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Is it too late to suggest that before a siege the occupiers be given the option of withdrawing before a siege takes place thus saving the garrison and the attackers many men? I think this was the done thing in those days and it would be good for the game especially when short of troops in the area being attacked.
Yours,
basics.
I like that idea (if I understand you correctly). I think you mean that the army can evacuate from a settlement if an atttacker attacks henceforth giving it to them. However I think that could be too simple. If the enemy is surrounding them where can they run? Mabye they could only do that if you have somebody with plenty of influence (lets say 6+) who could convince the enemy general that letting the army escape would be a very could idea. Mabye it could also help if the general is a bit selfless and hates battles so he will let them go to avoid having one.Quote:
Originally Posted by basics
I am afraid that's hardcoded. Can't be done.Quote:
Originally Posted by basics
Salve, EB fans.. this is my first post even though Ive lingered on these forums and been a fan of EB from the start.. I'm a US soldier in Afghanistan so I dont get a chance to check up that often since Ive been over here nearly a year now, but now I have the chance, and I'm very impressed so far, and love EB and everything it stands for being a Classical History graduate myself ;)
Here's my humble suggestions, and I apologize if theyve been brought up before:
Ancilliaries for each Roman legion. (I Legio, II Legio, etc)?
How about Consuls get Lictors as Ancilliaries?
Would it be possible to have a pair of generals be named Dictator and Magister Equitium? perhaps they get it for only 2 turns (6 months) and recieve broad influence and command bonuses, and afterwards have a "former dictator" title?
I also hope that some of the great work Prometheus has done with the strat map may be included or something similar for ports, cities, diplomats, ships, etc.
Love the new resources map by the way, stellar work as always!
Being in a country like this gives me a fresh look at classical history and causes me to appreciate it more--the people here still live much like they did 2000 years ago, and the landscape is breathtaking. I actually live in a castle built by soldiers of Alexandros Magnos, (or the ruins of such, actually)!
I like the idea of having a dictator office in state. This could perhaps only occur if the state has a crisis (like if Epeiros over runs Italy and Rome is down to only one pathetic province). Also at this time all senate offices could sort of close (meaning that they remain open, but offer less effective bonus')and perhaps if the dictator is powerfull enough he could declare himself a sole ruler (some dictators did that). Perhaps if this happened it could trigger a civil war between the dictator and the senate and perhaps parts of the republic that support the senate could turn rebel however if down to one province then they are stuck with a sole ruler if the dictator decides to call himself that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaknafien
you may want to change some charge distance and fire delay stats (i may be mis-stating these values). Darth put up some research he's done very recently on the way these stats affect AI behavior, and it sounds very interesting.
he's got a patch up to test the changes, but I don't have Darthmod 8 (out of room on my pc, what with all the installs I already have), so I haven't tested it. but if it works properly, sounds like some helpful changes.
I think the othe guy meant if they felt threatened... i.e. when a full army of pontic soldiers enters into the land surrounding sinope and the ratio is like 3 to 1 or greater, it rebels to the greeks because it knows it will lose if it fightsQuote:
Originally Posted by Kull
or some such
I think a huge army strength difference should be the factor that causes the cities to revert to the koinen hellenon
I would love it if it could happen but I am afraid it will be hardcoded.Quote:
Originally Posted by soibean
Hi EB team!
I'm a newbie here and maybe my questions were already answered to someone else. Since i haven't found (wasn't answered in TW center forums) answers to my questions I decided to post them here also.
I installed your mod recently and I really like what you have created (am a realism freak ). Your ideas are realy outstanding and add unimaginary better gameplay experience to the original game. Everything is just perfect (except unfinished icons for buildings and units, missing descriptions, ect. ofcourse) until you start battle. AI is very lame (archers attacking meele instead of firing bows, ...). Will this problem be adressed in 0.8? Since I read that you don't want to add any other mini mod (everything made solely by your team) I'm not shure if you will consider my suggestion: why not try to implement DarthVaders/Sinuhets formations or whatever exists to properly adress this?
It would spare developing team a lot of precious time I believe and would in process enable more effort to be put on finishing 0.8 version.
Can you maybe update me if you intend to adress "lame AI in battle" problem or it is going to be left out as it is in version 1.5?
Another question is about system requirements for your mod. Since you have implemented so much your mod runs very very slow on weaker PC's (it's very demanding). This is kind'a bad info for us who posses low end computers and can't afford to buy new hardware upgrades (or new computer). Yesterday I stumbled across new mod called Legion III made by modder GAY. This mod has great graphics and runs very smood also on weaker PC's.He is saying that he uses version 1.9 derrived from alexander. I don't know what this is all about but it would maybe be an interesting info for you to consider in future. You will find mentioned mod in mod threat forum.
I thank you in advance for your answers and also for all the hard work you put in the mod so that we can enjoy ourselves playing the game.
I really must encourage you to continue your amazing work - when finished it will probably be my favourite mod. :2thumbsup:
We are investigating Darth's latest discoveries about foot archers. Can't say it will be implemented in 0.8 (if ever) but we'll do our best.
It's not as simple as transferring somebody elses stats to our mod, the stats of our units are carefully calculated and constructed, so before we do anything new with them we have to recalculate them, see which units to change and which not (for example, some of our "archer" units might actually prefer melee combat, historically) implement into internal tests, do internal testings, etc. etc. A lot of work, but I can assure you we keep track of things in the modding community as well as anyone :)
It would probably not need asressing by the team anyway because RTW 1.5 is (supposed) to improve the AI drastically or at least this is what the CA claim. One site which you can download it from (I don't remember which) says that the AI now trys more flanking moves and also will have more sence as in not sending rubbish units (like archers) into melee.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hister
Yeah, but it doesn`t compare to Darth`s work.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
It`s totally different, another dimension entirely.
Hope you get to implement his work on this mod.
That is true, yes. 1.5 AI is way smarter than 1.2, although that still doesn't mean it's smart :) It will make better use of cavalry and perform some more complicated manouvres than you may be used to. Also, don't forget we do put some decent work into stuff like formations and unit stats on our own, so it's not like nothing has changed in the way battles are fought since vanilla :)
finally!Quote:
Originally Posted by Krusader
I don't know if this is written down somewhere else, but I figured it'd be better for me to ask here rather than start another topic. Will there still be peasant/barracks standing in for units or buildings or all the cards complete? I think that would go a long way towards destroyed EB's (undeserved) reputation as an unbearable incomplete or "buggy" game.
Getting as many pics and descriptions in as possible is one of the reasons 0.8 is delayed so much. I'm not sure if we can get -all- of them, but there will be definitely less "peasants" and "barracks" on the map.
Don't forget that our final aim is to have somewhere about 500 (unit limit) new units, so that's a lot of "peasants" to replace :)
fixing them very quickly with patches will be much easier too if we stick to this -mod format. If there are problems with buildings or units lacking icons or cards, we can quickly fix them and put corrections up that aren't packed.
Hello frineds;
I think "Advisors images" for Pahlava need to be changed.You know that even those advisors images(Both in campaign and battle maps) in RTW:BI are not suitable and are not look like iranians (particularly parthians).
have you changed them ?Or do you have plan to change them?
Thank you EB team
-Kambiz
from what i know 0.8 will have new interface for Pahlava (so new advisors faces too), but im not sure if they got the interface for "eastern" or for "nomadic" factions... anyway both have their new advisors.
Ten words. It's a BETA so of course it is not finished!Quote:
Originally Posted by Imperator
but EB has a reputation as a buggy or extremely incomplete game. It is not buggy, .74 has no CTD's that haven't been addressed and isn't that incomplete. Sure certain factions have peasants instead of unit cards and whatnot, but it really is more complete than people admitQuote:
Ten words. It's a BETA so of course it is not finished!
I did a search and couldn't find anything of substance, so I appologize if this is mentioned somewhere else (you guys can just direct me there if it is).
Will the Iberians be beefed up in .8? I know they're not the most finished faction in EB, but will they have some more intimidating units at some point before 1.0? I'm playing as Casse (VH/H), and I know the Romani, Germans, and even the mainland Celts with their naked crackheads are not to be taken lightly.
The Iberians, however, aren't nearly as hard to fight as I thought they would be - I'm fighting both them and the Romani, and the Romani are, by far, the foe deserving the most attention...I made war on the Iberians simply to pay for the campaign over in Italy, and historically speaking, somebody would have to have a lot of nerve/power to take on a united Iberia.
(Of course, I've only had one major feild battle with them so far, so I could be eating my words in a couple game years...)
They are working a lot more on Iberians now. They probably aren't going to be as ready as the other factions in 0.8, but they will be there by 1.0 if not by 0.9.
:2thumbsup:
So there is going to be a 0.9 as well :shocked:!? So what will happen in 0.9. Will there be even more new units/buildings/faction/governments/traits or will it just be a more advanced version of 0.8. Also will 0.9 be on M2TW or will EB move to BI with emergant factions and rebellions. A little bit like RTR will do in 7.0?Quote:
Originally Posted by Teleklos Archelaou
I can't answer your questions about 0.9, but EB 1.0 will be on R:TW 1.5. Though there may come an unofficial EB-for-BI mod, the official version will stick to R:TW vanilla. Whether there will ever be an EB for M2:TW is an open question, but perhaps Ortus Romani will take that place. The OR team has several EB members, and Khelvan has suggested that the teams work together (I don't know if this cooperation got of the ground, though). EB won't implement R:TR's emergent faction system because fleshing out another twenty faction will be too much work.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
That's not really the reason. The reason is that having emergent factions would require getting rid of any of the existing ones. The faction limit is still the same, RTR is not really adding any new ones. We could have for example Baktria as emerging faction, but that would rid the players opportunity to play Baktria themselves, if I understand the BI system correctly.Quote:
EB won't implement R:TR's emergent faction system because fleshing out another twenty faction will be too much work.
Not all counterfactions in R:TR 7.0 will be emergent ones. For example Aedui and Averni will be each others counterfaction, but players can play either. Baktria will be a full fledged faction with the Saka as counterfaction IIRC, while the Seleucids' counter will be the Seleucid rebels. The Seleucid rebels won't be playable, as they are emergent.Quote:
Originally Posted by eadingas
How does that work, exactly? I haven't really played BI. For example, the Seleucid rebels, are they a separate faction, do they take up a faction slot? I understand they do, but maybe I'm wrong here... What are "counterfactions" if they're not emergent ones?
A batchfile that comes together with the faction of your choice, decides which faction uses the extra faction slot. For example, as Pontus you get Pergamon. You can also play as these counterfactions, unless it's unfeasable like the Seleucid pretenders.
Oh yeah, the batch file. I forgot about that. So it's not really a BI-thing. That batch method could be used for any version of RTW, really...
:idea2: Well, you guys asked for suggestions and I've got them for you.:idea2:
1. Should Baktria maybe start as a protectorate of Arche Seleukia? From what I've read of the history and when they came to power this would make more sense and would prevent them from overrunning Seleukia early on in the game. This would also justify giving them another province like Alexandropolis or something.
2. Islands. Only about a quarter of the islands in EB can be landed on. I would really appreciate it, and it shouldn't be too hard, if you would all the islands, or at least the ones larger than 1 square landable. Not only is this simply a cool feature but it has tactical uses. First of all, having watchtoers on your islands would allow you to see enemy ships approaching and having forts on islands close to the shore would help as I've found out that the more garrisoned forts you have throughout a province, or series of close provinces, the fewer rebels appear. This could also result in cool and characterful events like the AI sacking a fort or tower you built on an Island, or two AI factions fighting over a seemingly insignificant island, like malta, and also to Eleutheroi appearing on islands to represent emergent cities/nations.
3. I know the EB team has enough to think about already, but is there a possibility of making new faction specific intro videos in the future? If not 0.8 then perhaps .9 or 1.0? If someone would be kind enough to hand me a script and tell me how to make videos for the factions then I would gladly do so. I'm not too bad with accents and I could send the EB team what I made for criticism.
4. OK, this is the long one, so for those of you with short attention spans you might just want to skip this.
THOUGHTS ABOUT THE ROMANS
Most of this you most likely already have but I have to mention all of it in case in guessing I missed something that you don't have. Some of this could be used for other factions most likely but that is up to the EB team. I was just reading a book on Roman culture and society and I had a few thoughts.
Roman Ethinicity.
I believe that this should be divided into several sections that all affect the traits of a character based on the levels and ethnicity of the Romans historically.
Class 1 - Freedperson
- Freeperson
Class 2 - citizen
- non-citizen
Class 3 - Honestiores
- Humiliores
Class 4 - Patrician
- Patrician Senatores
- Equite/Equestrian
- Equite/Equestrian Senatores
- Plebeian
- Plebeian Nobiles
Class 5 -Latinae
- Latinae Romani
- Etruscan
- Samnite
- Greek(colonial descendant)
- Lucanian
- Messapian
- Sicilian
- Gaul(Northern Italy)
- Possibly others once Rome expands outside of Italy
Class 1 represents the status of the person or their parents concering slavery. Obviously most every family member would be a freeperson but it was possible for freedpersons(ex-slaves) or their offspring to rise in Roman society naturally or by adoption.
Class 2 represents whether a character was a Roman citizen or not. As with class 1 most every character would be a citizen but bribed characters would be immediately stated to be non-citizens and could only change that to citizenship through their deeds or time spent in Italy
Class 3 states whether they were in the upper or lower end of society. this division is usually seen as the difference between plebs and patricians but a Plebeian Nobiles(Like the Neaveue Riche in France) would be Honestiores(high end) and a poor Patrician could conceivably drop into the ranking of Humiliores(Low end). This end represented how they were treated by other Romans and what kind of punishments they were given for their crimes. As punishments for Honestiores would be less severe they would be more likely to develop vices than humiliores. But a characters status in this category could be altered conceivably by wealth.
Class 4 is the one that EB currently uses but it could be expanded. From the bottom up there are your normal Plebeians, your rich plebeians(Plebeians Nobiles) who are almost as powerful as Patricians/Equestrians, your equites, your equites senatores who are old equites that are no longer eligible for military service and now run for senatorial office(could be a trait gained by equites), the regular patricians who held jobs like lawers and judges and priests, and the Patrician senatores who are patricians that run for senatorial office. Also included here could be magistrates and their individual positions but that is more a matter of election than birth and age like the rest of these.
Class 5 deals with actual ethnicity. Listed above are just some examples of the many ethnicities to be found in Italy alone. I have not listed all of the possible ethnicities as I don't know them all. The three that would be the most common would be Latinae - regular latin people who are not from Rome-, Latinae Romani - latin people from Rome or surrounding farms-, and etruscan -having an ancient bloodline from such a noble and legendary people is something to be admired, or mistrusted-.
Buildings
Vacation Villas: The estates of Roman patricians who occasionally visited but for the most part left the estates care to tenants. As the owner(s) can buy up large sums of land for farming this can greatly increase the amount of useable farmland. As the same lords would be rich enough to hire workers or buy slaves then the farm output would be ensured. Game effect that this building increases farming output.
War Bonds: The only way I could think of representing this would be if it was a building. In times of great financial stress during war (like the Punic wars) the government would find itself short on funds and would ask the rich patricians in the city if they would loan money t the state that was promised to be payed off in increments. Game effect - Increases income somehow(I'm not a modder).
TRAITS
Historian/poet/playwright: many famous generals documented their own achievements or were simply interested in writing.
Farmowner/landowner/landlord: More likely to get rich or be an unwilling campaigner but would also increase farm production in the city their in.
Clients/Patrons: The character can both be a patron(meaning he has followers that will support him in political elections) and be a client(he follows a patron). This can happen because a character can have Plebeian clients and yet can be the client of a more powerful Patron. Being a patron would increase your chances of being elected to offices but being a client would lower them. Being a patron would also increase happiness as he could and would offer protection, legally or otherwise to locals. This could also lead to traits like has/is a rude/kind patron
Pater/Paterfamilias: Any Roman character that marries immediately becomes a pater meaning that he is the father head of the household. This oppens up other traits. Paterfamilias is given to any Roman character that has children/grandchildren and does not have a living father. This means that he has absolute power over his section of the family. I don't know what the game effect of this would be.
Family Related: I don't know what exactly the game effect of these would be but the name of each trait knid of implies an effect. Kind father/ Loves his children/ Tyranical father/ Loves his wife/ Kind husband/ Wife beater/ Lost his father, mother/ lost his child, wife, sister, brother/ had a stepmother/ had a kind or tyranical father/ Is an ungrateful son/ has an ungrateful son/ loves, detestes his brother,sister/ Has a child(happiness)/ infertile wife (unhappiness)/ spoils children/ disciplines children
Guardian: This means the character is the financial guardian of a nephew or niece or other relative due to being given this responsibility by that relatives father or paterfamilias upon their death.
Holds Dinners: Goes along with wealthy, increases chance of vices.
Eats well, poorly: based on class, also affects morale. If general eats well when the troops are starving they will not be happy, but if the general eats rations like the men they will take courage in his presence.
Diseases/illness/dysentery/asthma/broken bones: I think you guys have most of these. Just listing them.
Distrusts doctors: Lowers recovery rate, decreases fertility
Education(good/bad) - Studied abroad: education is self explanatory but studied abroad could give him different bonuses depending on where he studied, especially military bonuses against the faction he studied with if he studied in another country.
Magistrates:priest/judges/diplomats/military officers/senators/lawers - each of these professions offers different bonuses to those who have them, like diplomat increasing a character's influence.
Holds public contract: Means they are 'less likely' to get a senatorial position as the senate didn't allow its members to hold public contracts. Also increases wealth and reduces building time/cost in a settlement.
Gambler:Excessive/Doesn't - vices virtues affected- could increase or decrease wealth depending on his luck.
Frequents the Baths/ Doesn't bathe: First increases laziness and vices, second decreases influence. A balance is best.
Napkin Tief: An amusing trait. I read that because guests had to bring their own napkins to a dinner party, some guests would sneakily remove their 'friend's' napkins while they weren't looking and profit greatly from the event.
ANCILLIARIES
Persistent Nurses and Paedagogues: Nurses and Paedagogues were the female and male tutors, playmates and guardians of Roman children. Persistent guardians continued to follow their old charges around after they had grown up to ensure that they lived a good moral life. Decreases vices.
Doctor: I think you have this one, but just incase.
Undertaker: Don't know what this one could do.
Gladiator: Rich men bought gladiators to fight in the arena. May increase vices but may also decrease personal security.
Midwife: Increases fertility
Tutors: School teacher/private tutor/Rhetor(professor of rhetoric) - affects childs education
Farm and ranch slaves/Household slaves/mill slaves/ mine and factory slaves: most of these would be limited to settled governers except maybe household slaves and the rest would increase production in some way or another. But could also increase the cruelty and harsheness of the governor due to him mistreating slaves.
Aediles: I think you have this already. I believe there were different functions for aediles like selling captive slaves, etc...
Herald and Pantomime: Herald increases influence, pantomime, I don't know, just fun really.
Playwright: Much like the historian and poet ancilliaries.
Client: In relation to the Patron/client trait discussed above.
Disgusting Practices
Although it seems apalling to us the Romans (and Ptolemies) often wed their daughters at horrifyingly young ages. EB might want to lower the 'maturity' age of girls a little bit more to reflect this. It seems strange, but There are inscriptions of child brides being only !!!!7!!!!! years old. Oh the horror.
:laugh4: Well, thats that for now, I have some pictures of military units to put up in a question about skins and successor elephants but I'm having trouble with posting pictures for now so I'll leave that for later.:dizzy2:
Factions can not start as a protectorate in 1.2 and I doubt its changed in the 1.5 patch would be nice though :( But on this same subject would if be possible to give the Baktrain faction leader the satrap title until Baktria breaks away from Seleukia?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanit
As for the rest sorry Tanit but I'm on a 10 min break at work so I will have to read the rest of your post later looks good though!
We had to make islands unreachable because AI had a tendency to land full stack armies there just for the fun of it.
Obviously to guard against the terrible "Sea Rebels". The AI is not stupid, its just TOO smart.Quote:
Originally Posted by eadingas
So, can we expect counterfactions in EB 1.0? ~;)Quote:
Originally Posted by eadingas
@ Tanit
1. Bactria protectorate: I don't think this will work. A faction that becomes a protectorate will go docile, while Bactria should be actively trying to gain its independence.
2. Islands: again, it messes up the A.I.
3. Intro movies: sounds good. I wonder if the EB team is interested.
4. Roman ethnicities: I don't think this is really relevant: all family members are at least of the equestrian class, or else they wouldn't have leading positions in the administration. Nobility counted for a lot in those days.
Well, if the AI is improved in 1.5 then this would possibly occur less often. Also, there are a few islands still landable in the current game and the AI never lands on them. Besides, as long as they still had their fleet they could remove their armies from said islands when they wished, giving the player incentive to crush their fleet rather than ignore it. Perhaps at least the ones close to shore? :juggle2:Quote:
Originally Posted by eadingas
Well ahead of you on that one. They are in the works (planning stages at the moment and work won't start again until 0.8 gets out), I head up the group doing EB movies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ludens
Foot
Hey guys I just noticed something (I hope u guys did already) that needs to be fixed.
-I had Thorakitai Hoplitai, Thorakitai, and Thureophoroi running around and fighting until all 3 were Exausted. Then I stopped moving them so they can take a break..... BUT after 12 game minutes the Thorakitai Hoplitai were FRESH, but the Thorakitai and Thureophoroi were TIRED. :dizzy2: wtf???
-Apparantly the Thorakitai and Thureophoroi take much longer that the other units to catch thier breath. Is this going to be fixed in .8???? Or is there a Specific Reason for this???
In vanilla RTW the House of Julii had a character called Amulus Julius who was 23. He married a 4 year old! Everybody who I know who knows the game was shocked at how disgusting and strange this was! Perhaps as well as implimeting this in game they could also implimeting family members coming of age younger. Perhaps at twelve or at latest fourteen? Roman men would historically come of age between this period. Also perhaps give women a wider variety of faces. For example on one family tree all women had either one face (under 16) or another face (over sixteen) this would add personality to the women.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanit
Tanit they were brilliant suggestions. The EB team should demand you sign up for supplying such brilliant ideas which are possible to implement (unlike mine which change things which are hardcoded). I am almost jealous!
Great suggestions Tanit, I absolutely agree with you. Im all for a totally immersive gaming experience.
Following the Roman suggestions, what about some of these?
Traits:
Dictator --This man has been voted military Dictator of Rome. He will hold this office for 6 months (2 turns) All other magistrates imperiums have been suspended, and the Dictator commands the authority of two Consuls in one.
Magister Equitium--The Dictator's second in command and advisor, literally, "Master of Horse". The tradition that the Dictator would not ride a horse likely came from older, hopilte centered Roman warfare, and was partially suspended during the Second Punic War.
Former Dictator (influence bonus)
Former Magister Equitum (influence bonus)
Ancilliaries:
Lictor --Consuls were accompanied by 12 Lictors
Fasces --Axe men who accompanied the Consul, signifiying his power over life and death.
Named legion banners (I Legio II Legio, etc) or more detailed ( I Italica)
Buildings:
I totally agree with the pleasure villas, as these were more a status symbol than a vacation home in Roman politics.
Resources:
The Italian coast south of Rome should have oysters for Orata's famous oyster farms there. :2thumbsup:
Miscellaneous:
This is probably crazy and impossible in RTW, but it would be neat to have a researchable building in the MIC that was something along the lines of a professional Roman logistics network, and would slowly allow units to replenish their numbers when in garrison or stationed in forts over seasons, to account for 'new recuits' being sent to join the legions.
In addition, it would also be cool if there was attrition on units while in the field, moreso during winter campaigning, seiges, etc.
The coming of age for family members is hardcoded.
I expect that to be a joke, but can say, that I for one and I think others too will no way as hell start researching and collecting materials for 19-20 new factions with the depth and accuracy we have.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ludens
@Zaknafien:
Romans only elected dictators in times of great peril and need. If the Republic is going along smoothly, why give one guy all executive command?
If you read what I said earlier...Quote:
Originally Posted by Krusader
So only in a crisis should a dictator turn up to boss everybody about like if somebody overuns the republic or the Parthians are a problem to conquer e.c.t.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
And there was something I noticed when I first started playing vannila. The issue that spies can end up in a city but only tell you about what the garrison is like there, what buldings are there, the population and public order. This is an obvious thing that anybody could possibly do without even putting a spy in the settlement (although maybe it should be harder to find out about the garrison), but what a spy cannot do tell you anything useful. Perhaps a spy could end up getting himself in the goverment so that he can give you line of sight to the faction being spied and could also realese plans of miltary statragy and notify you of when they are going to attack you (or when they are not). Eventually they could (with enough subterferge) end up as a general of the enemy and lead enemy troops to take over the enemy's own faction. Of course this would need ALOT of subterferge, at least 6, to be able to do this well they should need at least 8 and to do this perfectly they would need 10. Of course this would be a risky buisness so if they were to get intrigrated into the goverment the chances of them being killed should go by at least 75%. This may have historically never happened, but it could have happened. For example the Adeiu never conqured the whole of Italy, but I did when I played them.
Also assasins should take a long time to kill their target. They would not just sneak past guards and stab the target in the neak. A clever killer would get themself trusted as the targets freind and then when the guards leave him alone with the target he takes the oppertunity to kill him. So perhaps the higher the subterferge the longer the killer will take to kill the target, but the chances of killing the target will be much higher. Also assasins should manage to kill the target and then get themselves killed as they escape.
Also a few trait suggestions for Romans:
Gladiator-This man is so obsessed with the blood and gore of the games that he even decides to take part, something that no true Roman patrician would ever do! Gladiator are simple criminals and common slaves! Of course his victims are either unarmed or have "toy" wepons. -4 Influence -2 to Personal Sercurity.
I got that idea from reading about Commodus been killed by the Pretorian Guard for his gladitorial and strange ways.
Distrust's his bodyguard-This man is terrified of being assasinated by his own bodyguard. So terrified that he tried to keep his guards away from him at all times. This foolish act opens him up for assasination from his true enemies. -2 to Personal Sercurity, -20% off the general's bodyguard size.
And a suggestion for an ancillary:
Power hungry bodyguard-This man has a power hungry bodyguard who would do almost anything to get this man's power for himself. -9 to Personal Sercurity and increases the chance of the general getting the "Distrusts his bodyguards" trait.
I hope that these ideas are possible to be implimented.
Thankyou
These ideas would be great if we were making our own game. Unfortunately, we're just doing a mod for a game somebody else did :)
These look fairly good but I don't know much about whether a general's bodyguard can be altered like that. Otherwise, great.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
I have just one point to make about that one. perhaps there could be an ancilliary that was called a power hungry bodyguard but IF the An. was as you described it then no self-respecting general would keep such a man, in fact such a man would be killed. Perhaps instead the Ancilliary would simply be power hungry in general and is actually leeching onto the general he is attached to trying to move up the political/military ladder. Basically the same effect but maybe only a -3 or -5 to personal security, not so drastic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
Spies and Assassins. Both need work but I think both are hardcoded so I'll wait for an EB memeber to define that before I make any suggestions.
Dictator and Magister Equitum As my esteemed colleagues, in the group known as "The EB fans", Zaknafien and Matthius Julius said, it would be great to see it in the game. A dictator can be declared in two ways, as an emergency in the state, or by a powerful general. Should the Romans lose a specified number/percentage of either generals or cities, preferably cities, but maybe both, or, should a consul or both consuls be killed before the elections, then a character with high command will be declared temporary dictator and another will be declared Magister Equitum. Option two, should a general be immensely successful, take a lot of provinces, defeat a lot of armies, etc.. and should he be old enough to have influence in Italy/Rome(about 50/60) and should he have previously held the position of consul, then he can declare himself dictator for life, which while it has its bonuses would also be well represented by causing a lot of unrest, caused both by the man holding the title and certain other generals. This would be because when he declared himself dictator for life all other faction members would get a trait that either said they support the dictator or they don't. Those that support him decrese unrest(law enforcers) While those that don't support him cause unrest and get a major decrease in cost to bribe(Rebel Romans). It would also be interesting if after a while the faction leader was capable of receiving the posittion Tribunis Plebeiis Imperator should he have previously held consul or dictator. This would represent the start of the emperors. Basically the character gets the same bonus as the Tribune of the Plebs and other bonuses for being the Imperator. This is what Augustus did and other Emperors continued to do. He said he was actually restoring the Republic and declared himself Imperator but legally took the position of Tribune of the Plebs in the government. He was in theory just an official, but in reality the (almost) absolute ruler of the Empire. This trait could be any of the important positions in the government from Tribune of the people up to Consul. All the emperors did this up until around the time of Constantine, they took a position in the government and the name Imperator. Different Emperors had different degrees of power in actuality as the senate and other governmental positions still had a fair bit of power and the election of officials stayed in the hands of the people for a long time. All these positions would be rare but if they just happened to turn up it would make the game immensely exciting!:2thumbsup:
unique building ideas: (more to follow)
The Ovile ("sheepfold")
One of the few structures that exist on the Campus Maritus, the Ovile is a compound filled with barriers and aisles, the kind used to pen livestock. This is where elections to the various Roman magistracies are held.The voters are herded down the aisles in separate blocks according to wealth and status. To vote for Tribunes, for instance, the voters would be divided according to tribe. Every vote had to be delivered in person at the Ovile, ensuring that only the most wealthy Romans abroad could afford the trip. The citizens assembled to vote in the same way their ancestors assembled to go to war. Just as in the days of the kings, a trumpet would be blown at daybreak to summon them to the Campus. A red flag would be flown from the Janiculum Hilly beyond the Tiber, signalling that no enemies could be seen. The citizens would then line up as though for battle, with the richest at the front and the poorest in the rear. So heavily weighted were the votes of the wealthy, that they usually served to decide the election before the poor had a chance to cast their ballots.
What about the trait "imperator", that is in the Res Gestai mod. Anbody in the imperial family gets the trait.
We already have the trait imperator, it just isn't passed by family.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roderick Ponce Von Fontlebottom
Foot
~:thumb:Quote:
Originally Posted by Foot
Can't wait!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
Owing to what Tanit said I'm going to change it slightly:Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanit
Power Hungry Manipulative Bodyguard: This man has a power hungry bodyguard who would do almost anything to get this man's power for himself. Normally in this case he would be killed, but this bodyguard is also a smooth talker and liar, this General has no idea what he is like. -5 to Personal Sercurity and increases the chance of the general getting the "Trusts his bodyguards" traits.
And a few more trait suggestions:
Trusts his bodyguard: This man puts his trust in his bodyguard in times of need. +1 Personal Sercurity
And then perhaps you could put some more in between traits that give +2 personal sercurity, another one +3 till you get to:
Adores his bodyguard: This man has an obsession with his bodyguard and every single man in it to the point of (at times) even having love affairs with his men. Of course this keeps him safe from his true enemies, but what about enemies in the bodyguard. +1 to personal sercurity +20% to bodyguard size.
The amount of sercurity is decreased in the last one because he trust his bodyguard too much.
And another one:
Distrust's his bodyguard-This man has not trust of his bodyguard. He has such a lack of trust that he keeps it away from him most of the time. This opens him for assassination by his true enemies. -2 to Personal Sercurity, -20% off the general's bodyguard size.
And then you could turn it into a trait line having a series of traits each one decreasing into personal sercurity till eventually
Terrified of his bodyguard: This man hates his bodyguard above all things and in terrified that they might turn on him to. He keeps them away from him at all times and only allows them near him in a battle. This of course opens him up to his true enemies. -4 personal sercurity, -50% to the general's bodyguard size.
And another one:
Fought with assassins: This man has fought with men trying to kill him. He was sucessful, but now he may put more trust in his bodyguard. Game effects: Increases the chance of the man getting the trusts his bodyguard trait or if he already has the trait the distrusts his bodyguard trait.
Another set:
Partially blind: This man cannot see very well. Of course he tries to hide it from the general public. -3 Command -2 Management -1 Personal Sercurity
Fully blind: This man cannot see a thing. Somebody could wave a large flag in front of his face and he would never even see it. Of course this has an immense effect on his life being unable to see. -6 Command -5 Management -3 Influence -2 Personal Sercurity
And finally:
Up the (racing teams name): The man supports this chariot (racing teams name) racing team. This mans love of one team makes those who support the other teams a bit shifty. +1 influence +3 to Unrest.
And some ancillaries (for Romans):
Charioteer-A charioteer is an expert in managing to control a weighty chariot around corners. He understand everything about them and he also can give lots of advice in how to stop them. +1 Command when fighting chariots.
And to join a general in Rome around 110BC:
Gaius Marius: Famous Roman military reformer who put the Roman army on a proffesional footing. His immense performances in battle and an understanding of his new military machine enable him to help a general command armies with immense skill. +3 Command.
Or perhaps Gaius Marius could be a character up for adoption/marriage around about 130BC-120BC. Perhaps whether they adopt Gaius or not could effect the Marius Reforms and when they happen. No adoption - a long time till reforms, an adoption or marrage reforms very soon! Although I wouln't recommnend that you tell anybody if you were to impliment that. It would make the game unfair.
Lovley idea Zaknafien. Hopefully your idea(s) can get worked in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaknafien
And I am going to celebrate because this is my 50th post!~:cheers:
Thankyou
Oh and something else:
So why don't you make your own game?!Quote:
Originally Posted by eadingas
Because we're amateur modders, not a game-making company :)
Yes I agree that you are, but from humble beginnings an mighty empire can grow. The EB Team could try to make a profesional game that contains everybody's brilliant ideas to create a Total War style game that is in no way associated with the CA. This would be easy with all of the EB teams immaginations. Eventually you could even undermine the CA and (if you get enough revenue to) buy them out so that you can change the Total War Series and make it to historical and gameplay perfection. One day the EB team could perhaps even contol the entire real time strat (or at least the ones that take place in the past) gaming industry. All of that power in EB's hands equals a perfect world of ideal gaming.Quote:
Originally Posted by eadingas
Of course this would probably never happen, but hey! It's a good idea and worth a try. A publisher with any sence would publish a game created by the EB team due to it's brilliant gameplay that completly make you feel like you were there and people would most certainly buy it. Sell them all off a £29.99 and soon you will all be millionares!
Hi!
Pardon my disturbance of the tread Only wanted to say that my great wish for EB is to have the city of THESSALONIKI included on the map:)
Sorry, but it can't happen. There are lots of greek cities we would like to include, but we don't have enough province/city slots. We thought about it, but Salonika isn't big enough yet at the game's start (272bc) and other cities elsewhere were more important. Don't feel bad - lots of important places can't be included either. But that's one that we didn't feel was very close esp. with Pella being nearby and the capital.
Who would actually code the game, and why would EB modders actually want to spend their lives doing this? Remember, modders are amateurs who do this in their spare time next to other jobs or studying. Starting a company and creating a new engine is way out of almost any mods league.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
Fair point :shame:.Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoffrey S
Well frankly, I wouldn't mind working for a gaming company if I could do what I do for EB... unfortunately there's not many companies willing to employ a guy who just researches stuff on the internet and comes up with weird ideas for others to implement ;)
I would employ you! Thing is I'm just odd :laugh4: and I'm not a big gaming boss so I can't.:no: :shame:Quote:
Originally Posted by eadingas
After watching "Rome" on BBC1 last night I though of some more trait (lines):
Poet for Romans (this was in vanilla, but I think that it should be negative for Romans): This man is a poet who resorts to writing epic poems and reciting them in public! Nothing a true Roman would ever do! It's modern equivalent would be a monarch becoming a pole dancer! And of course this act leaves him exposed for assassination too - theatres don't have great sercurity! -4 influence and -3 personal sercurity.
Obsessed by the Beauty of the Arts: This man loves the arts above all things and has an immense taste for great things of immense beauty. This "love" of this causes him to demand more decorative buildings which are ornate. The people love his fine taste for beuty. His treasury does not! -2 Management, +2 Influence, +20% to building build times, +20 to building cost.
A few in between traits and:
Derranged by Art: This man is obsessed with the arts. So obsessed that he would perhaps even burn down a city and rob the temples to rebuild it perfectly. However his obsession would not end there. He would even be insane enough to "tame" his enemies by standing in front of the enemy army and singing. The fool! -5 managment -1 influence +50% to building build time +100% to building cost.
If the man has low enough influence, is mad and has lost enough battles he get the trait:
Enemy of Rome: This man is so useless and insane the senate have decided to declare him an enemy of Rome. It is every citizen's duty to kill this man. -10 influence, -20 personal sercurity and -8 morale for all troops under his command. Game Effects: When a general gets this trait him and a few of his troops turn rebel.
Also perhaps you could add traits for most illness' that people may have suffered at this time. This could include deafness, loss of limbs, gangrene, paralisis and Leprosy.
On another topic - don't the BI barbarians have a full city tree (huge cities)? Would there be a way to make EB 'barbarians' have these?
I think barbarians in 1.5 can have the ability (through modding) to build level 4 and 5 cities.Quote:
Originally Posted by Orb
I would personally love to see it...but maybe make a sort of reform type thing. If they come into contact/conquer with enough Romans/Greeks they adapt a bit of the culture...making larger cities...Roman architects being employed to build aquaeducts etc etc.
I don't think they need a reform to have these level 4-5 cities, I'm fairly skeptical that the Greeks and Romans were the only ones who knew what a city was. The 'barbarians' were, ironically, better-bathed than the Romans (if I'm correct, which I might be)
At Matthius, many of those traits seem much too exaggerated in effect. EB has a nice system where traits combine to make up a character, rather than a character's entire stats being dominated by one trait.
Can't speak about the "barbarians," but at least during the principate every tiny roman backwater garrison and small town has had it's own bathhouse. I doubt the number of public bathes was surpassed by any culture since then.Quote:
Originally Posted by Orb
At least celts will have large lvl. 4 cities in 0.8, not sure about iberians and getai. Sweboz and nomads will still be limited to lvl. 3 cities.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orb
Ok lets get rid of that trait then. Mabye I was a little over the top with that one... So perhaps if all of the traits I ever suggested were to have a slightly less influence, management or command bonus/penalty then it would not be so extravagant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
Orb you are correct in saying that the Barbarians were better bathed. They washed with soap. Something that the Romans and Greeks never would use.
Can I just suggest that the Celts, the Germans and other Barbarians don't have the word "barbarian" in the culture name. It should be changed to something a little more like what they would call themselves. Don't ask me to give examples. I have no idea what they would historically call themselves!
What's a suitable pan-Eurasian equivalent?Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
I was thinking about the Carthaginians the other day and I had a couple of thoughts.
They would not call themselves Quarthadastim. I could be mistaken, but as Quarhadast (The true name of Carthage) meant 'new city' in Phoenician then Quarthadastim would be something like 'People of the new city' I don't know for sure, but I would like to know why EB wants them to call themselves that.
Phoenician colonies. It was mentioned on another thread that it should be possible for Carthaginians to recruit at least their militia citizen phalanx from any city with a Phoenician colony. After some research I discovered that this was, pretty much, true. The Phoenicians would colonize places and then the colonists, still being Carthaginian citizens, would, in times of need, form citizen armies much like those that fought invaders in North africa. Of course there was supposedly a difference between colonial citizens and homeland citizens though I couldn't find anywhere that said what the difference was. I suspect this difference would have had something to do with local influence. The ability to recruit these citizens after building a colony would help in areas where Carthage can't build any troops, like in Latium for example. It's really annoying in the campaign to capture Rome and then be unable to recruit a garrison.
Carthaginian naval reforms: The Carthaginians, at the outset of the Punic war had a large number of ships partially beause they contained very small complements of armed men(marines). Partway through the Punic war the Carthaginians began outfitting their fleet with more marines and more specifically the best pick of their most skilled mercenaries. In game this would be a normal reform with the Punic fleets starting out with fewer men than they have now and then after the reform their ship complement is brought up to what it is now.
Carthaginian land forces reforms: In addition to the reforms you already have. After Hannibal had fought several battles with the Romans his men began to use Roman equipment they had captured from the defeated enemy. They took armour and weapons from the Romans but not shields so that they would not be mistaken for the enemy. It would be cool to see Iberians, Liby-phoenicians, africans and Libyans armed with Roman weapons and armour.
Libyans: It is mentioned in the accounts of the invasion of North Africa by Agathocles of Syraceuse that he convinced the Libyans to join him and that these included Libyan chariots. It is also mentioned that the Libyans were charioteers in the same way as the Balearic Islanders were slingers, it was a natural passed on speciality of the locals. Agathocles' invasion of North Africa took place approximately thirty years before the game of EB starts. There would most likely still be local Libyan charioteers and also likely mercenaries as well. The Carthaginians didn't employ them in the Punic wars, but they were still there if a brilliant Carthaginian general had known how to use them, or if an invader had been able to rouse them against their Punic masters. Also, Libyan cavalry is suggested in Polybius' account of the first punic war and the Mercenaries war. In the Punic war there is an account were he mentions the cavalry of the Carthaginians going ahead of the army and then he says that the Libyans fell back to the main army, drawing the enemy in. In the Libyan/mercenaries war, it is mentioned that the rebels received infantry and cavalry from the Libyan cities that joined them.
Xanthippus: I must protest to the way Xanthippus was portrayed inEB 0.74. He didn't arrive in North Africa until at least eighteen years into the first Punic war, and that started ten years after the start of EB. That's 56 turns! Not that the Carthaginians couldn't have hired him sooner, but he certainely wouldn't be in Africa at te start of the game. Now I understand the limitations that CA has put on EB, so if none of suggestions are plausible than the EB team has done the best they can and I approve.
Suggestion #1: Xanthippus starts on a ship with some greek mercenaries (as it was said that he came over with Greek mercenaries hired by Carthage) on his way to North Africa. This one is probably not possible but if it is then it is a good option.
Suggestion #2: Xanthippus starts as a Carthaginian general in Greece with a transport awaiting him.
Suggestion #3: The most historically accurate, though not neccesarily possible. Xanthippus starts as an eleutheroi general in Greece with traits that make him easy to bribe and a Carthaginian diplomat right nearby.
Skiffs: During the account of one of the many times in the first Punic war that Carthage rebuilt her fleet it says that they outfitted triremes, quinqueremes, and the heaviest of their skiffs. I don't know exactly what a skiff is, but its just a thought for making the Carthaginian fleet more diverse.
According to the world's foremost Punic historian, the Carthaginians called themselves, alternately, Qarthadastim, Tsorim, and one other I can't recall at the moment.
RE: The Naval Reforms.
I'm not sure about this one. I don't doubt the historical accuracy of it, but consider what would happen if they had won most of the naval battles in the First Punic War. They most likely would not have reformed the navy. Perhaps the only way to truly represent this would be if they had lost several crushing naval defeats vs a nation with far superior infantry (Like the Romans). I personally am not sure if this is possible (I don't think it is).
I didn't think it was possible but I had to throw it out just in case.Quote:
Originally Posted by CountArach
After I wrote it and looked back at it, the name made a whole lot more sense then when I was writing it. Thanks for the source info Khelvan!:book: :2thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by khelvan
I know you guys say that you work in concert with other mods, and this has probably been asked elsewhere, but, Will EB be using some of the AI enhancing features that DarthMod used? This would be great as I currently find the AI sloppy and far too easy to beat. Even on VH/VH the biggest problem to face is simply the number of rebels popping up everywhere. I personally feel that when the difficulty level says hard, then the AI should be improved, rather than just giving them more randomly appearing units.
so, just who is the world's foremost pre-Roman Punic historian?Quote:
Originally Posted by khelvan
Slightly off topic, Xanthippus turned up in Age of Empires (the first one) if you could find him in the First Punic War, the battle of Tunis (I don't know if that battle really happened as I have never heard of it). He had a reasonably Greek army with lots of Phalaxes, two Catapults and a couple of Cataphracts. Now I know who he really was. Yes!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanit
Anyway back on topic he could turn up like this:
The Script at the games start causes a eleutheroi general and a large army of Greek mercenaries turn up near Karthage between 10 - 18 years after a major war has begun and major defeats and victories have started showing up. Then when he appears the scripts causes a box/advisor to pop up telling you "A General can be Hired". This box will tell you that a General named Xanthippus is willing to be hired by you for lets say 30,000. It could give historical infomation about him his armies and what Carthage used him for. Then it could give two options Yes hire him, No don't hire him. If you don't hire him he goes of the be hired by somebody else on a rebel navy. If you say yes his army joins you. Brilliant solution!
I agree with all of the above, but I wish to suggest that the Romans have naval reforms too. The Romans, had almost no sea power at the games start and had no very good idea how to build ships. A reform should occur after Rome has started a war with a naval faction. Also I think ships sinking by storm should occur much more often. During the Punic Wars Rome lost most of it's fleet to a terrable storm and there were several more historical reports of bad weather on the seas. I also think that if you go out onto the West Coast of Iberia or Gaul you should sink, almost guarenteed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanit
Dr. Charles Krahmalkov.Quote:
Originally Posted by paullus
Probably suggested before, but, could you enable multiple temples of various gods in a settlement, like RTR does? The bonuses each temple gives probably should be altered in order not to make the overall result overpowering, but still it seems not logical that a power would build only one temple type per settlement.
A lot of people have mentioned the unbalancing effect of massed elite units, particularly those produced by the AI. I was wondering whether the most useful way to limit production of these units, unbalanced when in large quantities, might just be to increase the training time substantially. After all, one would expect elite units to be much better trained, and accumulate training, equipping and rearing time ought to be factored into production time. 3-4 turns for lower order uniques, 4-6 for higher order. After all, it's not like the king's elite guard can be replaced every year in seven different cities all at once. This might also help balance out roman armies: 1 year for hastati, 2 years for principes, 3-5 years for triarii.
A small suggestion for a Roman Trait for spies that spend a turn in Britain or who are trained in Britain or who are hired (if possible) as spy mercenaries in Britain (if controlled by Rome) after the Imperial Reforms:
Areani:
This spy is a member of the secret Roman Imperial British spy network. The Areani were agents in the Roman Imperial army stationed in Britain. They served as both scouts for the legions and as undercover agents spying on the enemies of Rome. Many of them were mercenaries. They were eventually disbanded after they joined the rebels in "The Great Conspiracy" of 367AD.
Game Effects: As this man is with other spies in a unit he learns many new things from them. This increases this spy's chances of getting traits that increase his subterferge and/or line of sight.
That's Great!!!!:laugh4: Let's hear it for great old school games!!!:laugh4:Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
Is that possible? If so it would be awesome.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius
I agree, but I think that the EB team once said that storms and their effects couldn't really be modded. I could be mistaken here.:juggle2:Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthius Julius