think the Open Beta will be out before December, 2006. That's my prediction, but it's not an official statement that it will be out before then. It's just a guess. :san_tongue:

so how long has it been now... 1 1/2 year? dec 2006 will then be 2 1/2 years (if it's 1 1/2 year now). sorry not nagging, just reflecting upon it. the amount of details I've read about the last couple of days just makes me dying for the game. sorry not kissing ass, still just reflecting

So all this talk of the open beta being released soon is just... crud? Or will it actually be released soon... As in, within december or early january... :san_angry:

Good things take time.

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Originally Posted by Dayve

So all this talk of the open beta being released soon is just... crud? Or will it actually be released soon... As in, within december or early january... :san_angry:

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By that criteria it will be released soon, yes.

Be patient guys, the longer we wait the better it will be !

oh I suddenly got the feeling of christmay joy :san_grin:

Lucky you... That feeling seems to be dead within me, not even EB has been able to revive it... OB please :san_angry:

oh I suddenly feel a urge to spam... with pictures or something... I've never been a spammer before, and I have never looked upon myself as someone who would spam. I don't even want to

any psychologists here?

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Originally Posted by Dayve

So all this talk of the open beta being released soon is just... crud? Or will it actually be released soon... As in, within december or early january... :san_angry:

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Tee hee mate. I asked the same thing roughly around May?, or there abouts. I got a cryptic answer back then also, which hinted at a few weeks.
Best thing you can do is expect it to not be released or completely forget about it, that way if/when it is released you will be pleasantly suprised.
Check the website every week or so. Dont delve to deeply, just skim the surface to browse for release hints that way it does not get annoying.
Plenty of other great games out there atm to keep us occupied. Treat EB as in development. If it gets released great, if not no biggie.

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Originally Posted by Spendios

Be patient guys, the longer we wait the better it will be !

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How untrue this can be...

Now I hate to be direct, and this is a nice forum, but I don't like to sugarcoat words, and the last time I brought this topic up (see below), I got a lame answer, so here is my take:

I don't think EB will ever be finished, I firmly believe they are tinkering and tinkering, and keep adding and deleting features, and have so far changed from the original concept, that the direction is unclear, thus the status is unknown. One person might report a week or two before the mod is released, then several months. How many features? Who knows, they don't seem to give clear answers, probably because the EB team simply doesn't know what is happening. Keep adding and tinkering... where they are going, what they are doing, nobody knows!

I expressed this feeling in this thread:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=57433

And of course, I got an indirect and vague answer...

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Originally Posted by Divinus Arma

It is an artist's gallery, where each piece alone is beautiful, but the artist views the totality of the gallery as the masterpiece. The whole is not dependant on the individual component, instead the individual component id unique in it's own respect. EB is a collection of many brilliant mini-mods all wrapped and packaged into one, with each mini-mod amazingly tied into the whole and made symbiotic with others where possible.

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...because the fact is, the guy who answered me doesn't know what is happening, because the entire EB team doesn't know.

While it is just a theory, I'd say believing what I said is easier to do than believing the EB team that EB will be out soon, since they have been saying that for just about, ever? And that just supports my theory of course. Further evidence can be shown also.

Think of EB as a direction, moving toward a realistic mod for RTW, but then realize you'll never reach the goal of realism, thus you can only move toward EB, you'll never actually get it.

Oh well.

I think many things you have writen could be true, btw I hope they can release the OB before the year finish. One person, who also made alone a mod as you, told me in similar ways about this matter.

If the year finish and OB continue unreleased I will began to think all things you had talking are the true :san_sad:

I am awaiting for the OB since april aprox. and many times I could read the OB release will be soon, very closest, or similars.

First the say us they could released the OB before the all factions previews will be finished

or inclusive later they say us before Barbarian Invasion release...

and later... before 1.5 and 1.6 patches

The Last new was we can a present by the christmas...

But the hope its the last thing you can lost and I continue believing I will have my christmas present: the best RomeTW mod we can imagine.

I am awaiting EB release to make a different multiplayer tournament with this mod for people who dislike as I the type of vanilla gameplay.

Simply put, the reason it took so long is because we had to start over, not because we "continue to tinker."

I have explained this, but I suppose it takes repetition to sink in. We have no very fast coding person either, which doesn't help.

I would be blunt as well, but I think the team members would not like it if I were.

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Originally Posted by khelvan

Simply put, the reason it took so long is because we had to start over, not because we "continue to tinker."

I have explained this, but I suppose it takes repetition to sink in. We have no very fast coding person either, which doesn't help.

I would be blunt as well, but I think the team members would not like it if I were.

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Khelvan
Im scared just from the scope of game mechanics that you want to change, the workload...
EB started at February 2003 IIRC its soon gonna be 3 years since then, holy mother of christ 3 years...
All my eager had burned out...I dont anticipate EB unfortunately Ive started to admire the record braking mod evelopment time and everyday that passes makes that record even stronger and unbeatable...
I dont believe that EB OB will be released, not before Spring 2006 at least, because of the complexity of the changes that lead to complex errors that make the game unplayable as I see...combine that with the whole finished product (youre not selling it...really youre not...) perfectionism its truly sad, like Thermopylae an impossible but glorious task...

Hellenes

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Originally Posted by fallen851

How untrue this can be...

Now I hate to be direct, and this is a nice forum, but I don't like to sugarcoat words, and the last time I brought this topic up (see below), I got a lame answer, so here is my take:

I don't think EB will ever be finished, I firmly believe they are tinkering and tinkering, and keep adding and deleting features, and have so far changed from the original concept, that the direction is unclear, thus the status is unknown. One person might report a week or two before the mod is released, then several months. How many features? Who knows, they don't seem to give clear answers, probably because the EB team simply doesn't know what is happening. Keep adding and tinkering... where they are going, what they are doing, nobody knows!

I expressed this feeling in this thread:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=57433

And of course, I got an indirect and vague answer...



...because the fact is, the guy who answered me doesn't know what is happening, because the entire EB team doesn't know.

While it is just a theory, I'd say believing what I said is easier to do than believing the EB team that EB will be out soon, since they have been saying that for just about, ever? And that just supports my theory of course. Further evidence can be shown also.

Think of EB as a direction, moving toward a realistic mod for RTW, but then realize you'll never reach the goal of realism, thus you can only move toward EB, you'll never actually get it.

Oh well.

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Whine whine whine.. ~:rolleyes:

Seriously dude, if you don't think the mod will ever be released why come over here in the first place?

They don't have to do this you know.. they're putting their time and effort in this mod so that we could enjoy a better, more accurate game.

If you're too impatient to wait for this mod then just move along instead of criticizing the people who have put I dunno how many hours of hard work into this mod while you're not contributing anything yourself.

I for one am quite happy to wait until they have an OB that's fit for public release. I'd rather wait a little longer and have a decent OB instead of some buggy OB that CTDs all the time.

Keep up the good work guys and don't let the whiners get you down. There are still people around here that do appreciate the time and effort you're putting in this mod. :bow:

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Originally Posted by GMT

Whine whine whine.. ~:rolleyes:

Seriously dude, if you don't think the mod will ever be released why come over here in the first place?

They don't have to do this you know.. they're putting their time and effort in this mod so that we could enjoy a better, more accurate game.

If you're too impatient to wait for this mod then just move along instead of criticizing the people who have put I dunno how many hours of hard work into this mod while you're not contributing anything yourself.

I for one am quite happy to wait until they have an OB that's fit for public release. I'd rather wait a little longer and have a decent OB instead of some buggy OB that CTDs all the time.

Keep up the good work guys and don't let the whiners get you down. There are still people around here that do appreciate the time and effort you're putting in this mod. :bow:

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Hear, hear!! :yes: ~:cheers: ~:thumb:

O Stratigos :bow:

Let's keep things civil here, fallen851 did that too.

I do not agree with his theory, however. EB has not claimed it will be soon for a long time, instead they claimed it might be done in months. That it turned out to take longer than they hoped is not their fault.

Incidentally, Khelvan did say that they are trying to get the last CTD's out before releasing the OB, so that does suggest a plan, and not an "adding and removing of features".

That said, I'll be very relieved if the OB finally arrives. If they don't hurry up, I might be too busy again to try it out... ~:(

It has become clear that, with the decimation of our internal testers, and the complete failure of our earlier closed beta test culminating with the leakage of an alpha version of EB, that we're just not going to be able to test this ourselves. So you are going to see a buggy OB, there is no way to get around that.

Anyway, as to a plan, we have always had one, and always knew where we were going. It just took us a very long time to get there. It has nothing to do with making things better, and everything to do with how long it took us to create our core functions again, such as unit recruitment, and governments, based on the discovery of a hard-coded limit that caused us to have to scrap our first plan.

So I guess, in a sense, we didn't have a plan for months. Or rather, our initial plan was rendered unusable, so we had to create a new one, and for several of our core systems we could not find a solution for months. So while unit work went on, and scripting and trait work went on, and other work ancillary to the development of things like our economy and unit recruitment continued to go on and be improved, our core systems weren't in place.

Basically we had units being made that could only be put in the vanilla economy, and an expectation of governments limiting certain things which just didn't work for us. We had a new mod that had nice new names and units, but played much like vanilla. That didn't work for us.

So, we finally found a solution that gave us most of the features we wanted out of the government system, and since the time I said we had found that solution we have been working on implementation.

Basically, we should have been at this point way back when we posted our "Announcing: Europa Barbarorum" message. I think I posted that in April. It should have been about a month to two months and then we were going to open beta. Except, we ran into a problem that caused us to toss out our entire plan for our core systems. Everything since then has been a rebuilding of those systems.

I don't know why I'm explaining this to you guys again. I mean, honestly, I have said it before - I have explained the process, I have explained our problems. I have told everyone why it has taken so long.

When I say "we've had to start over," does that just not make a difference to you guys? Do some of you just assume then that I am lying to your faces? There is no other explanation for the behavior here. I give you updates on exactly what is happening, without giving any dates out. Why would I give a date we might not be able to meet? My mistake was hinting when the open beta might be; I should have known we would run into a problem.

Unfortunately, none of us could have imagined just how devastating that problem was. Our whole idea for how the mod was going to play was gone. Just destroyed in an instant. Do you know what that did to our morale? To our plans, our dream for this mod?

No, you couldn't possibly know that, which is why you can't possibly understand how reading some of these comments can be so hurtful for those of us who have spent so much time working on things, for free, that will bring you enjoyment.

I'll add that it *looks* like some of the lingering problems that we do have might be able to be solved by the 1.3 and then 1.5 builds. The ability to mess around with the cultures gives me more hope that some of the things that bug me (and that we have to use intricate scripting to get around) still might be totally wiped away once we get around to porting it (which looks quite likely but is not 100% certain).

Hello,
I've been checking up on this mod every few days, never said anything. I love playing mods for RTW - played just about every available ones :san_smiley: and your mod sounds great. I know nothing about moding though, in fact I dont even know what an open beta version of something is... maybe someone could explain. But your mod sounds great and I do hope you take your time in its creation and resist the urge to produce it quickly for those who perfer fast food to fine dining. :san_cheesy:

Lets ban all the whiners.

It's not a good thing to do, it's not a "democratic" thing to do, but frankly I don't care. At this point, it's turned into a waste of time responding to posts and topics that all they do is add more tension and just gets everyone wired up.

Note: I don't expect this to be taken seriously.

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Originally Posted by jedispongee

Lets ban all the whiners.

It's not a good thing to do, it's not a "democratic" thing to do, but frankly I don't care. At this point, it's turned into a waste of time responding to posts and topics that all they do is add more tension and just gets everyone wired up.

Note: I don't expect this to be taken seriously.

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You are whining about whiners so you have to be banned...:san_grin:

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Originally Posted by jedispongee

Lets ban all the whiners.

It's not a good thing to do, it's not a "democratic" thing to do, but frankly I don't care. At this point, it's turned into a waste of time responding to posts and topics that all they do is add more tension and just gets everyone wired up.

Note: I don't expect this to be taken seriously.

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Originally Posted by Spendios

You are whining about whiners so you have to be banned...:san_grin:

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*Laughs*

Khlevan, this is the first time you told all details in a clear manner. Infos about your problems were before either to short or written in secret manner.
(I know nothing about those in April, though)

I hope now some of those whining guys will see the programming is not just that easy as making new skins and that "more visibe" stuff, what is the only problem for most of the mod makers.

It seems that you made the mod to the point when everybody stops and realised that in fact you "dyed the hair" instead of intended "chirugical changes" so you had to stop and start again.

And then again.

THANKS for all the work you put in the mod for ALL EB team!!!

:bow: :bow: :bow:

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It seems that you made the mod to the point when everybody stops and realised that in fact you "dyed the hair" instead of intended "chirugical changes" so you had to stop and start again.

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More like performing a heart transplant operation and noticing that the heart that was we placed in there was that of a blue whale, not a man. It was an organ that worked, but didn't fit inside the ribs.

Now, we have one of these babes in place:
https://img453.imageshack.us/img453/...corhand0ma.jpg

Edit: modified it a bit to better reflect the situation.

I can't help but feel that the smiley used by O'ETAIROS is vaguely racist...

Anyway, I understand how you feel Khelvan. We in Troy Total War ran into a pretty similar problem. We announced that we were going to have 1.0 out by Christmas, and then our main scripter vanished, taking a good deal of good work with him. Since then we've had a real struggle getting things back on track, and the future is looking distinctly cloudier for us. Though I'm still confident that we'll finish it. Anyway, I appreciate your situation and laud you for your perseverance and hard work.

I am extremey worried about TTW.

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Originally Posted by Zenith Darksea

I can't help but feel that the smiley used by O'ETAIROS is vaguely racist...

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:san_rolleyes: why does it feel like I'm at work when I'm at home :san_cry:

I don't know, why does it?

Khelvan, I appreciate the fact that you continue to take the time to explain the state of affairs to the fans. To me, what you've described has been obvious for quite some time due to your consistently informative posts, and I find it hard to believe that anyone who has spent even a minimum of time here can miss this; laziness when it comes to actually looking for the answer, I'd wager.

Any chance you could make a sticky with your explanation post, containing a clear warning that any questions asked henceforth of which the answers are in the sticky will be deleted? After that you could simply edit any posts asking about why it's taking so long to redirect to said sticky. I can imagine the team gets fed up of such posts, as do the people looking forward to EB who actually make the effort to read your posts to find out what's causing the delay.

Anyway, I'm still looking forward to EB and wish you the best of luck sorting out the problems, and at your own pace.