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I've been wondering about something for awhile, seems it help us Americans understand were you are coming from a bit more. I know for most middle class Americans it isnt to hard to find and buy your own land/house. But for Europeans, how many on this Org own their own land, not just the house, but the land its siting on. And what is your opinion on most Americans owning land so easily? :book:
Here in Finland you can buy land without any problems.:inquisitive:
Wait, you can own...land?
I really don't know.
Not in the Soviet Socialist Republic of France :laugh4:Quote:
Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat
Well, after Kelo v. New London, I wouldn't go trumpeting the average American's ability to "own" land. :furious3:
One thing this posed question tells me about the american psyche :laugh4:Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTex
Too true.
I do want to become a major developer and hound the justices that voted for that. And their families. Send them to a communal... mud hut. Or something.
We (my own family) owns a few acres of land...
I'm fairly sure that most freeholds and leaseholds include the land that the building is on...how would it work otherwise?
Perhaps I'm missing something here.
Actually, according to English Common Law, you have authority over the land, but not ownership. You own the authority, which is about as close as it comes to ownership. Or at least it was like that in the middle ages and reneissance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Big King Sanctaphrax
It's all way to complicated for me to contemplate at 3 AM after a long celebration, so I'll just add my bit and stick to Continental law.
I don't actually own anything, since, until recently I was a minor. My family has some land, although, being city people, don't really concern themselves overmuch with it, that is left to my gradfather, who seems to like working on the land, strange for a submariner. Um, anyway, several apartments, one house and one small cottage (is it still a cottage if it is made of concrete?).
Hahaha, "middle class".....owning land, like, a house on a 1/2 acre lot 6 feet from the next house on the next 1/2 acre lot. I bet thats what most "middle class" owns, better than paying rent, but certainly nothing to brag about.
Doens't Ted Turner own half the land in America?
An english friend of mine lives in the US. He was looking for maps of the area for going hiking and was suprised about how difficult it was to find decent ones (the UK is well mapped to 1:25,000 and the maps are available at local gas stations).
He asked a local and was told 'Well most of the land here is privately owned'
Unlike communist europe where we all live on communal land. And of course you can't make maps of privately owned land... hehehehe.
I own all the land I pee on
So BigTex, why is it so important to own your own land and if it is so important, why is it that some people in your country while working flat out 7 days a week will never come close to that goal? What does that say about your culture?
I don't think it is as straightforward as you would like, since laws will be different in each country of Europe.
For example, I own an apartment in England, which is leasehold. This means I own the right to live in it for a set time (999 years) but pay a fee to the owner of the freehold for the 'land'. AFAIK, all land in the UK actually belongs to the Crown ultimately - an owner can buy the freehold, ie the right to hold the property indefintiely subject to the requirements of the Crown. For example, the government can evict you from your home to build a road via compulsory purchase. So you don't have an inalienable right to the land you 'own'.
In Ireland, my family (and as I'm the oldest son, it's mine) has owned the same patch of wilderness for many hundreds of years. Occasionally, as native Irish prone to foster rebellion, the English Crown saw fit to take it away under attainder, but they usually gave it back. Under the Republic, we got it back under authorised deed. This belongs to us by ancient tradition, right of conquest (in the beginning) and lawful deed. I don't doubt the government could take it away at any time. There are no livable quarters there now, so I live in a house not far away.
The family has a similar situation with a very pretty chunk of France, except that the nasty people who replaced Napoleon (who was very understanding about it) have refused so far to recognise our rights.
My wife owns an apartment in Perm, Russia and her mother in St Petersburg. Both of these were awarded in Soviet times and are therefore completely the State's property, with living rights granted to valuable comrades. In modern Russia, this has metamorphosed into property rights for the current occupants. However, they can now be sold or leased commercially. Previously, if you didn't live in it, it would be taken away.
Finally, I have land rights to a mountain in Chilean Patagonia which was given to me for some services rendered. My deed has recently been re-confirmed by the new president. There's no house there, but you can take a hot bath in the thermal spring. It's mine in perpetuity, according to the deed, but I daresay the native americans who lived there three hundred years ago (and who have a burial site nearby) thought the same thing when it was their mountain.
We were not able to own land in Scotland until 28th November, 2004... until that date it was considered something over which one merely held control and was under the supreme ownership of God...
But my parents own the house in which I sit and the land thereunder...
Only to the depth of a few inches.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke Malcolm
In Belgium land can be privately owned (and most of it is), nut it can be taken away for the the public 'good'. You get some money for it, but nor nearly what it's worth.
As for how easy it is to own your own house, I'm guessing around $500 000 gets you a decent house with a garden here these days. Depends on what you want of course. People take loans from 10 years to (I think) 40 years, with 20-25 being considered normal.
And yes, a lot of new houses are built and most people want to own their own house and end up doing so (often buying up old houses and renovating them). Even lower middle class (honestly, I don't know much about a 'lower class' in Belgium).
You can buy land and houses here no problem.
Take a look at www.yourmove.co.uk ~:confused:
Property law in the US is only about 100 years old. Before that anyone with a gun could clear injuns off and call it home.
That's it works here in Canada. But we call it imminent domain. It means that you may hold the title to the land but the crown can take it anytime it sees fit. They have to pay you fair market value but you have to take it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Haruchai
That's "eminent" domain -- though after Kelo, those of us in the USA might have to worry about your version as well. :laugh4:
Eminent domain is an old doctrine in English property law allowing the government to acquire/take back land needed for a recognized public purpose. This concept has become a part of most of the legal codes in all of the former British colonies (regardless of the means by which they acquired the "former" status).
I am not aware of how the concept plays out in other legal cultures/systems, but suspect most have an analogous concept. Comments from those of you in Code Napoleon or Sharia countries?
Fantastic, a private little empire on which the sun never sets. Man, I would start to plot schemes for global domination. :laugh4:Quote:
Originally Posted by Haruchai
I don't do spell checks for forums, not worth the time. And I figured it was from English law. Ours is 100% base on the English system. Like common law marriages and such, you have a version of that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh
Even a lot of private land here can be hiked on... As Madonna discovered to her cost having bought half of England, and finding it crawling with cameramen.
Something new in this northern outpost of Great Britain since the Abolition of the Feudal System in 2004 is the compulsory right to buy. People renting land now can group together and force the laird to sell all his estate for the market price, whether he wishes to or not...
That's pretty absurd.Quote:
People renting land now can group together and force the laird to sell all his estate for the market price, whether he wishes to or not...
Crazed Rabbit
I dont know how usual custom this is around world,but here we have this thing called Every mans rights. That allows everyone to walk on anyones land unless its guarded private zone like some in the industrial areas.The same rights also allow people to gather berries and mushrooms from any land no matter who´s it is .Also you can Fish with certain basic Fishing equipment on Sea, lakes and ponds anywhere.There are ofcourse limits to every mans rights.When passing through land of others you shouldnt camp in vicinity of buildings and also not go in peoples gardens to gather anything.But anything that grows in the Wild Life you can gather if you want.Im intrested,Has other countries these kinds of rights?Quote:
Originally Posted by BDC
Land is good
Here it's called 'onteigening', wich translates to 'depropertising' or something along those lines. I'm pretty sure we inherented that from our old Napoleonic code.Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh
Usuable land is pretty scarce over here, last time I checked we were in fact the most densely populated country in the world. Such scarcity can royally screw up the proper workings of a free market system, and the high prices of land are the least of it.
During the 80'ties over here, it was so difficult to get your hands on living space that calling it a crisis is an understatement.
Now, selling land or appartments for a high price is much easier when there are no strings attached, such as a tenant wich here has quite some legal rights to prevent him from being evicted. Many property owners here liked to speculate with their property, leaving it empty and sell it a few months later with huge profits. That lead to the paradox that it was incredibly hard to find a place to live, yet cities were filled with empty apartment blocks and houses. Mass squatting was the obvious result.
It's hardly surprising that now under certain conditions, squatting is legal, to prevent the workings of the 'free market' produce results that are socially unacceptable. I find myself in agreement with this, despite that I have no good words for 'squat culture'. Property owners who don't want their property being squatted now would do wise to seek an 'anti-squatter', a quasi-tenant wich doesn't have the same legal protection wich real tenants do.
Sorry for deviating off topic, but I thought it was interesting background information.
opps
Sadly, my sense of humor has not improved much in the ensuing 15+ years. Egad what a nerd I am.