Question for CA: What about Shogun 2:TW?

Dear CA staff,

I'd like to pose this question on behalf of all the patrons who still enjoy Shogun:Total War or the Samurai Warlords mod for Medieval:Total War.

While planning Medieval 2, was there at any moment a discussion to make Shogun 2 instead?
If so, why did you decide to favour the Medieval period?
Where there any researches into customer opinion or did you decide pro Medieval because it was more popular and its release
not that long ago?
Is there any chance that CA will in the future release a Shogun 2 game?

:bow:

I think the answer for the preference is simple: A new MTW was much more liked by the community. 70% of the people wanted MTWII.

:bow:

Oh, i didn't know there was a poll!?

Got a link?

No no no. Not a poll. I was generally speaking.
If you look back at the 3 big forums(TWCom, TWOrg, TWC), you'll see that most of the people want a remake of Medieval TW. There were some voices with STW2, but not much.

~:)

I see.

Still the question remains:

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Is there any chance that CA will in the future release a Shogun 2 game?

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:grin:

I bet its possible. Anything with gunpowder in it will be too confusing for the TW series, sooner or later they will have to revert to that time era again.

Shogun 2? No offence, but all I can say about this idea is "yawn". Shogun was a great game and all, but after Medieval and Rome I simply cannot imagine going back to a game with one culture and less than 20 units. I'd much prefer a game covering the whole of east Asia. I'd prefer it to MTW 2 in fact.

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Originally Posted by Furious Mental

Shogun 2? No offence, but all I can say about this idea is "yawn". Shogun was a great game and all, but after Medieval and Rome I simply cannot imagine going back to a game with one culture and less than 20 units. I'd much prefer a game covering the whole of east Asia. I'd prefer it to MTW 2 in fact.

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Are you talking about a mongol:total war?

Or quite possibly....steppe:total war?

hahha it would be hard to think of either one.

I'd think they *might* consider a Shogun expansion pack to something like MTWII, the basic mechanics (gunpowder) are already in the game, the map is smaller, and there would be less diversity in the units. It would make an ideal expansion imho :2thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by doc_bean

I'd think they *might* consider a Shogun expansion pack to something like MTWII, the basic mechanics (gunpowder) are already in the game, the map is smaller, and there would be less diversity in the units. It would make an ideal expansion imho :2thumbsup:

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I agree to that and hope for STW 2.

And if not so many here asked for STW 2, that might be not because people didn't like it, but maybe because Shogun was the first title in TW, and the TW community was much smaller, at the beginning.

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Furious Mental
Shogun 2? No offence, but all I can say about this idea is "yawn". Shogun was a great game and all, but after Medieval and Rome I simply cannot imagine going back to a game with one culture and less than 20 units. I'd much prefer a game covering the whole of east Asia. I'd prefer it to MTW 2 in fact.

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For me it's not about how many units are on offer, it's about the gameplay.
IMO STW had the best gameplay of all TW games. Although CA could probably squeeeze in some extra fantasy units, for those who like such things.
In RTW I only use a few of the units that are on offer, and dislike having my recruitment queue cluttered with inferior and useless units. This is also where the AI falls down, as it recruits these useless and inferior units causing it to have crap armies compared to my own.

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doc_bean
I'd think they *might* consider a Shogun expansion pack to something like MTWII, the basic mechanics (gunpowder) are already in the game, the map is smaller, and there would be less diversity in the units. It would make an ideal expansion imho

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I think a STW2 deserves it's own release and expansion.

M2: TW will be much better. I don't see CA going back so far...I think the next game after M2 will start a fresh title, such as Napoleonic:TW or Colonization:TW (a setting similar to AoE3) CA cannot avoid gunpowder forever.

"For me it's not about how many units are on offer, it's about the gameplay."

Do I really need to point out how limited the gameplay is when you have one culture and less than 20 units and therefore all factions are predisposed to one style of play?

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Originally Posted by Furious Mental

"For me it's not about how many units are on offer, it's about the gameplay."

Do I really need to point out how limited the gameplay is when you have one culture and less than 20 units and therefore all factions are predisposed to one style of play?

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Yes, please explain how having so many differing units improves gameplay.

Perhaps you just dislike same skins and having different skins gives you the illusion of better gameplay. Because the basic concept of spearmen, swordsman, berserkers, archers, heavy cav, light cav, missile cav, and peasants are all there. In the setting of a japanese civil war similar units are not out of place, and also allow for the game to be almost perfectly balanced with victory going to the better general and not the better faction.

Adding units such as screeching women, head hurlers, chariots, cannons mounted on elephants etc. For me does not improve gameplay. Although I concede that the mass market probably prefers these fantasy type units.

-IceTorque

A Zhan Guo period set in East Asia would be great. ~:thumb:

I would like them to redo RTW most of all, maybe they will finally get it right one day, heres hoping :)

If they do do an Asian setting, I'd like it to be not just Japan, but also Encompess the Northern Steppes, Mainland China, Korea, possibly even India and the Eastern Middle East (o_O) If we get lucky. Japan just seems to boring by itself after getting all of Europe and parts of Africa and the East in two, coming on three games.

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Originally Posted by doc_bean

I'd think they *might* consider a Shogun expansion pack to something like MTWII, the basic mechanics (gunpowder) are already in the game, the map is smaller, and there would be less diversity in the units. It would make an ideal expansion imho :2thumbsup:

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That sounds like a great idea. Perhaps they may even consider doing something like they are doing now with Alexander: TW. I would be far more willing to pay for a S:TW expansion than I am for A:TW.

On the other hand, if there is one certainty about M2:TW it is that someone is going to make a Shogun mod for it, so CA may not feel it worthwile to do this.

That would be a nice idea, instead of beating that dead horse repeatedly (rome), with expansions, why not announce a STW2, I haven't bought RTW:BI, nor will buy ATW, but I shall buy MTW:II (surely) and I would by a STW2. I would say the best games in the entire TW series, were MTW and STW, without their expansions.

WITHOUT THEIR EXPANSIONS? :skull:

Wow man. I can't believe what I'm reading. Vikings Invasion was far much fun than the original MTW. :book:

Rofl. Oh dear, I guess I do have to explain.

"Perhaps you just dislike same skins and having different skins gives you the illusion of better gameplay. "

Perhaps not?

"Because the basic concept of spearmen, swordsman, berserkers, archers, heavy cav, light cav, missile cav, and peasants are all there."

Precisely. Every faction had exactly the same units. And the landscape was pretty much identical all over the country. Ergo no matter which faction one played as one invariably ended up commanding armies of exactly the same composition in every single campaign and using exactly the same tactics; the only difference was at the beginning of the campaign when certain factions already had some buildings an others didn't. On the other hand I found there was alot more variation of playing styles in MTW and more still in RTW. There is a substantial difference between playing as the Parthians and playing as the Seleucids, and a big difference again between playing as the Seleucids and playing as the Romans. And it is even more pronounced in various mods.

"In the setting of a japanese civil war similar units are not out of place,"

Which is exactly why I do not want another game based solely around the Sengoku Jidai.

"and also allow for the game to be almost perfectly balanced with victory going to the better general and not the better faction."

I don't believe it is impossible to balance factions with different unit types.

"Adding units such as screeching women, head hurlers, chariots, cannons mounted on elephants etc. For me does not improve gameplay. Although I concede that the mass market probably prefers these fantasy type units."

Irrelevant. There is a difference between wanting different cultures and wanting crazy units.

What i liked about Shogun was the "feel" of it. Although including the rest of asia would provide great variety in the way of new tactics and units. It would be impossible to retain the unique samurai culture which imo is one thing that made the original game so captivating.

It would be very nice, but CA is not the same as it used to be. I doubt we will see a STW2

How i see that MTW2 will most likely be lot easier platform for Sengoku period Japanese mod(gunpowder units,Hilltop castles,mixed units). We are talking inside our team of the possibility to transport RNJ to MTW2 too,altough the RTW/Bi version is the main focus at this point.:bow:

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Originally Posted by buujin

...CA is not the same as it used to be...

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Really?

Now, admittedly we have taken on some new people -- and hello to them -- and a few old lags have ridden into the sunset, but I just had a quick look round the office and it looks much the same to me. Same old carpet, same old office kitchen, same old happy smiling co-workers' faces, same old miserable curmudgeonly other co-workers' faces, same old ceiling, same old walls, same old desire to produce insanely great games.

On the other hand, whatever I say about the future appearance or non-appearance of a Shogun 2 will cause trouble, so I'm saying nothing. Nothing should be read into the fact I'm saying nothing, either. :hide:

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Originally Posted by Captain Fishpants

Really?

Now, admittedly we have taken on some new people -- and hello to them -- and a few old lags have ridden into the sunset, but I just had a quick look round the office and it looks much the same to me. Same old carpet, same old office kitchen, same old happy smiling co-workers' faces, same old miserable curmudgeonly other co-workers' faces, same old ceiling, same old walls, same old desire to produce insanely great games.

On the other hand, whatever I say about the future appearance or non-appearance of a Shogun 2 will cause trouble, so I'm saying nothing. Nothing should be read into the fact I'm saying nothing, either. :hide:

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Well well well... ~D
It looks like we have someone on our hands...Thanks for telling.

Anyhow, CA is the same old rugged company, but with new rugged face.
AND I WANT TO SEE THE RUGGED STUDIOS!!!!

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Originally Posted by Captain Fishpants

On the other hand, whatever I say about the future appearance or non-appearance of a Shogun 2 will cause trouble, so I'm saying nothing. Nothing should be read into the fact I'm saying nothing, either.

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I get it. So, you're saying that CA already started to work on Shogun 2? :wink:

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Originally Posted by Captain Fishpants

On the other hand, whatever I say about the future appearance or non-appearance of a Shogun 2 will cause trouble, so I'm saying nothing. Nothing should be read into the fact I'm saying nothing, either. :hide:

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That means they are working on Shogun 2!!!! :idea2:

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Originally Posted by Captain Fishpants

On the other hand, whatever I say about the future appearance or non-appearance of a Shogun 2 will cause trouble, so I'm saying nothing. Nothing should be read into the fact I'm saying nothing, either. :hide:

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Ah ha !!
Reading between the lines I finally get it confirmed.:book:
You guys are in fact working on LEGO:TOTAL WAR !!!!:idea2: :2thumbsup:

Mongol Total War would be a better title IMO. The whole of Asia plus Japan as a main campaign, maybe with some separate campaigns that would encompass the Shogun era

........Orda

I would buy Lego: Total War.

Id love to see a new and expanded shogun...I lived and died for that game when it first come out...

Gameplay to me is about game immersion, being drawn into the games atmosphere and not being dazzled by different coloured polygons. As for same armies, well. The different unit types are all there, allowing one to play with different army compositions. When I played Shogun I used to yell at the monitor, mimicking the games broken english. Yes I was totally immersed in the game, I was after all a japanese warlord fighting to become the Shogun.

The subsequent TW games, with their wider troop variety never quite immersed me into the game as STW did. Actually, RTW with it's micro management heavy strat map and it's constant tiny battles and lack of troop build up before it attacked, to me seemed more abstract and surreal and totally un-immersive, despite it's abundance of eye dazzling polygons.

I have no doubt that any future TW games will have plenty of different coloured soldiers on offer. I would just like to be immersed into the games atmosphere as I was when I played Shogun, adding a plethora of polygons or different coloured soldiers, would just be icing on the cake.

-IceTorque

You know, CA really has picked a winning formula. 2nd Generation Warfare has such a diverse and storied history. They could keep on running with this combo for years to come. I mean think about all the possibilities this franchise will be able to engage in! Napoleonic era, the American revolution, the chinese three kingdoms, British colonialism in the 11700-1800s!

I personally look forward to their first dive into the gunpowder era. It still follows the same concept of warfare, but the concept is a tad different. You have redoubts acting as castles, cannons for seige weapons, cavalry, bayonet charges, etc. And once they get their sea model down, we are in for a real treat. We all anticipate a good experince with the sea element but that is such a hard concept to wrap your brain around, given all of the variables involved. Individually controlled shipa are far too complicated. Look at Imperial Glory; their ocean combat model was laborious at best, absurd at worst, and always boring.

OMFG SHOGUN 2 !!!!!!!1111111111 ITS CONFIRMED 8888888888888888 W000T !!!!!!!!!!!!!111111111111


:2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader:

Bless CF and the other CA guys who post on these boards.

However, even my old, shrivelled, miserly, and cursed soul did flip-flops when I read:

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On the other hand, whatever I say about the future appearance or non-appearance of a Shogun 2 will cause trouble, so I'm saying nothing. Nothing should be read into the fact I'm saying nothing, either. :hide:

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My brain is already rapidly spiralling down into:

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By nothing did he mean something or by something about nothing did he really mean nothing except to imply something to those who know nothing?

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Things that make you go hmm... and argh and oof and too... much... thinking...:help:

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Originally Posted by edyzmedieval

WITHOUT THEIR EXPANSIONS? :skull:

Wow man. I can't believe what I'm reading. Vikings Invasion was far much fun than the original MTW. :book:

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Yep, there was nothing like trying to defend Armenia and Georgia, playing Byz or the egyptians, from the mongols. I once fought a battle their that summed up to 25000 casualties, and still lost armenia.

There was also nothing like trying to stop a joined attack on multiple provinces, playing the Takeda.

MTW:VI was too easy for me personally, playing the norwegians, and the game ended too fast.

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Originally Posted by doc_bean

OMFG SHOGUN 2 !!!!!!!1111111111 ITS CONFIRMED 8888888888888888 W000T !!!!!!!!!!!!!111111111111


:2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader:

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Where/When was it confirmed??:dizzy2:

It wasn't. Everyone is just reading too much into Captain Fishpants' post earlier in this thread. He was very specific that nothing should be made of what he said.

Of course, I would absolutely *love* it if Shogun 2 Total War was in development. For the time being, however, I'm assuming there is no such game in the works at this time. I will believe nothing short of CA officially confirming something like this.

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Originally Posted by R'as al Ghul

If so, why did you decide to favour the Medieval period?
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they also said a medieval period would have more units.

id like to see R2TW because of its special units elephants,chariots,phalanxes,testudo formation.

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Originally Posted by Ibn Munqidh

Where/When was it confirmed??:dizzy2:

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Sorry mate, I was just joking :oops:

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Originally Posted by doc_bean

Sorry mate, I was just joking :oops:

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WELL THATS EVEN WORSE, THAT SHOWS HOW LAME I AM!!!:furious3: :furious3: :furious3: :laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:

I guess I'm just 'out of step' but I dont want to see a STW2. In fact, I'm not all that thrilled about MTW2 either (but since its a fait accompli I'm willing to have a look ~;) ). I want new games.

Maybe a RTW2 would be great. :2thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by edyzmedieval

Maybe a RTW2 would be great. :2thumbsup:

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:idea2: We already have that - EB :2thumbsup:

Yeap, true. ~D

But EB needs to be a proper game. :embarassed:

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Originally Posted by doc_bean

OMFG SHOGUN 2 !!!!!!!1111111111 ITS CONFIRMED 8888888888888888 W000T !!!!!!!!!!!!!111111111111


:2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :elephant: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader:

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Oh, for crying out loud!

Look: did I say we were working on Shogun 2? No. I said nothing. I deliberately worded my post so that no inferences about current work or future plans could be drawn.

Sit down, take a red pill and please, do not leap to conclusions. Even "joking" like this has major repercussions when such remarks are picked up and take on a life of their own. Sigh.

As for me, I'm off for a quiet few minutes of despair. Posting here is getting difficult...

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Originally Posted by Captain Fishpants

Sit down, take a red pill and please, do not leap to conclusions. ... Posting here is getting difficult...

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Sorry for any irrititation caused, Captain. I'm going to close this thread so we can all take our red pills.