I seriously need some advice.

Thing is, the guy my sister married is a complete faillure and just about every way, and I don't like the way he is treating my mother, she borrowed him money to buy something and he doesn't repay, each month it's the same bull. He's from the old money, poor as hell nowadays but all too fimiliar with the haute cuisine, all the manners, all the dedain for the people that 'aren't their people' or just about everything that absolutily disgusts me. Now I gently urged him to pay my mom back her money because she feels betrayed and is actually starting to grow pretty annoyed herselve without actually saying it, but there is something wrong, I guess we are there to serve him, I am not absolutily blind and this guy is bad news. I have never been very subtle, a kick in the face says more then a thousand words but I don't want to lose my sister, my sister is pregnant, just a few weeks till the hatch. I have a really bad feeling about this and I have no idea what to do. I want to talk some sense into him but I have somewhat of an aggresive nature I know I am going to hurt him the second he says something I don't like I have never been able to control that. That would mean my sister would be pretty pissed at me, and my mother who is still trying to like him. But it is what it is and this guy is it I think. Harm my family in any way and I tear you apart but that is pretty hard when someone is already in.

Talk to your sister first, and tell her what's going on. Make sure you don't seem like you're accusing her of anything. If she cares about her family, she'll listen.

After you get a positive sign from your sister (maybe she can even help you talk to him), then talk to him. In private (not on the phone - this way he can't hang up), not in front of your family (except maybe your sister, if she agrees with you), state your problem. Lay it all out to him.

edit, no no good idea

You could encourage your mother to put some pressure on him or tell your sister of his less charming qualities, but that's about it. I don't think your mother or your sister would appreciate it if you decided to talks some sense into the guy on your own accord.

Is your sister happy with him?

I agree with part one of EMFM's advice. Work it through your sister. If he borrowed money, she should hold some responsibility to make sure it gets paided back.

Given your distain for your brother-in-law and "over protective" nature, I'd try to find another family member to do the talking to him IF you don't get anywhere with your sister. You're love and concern for your sister tells me you should take every step possible to avoid alienating her.

Good luck. I hope it works out for everyone.

edit, that isn't a good idea either

@Andres, yeah she is.

Well, I'll assume your sister is happy with him (they are just married, right?).

Just tell your sister that it bothers you a bit that they (yep, "they". They are married now, his problem is her problem and vice versa) don't pay your mother back. Don't tell her yet about your personal feelings for your brother in law (leave that when things get really, really nasty, i.e. they are going to divorce or he treats her really bad. As long as it doesn't come to that, the best you can do is swallow your pride and don't mention that you don't like the guy.). Just let her know that if there's any problem, you will be there for her. Make sure you tell her that you love her and that she can always count on you. End the conversation with something pleasant, talk about the baby she's going to have soon.

You can also try to calm down your mother. Tell her they will probably pay her back. And if they don't, well, maybe she can just drop it (and never ever borrow them money again off course and certainly don't give him money in the near future)? It might not be the most pleasant solution, but maybe it's the best one there is to keep the peace in the family.

And a word of advice: don't borrow your children or children in law money. Give them money or don't give them anything at all, but never borrow them money.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Andres

Well, I'll assume your sister is happy with him (they are just married, right?).

Just tell your sister that it bothers you a bit that they (yep, "they". They are married now, his problem is her problem and vice versa) don't pay your mother back. Don't tell her yet about your personal feelings for your brother in law (leave that when things get really, really nasty, i.e. they are going to divorce or he treats her really bad. As long as it doesn't come to that, the best you can do is swallow your pride and don't mention that you don't like the guy.). Just let her know that if there's any problem, you will be there for her. Make sure you tell her that you love her and that she can always count on you. End the conversation with something pleasant, talk about the baby she's going to have soon.

You can also try to calm down your mother. Tell her they will probably pay her back. And if they don't, well, maybe she can just drop it (and never ever borrow them money again off course and certainly don't give him money in the near future)? It might not be the most pleasant solution, but maybe it's the best one there is to keep the peace in the family.

And a word of advice: don't borrow your children or children in law money. Give them money or don't give them anything at all, but never borrow them money.

---

Wise words. :bow:

Oh gah close it already. Bad day.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fragony

Oh gah close it already. Bad day.

---

Apparently bad advice too. :shame:

Where were you before they were married?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fragony

He's from the old money, poor as hell nowadays but all too fimiliar with the haute cuisine, all the manners, all the dedain for the people that 'aren't their people'

---

Quote:

---

The money lending is just one out of the many, I am from a well of family and the ease of which it is assumed there is enough is simply disgusting.

---

Old money, monetarely present or not, is still valued higher than new money. Has been since time immemorial. Marriages between the two are quite mutually beneficial. The old money can replenish it's withered fortune, and the new money can buy its way into ancient respectability.* I think your sister's is marriage number 68925536621 of this kind in Europe. Did they, perchance, seek each other out for this, aware of it or not? If so, then why interfere? Even if not so, why interfere with your sisters choice anyway?

I suggest that after the wedding, if only for your own peace of mind, you invite him to a bar one day. Tell him, that, since he is married to your sister and is now family, it's time the two of you spend some quality time together, to get to know each other. Get drunk together, take a stroll afterwards, and then beat the crap out of him in an alley. And say that such is the way your family treats those who disrespect your mother and that it will all be as nothing compared to what you'll do to him if he ever even thinks about mistreating your sister or mother again.

* All of which reminds me of the 17th century play 'Le Bourgeois Gentilhomme' by Molière. Here is a link to an English version, posted, not out of any expectation that any of you will ever read it, but because all this reminds me that I should never pass up on the opportunity to discretely show that Louis is of cultivated old stock himself.
The play, a comedy, is about a rich merchant family, wealthy but coarse and uncultivated, and an impoverished, parasitic but nobleman 'friend', Dorante. Did your sister found herself a Dorante, I wonder?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Andres

Well, I'll assume your sister is happy with him (they are just married, right?).

Just tell your sister that it bothers you a bit that they (yep, "they". They are married now, his problem is her problem and vice versa) don't pay your mother back. Don't tell her yet about your personal feelings for your brother in law (leave that when things get really, really nasty, i.e. they are going to divorce or he treats her really bad. As long as it doesn't come to that, the best you can do is swallow your pride and don't mention that you don't like the guy.). Just let her know that if there's any problem, you will be there for her. Make sure you tell her that you love her and that she can always count on you. End the conversation with something pleasant, talk about the baby she's going to have soon.

You can also try to calm down your mother. Tell her they will probably pay her back. And if they don't, well, maybe she can just drop it (and never ever borrow them money again off course and certainly don't give him money in the near future)? It might not be the most pleasant solution, but maybe it's the best one there is to keep the peace in the family.

And a word of advice: don't borrow your children or children in law money. Give them money or don't give them anything at all, but never borrow them money.

---

Good Advice! Fragony, as long as your sister is happy it is very important to keep the peace.

I'm reminded of that line by Kevin Spacey in "Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil".....

"They may look down on me for being Nouveau Riche, but it's the Riche part that counts".

I understand what Fragony's saying. But Fragony, focus on the money. Don't make it about your feelings for this moocher. You haven't mentioned a 'father', so I'm guessing your mother is on her own. Explain to your in-law and your sister that your mother needs that money to get by, and if they can't repay it, they should at least start making payments towards the amount. If they're not willing to do that, they're not welcome to come around the rest of the family.

And if he gives you any lip, clean his clock. Nothing wakes aristocrats up to the merits of egalitarianism quicker then having their asses kicked.

I think you're screwed. If he's a deadbeat - he's a deadbeat. Nothing you can do about it except learn to deal with it. You just have to differentiate between your sister and him. Be nice to her, be useless with him.

As for pounding him; you can't lay a hand on him as long as he doesn't lay a hand on anyone in your family first. You might win the battle but you'd lose the war.

Tell your sister that you hate the guy, but still be nice to him and that way you'll be the good guy if anything happens in future.

Start railing on his face. Ditch your sis if she takes his side. Tell your mom to make you a new sister.

I don't care what my siblings do. It's their life. They can screw themselves if they insist. I give advice, then if they don't listen, they can't complain to me.

In fact, if they make decisions that I find stupid or abhorrent, I don't speak to them until they correct it.

Blood means very little - protect them and make bonds, but the bonds and similarities are key - if the siblings are retarded and destructive, we don't have much in common and I am not as close to them as I am to my actual friends.

I'd die for my brothers and sisters, but they are entirely responsible for their own lives. This understanding has kept them from making more serious mistakes to this point.

Haven't you freaks legalized murder yet? Murder is the other option. It's only wrong if someone catches you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Beirut

I think you're screwed. If he's a deadbeat - he's a deadbeat. Nothing you can do about it except learn to deal with it. You just have to differentiate between your sister and him. Be nice to her, be useless with him.

As for pounding him; you can't lay a hand on him as long as he doesn't lay a hand on anyone in your family first. You might win the battle but you'd lose the war.

---

Aye there merci that's what I thought.

Hire some Italians to "Take him for a ride" if you get my drift.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wakizashi

Hire some Italians to "Take him for a ride" if you get my drift.

---

Regarding the fact that he's a Dutchie, Turks/Kurds would be more available and willing to offer that ride.

On a serious note, I know it is "easy to the tongue"[*] but keeping cool while your sister is happy with her man seems the ultimate must for the time being. If your sis gets sick of him in a further time due to some reason, that's when you'd have a full hand of aces. Trust me, the kickbutting will be orgasmic at that time.

Fondest wishes,

LEN "Orange Wolf" Boss

:smoking:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[*] : Another stupid Turkish saying implying that it is quite easy to mention it rather than actually doing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Beirut

I think you're screwed. If he's a deadbeat - he's a deadbeat. Nothing you can do about it except learn to deal with it. You just have to differentiate between your sister and him. Be nice to her, be useless with him.

As for pounding him; you can't lay a hand on him as long as he doesn't lay a hand on anyone in your family first. You might win the battle but you'd lose the war.

---

Wise words.

I've seen some acrimony in my own family, and the moral is that you should never act in ways that alienate the ones you love, even if you have to suffer the presence and capers of Mr Bad News. Cause if he is bad news, he will thrive on a row between your sister on the one hand and you and your mother on the other. Your sister will be hurt, you will be frustrated and he will feel vindicated.

Honest, some people think that's what life is about. Prove them wrong. Of course that is difficult, but if you love your sister you must suppress your instinct and not lash out the way you'd like to. That's what sets love apart from convenience.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LeftEyeNine

Regarding the fact that he's a Dutchie, Turks/Kurds would be more available and willing to offer that ride.

---

But nobody would suspect the Italians...:inquisitive:

Plus after he's "gone" She'll come crying back into your families loving embrace, and soon after find herself a better mate. Badda-Boom-Badda-Bing Like that. :laugh4:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wakizashi

But nobody would suspect the Italians...:inquisitive:

---

Nobody would dare coping with the Turkish/Kurdish ones. :smoking:

*stubs his cigarette on the lip of the unlucky Italian*

You may also suggest as your mother really needs her money, it might be a good idea for him to get a commercial loan to pay her back, then let the professional debt-collectors chase the repayments. It will take some of the stress outside the family, and might just help turn him round to face his responsibilities - which is well overdue by the sounds of it if he soon has a family to provide for :bow:

I also agree with Adrian - don't let this rip the rest of your family apart, don't force your sister to "take sides" - especially if the baby is your mother's first grandchild.

Nobility, eh?

Buy a guillotine and place it in your front yard. I hear it works on nobility like garlic to a vampire...

Seen some sensible words here, some less so. I certainly agree with those of Anders, Beirut, Don and Adrian. However, it's a tough situation and might not end well. Be prepared for that possibility, hard as that may seem.

I can only assume that you have been over this with close friends. If not, do so. Do take care of your mother, since the way you describe it it must also be a disappointment for her - perhaps treat her to a pleasant evening out or something of the sort.

I'm not convinced the .org is the best place for advise on matters like these - though if you must, I'd recommend PMing members whom you respect to at least structure your thoughts right now and filter out the less useful contributions of a public discussion.

And best of luck!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Beirut

I think you're screwed. If he's a deadbeat - he's a deadbeat. Nothing you can do about it except learn to deal with it. You just have to differentiate between your sister and him. Be nice to her, be useless with him.

As for pounding him; you can't lay a hand on him as long as he doesn't lay a hand on anyone in your family first. You might win the battle but you'd lose the war.

---

This is good advice.

You won't like mine though.

I assume that all the parties concerned are over the age of majority? Yes? In that case, mother, sister or whatever are adults and made desicions as adults. In a nutshell, it has nowt to do with you. I see where you're at emotionally but if it were me I'd wind me neck in and mind me own business. Let it be.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Beirut

I think you're screwed. If he's a deadbeat - he's a deadbeat. Nothing you can do about it except learn to deal with it. You just have to differentiate between your sister and him. Be nice to her, be useless with him.

As for pounding him; you can't lay a hand on him as long as he doesn't lay a hand on anyone in your family first. You might win the battle but you'd lose the war.

---

True be nice to her will help in the long run.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by InsaneApache

This is good advice.

You won't like mine though.

I assume that all the parties concerned are over the age of majority? Yes? In that case, mother, sister or whatever are adults and made desicions as adults. In a nutshell, it has nowt to do with you. I see where you're at emotionally but if it were me I'd wind me neck in and mind me own business. Let it be.

---

To add tell your Mom no more "loans". However, a grandchild is coming and she will want to be there and help and with a bum for a son-in-law money can't be trusted.
Buy supplies the baby needs and never give cash. That way she is there supporting her daughter and grandchild.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HoreTore

Nobility, eh?

Buy a guillotine and place it in your front yard. I hear it works on nobility like garlic to a vampire...

---

Nah no nobility but that doesn't mean a french shave wouldn't be a good idea sometimes. Ah well maybe I am overreacting I am always a bit prone to hysteria, but family is family. The guy is acting like a child when it doesn't go his way and that pisses me of he is 35 years old, sometimes I think he is mildly authistic.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fragony

The guy is acting like a child when it doesn't go his way and that pisses me of he is 35 years old, sometimes I think he is mildly authistic.

---

Sorry to be taking this a bit harder at you but isn't he whom your sister chose on her very own will ?

So, where do you think the problem starts ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LeftEyeNine

Sorry to be taking this a bit harder at you but isn't he whom your sister chose on her very own will ?

So, where do you think the problem starts ?

---

No need to go easy on me it isn't like I am a barrel of subtlety. He didn't marry my mother, she is helping them to buy a house and the way that is done borders on moral blackmail, especially his mother has a hand of trying to make my mother feel guilty. House was too expensive and they start pushing my mother around it's completily shameless 'he already is so depressed if this doesn't work I don't know what he will do' (his brother killed himselve two years ago), he has debts he couldn't buy a house so he, and especially his mother should just shut up and stop trying to max out what they can get. It's disgusting. Add to that that it is one arrogant little weasle, the perfectly lovable wife of my brother was a 'commoner' to him he actually said that to my mother. He's an ass and I want to kick it. But I am going with Beirut and do nothing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Beirut

I think you're screwed. If he's a deadbeat - he's a deadbeat. Nothing you can do about it except learn to deal with it. You just have to differentiate between your sister and him. Be nice to her, be useless with him.

As for pounding him; you can't lay a hand on him as long as he doesn't lay a hand on anyone in your family first. You might win the battle but you'd lose the war.

---

True be nice to her will help in the long run.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by InsaneApache

This is good advice.

You won't like mine though.

I assume that all the parties concerned are over the age of majority? Yes? In that case, mother, sister or whatever are adults and made desicions as adults. In a nutshell, it has nowt to do with you. I see where you're at emotionally but if it were me I'd wind me neck in and mind me own business. Let it be.

---

To add tell your Mom no more "loans". However, a grandchild is coming and she will want to be there and help and with a bum for a son-in-law money can't be trusted.
Buy supplies the baby needs and never give cash. That way she is there supporting her daughter and grandchild.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Northnovas

True be nice to her will help in the long run.



To add tell your Mom no more "loans". However, a grandchild is coming and she will want to be there and help and with a bum for a son-in-law money can't be trusted.
Buy supplies the baby needs and never give cash. That way she is there supporting her daughter and grandchild.

---

5 hour rewind?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Craterus

5 hour rewind?

---

I noticed this too.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fragony

No need to go easy on me it isn't like I am a barrel of subtlety. He didn't marry my mother, she is helping them to buy a house and the way that is done borders on moral blackmail, especially his mother has a hand of trying to make my mother feel guilty. House was too expensive and they start pushing my mother around it's completily shameless 'he already is so depressed if this doesn't work I don't know what he will do' (his brother killed himselve two years ago), he has debts he couldn't buy a house so he, and especially his mother should just shut up and stop trying to max out what they can get. It's disgusting. Add to that that it is one arrogant little weasle, the perfectly lovable wife of my brother was a 'commoner' to him he actually said that to my mother. He's an ass and I want to kick it. But I am going with Beirut and do nothing.

---

Still that ass or whateverelsecallID you rightfully want to burst your anger through is the one that your sister chose to be her man for a lifetime. If there is a mistake, I personally take this for the starting point of all.

Women need counselling at times (a bit of sexist view but, well, here is mine), but it is obviously not yet. Things need to get visibly screwed up to take some counselling action (that varies from one individaul to another) so as not to be trashed with the eternal whining of a woman, which also prevents you from acting prematurely.

Glad to hear that you'll keep it cool. Vent here if need be, keep that up.

First of all, what do you feel is the right approach? You know your sister much better than he does. How is she likely to respond by your telling her your feelings about this man?

I think that it might also be a matter for your Mother to discuss with her, as her word may have more authority with your sister. Women have a way of cutting to the chase when it comes to discussing something like this. Men are often too soft on them to get to the point.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Beirut

I think you're screwed. If he's a deadbeat - he's a deadbeat. Nothing you can do about it except learn to deal with it. You just have to differentiate between your sister and him. Be nice to her, be useless with him.

As for pounding him; you can't lay a hand on him as long as he doesn't lay a hand on anyone in your family first. You might win the battle but you'd lose the war.

---

I still say Frags aims for this bloke's kneecaps. :whip:


Hey, what's the point of venting, eh? It's to talk nonsense with your mates about ripping somebody's head off with your bare hands and sucking out his brains through his eyesockets. Not with the intent of doing it, but just to vent. And be heard. That way, you can keep your cool in real life and do the sensible thing.

Take him out for a pint and let him know how things go down in your family.

P.S. If they are married and having a child, your too late.. he knows how things go down... his way.

Are you confident that your sister's safe with this guy? That didn't seem to come up,and this kind of stress can have a bad effect on a pregnant woman.

Anyway,this guy sounds like a real lowlife,and I've found the best way to deal with that kind of person is to be direct. Not rude or violent,just direct. Try to stay as calm as possible and don't let your anger cloud your words. Frankly,if the guy's as immature as you say,he may just break down and start crying about it. My sister's ex-boyfriend was just like that and did the exact same thing when I set him straight for telling my grandmother to shut up.

But I would agree that you do try talking to your sister about it first,though,and attempt to let her try to settle the situation (the reason I inquired as to whether you thought she was safe around the guy).

Well sis got baby, going to the hospital in a few hours, useless git pretty much useless to her but I probably would have as well. It's not a bad guy he's just useless but if the sis is happy so am I.