Crusader Kings [Concluded]

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...om/index-1.jpg

A Crusader Kings Game


https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...thom/Map-1.jpg

Ireland, 1070 AD.

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...hthom/ulst.jpgUlster:

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...om/khaan-1.jpgkhaan (Duke)

Courtiers -

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...thom/I-K-1.jpgI-K
https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/.../DoubleA-1.jpgDouble A
https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...m/Beskar-1.jpgBeskar

Counties: Ulaid, Tir Eoghain, Tir Connail.


https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...hthom/MUNS.jpgMunster:

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...hom/cent-1.jpgCenturion (Duke)

Courtiers -

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...48-32-54-1.jpgSkooma
https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...thom/TCV-1.jpgTCV
https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...om/Roman-1.jpgRomanic

Counties: Tuadmumu, Desmumu, Urmumu.

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...hthom/CONN.jpgConnaught:

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...hom/Kage-1.jpgKage (Duke)

Courtiers -

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...thom/TLD-1.jpgTLD
https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...hom/auto-1.jpgautolycus
https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...om/B_Ray-1.jpgB_Ray

Counties: Galway, Mayo, Sligo.


https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...hthom/LEIN.jpgLeinster:

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...amondeye-1.jpgDiamondeye (Duke)

Courtiers -

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...dEmperor-1.jpgGod Emperor
https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...om/Beefy-1.jpgBeefy
https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...m/A_Dane-1.jpgA_Dane

Counties: Dublin, Laigin, Osraige.


https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...seal-90x65.jpgBishop:

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...hom/Jolt-1.jpgJolt

Gameplay:

The objective is to become the sole remaining house in Ireland, the last remaining Duke will be crowned King.

Houses:

Each house has county as well as Dukedom titles, these can be given to the other members of the house, though the Duke must always have at least one county title, each title gives it holder a bonus. Each House will also appoint a Chancellor, Steward, Marshall and Spymaster. The Duke can hold one of these titles.

Diplomacy:

Alliances are made by marriage, one house will send a bride, the other the groom. The house that sends the bride has a chance of a claim on a title held by the house of the the groom. The skill level of the respective Chancellor will determine which house sends the bride. The bride's house pays a dowry. Alliances can be made and broken at will, though breaking an alliance will not prevent a potential claim. Each house may only ally with one other at any one time.

Warfare:

Each provice has a manpower level which determines the number of soldiers that can be levied. Each 10 soldiers levied will cost 1 gold per turn. Military level, Duke and Marshall martial skill and other factors will determine combat. War can only be declared with a claim on a title, or with a valid Casus Belli (you'll know if you have one...)

Intrigue:

Spymasters can spend money on spying and assassins. The likelihood of success will come down to Intrigue levels of each Duke and Spymaster, the money spent and other factors.

Financial:

Each province has an income level which will determine how much money you make from it. Farming level, Duke and Steward's Stewardship levels and other factors will also affect your income. Trade agreements can also be made with allys.

Technology:

Each Dukedom will have a Farming level, Military Tech level and Stability level. These are determined mainly through choices made in events, you can choose to focus on one over the other.

Characters:

Each character starts off with random stats. These can change through time, through getting older, choices made in events and traits gained/lost. Each player is considered part of the family tree of his Dukedom, and could potentially become Duke were something to happen to the current incumbent...

Events:

Many events will take place over the course of the game, some effecting everyone and some only a select few or an individual. Some will be public, others private. You will have an option on how to react to each, each course will have different outcomes, these wil be unknown until the decision is made. Random events are a huge part of Crusader Kings and so will play a large role in this game.

Gameplay:

Each turn will be 48 hours, this will represent one game year. Each realm will have a Quicktopic to decide on how to proceed that year, all orders need to be made through the QT. PMs will only be used for individual's orders.

New Players:

Rather than post in thread or pm me, anybody wishing to join should approach the Dukedom they wish to join who will then announce the new player if accepted. (Idea stolen from I-K's EB RPG here) Dukedoms can actively recruit for players if they wish, this is encouraged early game as the Duke will be doing two jobs, which may have adverse effects.


Turn one: 1070.

William the Bastard has been on the Throne of England for almost 4 years, fighting to control his new subjects. The Lords of Ireland look fearfully across the Irish Sea, knowing Norman eyes will be on their lands once he is secure. Ireland is a divided land, answering to no King, easy pickings for a distinguished warlord such as William. Ireland will only be safe under it's own Monarch, an Irish Monarch. But who? Four great houses believe themselves destined to rule the Emerald Isle. Who will win out?

Year one:

A feast will be held this year in the court of Leinster. The Duchy of Leinster must choose how much to lavish on the event. All duchies must choose how to approach the great tourney, will the Courtiers be forced to help their Duke to win, or will the Duke allow them to compete freely?

Also the Pope has sent a Bishop to Ireland, he has no lands of his own. Perhaps he will find a generous Lord and benefactor, though he answers to no authority but God and the Pope in Rome.

This phase will last 72 hours, I will pm everybody and get the QTs open for each house tomorrow. They will have manpower, income, character stats etc for each Duchy and character. Let me know if there are any questions.

Haven't finished reading the post yet, but I wanted to make a couple points:

1) You've almost certainly got Leinster and Connaught switched. See this link.

2) Mide isn't controlled be anyone. I figured it must belong to the Bishop, but I see that is not the case.

Anyway, looking forward to this! :laugh: Should be absolutely awesome!

By the grace of God the Pope Alexander the II has, in his papal wisdom, decided to make me God's representative over this island. The Holy Church wonders who will be a faithful servant of the almighty god and offer our delegation its rightful place in this blessed island, so that we may offer our prears to God and witness his unending blessings.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jolt

By the grace of God the Pope Alexander the II has, in his papal wisdom, decided to make me God's representative over this island. The Holy Church wonders who will be a faithful servant of the almighty god and offer our delegation its rightful place in this blessed island, so that we may offer our prears to God and witness his unending blessings.

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Honored Servant of the Lord,

There is to be a great gathering in my lands this year where I count on all Dukes of the realm, as well as their retinues, to be present. Perhaps this could also prove an opportunity for Your Grace to introduce Yourself to the Dukes of the realm and settle this issue of where to reside. If Your Grace should find no other Dukes amiable or welcoming of Your company, consider this my invitation to make Your home in Leinster lands after the feast is over.

Walk with God,
His Faithful Servant and Duke of Leinster,
Diamondeye.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by B_Ray

1) You've almost certainly got Leinster and Connaught switched. See this link.

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Gah, well spotted. A copy-pasting goof. Fixed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by B_Ray

2) Mide isn't controlled be anyone. I figured it must belong to the Bishop, but I see that is not the case.

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Nope, not controlled by anyone. None of the players that is...

Pms sent, QTs opened.

Just to clarify, Jolt will need a new Cathedral built and given lands. It is up to each Dukedom to decide whether to offer to spend a certain amount (up to you) on a Cathedral, and he will need a county and the income from that also.

Maybe Mide should be given to the Church as base to spread the good word of our Lord to these lands? I cant think of a better place for Cathedral on our Island.

Humble Servant of God and Ireland,

Duke of Connaught

I think the current, non player, Count of Mide might have something to say about that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by johnhughthom

I think the current, non player, Count of Mide might have something to say about that.

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Who is this person whom i havent even heard off? Surely he would not want to to stand in the way of God?

Slight update made to gameplay section in opening post.

Why is there a game about Ireland going on, and I didn't know about it, Bah!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by robbiecon

Why is there a game about Ireland going on, and I didn't know about it, Bah!

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Feel free to join. You're in Dublin, right? Contact Diamondeye and ask to join Leinster, or any other Dukedom you prefer, pming the relevant Duke.

I've never been in the gameroom before, but this looks VERY interesting since I just got CK free. What character is still open?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Skullheadhq

I've never been in the gameroom before, but this looks VERY interesting since I just got CK free. What character is still open?

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Choose which Dukedom you would like to join and pm the respective Duke. Each house is in the process of choosing Counts and offices at the moment.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by robbiecon

Why is there a game about Ireland going on, and I didn't know about it, Bah!

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We could always use more arrowfodder loyal companions!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Diamondeye

We could always use more arrowfodder loyal companions!

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The holy auction is opened! Whoever wishes to throw more mone-I mean indulgencies and land at me, then they shall enlist the support of the Holy Church in their endeavours in this island.

Just to clarify after a query I had. This game isn't quite like the PBM games in the Throne Room, you don't need a copy of the game to play. Everything is done in the forum, and in the Dukedom QTs.

As the character with the biggest nose, I feel need to point out that "gained lost" is not a phrase in any language I know of.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Characters

Each character starts off with random stats. These can change through time, through getting older, choices made in events and traits gained lost. Each player is considered part of the family tree of his Dukedom, and could potentially become Duke were something to happen to the current incumbent...

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Good to see your reading the rules Double A, fixed. Having the biggest nose in CK is quite an achievement.

Dutchy of Dublin still open?

I'm lost - On the map there's no Ulster, Munster etc.. Where are the kingdoms located? :embarassed:

Ulster - top right.
Leinster - bottom right.
Connaught - top left.
Munster - bottom left.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rules

Gameplay:

Each turn will be 48 hours, this will represent one game year. Each realm will have a Quicktopic to decide on how to proceed that year, all orders need to be made through the QT. PMs will only be used for individual's orders.

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Also, I have no idea what kind of orders are expected of us, and my QT looks rather dead except for Skooma who's as clueless as I am about this game.

I'm expecting many kind of actions such as : Diplomacy, increase/decrease manpower, covert operations, technology fundings, farming etc... but there's no real list of action that can be taken and most of the things in the OP are rather vague (perhaps because I've never played Crusader Kings).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by johnhughthom

Ulster - top right.
Leinster - bottom right.
Connaught - top left.
Munster - bottom left.

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That's not really helping me! :laugh4:

I thought the kingdom borders would be the red lines on the map, but in this case there would be more than 4. I think it would be simpler if you could list every provinces owned by each kingdom. :P

Edit: LOL the OP is already listing this. :embarassed:. Forget my stupid request.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Romanic

I think it would be simpler if you could list every provinces owned by each kingdom. :P

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You mean like I did in the op?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Skullheadhq

Dutchy of Dublin still open?

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Yep, just approach the Duke of Leinster, Diamondeye, to join.

JHT, have you missed this post? :smug2:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Romanic

Also, I have no idea what kind of orders are expected of us, and my QT looks rather dead except for Skooma who's as clueless as I am about this game.

I'm expecting many kind of actions such as : Diplomacy, increase/decrease manpower, covert operations, technology fundings, farming etc... but there's no real list of action that can be taken and most of the things in the OP are rather vague (perhaps because I've never played Crusader Kings).

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e.g. Can we have a defined list of actions, or some guideline for what we should be doing?

Diplomacy = marriage alliances.
Manpower changes mainly through events.
Covert operations = The Spymaster can give me spying/assassination type orders, I'll leave the details up to you. Each attempt will have to be paid for, the Spymaster chooses how much to spend on an operation. This will determine outcome, as will Spymaster stats.
Farming increases mainly through events, you can choose to focus on Farming or Military tech.

If you haven't played CK before you probably won't realise how much the game revolves around random events, and your choice of how to approach them. This phase is mainly an introduction for the members of each Dukedom to get to know each other. All I really need from each Dukedom is a list of Offices/title holders, whether to offer Jolt lands/money towards a Cathedral, how to approach the tourney, whether to focus on Farming/Military and any Spymaster efforts for thids phase. Next phase each faction will have at least one event to react to, and a number of individuals will also have decisions to make.

For those who could use a map with the Duchies' boundaries shown, here's one I whipped up based on JHT's original.

https://img577.imageshack.us/img577/8364/ckireland.jpg
Yellow = Ulster
White = Connaught
Blue = Munster
Green = Leinster

Thanks B_Ray!

Who's holding Mide, in the center?

It's NPC controlled. Not for long, though...

I think it'd look nicer in a bright yellow.

Much obliged B_Ray. :bow:


edit: a few people have posted expressing interest in playing, not sure if they have approached any of you yet, but I would recommend trying to get another player so the Duke isn't doing two jobs at once. Anybody who's played CK will know how easy it is to get stressed...

Sent a request. This is going to be so much fun.

((I'm fine with SkullheadHQ joining Leinster, but before reassigning anything, I'd like you to generate his stats and tell them in our QT :bow:))

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Diamondeye

((I'm fine with SkullheadHQ joining Leinster, but before reassigning anything, I'd like you to generate his stats and tell them in our QT :bow:))

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So, are the rulers of this land so devoid of faith that they do not approach the Holy Church with any pious offerings? Phreaps it's time to make a report to the Holy Father and the King of England to bring the Holy Faith into this island...

Bishop Jolt, Connaught will be making a substantial donation to the Cathedral construction fund. Duke Kagemusha and I are hammering out the details as we speak.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jolt

So, are the rulers of this land so devoid of faith that they do not approach the Holy Church with any pious offerings? Phreaps it's time to make a report to the Holy Father and the King of England to bring the Holy Faith into this island...

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Ulster have offered you a County and 60 gold towards your Cathedral, sorry I thought they'd already contacted you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Diamondeye

((I'm fine with SkullheadHQ joining Leinster, but before reassigning anything, I'd like you to generate his stats and tell them in our QT :bow:))

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Doing it now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by autolycus

Bishop Jolt, Connaught will be making a substantial donation to the Cathedral construction fund. Duke Kagemusha and I are hammering out the details as we speak.

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Ah very well, do your planning and then send me a proposal. I shall see which city is worthy of having direct control of God.

oh dear, completely missed this has started, but been preparing for an exam anyway.. Regardless, after tomorrow I shall join this for real :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jolt

So, are the rulers of this land so devoid of faith that they do not approach the Holy Church with any pious offerings? Phreaps it's time to make a report to the Holy Father and the King of England to bring the Holy Faith into this island...

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We of Leinster have already sent word that should you require it, We will grant you a Duchy for your seat. If you chose to accept Our proposal instead of that of others, we would install you in Osraige.

I am afraid that with the upcoming tourney, we lack the funds to be truly lavish when it comes to your Cathedral. We cannot outbid - or even match - the Ulster offers. We await your decision, Your Grace.

A couple of factions still haven't quite decided everything, I'll extend for another day to let you all get to grips with the game.

Got any room for an Ignoramus?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ignoramus

Got any room for an Ignoramus?

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Indeed, Ulster or Munster could do with another player. Just contact the Duke of the faction you want to join, issaikhaan or Centurion1.

Time to don my armor and shine my sword! The marshal of Leinster has arrived!

1070

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...nkinghall5.jpg

Dublin, Ireland.

The seat of Duke Diamondeye of Leinster was the scene of a great tournament, bringing all the Lords of Ireland together for feasting, jousting and diplomatic discussions. The tourney took place over a number of days, winning would involve defeating at least three other Lords. The two newest Lords sat it out, Skullheadq and robbiecon would have to wait until next year for their shot at glory. Bishop Jolt watched with an ironic smile on his face, jousting would mean nothing when these men faced their God, let's hope they remembered that when he asked for lands to build his cathedral.

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...m/images-9.jpg

First up was B_Ray vs Double A. It was clear from the start that it was a one sided match and it took only one run for B_Ray to knock Double A flying and go through to the next round. The match following was just as one sided as The Celtic Viking easily defeated Ibn-Khaldun. The next duel saw the first Duke to compete as khaan faced Skooma Addict, the third consecutive match to only need one run saw the Duke safely through. Duke Diamondeye was in the next match against A_Dane, the crowd looked bored, expecting another easy victory, and for A_Dane to let his Duke win. They were wrong, in a very close contest that took four runs A_Dane knocked his Duke off to qualify for the second round, quite the shock for everybody. The next match was just as close, seeing Romanic defeat autolycus in the fourth run.

The third Duke to compete was next, Kagemusha versus Beefy and the simple victories of earlier were emulated as Duke Kagemusha won on the first run. The final Duke, Centurion, took the field against Beskar, with another quick Duchal victory. The final first round match saw God Emperor take on TheLastDays, this was the closest match of the day, God Emperor winning in the fifth run.

https://i405.photobucket.com/albums/...al-banquet.jpg

As day one ended, Bishop Jolt took his chance to ask the Dukes present for lands and money for God, to enable him to build a Cathedral in Ireland. A rousing speech was made, and many of the lesser nobles cheered, there was less happiness among most of the Dukes, only Duke khaan of Ulster offering lands, the County of Tir Connail plus 60 gold to build the Cathedral. Duke Diamondeye offered 15 gold, Duke Centurion 10. Jolt sat impassive, waiting for an offer from Kagemusha. When nothing was forthcoming he rose and said, "Thank you my Lords, I will go and pray to the Lord and ask him what I should do."

As day dawned on the second day of the tourney the eight competitors all seemed confident of victory, first up was B_Ray against TCV, two of the most impressive performers yesterday. It was a classic battle and would have been a worthy final match, one of them had to go however, and on the ninth run B-Ray was unseated to a great roar and The Celtic Viking took his place in the last four. Next up was Duke khaan against the hero of yesterday, A_Dane, surely he couldn't defeat another Duke? It seemed that God was smiling upon A_Dane and he unseated his second Duke of the tournament in the fourth run to a roar even greater than that which greeted The Celtic Viking's win. Duke Kagemusha was next, against Romanic. There was to be no upset here however, and Romanic came off his horse in the second run. The last match of the day saw Duke Centurion take on God Emperor, the Duke took the victory in the seventh run for another close victory.

There seemed to be distrust in the air during the second night of feasting, this was usually a time of intrigue and diplomacy. This year however no daughters or sons were married off, no secret letters passed between agents of court. Well none that were seen anyway.

Day three of the joust dawned bright and clear. This was turning into a success for Duke Diamondeye, he had spent a modest sum, but the excitement of the jousting made up for that. The first semi final saw the tournament favourite up against the surprise package, The Celtic Viking facing A_Dane. If TCV was under pressure he didn't show it, it only took one run for him to throw A_Dane off his horse, the Leinster man took a fierce blow and lay still after coming off. As the crowd held their breath he got up after a few minutes, holding his ribs in pain. The battle to determine who would face TCV in the final was between two Dukes, Centurion and Kagemusha. Duke Kagemusha knocked Centurion off his horse in the third run to reach the final. The final saw The Celtic Viking eager to avenge his Duke's defeat in the semi final, he hadn't face a Duke yet in the tourney but was confident of victory, Kagemusha had eased into the final with no real problems, it was sure to be a great contest. It didn't disappoint, going to an amazing eleven runs before one man could defeat the other. The Celtic Viking was the eventual winner, unseating the Duke with a powerful blow. The crowd rose to acclaim their victor, he may not have been a Leinster man, but it was a terrific performance.

The final nights feasting was a raucous affair, with the Munster contingent cheering their victor constantly and the Leinster men cheering their unlikely hero A_Dane, who defeated two Dukes, even if he did receive an injury in the process.

End of phase one

Each Dukedom has now chosen their Chancellors, if you would like to do any diplomacy approach the relevant Chancellor.

Ulster: Ibn-Khaldun.
Connaught: autolycus.
Leinster: God Emperor.
Munster: Romanic.

I'll do each Dukedom and individuals results and events over the next 24 hours, there's quite a bit to it, most will be in the QTs but a few people will get individual pms. Phase two will begin when it is all done.

Woohoo! So, we're all agreed to pursue Cultural Victory through independent agricultural and technological advances, right?

:charge:

Hip hip hooray for TCV, the best knight around! :applause::applause::applause:

Wait a minute! What is that I read? TCV easily defeated me! That is absurd. I was trying to do a backflip to impress the women but my horse kept running forward. So, it only looked like I fell. I demand a rematch! :tongue:

Yeah, Dukes get beaten down by the underdog. Fear me! XD

Now I wonder if it was with his duke's consent that he fought with full strength against him

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TheLastDays

Now I wonder if it was with his duke's consent that he fought with full strength against him

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Absolutely. A tourney is no fun if the victor is given in advance. I sought to make this a fair sport, and I think it has been proven so.

nevermind...

I think TheCelticViking should be tested for performance enhancing drugs. Regardless, I'm proud of my Duke's performance, making it all the way to final match! Hip hip hurray for Kagemusha!

Congratulations for The Celtic Viking. I am sure any Duke would be proud to have a man of your caliber as his retainer.

-wrong thread-

1071

Phase 2 begins.

One man was noticable in his absence from the tourney, and on their seperate ways home news reached the four Dukes of the death of the Count of Mide. He left no male heir, only a fourteen year old daughter. The County was ripe for the picking, with no legitimate heir no claim was needed to take it with force. There was little to fear from the former Count's forces, they would likely accept a strong Duke as their overlord. Who would be strong enough to take Mide from the grasp of the other three Dukes?

48 hours for discussion and orders, the QTs have been updated with phase one results and phase two events.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Had any of the Spymasters sent a spy into Mide they would have been forewarned of the Duke's illness and could have offered a marriage alliance, therefore inheriting the County without fighting for it.

'Twas a good match noble Duke Centurion.. But as you can clearly see I am a most keen fighter, although age might have claimed much of my old strength. I bow to you :bow:'

The high Duke Diamondeye of Leister, is most happy to see that so many of the fiefdoms helped spreading the word of God... Though it appears that some *adding a small sigh while looking at Kagemusha* did not wish to see the will of God, touch these beautiful lands..

Duke of Connaught return´s a light hearted smile towards the Leinster Vassal and speaks:

"It is indeed worrysome news that the Duke of Mide has passed away. Knowing you all for long my fellow Dukes.I think we are like flock of Falcons smelling prey, but how about if i would offer thee another kind of solution to the problems with Mide?
Instead of us all rushing into those lands in order to gain more to our lands.Did we just not have splendid joust in Leinster, where men fought and some better then others. How about instead of some of us conquering lands of Mide. We appoint the strongest knight in all our lands as new Duke of Mide? I am talking about TCV of Munster. Who would be a better man to protect the integrity of Mide? I think we should accept this strong knight as one of Ireland´s Duke´s. What say thee?"

But that would be willingly strengthening Munster? I'm not too sure alot of people would do that..

Duke of Connaught turns towards the speaker and replies:

"We are not talking here about giving Mide to Munster, but making TCV a Duke. Like the Duke that held Mide before him. He would be not a liege of Munster or anyone else, but an independent Duke of Mide."

Mide was a county, not a dukedome, and hence it would fall under Connaught.

Here is what the news concerning the Mide said:

"One man was noticable in his absence from the tourney, and on their seperate ways home news reached the four Dukes of the death of the Count of Mide. He left no male heir, only a fourteen year old daughter. The County was ripe for the picking, with no legitimate heir no claim was needed to take it with force. There was little to fear from the former Dukes forces, they would likely accept a strong Duke as their overlord."

In the end it says that: "There was little to fear from former Duke´s forces."
To me it seems that, yes. Mide is a single County, but a single county ruled by A Duke. Of course the scribes can enlighten us if i am wrong about the title of the last Lord of Mide, as far as i know he did not serve any of the other Duke´s of Ireland.Thus he was independent. So I would propose to have an indpendent Duke to continue ruling his land and i cant think of a better man then the one i proposed.

I think we will have to get THC's input about this proposal. I doubt the nobles of Mide will willingly agree to be put under the rule of an outsider just because the other dukes like the idea. I'm almost certain they will have to be subdued, and a ruler installed by force.

Yes. That is why i talked about the scribes and their wisdom. ;) After all in absence of King the Duke´s have to try and govern the land and unamous decisions are less likely to result into a country wide war over a single county.

he would still, for all intents and purposes, be the duke of connaughts slave, in order to avoid being eaten by one of us...

"I thank you all for your kind words. It was an honour to participate in the tournament, and I thank the almighty God for smiling upon me that day. Thank you all!"

TCV throws a glint towards Ibn-Khaldun.

"And a special thanks for the horsebreeders of Ulster for not teaching their beasts to recognize when their masters wants to make stunts. I'm sure you will have your rematch some day, my dear Ibn-Khaldun.

Now, Kagemusha, you speak fairly and I am deeply, deeply honoured by your suggestion. I absolutely agree that a peaceful solution to this matter is the best solution, and if this means me taking over as its new Duke, I would be happy to do it should it be offered to me officially. However, I am still loyal to Centurion, and if he says no to letting me go, I will respect his will."

Why would TCV be Connaught's slave? If anything I would expect him to have some residual loyalty to Munster, his former homeland. Once he, a strong adult, is on the throne of Mige, no one would be so heretical as to make war on him without a legitimate claim on the land. It is only the irregular situation of a Duke dying with no relatives except for a young daughter that has created a void liable to be filled by a general melee of arms. My duke seeks a way to avoid that bloodshed, and I support it.

Connaught because he was the one to get him in the position ? If anything, this would tie those 2 together, strengthening Connaughts situation.

But even if that's not the case, he won't be strong enough on his own, and this means he'll need to stick very closely to someone, and that would probably be either Munster or Connaught, either way, not a prefferable option for the 2 other dukedoms...

Anyways, this is my personal opinion, and it'll be up to my duke to decide..

There is only one Dukedom that could be created, Duke of Meath. Mide and Dublin would need to be held, Leinster would have to give up Dublin. More than that, we don't have enough players to create another Dukedom, two Dukedoms don't have enough to fill all the offices as it is.

That was a typo regarding "former Duke's forces." It should have been Count.

Illuminating. I think that settles the matter then. Mide will have to be taken by force and annexed to one the 4 existing Dukedoms.

Mide does not have to be annexed by force. Myself, the remaining dukes, and The Church can surely come to a resolution which avoids needless bloodshed.

I will declare my intention now that I feel Mide rightfully belongs to the Duke of Ulster. I alone declared myself the servant of God, recognizing that all we have is given by Him. Words are cheap, but actions attest to the true mettle of a man. We must remember that, above all, we are to seek unending glory with the Lord. This means that all rulers must exist as righteous examples for their subjects. I have shown myself to be just that. I grant the Duke of Leinster leave on this matter- he had spent much planning such a grand tournament before the matter of a home for the Lord here on our island became problematic. However, the other two dukes have no such excuse. If the Lord decides to grant the county to another, it would comfort me that it would go to Duke Diamondeye.

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Originally Posted by issaikhaan

Mide does not have to be annexed by force. Myself, the remaining dukes, and The Church can surely come to a resolution which avoids needless bloodshed.

I will declare my intention now that I feel Mide rightfully belongs to the Duke of Ulster. I alone declared myself the servant of God, recognizing that all we have is given by Him. Words are cheap, but actions attest to the true mettle of a man. We must remember that, above all, we are to seek unending glory with the Lord. This means that all rulers must exist as righteous examples for their subjects. I have shown myself to be just that. I grant the Duke of Leinster leave on this matter- he had spent much planning such a grand tournament before the matter of a home for the Lord here on our island became problematic. However, the other two dukes have no such excuse. If the Lord decides to grant the county to another, it would comfort me that it would go to Duke Diamondeye.

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I agree Duke khaan. According to the law of Jus Uxoris, the Count's daughter cannot rule the lands. As the family has no male member which to inherit the land, it thus becomes without a Lord and master, it is a land without any legal proprietor, thus theoretically becoming Res Nullius and ellegible to be seized by anyone who wants it. It is therefore clear that all Dukes have stakes to claim in the land and only the Holy Church, who has no outstanding interests in the county, with the exception of the protection of the children of God and the prevention of bloodshed between Catholic brothers, can intervene and mediate this dispute, so that we may find a suitable benefactor who is the most legitimate to secure the lands of Mide and its prosperity.

As noone has any legitimate claims over the land of Mide, moreover according to the principle of the Res publica Christiana, which states that the surpreme ruler of every land is His Holiness the Pope, and that all land is merely delegated by God to be governed by his subjects, designated and sanctioned by the Pope, much like the feudal contracts where Kings give their own land to their vassals, the land is under the administration of the Holy Pope, and as I am his representative in this island, I have the authority to decide who will recieve the land; As there also is no way of seeing how good is a Lord to his subjects, this decision can only be made on analyzing the piousness of its ruler and his commitment to God.

Thy last link needeth fixing...

I know it is late I concern myself with this situation, but it is because I have been pondering this same question in private. Like the rest of you, I seek a peaceful solution to this problem. If his Grace the Cardinal and the honored Duke of Ulster agrees, I would propose the following;

I will ask the daughter of the late Count of Mide for her hand in holy matrimony, that we may be one in God's eyes. I ask of Jolt to approve this, and if it pleases his lord, to take our vows in person, thus bringing them closer to God's eyes on earth, and that much stronger. If the Church - and the Lady - agree to this, then the County shall fall within Leinster borders without bloodshed, and a crisis will have been avoided.

I would like to offer some sort of compromise to the Duke of Ulster in this situation, but I think the matter would be easier solved in private. For now, Duke Khaan, if things go as they should for the sake of peace, I would ask that you stand as my Best Man on this holy union of man and woman, but I would like to discuss these matters in greater detail.

Diamondeye,
Duke of Leinster.

It is unfortunate that my solution is not something that could have resolved the issue. Connaught is ready to discuss in private about any suggestions the other Dukes and the Church has to deal with this situation. We are listening.

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Originally Posted by Diamondeye

I know it is late I concern myself with this situation, but it is because I have been pondering this same question in private. Like the rest of you, I seek a peaceful solution to this problem. If his Grace the Cardinal and the honored Duke of Ulster agrees, I would propose the following;

I will ask the daughter of the late Count of Mide for her hand in holy matrimony, that we may be one in God's eyes. I ask of Jolt to approve this, and if it pleases his lord, to take our vows in person, thus bringing them closer to God's eyes on earth, and that much stronger. If the Church - and the Lady - agree to this, then the County shall fall within Leinster borders without bloodshed, and a crisis will have been avoided.

I would like to offer some sort of compromise to the Duke of Ulster in this situation, but I think the matter would be easier solved in private. For now, Duke Khaan, if things go as they should for the sake of peace, I would ask that you stand as my Best Man on this holy union of man and woman, but I would like to discuss these matters in greater detail.

Diamondeye,
Duke of Leinster.

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A most excellent proposition! Following this peaceful way I can keep the armies at home, and I think our rivals like them better there then underneath their very city walls...

If people want to have peaceful solution to this dilemma, some might actually think they should negotiate with the other Dukes. If Ulster and Leinster believe that they have the power to just take Mide without the concent of Connaught and Munster, they should think twice.

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Originally Posted by Kagemusha

without the concent of Connaught and Munster, they should think twice.

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Connaught and Munster speak with one mouth now? Interesting...

I will not go into biggering with a Leinster vassal over this matter, maybe you should talk with your Duke before speculating further? It is just very disturbing that Ulster and Leinster seem to dividing lands without consent of other Duke´s.