To all those who have studied or study history

I am currently thinking about which subject is the right one for me to study at university. One possible subject would be history since I am a history buff since I was a child. In my eyes I am also well qualified for the subject because I have good analytical skills, because I have quite good language skills and because I am interested in the subject and can bring a good basis of historical knowledge.
After all studying history won't be the problem- but finding a job afterwards seems to be. Cynics name taxi driver as the most common employment for history students. I know that there are, besides the 'classic' fields of the historian, namely reasearch and the education system, also chances in thinktanks or larger companies.


Since I know that the .Org consists out of history buffs (mostly) I hope that in here are some fnished history students who could tell about their experience since this might be interesting for people than just me.

I discarded history almost as soon as I thought about it for just this reason: it has no meaningful value in the job market. The only good options are museum/reasearch work, as well as reproducing your professors by becoming one.

If you like the idea of being a history researcher - go nuts. If you don't - stay away. An alternative would of course be research in a related field with history as a side skill. Sociology comes to mind as a field where you'd be well served by having some points in history.

If you intend to go into education below college, I'd say you should go for a standard education program instead. You'll soon find out that your shortcomings and areas of improvement lie with education knowledge, not the specifics of the subjects you're teaching. If you have a well-above average interest in the subject(like you have with history), you already have what you need.

A friend of mine finished his masters degree in engineering last year. This year he started on a bachelors degree in history - which will include three languages(he's done arabic, I think the next are Hebrew and Persian). I don't have a clue what he's doing, and I highly doubt he has any either....

For the record, I'm a teacher with social science as my field, which in norway is split in three between history, sociology and geography.

I got drunk and here I am 4 years later with a degree and soc major with a tongue piercing

The monastery is the history forum I'm sure they can point you in the right direction.

If I could do it all over again I would go engineer, or something in the biology field.

History is great if you plan to research, write, teach or go into law or journalism.

I can only echo what people are saying. It's important to do the things in life you are passionate about. If you love history, then do it. If you wan't a non-academic or non-history related job then perhaps choose another degree however. Most big businesses recruit only business, management, accounting or other similarly work related background graduates. You could always do a history degree and then do a conversion degree. In the Uk at least a lot of people do one degree i.e. history, English literature or any other such less 'applicable' degree then do a one or two year conversion course to gain another degree in something like law. The likelihood of this happening will probably diminish however with the rise in tuition fees. It's a popular degree though. The reason here at least the entry requirements at top institution tend to be so high is because of the number of applicants. Few people are aware that at the top institutions the required grades for medicine (typically a big money career) are inferior to that of history.

Also forgot to mention the civil service is another place you could get a job with a history degree. They just want educated people and lets be honest, do you think the majority of people working in human resources went to university with admiration to study the works of people like Marquis de Sade and then had a sudden change of heart and wanted to manage employee work rosters for the next 30 years? I thought as much..

I got my degree last December, and still haven't found a job. You are overqualified for most minimum wage jobs and not competitive enough for anything else. Don't do it if you want a future. Sorry to sound cynical, but doing what you love isn't always what will make you the happiest in the long run.

You are never overqualified for employment if you currently are unemployed

That's some fancy city boy talk for someone who salivates over hard work

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Originally Posted by Strike For The South

You are never overqualified for employment if you currently are unemployed

That's some fancy city boy talk for someone who salivates over hard work

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No dumbass, I am saying people won't hire you because they think you are overqualified. I cannot even get a job as a cashier while I am waiting to find better employment! People will hire brainless highschool kids over you, because they think you will expect much and only be on for the short-term.

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Originally Posted by Vuk

No dumbass, I am saying people won't hire you because they think you are overqualified. I cannot even get a job as a cashier while I am waiting to find better employment! People will hire brainless highschool kids over you, because they think you will expect much and only be on for the short-term.

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I have never seen overqualified employees turned away. It's one of those things you hear allot about but never see. Funny.

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Originally Posted by Strike For The South

I have never seen overqualified employees turned away. It's one of those things you hear allot about but never see. Funny.

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Whatever you say Strike.

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Originally Posted by Vuk

Whatever you say Strike.

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I work in a place that is considered a last resort for most and entry level for some. Never seen a grad turned away because they were to educated.

Laziness is not an admirable quality. Farmers know this. Of course farmers know shooting up a pig carcass with an automatic weapon is dumb too.

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Originally Posted by Strike For The South

I work in a place that is considered a last resort for most and entry level for some. Never seen a grad turned away because they were to educated.

Laziness is not an admirable quality. Farmers know this. Of course farmers know shooting up a pig carcass with an automatic weapon is dumb too.

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Neither are stupidity, ignorance, and arrogance.

Doesn't feel very good, does it?

I'm in the process of switching from chemistry to chemical engineering soooooooo, I don't think I can help you out much OP.

I have seen people turned away for being over qualified, but there are underlying reasons.

In cases where they think you will jump ship at the first opportunity at a better job, they will not hire you if there is lots of training involved OR if you have a history of quitting on short notice.

In other cases, they want someone who will stick with the company long-term due to having few options, and a college grad/talent is not what they are looking for. It makes for a predictable business. In my Big Box days my best employees were the ones who were borderline retarded. Another reason companies want longevity is because they want you to compete for promotions and take ownership in the company, which results in more productive employees.

I don't think you will be seeing this at large corporate customer service type jobs, like McDs, walmarts etc. It happens mostly at smaller businesses where an emplyee is not a number, and especially in start ups where they lure you in with promised benefits down the road

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Originally Posted by Vuk

I got my degree last December, and still haven't found a job. You are overqualified for most minimum wage jobs and not competitive enough for anything else. Don't do it if you want a future. Sorry to sound cynical, but doing what you love isn't always what will make you the happiest in the long run.

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Sadly this is a pretty typical story.

There are things which can be done to make yourself more employable but this may only be applicable to the UK. For example a lot of people will seek out internships or work experience placements in fields they're interested in going into when they graduate and accounting companies will accept politics undergraduates for internships or placement years for example if they have the relevant maths skills. These are however very difficult to come by. My academic record is otherwise excellent yet I applied for two internships this year, one which was at a pretty small company and I still didn't get it. I did however get a two week work experience placement out of one interview despite not getting the full month long internship and considering the difficult of getting any relevant experience in the job market I'm more than happy I got it. My dissertation is also a work based one where I work with a company using their model, statistic, strategy ect to argue about the effects of public sector outsourcing. Essentially taking my normal dissertation work topic and combining it with active research in collaboration with an external company. I'm hoping it will look better on my CV and I can show employers I have actually undertaken a project with real world applicability whilst working with a big company, instead of arguing about US foreign policy in the Middle East which most people tend to do. This of course is all circumstantial and I wouldn't be working with this company if it wasn't for my families connections for which I'm very grateful.

Also on the point of overqualified, there is such a thing. Many places will turn down people they see as overqualified, usually on the basis that most people are seeking such jobs on a temporary basis till something better comes along which justifies they're higher level of qualification. This also tends to be true. No one goes to university with the aim of stacking shelves when they graduate with the guys who spent their high school years gaining straight Ds.

I was a history major in undergrad and have done relatively well, but I immediately went to law school and have been employed as a lawyer for my entire post-school life. There really isn't any such thing as a 'career' in history outside of academia, and a career there generally requires a Masters or a Doctorate. I would treat a BA in History like I would a BA in pretty much anything else... it demonstrates that you've got a general education and are smart enough to do work. It's not really going to qualify you for much on its own. You'll have to find an entry level job in whatever field you're interested in, and work your way up. If you want a degree that will actually open doors for you beyond general education, I'd recommend a BS or a graduate degree in something that is in demand.

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Originally Posted by Strike For The South

I have never seen overqualified employees turned away. It's one of those things you hear allot about but never see. Funny.

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"Over Qualified" means "did degree and has less experience as general munchkin"

It's a problem. Want to work in a supermarket stacking shelves? Well, you did that job for a couple of months over Christmas while studying, but that guy who can barely spell his own name has been doing it for 10 years. He can be crap at the job, but on paper he's more likely to get hired because life sucks.

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Originally Posted by Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla

"Over Qualified" means "did degree and has less experience as general munchkin"

It's a problem. Want to work in a supermarket stacking shelves? Well, you did that job for a couple of months over Christmas while studying, but that guy who can barely spell his own name has been doing it for 10 years. He can be crap at the job, but on paper he's more likely to get hired because life sucks.

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I honestly think that is one of my hurdles to getting a job. I spent my childhood and teen years working on my family's farm, and only have limited work experience outside of that. I have been trying to play up the experience I have for all it is worth, but employers don't seem to be buying it. :P Of course where I worked I always out performed most people there who had years of experience, and I have a very strong work ethic and am a fast learner, but despite trying to get that across to employers, they seem to think that if you do not have experience from when you were younger, you are not going to be any good.

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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube

I think getting a doctorate in some kind of history, and then teaching history at a college level, would be fan-freaking-tastic. That's been my pipe dream since middle school, at least.

Bummer the odds are so long on that one. :no:

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That's what I wanted to do too. (not so much on the teaching end as the research and writing end) I have kind of given up on that for now though and am just looking at getting by till I can set up my own business.

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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube

I think getting a doctorate in some kind of history, and then teaching history at a college level, would be fan-freaking-tastic. That's been my pipe dream since middle school, at least.

Bummer the odds are so long on that one. :no:

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But you do know that trading sex for better grades will likely get you fired, right?

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Originally Posted by Major Robert Dump

But you do know that trading sex for better grades will likely get you fired, right?

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Source, or it's a lie.

I had sex with my college math teacher for a passing grade. When the semester was over, I reported him.

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Originally Posted by Strike For The South

Never seen a grad turned away because they were to educated.

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One of my friends was turned down for a basic sort of desk job/general office worker job. He is also doing his PhD in Italian Renaissance Studies. They specifically said that he was too qualified and they realised that he would not be staying with the company for as long as they wanted because of this. So it does happen. I agree that people always use it as a truism or an excuse for not being given a job they wanted, but yes. It does happen.

As for the OP, I'm currently writing my PhD in Ancient History and am planning on academia, so I'm not really sure what use I would be beyond urging you to follow your passion. If you would be a good academic, you would realise by the time your last year rolls around. If you aren't going to make it as one, or wouldn't find the lifestyle interesting enough, then you can always change degrees.

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Originally Posted by CountArach

One of my friends was turned down for a basic sort of desk job/general office worker job. He is also doing his PhD in Italian Renaissance Studies. They specifically said that he was too qualified and they realised that he would not be staying with the company for as long as they wanted because of this. So it does happen. I agree that people always use it as a truism or an excuse for not being given a job they wanted, but yes. It does happen.

As for the OP, I'm currently writing my PhD in Ancient History and am planning on academia, so I'm not really sure what use I would be beyond urging you to follow your passion. If you would be a good academic, you would realise by the time your last year rolls around. If you aren't going to make it as one, or wouldn't find the lifestyle interesting enough, then you can always change degrees.

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I'm interested to know what you consider the traits of an academic are? If someone for example enjoyed academia but produced work of a 2:1 standard, would you encourage them to pursue academia? Likewise, if someone consistently gets firsts but carries a sort of indifferent attitude to study, who, in your opinion, would be best suited to an academic career?

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Originally Posted by tibilicus

I'm interested to know what you consider the traits of an academic are? If someone for example enjoyed academia but produced work of a 2:1 standard, would you encourage them to pursue academia? Likewise, if someone consistently gets firsts but carries a sort of indifferent attitude to study, who, in your opinion, would be best suited to an academic career?

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Either of them could do it, but they would have to accept their limitation and work on it. Quite frankly, the person in the first case, that is someone with relatively poor work performance, is unlikely to ultimately go particularly well regardless of how good their work ethic is, unless they can learn how to produce better work. It all depends on what sort of thing they were looking at. If they can find something that fires their imagination then they can still perform well in it - it is just a matter of picking the right field of study. Personally, I started off close to the second example, but since I started this I sort of fell into a subject which no one in the University ever taught me, but I loved it so much that I will happily pour over books for hours despite being a bit work shy in regards to a lot of other things. So providing you find the right thing, you can overcome a general unwillingness to work.

EDIT: But if I had to choose, I'd say the second person is more naturally academic, simply because there can be other reasons for not working as hard as they can beyond being generall unwilling, like not being challenged or not being taught something that interests them.

Ultimately, you need a combination of the two things, but you can work around either.

I did Classics and Philosophy and was hired by the Foreign Office before I left Uni. Historians are vastly under-rated in todays jobs market in my opinion. Without the perspective that a study of history gives you cannot see the bigger picture, nor begin to fathom long term consequences of decisions made today.

I decided to respond to this even though I don't major in History, but what the hell.

In fact, I major in Arabic and have been taking a lot of classes that are historical in nature (e.g. the first semester of my first year I took the obligatory "History of the Middle-East" class that continued into the second semester, and took an additional class on Modern Islamic philosophy and Sufism). Next semester I'll be taking a class called "History of Modern Iran" and plan to take additional history classes throughout my career. In fact, the honours course is part of the department of History.

Majoring in a language and doing a minor in History is something I'd advise for myself, but not necessarily to everyone. My mother always says you gotta do you what you like. She studied French, by the way.

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Originally Posted by SoFarSoGood

I did Classics and Philosophy and was hired by the Foreign Office before I left Uni. Historians are vastly under-rated in todays jobs market in my opinion. Without the perspective that a study of history gives you cannot see the bigger picture, nor begin to fathom long term consequences of decisions made today.

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Interesting. What was your CV like in addition to your degree though? And I'm assuming you went to a Russel Group university. Apparently the civil service fast stream tends to take on a lot of historians.

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Originally Posted by SoFarSoGood

I did Classics and Philosophy and was hired by the Foreign Office before I left Uni. Historians are vastly under-rated in todays jobs market in my opinion. Without the perspective that a study of history gives you cannot see the bigger picture, nor begin to fathom long term consequences of decisions made today.

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Interesting. What was your CV like in addition to your degree though? And I'm assuming you went to a Russel Group university. Apparently the civil service fast stream tends to take on a lot of historians.

Perhaps consider Political Science as an alternative to history?