Hey guys I'm just curious as to what others think about the starting positions in 4v4 games. What do you guys think is most important position.
Also where would you put your weakest general?
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Hey guys I'm just curious as to what others think about the starting positions in 4v4 games. What do you guys think is most important position.
Also where would you put your weakest general?
Gah Depends Gah
Since a strong 4v4 team will have a decisive plan, the best practice is to place the strongest player
- in the front of the advance, if advancing;
- in the front of the defence, if defending;
- in the reserve, if judged wise by the commander;
- or anywhere else the team agrees is the most crucial point according to the plan.
This decision should be completely dependent on the plan, not on the map position.
Of course this leaves aside which player is the strongest. Unless you are fortunate enough to have RageDevil on your team.
Totally depends on terrain, allies, enemies, distance, ect. I personally prefer the flanks, but not if there's 2 armies charging me.
I'm going to have to say the center, although it does depend. Center is usually the player who will have to make the crucial decision of which way to send his forces...either to defend the under-defended or to get in on some double team action.
The front left general is often in the mix of things from the get-go, and if he/she can't at least moderately hurt the enemy as they mow him/her down then the allies are in for an uphill climb.
For a newby I would suggest a deployment in the rear, but this person needs to be well aware that his/her moving to the front lines needs to be done expeditiously for the sake of the team. Also, a noob generally needs to be told which spot to move to and whether or not he/she needs to be walking or running. And most importantly, use the word "please" otherwise the noob will think you are being a jerk when you boss around http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pat.gif
In my opinion its front left if this player messes up its an uphill struggle from there, During the game if all starts well centre must support well with cav units to win the game vs experienced opponents.
when attacking i find that the top left on mini map position is very important.. i would generally place my strongest general there. but i agree with swoosh that the foward position is also one of great importance. i believe my second strongest would go there. although things like oppents and map/terrain can effect this decision. for best noob poition i would say center.. at the start of battle, the center position requires the least amount of movment.. and gives allies time to properly and curtiously ask the newer guy to delpoy one side or the other. the top right of mini map, or as is also refered to as the back position, i would give to my 3rd strongest general as long as the player understands the importance of moving up his forces as dump points out. just my humble opinion though ...there really isnt a wrong way to go about it http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif
in general, in every game the centre is most valuable so is in tw. but it depends on the situation. there are too many variables involved.
If you didn't think center is the most important position in a 4x4, you probably play in too many games with too strong allies. Time to try it with some newbie as center, you will see your battle plan goes up in smoke.
Center is the most important position, give it to the most versatile general (not necessarily the most skillful in attack).
Annie
I disagree any good general knows that in 4v4 you should attack whether defending or not so all positions are just as important http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif but the forward left guy has to setup right and lead the attack and also has to hold for support http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif Myself fearofstrike shingenmitch and some others used to be quite good at this
We won plenty of those games even if our centre player fell, Its a mad rush on each teams left and its great fun http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif
That's why I say it's the right side (weak side) position that is most difficult. A fast team can get a quick 3 on 2 over there. However if played well, the right side army can usually hold long enough for help to arrive.
I voted for it depends
It depends on the map, the players/armies, and how the players deploy in there zone. If i had to pick one though i would say center. Center has the biggest deployment zone and can deploy on one side or the other.
IMHO the front left guy has the most influence on the early game. If he deploys forward and attacks then the others are forced to attack/help him, so probably it will end up in rushing game. On the other hand, if he deploys back then he can steer the battle towards a more tactical game. At least this is the position I love the most http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif and surely I would not put the weakest gen here.
As far as the second question is concerned, a weak general has no good position http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif If I have to choose then I would put him into the back left postion, this is the safest one IMHO. He could not deploy too forward, he could not rush and he could not be rushed.
hmm yeah IMO back left position would be best for the weak general.
CBR
centre but you dont need the strongest general there.. but at least a capable one.
I voted Center, but was torn between that and front-left.
I went with Center, because if center loses, Right will be surrounded and will die. Then it just comes down to the 2 guys on the left which should be easy to mop up.
If the front-left loses, you still have 3 players to consolidate and counterattack.
Each position is important.
I'd say put weakest general in reserve position (back left) and yell at him to move move move.
ok i will say this..Which position ur prefer to setup in???
i like center and forward left http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/cool.gif
Always forward left for me, Fast.
That doesn't necessarily mean I am good at it, I just like the position, I think it is the most exciting:
either I get creamed or I don't http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif )
I hate being back left...I feel left out http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/mecry.gif
that's because you're too slow to catch up with the main body for the kills Dumpy http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/tongue.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
i voted front left simply because its the position that encounters the enemy first (normally) but centre is very important as it needs to spread its units carefully to where they are needed http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif
Speaking as Mr. I'm almost always the center Elmo, I say that the middle position has the greatest impact on a game. The responsibilities are many: support lone right player, cover left players' right flanks, isolate middle enemy from helping on left side double team, trapping enemies attacking lone right player. Lots of decisions and the largest area of the map to watch over at start. Forward left player has only to look in front and to his right flank, back player has only one good option and that is to move forward between middle guy and left forward, lone right guy has only to cover his front and left flank, which middle guy is normally helping with. All in all, you do not want your best player in middle, but a player who can quickly provide support for the other good players and hold the middle until the battles on sides are over. Also, in my case, I am very good at wearing down the enemy from chasing my poor men off the map http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif
That's because my men don't like to run unless they are going to The Sizzler.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Depends but ceteris paribus it's Center.
I like being forward left or right flank. When i'm center and want to attack, i have to worry about getting flanked by everyone. I'm just to aggressive and get tire of waiting or get bored of a staring contest. Sometimes being on the flanks isn't easy either, when the enemy has a good postion or he keeps backing away from you. Still the flanks have less presure and it's easier to push forward on the flanks.
I would stick my weakest general in center with lot's of missile units. So all he has to do is sit on his butt shooting. And he if has a strong army, you don't have to worry about him routing easy, since mtw it's more about the army you pick and not skill.
Just wait, we won't have deployment zones. All units will come in through the red zone like reinforcements. No more waiting for people deploying. You won't have to watch a newbie ally place his units 1 by 1 taking 10mins and once the game starts watch him send all his units to attack 1. And all the time have him telling you he knows what he's doing.
But for now, you'll have people with the most experience in charge of who deploys where. No more being uncertain to where your deployment is before you start, by selection of your color. The person with the better rank, when they make one will choose who has what postion or they might add postion picking instead having it based on your color.
Hehe yea right...
Well, i think it deppends.
True that the center is an important place as u can help fast allies who needed it (for defend or attack) but sometimes the best way to attack in one map could be right, or left or whatever, and also u have to be in mind which enemies are in the front and so on.
Perhaps sometimes the less important place is left behind, but it could be very important if the main battle is taking place and u reach there in the right moment to help allies like 7th cavallery http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif
Gah.. center bah...
center guy moves to right... left and right advance..
alll charge flanks..
I think also a good position would be right behind LadyAnn...hheeh no offense ment http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif
Amp:
I think my tactic of running away from you works http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif sometimes.
Talkabout rank and who would have the right to pick deployment: the newbie will certainly fight over who is the boss, the greener the newbie, the higher he would think he is in the chain of command.
You will end up having a newbie ordering you to be in the wrong place.
And one of those newbie would be me.
FaST:
Are you sure you will run as fast as your name suggest?
Annie
Nope no need to run as it tires u out too much http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
Unless my allie cries for help
i will be online sunday nite..so maybe u will find out... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pat.gif
FaST:
Reason I asked was because you need to get out of the way of routing army quickly...
Annie
hehe yeah....i heard u mastered the art of MTW now..Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
LadyAnn......i better take front left then http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/tongue.gif
But back on topic http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif i think center is most important IMO..Reason being its the core of ur main army and can send support either flank of ur allies if needed.Thus sending troops to help out when needed http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/flirt.gif
If u have enuf shooters and a few holdin units it can make for a very strong center while u send a few troops to help ur allies........
You heard wrong FaST. It is miss'T, from whom I learn a few tricks. The rest, I got it from applying Elmo's zen to everything:
You can't rout your opponent until you rout yourself
Annie http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif
still quite far from attaining nirvana.
LadyAnn you can order me around even if it is in the wrong place. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/flirt.gif
It always depends. The front left should usually deploy back a bit so as to not get rushed from the start. For the newbie I agree, back left might protect them. Of course, if you want to be mean, you could put them on the right and leave them to their own devices http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wave.gif . But that wouldn't be very nice.
I went with centre cos at least you're not exposed straight away. Speaking as a noob, it really isn't fun when your allies let you face the enemy and get slaughtered (after putting up a spirited fight naturally http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif ) before they move in for the easy kills and then have the cheek to say you did ok http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/angry.gif
whiskeyjack, you dont have to stand the punishment if you dont want to. Withdraw into the cover of your allies if you are doubled or outnumbered.
In the attack, you want your best attacking general on one of the wings. The attack really needs to start there because one side of that army is guarded by map edge.
But the center position is absolutely crucial for the reasons elmo says. In games between 2 very good sides, the reaction and support given by center usually will tip the scales. Center need not be the best attack general, but must be the general with best anticipation and support.
--- Amp the troop pick is critical... but amongst good players they all pick good and so it then comes down to ability.
Well whenever Im on a flank they always attack on the other flank http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/frown.gif
Voted depends , in flat maps its center thats the most important but on hilly / mountain maps the flank is ...
TGI
PS: And put the weakest general on the other team http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif
I voted in this poll long time ago so i don'remember, but it shud be depends.
heh only 2 voted for back left (reserve). imo reserve gen better be smart or left front and center are toast. in many cases i'd say both wings are most important, while center can stay put for a while waiting for an opening. i'm no sun tzu, it's just that this game gives huge advantage over mass route, and it is wings job to herd the router to the other side. If we flip the coin, it's also wings job to hold out from being herd like a cattle http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/smile.gif
well...since I have been gone so long I vote myself reserve (back left) as well as a few of my allies. Back left does not have to think as quickly and can be ordered around like a little monkey...perfect for me http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif
The most able Gen i would say should be at the right as there is high chances he'll be facing a combo attack.
The weakest Gen ( a newbie? ) on the other hand should be at the reserve left to provide support either to the centre or the front left.
For the front left, it should be a Gen who is well verse in offensive approach while the centre guy must be some cool headed dude who can monitor closely on his left and right. IMHO. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/smokin.gif
I would have to say centre because if hes gone the guy on the right is toast and the left has to defeat 3 1/2 armies
so they have no chance unless they are on the steepest hill in the game