Post-BI Imperial Campaign v1.3

I appreciate we're all playing the new BI campaign now (well, I certainly am!) :duel: but what do we know about the effects of the update of the Imperial Campaign (original RTW) from 1.2 to 1.3? There is ZERO documentation on the CD or install directory that I can find dealing with this.

Is the load/save bug fixed? Is the horse archer bug fixed? Is the "feature" where non-Roman factions have to wait for the Roman-initiated Marian reforms to get their upgraded generals gone?

It would be great if CA would release a v1.3 readme detailing the changes like they did for 1.2. If they have, I apologise to them and ask that someone point me to where I can find it.

Best read Kraxis's first impressions thread (yes, it's long but it is all good stuff). Save/load and horse archer bugs seemed fixed. I suspect the non-Romans still need to wait for Marius though.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Barbarossa82

It would be great if CA would release a v1.3 readme detailing the changes like they did for 1.2. If they have, I apologise to them and ask that someone point me to where I can find it.

---

I have a feeling they are going to be adding some things to the "1.3" patch before they release it. :)

It's not out yet, but I bet you that when the standalone patch is released, it will have a readme. I dunno if they will be able to get away with "Download this patch! Never mind what it does exactly... just do it. Wink wink." They will have to at least list stuff that they changed in order to convince a lot of people to download it. At least I hope!

Hi there

On a side note how did you play RTW after installing BI? I know you have to put your RTW disc back in but it will not let me play anything but the prologue. I checked the preference file and First Time Play is False.

Thanks in advance.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YAKOBU

Hi there

On a side note how did you play RTW after installing BI? I know you have to put your RTW disc back in but it will not let me play anything but the prologue. I checked the preference file and First Time Play is False.

Thanks in advance.

---

Well now. That's alarming. I haven't tried RTW after then new install, but will do so posthaste.

For those who are interested, with the 1.3 patch you can now use process_cq, add_money 40000, and create_units cheats unlimited number of times in vanilla RTW.

Hello again ~:wave:

Sorry I found out the answer to my question at the weekend. If you are having trouble playing RTW after the BI expansion then uninstall both RTW and BI. Then reinstall RTW then BI and you are ready to go again.

:charge:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YAKOBU

Hi there

On a side note how did you play RTW after installing BI? I know you have to put your RTW disc back in but it will not let me play anything but the prologue. I checked the preference file and First Time Play is False.

Thanks in advance.

---

Maybe you did a fresh install and have to start the prologue again?

EDIT: Try it and nevermind the pref-file, it may have been altered?

Thanks Magraev, but I had commented further before your post ~:cheers:

heh oh well good for you then ~:)

where can i download 1.3v dammit...can someone please link me

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by The Stranger

where can i download 1.3v dammit...can someone please link me

---

It's not out as the standalone version yet -I read somewhere it's due on Friday - I think they're waiting until BI has had global release before making it available.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Barbarossa82

what do we know about the effects of the update of the Imperial Campaign (original RTW) from 1.2 to 1.3?

---

The battles are better, the AI doesn't break sieges after a reload, AI generals combine with armies and the AI seems to be doing well combining small stacks to form larger armies.

In my Julii (M/M) campaign, by 215 BC Egypt and Brutii are as strong as Julii. Brutii has eliminated Macedon, Pontus eliminated Armenia, Egypt eliminated Selucia, Jullii eliminated Gaul, and Greece Spain and Parthis are just about eliminated. Britannia has taken cities from Germania and Dacia and is expanding. Scipii, Scythia, Thrace, Dacia, Numidia, Carthage, Pontus are medium strength but not expanding. Scipii took Sicily early, but then stopped expanding. I think this is all about the same as it was in RTW v1.2, but the rebel cities are eliminated fairly quickly and retaken if they re-emerge since sieges are not broken. There are only 3 rebel cities on the land accessible map in 215 BC and 3 rebel controlled islands (Crete, Rhodes and Hibernia).

Gaul offered me a ceasefire if I gave back one of their cities. I accepted, and on the same turn Gaul attacked me at a different place on the map. I guess news of the ceasefire hadn't arrived yet.

SPQR was allied with Britannia, and when I, as Julii, attacked Britannia, SPQR broke their alliance with me and gave me a warning. On the next turn, SPQR declared war on Britannia and I got a senate mission to blockade a Britannian city. An enemy SPQR agent was found spying in one of my cities on the same turn. I'm not at war with SPRQ. Scipii and Brutii declared war on Britannia and have remained allied with me throughout all this.

To me the RTW v1.3 diplomacy seems very similar to the RTW v1.2 diplomacy, but I'm not a diplomacy expert as I generally ignore diplomacy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Puzz3D

Gaul offered me a ceasefire if I gave back one of their cities. I accepted, and on the same turn Gaul attacked me at a different place on the map. I guess news of the ceasefire hadn't arrived yet.
.

---

Thats just the Gauls being themselves.

Cool Yuuki, so you're actually playing the 1.3 Imperial Campaign! One of the things that puzzled me was that in the descr_sm_factions text file there's a code line "prefers_naval_invasions" which is either "yes" or "no" for each faction.

Now, this is selected as "yes" for the Saxons in BI and yet none of the factions in RTW 1.3 have the same. Assuming this line actually has some effect on the AI, one might have argued that this should be "yes" for the Scipii faction and also potentially Carthage, Numidia and possibly Brutii...

Any ideas if this would make a difference?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Puzz3D

In my Julii (M/M) campaign, by 215 BC Egypt and Brutii are as strong as Julii.

---

My gosh - that was fast. That's in 1.3 and a fresh campaign? Are you autoresolving all the time or do you just have a lot more time to play than me?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Uriel

My gosh - that was fast. That's in 1.3 and a fresh campaign? Are you autoresolving all the time or do you just have a lot more time to play than me?

---

I autoresolve battles against rebels, but play all the others. I may have put in as much as 30 hours in this campaign in the past 7 days. I would estimate I fight between 1 and 1.5 battles per hour of play not counting autoresolved battles. My total record, which includes naval battles, is 60 wins and 19 losses, at difficulty level M/M. Right now I control 18 provinces with 49,000 denari income, 46,000 expenses and 30,000 in the bank. I got the Marian reforms in 221 BC.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jambo

One of the things that puzzled me was that in the descr_sm_factions text file there's a code line "prefers_naval_invasions" which is either "yes" or "no" for each faction.

Now, this is selected as "yes" for the Saxons in BI and yet none of the factions in RTW 1.3 have the same. Assuming this line actually has some effect on the AI, one might have argued that this should be "yes" for the Scipii faction and also potentially Carthage, Numidia and possibly Brutii...

Any ideas if this would make a difference?

---

I'm playing with fog of war off so I can see the whole map. Scippi might have used sea transport to help take Sicily, but I'm not sure. They did have some troops on ships after taking Sicily, but I don't know what happened to those troops. After taking Sicily, Scippi just built up 5 full stacks at Capua, and around 240 BC it moved one of these full armies all the way up to just north west of the city Vicus Venedae which is owned by Germainia. They then subsequently moved another small stack to the same spot, and there both armies have stayed. Scippi is at war with Carthage, Spain (probably due to naval contact), Britannia (in sympathy with Julii), Thrace (in sympathy with Julii who recently attacked Byzantium) and against the Rebels.

Brutii attacked Appolonia in 266 BC, and I believe that was by sea. After taking that city, they fought Greece for a while, and then went after Macedon who they defeated. I saw Brutii troops on ships during this time. I had a mission to take Bylazora (owned by Macedon) during this time which helped Brutii.

Carthage took Scallabis and Cartho Nova from Spain, but has done nothing else, and they have lost Cordoba to a rebellion.

Unlike the descr_strat file, descr_sm_factions is moddable during a campaign (i.e. effects of modding are instantaneous and don't require a new campaign).

Puzz, I wonder if you could change Scipii to "prefer_naval_invasions" "yes" in this file and see of that has any marked difference on their apparent stagnation on Sicily.

It might be this is indeed the reason, as in all my imperial campaigns I've never witnessed Carthage taking on Spain and apparently winning. It's true that this could be because Scipii have left them alone in N Africa, but Carthage is also labelled as "no" for "prefer_naval_invasions"...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jambo

Unlike the descr_strat file, descr_sm_factions is moddable during a campaign (i.e. effects of modding are instantaneous and don't require a new campaign).

Puzz, I wonder if you could change Scipii to "prefer_naval_invasions" "yes" in this file and see of that has any marked difference on their apparent stagnation on Sicily.

It might be this is indeed the reason, as in all my imperial campaigns I've never witnessed Carthage taking on Spain and apparently winning. It's true that this could be because Scipii have left them alone in N Africa, but Carthage is also labelled as "no" for "prefer_naval_invasions"...

---

Ok I'll try that, but it will have to wait until tonight after work. I have a savegame from 255 BC shortly after Scipii took Sicily where they have two stacks and two ships at Capua. There are already 3 units on one of the ships. I'll start from there.

Also of note is the new diplomatic content at the bottom of the descr_strat file which details the "core attitudes" of the factions to one another and the "faction relationships" (mainly just in relation to slave).

It's possible that the "core attitudes" for the Roman factions haven't been made hostile enough to provoke the early war with their most likely targets, i.e. Julii and Gaul, Scipii and Carthage/Greece, Brutii and Macedon/Greece...

?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jambo

It's possible that the "core attitudes" for the Roman factions haven't been made hostile enough to provoke the early war with their most likely targets, i.e. Julii and Gaul, Scipii and Carthage/Greece, Brutii and Macedon/Greece...?

---

Well I controlled Julii, but Scipii did go right after Greece and Carthage in Sicily, and Brutii was sieging rebel owned Appolonia in 266BC, and went to war with Greece right after taking it and later against Macedon who they eliminated. Britannia went after Germania, Egypt after Selucia and Parthia, Pontus after Armenia, Macedon after Greece, Carthage after Spain. Thrace and Scythia allied. Numidia and Carthage don't seem to be fighting. The AI faction expansions that have occured have been pretty slow and methodical. Except for Brutii, Egypt and Julii (myself) factions do not have large armies, but they all seem to spend all of their money. In 215 BC, I have basically a 10 faction game not counting SPQR since Parthia, Spain and Greece are about to go under and Macedon, Armenia and Gaul are already eliminated. I'm now at war with Carthage, Britannia and Thrace. I don't feel threatened, but I can't quite maintain 3 full armies dedicated to offensive operations either because of the ecomomics. At this point with 49,000 income and 46,000 expenditures, I don't have any offensive armies in the field.

Macedon made quite a few ships but are eliminated now, and Spanish had quite a few earlier but they are down to one city now. Carthage has a few. The AI has been pretty aggressive about attacking what few ships I did send out. I failed to complete about half of the senate missions because I haven't tried to gain naval superiority.

It seems to me that there is a proximity distance beyond which AI factions don't act aggressively even against factions with which they are at war. For instance, Scipii is at war with Britannia and Thrace because I'm at war with those two factions, but Scipii isn't taking any action against them at all, and i think it's because they are not in close proximity to those factions. It's unclear why Scippi moved a full army way up north away from the factions with which it is at war.

Interesting..

Ive modified the descr_sm_factions file in my Pontic campaign, and made the Scipii, Greeks, Carthaginians and Egyptians all prefer naval invasions. I'll also post my thoughts on any new developments.

Did a bit of experimenting myself playing as Julii and just ending turns. The naval transport AI is definitely a bit screwy in RTW 1.3. The Scipii could take Sicily but would go no further, and the Brutii wouldn't even leave Italy, not even to take the rebel settlement of Apollonia...

This is definiely different from 1.2.

I've tried the "prefer_naval_invasion" setting and that didn't appear to make any difference when set to "yes" for the Brutii and Scipii. The only thing I can think of now is to try altering the "core attitude" values at the end of the descr_strat file to see if the Roman factions can be encouraged to be more pro-active in their conquests...

I am definitely of the opinion that the Roman AI is bugged in RTW 1.3. After consecutive Julii campaigns doing very little other than ending my turns, the Scipii and Brutii simply cannot get to grips with naval transport/invasions. Brutii don't land and take Apollonia and Scipii don't do anything more than taking Sicily.

Same here. My Pontic campaign has been going on for 20 years. Brutii still in Italy, Scipii still in Sicily. No expansion whatsoever. Even after modding.

Gauls, Greeks, Dacia are all expanding. In the case of the Gauls, its almost unbelievable how fast, given their ecenomy.

In my unmodded Julii campaign, Brutii did make the jump to Appolonia before 266 BC and expanded after that becoming very strong by 215 BC, but Scipii only took Sicily. I made the change to Scipii to prefer naval invasions, and reloaded my 255 BC savegame. Scipii has already captured all of Sicily in 255 BC, has two ships with 3 units of troops on one of them, and two nearly full armies at Capua. For 5 turns, the ships went back and forth alternately between Messina and Capua, but the troops were never unloaded I suppose because they weren't needed on Sicily. After 5 turns a Macedonian ship passed through the area, and the Scipii ships stopped moving after that for the next 5 turns which brought the game to 250 BC where I stopped testing.

The problem appears to be related to naval transport for the Roman factions:

THe majority of the time, the AI Brutii's armies on the Italian homeland just get on and off their boats repeatedly without the boat actually moving anywhere productive, i.e. Apollonia. It's almost as if the order which the units should be moving is wrong, i.e. the units are leaving the boat before the boat has had a chance to move to Apollonia, or something like that.

One poster over at the .COM managed to break this cycle with a save /reload once which sparked the Brutii into taking Apollonia and therefore into action. Nevertheless, I would say it's definitely not a deliberate design decision as the behaviour of loading ships seems correct. The AI factions are simply not transporting them to the desired locations.

It's clear from Puzz's game that he got lucky and the Brutii did managed to break their cycle of loading and disembarking armies turn after turn on the Italian penninsula. In the 5 tester campaigns where I ran 20+ turns as Julii, the Brutii managed to land on Apollonia once and this was many years down the line once Gaul and Greece were fairly well established. In each of the other occasions, they simply followed this bizarre loading one turn, disembarking the next, without progression from the Italian penninsula.

Scipii never seem to be able to get into North Africa, however, and didn't manage this on any of the testing occasions.

Here's the similar thread at .COM:

http://p223.ezboard.com/fshoguntotal...ID=30203.topic

Well I must say I'm flummoxed. And pleasantly surprised.

Decided to start a new campaign as the Brutii just to see what would happen, and sure enough the Scipii and Julii sat there and sulked. It became so bad that relations between the two deteriorated and they BROKE their Alliance in 260BC!

Is it just me, or is that a major bug?? :book:

Moreover, the Greeks landed at Croton after I took Athens and Sparta - I had modded the descr_sm file, and made them 'prefer naval invasions.' Sure enough they invaded Italy. That was in 259BC. :dizzy2:

Gaul is expanding like theyve won the lottery and have already taken Salona. True to form, they broke the Alliance I had with them...

Bugged?

No real idea. One thing for sure is the Roman AI expands at a much slower rate, Julii included. Maybe it's been planned that way by CA, a deliberate design decision to slow them down and allow the other factions like Carthage, etc, to establish themselves?!

If given long enough, e.g. 200 BC, do the Romans eventually expand?

I remember hearing something about new units for the original RTW after BI, but when I went to play the original after installing the expansion, I didn't see anything new. Are there going to be any new units?

I'm currently playing an imperial campaign as the Julii(H/H) where the Brutii seem to be doing quite well. They've finished off Macedon and are seiging Sparta, after which, the Greeks will be gone from Greece (i've been funneling thousands of denari to the greeks hoping they'd make life tougher for the Brutii, but it hasn't paid off). As others mention, the Scipii seem bewildered after conquering Sicily and arent doing much.

On the balance, I'm enjoying the post-BI imperial campaign more than before- but I haven't really spent alot of time playing it so your mileage may vary. ~:)

For me, two full stack Scipii 'hordes' decided to go walkabout in Russia, even though they still haven't left Sicily. Perhaps they're on a Senate mission. Its ridiculous, really.

I'm at 191 BC in my RTW v1/.3 (M/M) Julii campaign. Brutii has done very well defeating Macedon and Greeks early in the campaign. They now have 16 full armies in Greece, and I can see two 4 star generals. I have four territories which seem to block Brutii from expanding north from Greece. The Greeks were hanging on with a single city, Rhodes, for a long time, and attacked Pontus in Asia Minor, but were thrown back. Brutii attacked Rhodes in 192 BC, and it looks like the Greeks might loose.

Scipii has still not invaded North Africa. Carthage is the dominant sea power, but there are not a lot of ships around. Scipii can only support about 6 full armies. They sent two full armies out of Italy up to the northeast part of the map. One of these armies is near Thrace who Scipii was at war with for a long time, but they never attacked Thrace. Now for the last 20 turns or so, Brutii, Scipii and SPQR have been alternately declaring war with Thrace and then getting a cease fire on on every turn. They are in some kind of diplomatic oscillation with Thrace. Interestingly, Thrace wouldn't accept a cease fire with me after I took one of their cities although I tried for the entire 20 turns since I got two senate missions to establish peace with Thrace.

Dacia has been recently eliminated, Parthia has one city, Spain two cities, Numidia seems to be fighting battles with Carthage, and Egypt and Pontus are fighing each other while Britannia, Germania, Scythia and Thrace are dormant. All of the AI factions spend all of their money except SPQR. I failed to complete about half of the senate missions. With 22 cities, squalor is an issue for Julii, and I'm in the process of garrisoning all but a few of my cities in Italy with town malitia so that economically I can go on the offensive and expand further.

I've been auto-resolving battles vs rebels, and haven't lost a single one. Auto-resolve is giving resonable results. I do take more casualties using it than if I fought those battles, but it would be a bit tedious to play them all out. I find the number of rebel armies to be occuring at a reasonable rate.

I looked at a 220 BC savegame of an RTW v1.2 Julii (M/M) vanilla campaign I had played back in Feburary. I used the same style of play in both campaigns which is to slowly expand Julii by land in a rather conservative way. I can't see the eastern most factions in the v1.2 campaign, but the factions I can see have almost exactly the same distribution as in my present RTW v1.3 (M/M) campaign in 220 BC with the one marked exception that the exact same regions Carthage owns in North Africa in the v1.3 campaign are owned by Scipii in the v1.2 campaign.

I've found a workaround to a bug then brutii and scipii try to load units in transport and then unload them back in next turn.

It seems if you save/load game, after ship is loaded, that naval units won't be bugged. Continue save/loading until they unload them at enemy shore, since otherwise they'll be bugged again and go back.


Brutii condition now seems the easiest to fix.
Just save/load at 2nd turn of the campaign and they'll take Apolonia.

Hi Puzz, a reason for this odd Roman behaviour has now been discerned and a partly workable solution put forward by player1. The problem with the AI Brutii and Scipii early expansions has been linked to yet another issue with saving and reloading, the only difference this time being that saving and reloading appears to HELP correct naval transport AI....

The thread and all the information available on this issue can be found here:

http://p223.ezboard.com/fshoguntotal...art=81&stop=92

Now that the problem hasd been isolated, I'm sure that as time goes by the problem and potential working solution will become even more clear.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jambo

Now that the problem hasd been isolated, I'm sure that as time goes by the problem and potential working solution will become even more clear.

---

It's fortunate that there is a workaround because I see in that thread someone is reporting that The Shogun has said there will be no more patches to RTW/BI. I'm not surprised that CA is drawing the line here, and I even predicted it.

I'll play another RTW v1.3 campaign saving and reloading on every turn to see if there are any other effects, but first i'm going to finish my present campaign.

Thx for the workaround player1. Nice find.

I've seen that someone has reported that something Shogun said too.

But, on the other had, I haven't seem a single thread in which Shogun actually said something like that.

Plus, at mods forums Jerome talked about 1.3.1/1.4.1 that is supposed to fix save game compatibility problems and probably something else.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by player1

Plus, at mods forums Jerome talked about 1.3.1/1.4.1 that is supposed to fix save game compatibility problems and probably something else.

---

Maybe The Shogun made his statement before this problem with naval invasions was known, and CA will reconsider patching it.

It shouldn't be too bad doing "ctrl s" then "ctrl l" each turn. However, let's just hope that saving and reloading each turn doesn't have its own ramifications....

They've now moved that thread to the Bug Repository so that's the last we can post in it over there. I'd be interested to hear people's feedback on this, particularly with regards to the Scipii faction and whether it really helps them. The Brutii really only need to get across to Apollonia and then they're fine from then on. The Scipii are arguably more complicated.

The AI for the Brutii has worked VERY well in 1.3, in my current Julii campaign(started out as a short campaign, as I didn't bother to unlock the other factions manually as it's been a looong time since I played the Romans).

The Brutii almost beat me to taking 15 settlements before me, if they had gone after the remaining greeks in asia minor instead of whacking the Thracians, they would have beaten me to it. I wasn't too focused on whacking the Guls(bloody senate sending me on damnable missions on the other side of my empire...), but still...

The Scipii have stopped expanding after taking Sicily however, their MASSIVE army is camped in Capua. I've changed prefers_naval_invasions to yes, so I'll see if they'll move out... On a side note, if the civil war erupts now, I'm definitely toast :P

Oh, and I play on VH/VH.

I'm playing Julii M/M and the Brutii haven't taken any new cities. Scipii has taken Sicily and Corinth (!??!). They marched a half stack all the way from Capua to Corinth and took the city from Macedon. Go figure.

Bruttii has marched armies to Greece, but they haven't taken any cities.

I tried to jumpstart Brutii by giving them the town north of Appollonia but they wouldn't take it. I didn't try to trade for it; I gave it to them as a gift and they wouldn't take it! The Senate wouldn't take it either, nor would the Scipii. ~:confused:

I'm allied with Macedon, and when Bruttii attacked them, the Senate and Brutii broke alliances with me. Scipii also attacked Macedon and then broke their alliance with me. ~:confused:
After they broke the alliance I tried to start the civil war but the game wouldn't let me (not popular enough).

Phred.. A Scipii stack is likely going to wander all the way through Scythia, Parthia, Seleucid country and end up somewhere near Pergamun. And then its going to walk all the way back. ~:handball:

First thing Im going to do when the civil war starts, Im going to kill a similar Scipii stack in my Brutii campaign.

Well, good news. I gave Scipii Cyrene and that accompanied with the occasional save/reload can really kick-start the Roman factions into action.

It seems Brutii and Scipii have trouble with the initial order for seabound invasions, but a quick save/reload seems to trigger them into action. If you see stacks hanging around the coastline doing little, possibly repeatedly getting on and off ships without apparent purpose or progress, then a quick save/reload seems to solve the stagnation.

Good work for noticing that player 1.

Now if we can only find a cure for the AI not using pila, etc, before attacking...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jambo

Well, good news. I gave Scipii Cyrene and that accompanied with the occasional save/reload can really kick-start the Roman factions into action.

It seems Brutii and Scipii have trouble with the initial order for seabound invasions, but a quick save/reload seems to trigger them into action.

---

An occasional save/load isn't enough to fix this problem. You're going to have to save/load on every turn. In my Julii campaign in 191 BC, Brutii had invaded Rhodes (no doubt due to reloading from a save) but needed reinforcements to beat the Greeks there. They put 6 units on a ship and sent it towards Rhodes, but just as player1 said, on the next turn, that ship returned to the Athens area where it came from. Then I decided to save/load on every turn. On the first turn, Brutii sent the same 6 units toward Rhodes. On the second turn, the ship didn't move, but on the third turn the ship landed the 6 units on Rhodes. On the next turn Brutii beat the last Greeks on Rhodes using those reinforcements. It's as player1 said that you have to keep saving and loading until the voyage completes, and in my campaign Brutii must make naval invasions after conquering Macedonia and Greece since I cut them off across the top of the Balkan peninsula.

I started another Julii campaign not doing anything except saving and loading on every turn. Brutii took Apollonia and sent reinforcements. The Greeks shipped some units from the Peloponnesus to reinforce it's more threatened cities to the north. Carthage semed to ship troops to Sicily and Sardinia, but I don't see them possibly because they are hiding in ambush. Scipii shipped 6 units to Greece, but didn't unload them. They brought them back to Italy and landed them near the Brutii city of Croton. It's 265 BC, so I'm only 10 turns into this campaign, and already there has been a lot of naval movement of troops.

When I had given Scipii Cyrene, I only needed one reload and sometimes I didn't need to reload at all to get them to take units from Capua or Sicily to Cyrene. Once their ships were on their way across the Med, I didn't need reloads for them to continue to their destination.

Maybe, this issue is strictly for naval movement to "enemy" territory? After all, once the Brutii take Apollonia, they don't seem to have problems landing further troops there (or at least not as many problem as when it's a rebel province)...

Yes I think it is issue with naval invasions not just naval transport.

In the campaign where I was saving and loading on every turn, Scipii did send troops to Greece by ship, but they turned around before reaching land and went back to Italy. It looks like they were at war with the Greek Cities the whole time. It's interesting that Scipii is allied with Carthage.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Puzz3D

It's interesting that Scipii is allied with Carthage.

---

Personally, I think it's scandalous.