Harry Potter 7

Hi all,

I got my preorder this morning, nearly finished. I'd say its the absolute best one yet!

Anyway, are you a HP fan? And what are yout theories about the ending.

And please, if you've read it, don't spoil it! :)

My gf bought the book a few hours ago, I plan to steal it when she goes to work and read the last 2 chapters(or so), so that I ind out who dies, and I can walk around smiling and teasing...

Mwhahaha

Badly written, I read it for reputation not worth.

Yeah, I've read it.

Not great, but not bad.

You have to have read it, anyway :grin:

My 11 year-old is killing me for this book.

:jumping: "Is it ordered yet? Can we pre-order? Can we pre-order now? Have you ordered it yet because I really, realy want it so can you pre-order it now? Do you think it will be here Monday if you order it now? Have you ordered it yet? Can you order it yet? Can you order now? I reeeeeeally want it. Did I ask you if we can order it yet? Oh I hope it's here Monday if we order it now. Did you find your credit card so we can pre-order it?"

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v...e/slowpoke.gif Hey guys! Did you know that Snape kills Dumbledore? Golly, I wonder what it's going to be like in the seventh book!

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Originally Posted by Kekvit Irae

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v...e/slowpoke.gif Hey guys! Did you know that Snape kills Dumbledore? Golly, I wonder what it's going to be like in the seventh book!

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Well, if you're asking, I'd be happy to tell you? :grin2:

@Beirut :laugh4:

Judging from things over here, I sincerely doubt that there'll be supply problems and/or the need to pre-order.

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Originally Posted by sapi

Not great, but not bad.

You have to have read it, anyway

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Yeah that's my impression, the style of writing isn't great. But the plot is good.

:tongueg: Nah, I'm a lurker at 4chan, so I got the entire list of the 12 confirmed deaths, plus I bought the book for 17 dollars at walmart.

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Originally Posted by Rythmic

Yeah that's my impression, the style of writing isn't great. But the plot is good.

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Yeah.

What the books excel in is the atmosphere, especially for younger readers.

Minor flaws can thus easily be forgiven.

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Nah, I'm a lurker at 4chan, so I got the entire list of the 12 confirmed deaths, plus I bought the book for 17 dollars at walmart.

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4chan, eh?

*runs :laugh4:

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Originally Posted by sapi

Yeah.

What the books excel in is the atmosphere, especially for younger readers.

Minor flaws can thus easily be forgiven.

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It wouldn't be the cashcow it is today if it didn't appeal to young audiences.

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Originally Posted by Kekvit Irae

so I got the entire list of the 12 confirmed deaths

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I read the site that had the spoilers, somewhat unwittingly.

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Originally Posted by Kekvit Irae

:tongueg: Nah, I'm a lurker at 4chan, so I got the entire list of the 12 confirmed deaths, plus I bought the book for 17 dollars at walmart.

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I'm shocked! I would never have expected to find any fellow /b/tards here on the .org. That is, if you lurk on /b/?

Anyway, i have the page numbers for all the major events. I plan to give them to my friends so they can give in to temptation and ruin it for themselves, absolving me of the blame.

Not a 4chan lurker, but I do occasionally browse /s/ :grin: As for the HP books, I've honestly only read part of the first one... I think.

/b/ and /gif/ for the lulz
/e/, /h/, /s/, and /u/ for the needs :tongueg:
/f/ for the amusement

I've got to give Rowling credit for attempting to wrap everything up. Most people don't bother nowadays.

Rowling hates her characters and have some weird death fetish. How else would you explain 12 deaths in one book? :tongueg:

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Originally Posted by Kekvit Irae

Rowling hates her characters and have some weird death fetish. How else would you explain 12 deaths in one book? :tongueg:

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12? Ouch. Now I'm interested. :clown:

*temporarily bans himself from 4chan and half the internets to avoid spoilers: Org moderators, my Harry Potter virginity is your charge! Be the safe haven from teh spoilers plz!*

I'll just wait for the storm to calm down then buy it, oh well. I don't like consuming entertainment in the midst of a particularly stormy hype and buzz. That tends to make it more about the hype and the buzz than about the book and the Shakespearean tragedy awaiting me.

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Originally Posted by currywurry

I'm shocked! I would never have expected to find any fellow /b/tards here on the .org. That is, if you lurk on /b/?

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/b/!? You mean that board with the most disturbing collection of pixellated drawings to be found on the whole internet!?

I must not say gb2/b/ I must not say gb2/b/

I read 1-5 but I'm not really interested in finding out the ending.

I didnt read HP6 yet.

I've read the first 6 books, and plan on getting the 7th sometime today. I'm rather interested in how its going to end.

Also,@ Kekvit Irae- wtf is that pink thing in your first post?

Pokemon!

When I was reading, I kept going 'Oh, there goes another one' especially the last bit, loved the ending though. That was good.

Ah, I just watch the movies.

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Originally Posted by God's Grace

Ah, I just watch the movies.

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*gasp* BLASPHEMY!!! The movies are awful in comparison to the books. So much gets left out its not even funny. I realize they've got a time constraint and all, but they producers have really just done a bad job for movies 3,4, and 5.

eh...my preordered copy should be in the store today...but Im being lazy right now.

All right, after a selective re-read I've only got one gripe:

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How come J.K. suddenly decided that Ron could speak Parseltongue? I mean, come on.

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Originally Posted by greaterkhaan

*gasp* BLASPHEMY!!! The movies are awful in comparison to the books. So much gets left out its not even funny. I realize they've got a time constraint and all, but they producers have really just done a bad job for movies 3,4, and 5.

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Meh, maybe so. The one thing about the movies and the actors relative to the books (I just went back and realized I did read all of the 1st one) is that I far, far prefer the characters as portrayed by the actors, visually, vs. how J.K. describes them in her book. To me, Daniel, Rupert, and Emma will always be how I imagine Harry, Ron, and Hermoine to look. Natalia Tena will always be the person I imagine when I think of (a very hot) Tonks, not some spikey haired char in the book.

:balloon2:

I only read the first 5 pages of the first book before I got bored. So does somebody mind PMing me who gets offed? And the page numbers they happen on? Thanks.

/b/.... :inquisitive: super odd and weird yet strangely alluring....nvm.
I like the wallpaper sections and the high def areas not to mention the mechs and guns sections too(great wallpapers in those. Other than that I surf Deviant for my "artistic" needs lol.

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How come J.K. suddenly decided that Ron could speak Parseltongue? I mean, come on.

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Yeah, that did seem a bit odd. The ironic thing was that they didn't even need the basilisk fang anyway, as that mystical fire took care of the ravenclaw horcrux. I suppose there was still the need for them to have a way of destroying it, barring that odd coincidence.

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Originally Posted by greaterkhaan

Also,@ Kekvit Irae- wtf is that pink thing in your first post?

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Slowpoke. Wiki it :tongueg:

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Originally Posted by sapi

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Yeah, that did seem a bit odd. The ironic thing was that they didn't even need the basilisk fang anyway, as that mystical fire took care of the ravenclaw horcrux. I suppose there was still the need for them to have a way of destroying it, barring that odd coincidence.

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Ron didn't speak Parselmouth, he imitated it. Quite confusing.

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Originally Posted by Warluster

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Ron didn't speak Parselmouth, he imitated it. Quite confusing.

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And the basilisk tooth was quite handy for mangling the cup from the vault...

I got... uh... emailed... the book, read it in one sitting (when I read, I read)

She's getting been getting more and more arrogant as a writer, you can tell - the books keep getting thicker and, though the plots are undeniably good, the quality of writing is actually pretty poor. Editors generally prune quite a lot of the manuscripts authors churn out - author's are generally too self-invloved to be able to filter out the good from the bad. The cheesiness is, of course, expected in a book aimed at a young audience.

I have a feeling that there were a few plot holes, and/or unsubstantiated leaps of logic, or I may have blanked out every now and then whilst reading - 6.30am is not a time to be finishing a book.

My only gripe with the deaths was

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they weren't really to any of the main characters. Basically to very minor characters and a few secondary.

As for her writing.
I'd say she is more like Dan Brown, who is an awful author but a very good storyteller.

Ah, I don't like JKR's writing, so I just watch the movies.

Harry Potter. Harry Potter? Harry PÓTTER? These books and films are to be collected and placed into a gigantic barrel filled with oil whereafter it is all set ablaze by the staccato of a fighter jet's gun.

*runs off*

Harry Pótter. Hah.

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Rowling hates her characters and have some weird death fetish. How else would you explain 12 deaths in one book?

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Ever read A Song of Fire and Ice. Rowling only killed off a ton of secondaries and non of the golden trio. :(

I have to agree with Sapi the fire was just way to convient.

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I would have preferred the fire over the basilisk fangs, actually. Just to show that the Dark Arts are self-destructive, etc. But it was stupid to use them both. One or the other.

I was really disappointed in some parts.



Snape...
Snape...
Snape...

:indian_chief:

You might wanna put that under spoiler tags.

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Originally Posted by ShadesPanther

My only gripe with the deaths was

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they weren't really to any of the main characters. Basically to very minor characters and a few secondary.

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Hmm, I dunno, I would consider Voldemort a pretty main character, in addition to Snape. So yeah, the trio didn't perish, but some main characters did die, at least imo. Also, as a sidenote, I never imagined feeling sorry for Snape. Guess I was wrong on that one.

My biggest gripes:

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Ron being able to imitate Parseltongue(just seems way too unlikely, even for a story based around magic) and the fact that the end still has me a tad confused(as to how the 'mechanics' of the whole thing worked with Harry and Dumbledore)

Going to get it today. Was a big fan, but now I lost interest.

Is it just me, or are people going to look back at Harry Potter and ask, what the **** was that all about?

As a series it just doesn't seem to work. Books 1-3 are sort of sub Jennings boarding school japes for fairly young children. OK writing but not great. Books 4-5 suddenly take themselves seriously, with, you know EVIL, and civil servants (but I repeat myself). Poor writing, great length. Not really suitable for young children.

Books 6 and 7 I have no idea as I have not read them but I imagine more of the same.

Who is the series aimed at? Narnia, or LotR, have one target audience for the whole series. If you enjoy one, you can read all the others. This series, you can give the first three books to a 7-8 year old, but the last ones need an older reader if only for sheer stamina, not to mention deaths and stuff. On the other hand the first three are too twee for anyone over 10 to enjoy.

IMHO its two mini-series. She got lucky by the time she was writing book 4, readised that adults were, inexplicably, reading her kids' books and she was hot stuff publishing-wise, and went off on a turgid prose mega-bender.

Good luck to her, but I can't see the books having lasting appeal.

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Who is the series aimed at? Narnia, or LotR, have one target audience for the whole series. If you enjoy one, you can read all the others. This series, you can give the first three books to a 7-8 year old, but the last ones need an older reader if only for sheer stamina, not to mention deaths and stuff. On the other hand the first three are too twee for anyone over 10 to enjoy.

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I started when I was 9 or something and now I'm 15 and I enjoyed reading them as I grew up.

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I didn't like the Ron does Parseltongue bit either, seemed a bit convienent. If Parseltongue can be imitated, why can it not be learned like any other language?

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The other thing that bugged me throughout was the fact Harry never once decided to train or even read a spellbook on his 6 months or so of camping. I mean, your being hunted by most of the world, you always knew you would be hunted and now you have weeks to do nothing out in the countryside and what does he do? Sits and bitches like hes in the Big brother house. Even Crabbe done some training and practice and learned some stuff.

Bought it now, I'm on page 35. :grin:
By tomorrow I'll finish it for sure...

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Originally Posted by greaterkhaan

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Hmm, I dunno, I would consider Voldemort a pretty main character, in addition to Snape. So yeah, the trio didn't perish, but some main characters did die, at least imo. Also, as a sidenote, I never imagined feeling sorry for Snape. Guess I was wrong on that one.

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Voldemort was always gonna die though. It was either him or Harry, and while i woulda loved Harry to be killed off in the final fight, being the tragic herio he is, I thought it was highly unlikely.
Snape was also a dead cert to die as well. Although the whole plot with Snape was there if you looked closely enough at the previous books.

Though I did hate

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the whole convenience of Ron speaking parseltongue.
While it would be simple enough to imitate in theory. It's just way to cheesy.

Gripes:

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Ron's ability to remember snake tongue he heard over 5 years ago.
The convenient fire and fangs.
How did Malfoy become master of the wand? Wouldn't he have to beat Snape?
The fighting scenes where horribly written, and half of the plot explaination during them was appalling.

Otherwise I enjoyed it.

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The book is too dark, totally unsuited for kids as young as 10-12 years old. The scene where Voldemort "violates" Dumbledore's tomb to take the Elder Wand, that is waaay off the mark.

Plus, I did find some things really sad, like the death of Hedwig and Dobby.

Spoiler tags, Edz?

They won't quite be necessary here. ~;)

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Originally Posted by Rythmic

Gripes:

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Ron's ability to remember snake tongue he heard over 5 years ago.
The convenient fire and fangs.
How did Malfoy become master of the wand? Wouldn't he have to beat Snape?
The fighting scenes where horribly written, and half of the plot explaination during them was appalling.

Otherwise I enjoyed it.

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Well He said it to open the locket (which btw was so obvious was the way to open it when he got it)

Malfoy became master because he disarmed dumbledore when he entered the tower in book 6.

I agree some of the fight scenes were poorly done

Anyone here go to Mugglenet forums?

Just finished it, reread the first five books over the weekend and stated the sixth on monday.

Overall I feel I've been overly critical of the series and that it is indeed a very good series. Not many fantasy series maintain a decent level of quality throughout 7 books (wheel of time .... ugh). The latter books are somewhat darker than the first few and aimed more at adults I'd say, though having reread the second and third book, they aren't exactly 'nice' books either.

The one big gripe I have with the series (I have several smaller ones too) is how one dimensional the 'houses' are portrayed, Slytherin=bad, Griffindor=good, Ravenclaw:okay, Huffledepuff=means well. Otherwise I feel most characters really grew throughout the series and the general plot really deepened (I didn't realize how much of a turning point the fourth book has been).

I didn't think there were too many deaths, considering the circumstances.

Good grief, this Potter mania is beginning to leach into my dreams, even though I haven't read the book yet, or seen the film. It basically involved me accompanying Harry Potter to the cinema, where he had his last fight with Voldemort and was killed. However, Voldemort didn't turn out to be such a bad chap in the end, so I decided to live out the rest of my days in BKS's and Beirut's Kingdom of Peace and Love, where I knew I would find sanctuary. Man, I visit this forum too much.:embarassed:

No you don't. You're as sane as we are all. ~;)
Half through it, I'm at the Gringotts chapter.

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Originally Posted by Marshal Murat

Anyone here go to Mugglenet forums?

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I think more people visited that in the past 72 hours than the number of people who visited the Org in an entire year.

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Originally Posted by edyzmedieval

I think more people visited that in the past 72 hours than the number of people who visited the Org in an entire year.

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5 years...

My BIG gripes.

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- Ron speaking Parseltongue...cheesy :inquisitive:
- Ron marries Hermione... that is waaay off the mark :shocked2:
- In the ending, Voldemort fires an Avada Kedavra to Harry, but he doesn't die, and instead, goes to visit Dumbledore
- the epilogue is weird really
- the book is TOTALLY unsuited for kids

And the biggest one of all

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- the sad thing which is called ENDING. I started reading HP when I was 9 years old, and all this time I really liked the books, and now it's over. ~:mecry:

Plus, some characters die, like Fred, Tonks, Remus and even Hedwig and especially Dobby.

Now comes the flood of fan fiction with

1. Poor writing
2. Bad plots
3. Made-up spells

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Originally Posted by edyzmedieval

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- In the ending, Voldemort fires an Avada Kedavra to Harry, but he doesn't die, and instead, goes to visit Dumbledore

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That was actually fairly well explained, and I could understand that happening. My biggest gripe with the whole Voldemort-Harry thing was:

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The duel at the end! Both of them only fired a single spell, and Harry's just happens to hit Voldemort's and rebound it directly at him. A longer and better-written duel would have added some depth and would have been much more realistic. Also, this way Harry doesn't even have to kill Voldemort, Voldemort essentially kills himself, though it was by accident. Honestly, just because Rowling wants her hero to be a saint doesn't mean he can't use Avada Kedavra on someone who deserves it.

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Originally Posted by Evil_Maniac From Mars

That was actually fairly well explained, and I could understand that happening. My biggest gripe with the whole Voldemort-Harry thing was:

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The duel at the end! Both of them only fired a single spell, and Harry's just happens to hit Voldemort's and rebound it directly at him. A longer and better-written duel would have added some depth and would have been much more realistic. Also, this way Harry doesn't even have to kill Voldemort, Voldemort essentially kills himself, though it was by accident. Honestly, just because Rowling wants her hero to be a saint doesn't mean he can't use Avada Kedavra on someone who deserves it.

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I really did hink that Harry would kill him with Avada Kedavra. But It was the wand unable to kill it's master thing. Well why did it kill Harry fine out in the woods??

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Originally Posted by edyzmedieval

My BIG gripes.

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- Ron speaking Parseltongue...cheesy :inquisitive:
- Ron marries Hermione... that is waaay off the mark :shocked2:
- In the ending, Voldemort fires an Avada Kedavra to Harry, but he doesn't die, and instead, goes to visit Dumbledore
- the epilogue is weird really
- the book is TOTALLY unsuited for kids

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-He imitated it, which I found hilarious. The further along the series goes the dumber/arrogant Voldemort looks and how easier it seems to get to defeat him. He starts off as this big, immortal, nearly invincible wizard and in the end gets blown up by his own wand.
-Their relationship has been coming since book four, at least
-That part is pretty complicated, essentially: Harry did die, in doing so Voldemort destroyed the Horcrux (which was not fully bound to Harry's soul, since he was shielded by his mother's love), that was baby Voldi in the station, the station is the place between life and death, where he could talk to the ghost of Dumbledore, he did however have a tiny connection with life left (the blood bond with Voldemort), harry had united the Hallows and apparently had become 'the master of death', so he could return to life with the Horcrux destroyed. I'm not entirely sure how important the blood bond is though, that part got pretty complicated
-The epilogue indeed doesn't seem to match the tone and writing of the rest of the book, however, it does tie in with the first book. I could have done without it.
-Kids love this kind of stuff ! I thought HBP was worse with all the soul splitting though, but perhaps for reasons most kids could not understand (non-religious reasons at that). The latter books do seem aimed more at adults than kids, but can be enjoyed by both I'd say.

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Originally Posted by ShadesPanther

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I really did hink that Harry would kill him with Avada Kedavra. But It was the wand unable to kill it's master thing. Well why did it kill Harry fine out in the woods??

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I think it was because this time he called out for the wand, in the first fight he actually wanted to die so the wand did his bidding ? Essentially the spells collided (like in the Goblet of Fire) but Voldemorts was pressed back immediately and he was hit by both spells ?
I agree the line about the wand not willing to kill the master is confusing and could possibly indicate something else. However, I've long since come to accept the little inconsistencies in HP...

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The wand was allowed to "kill" Harry the first time because Harry allowed it to happen (i.e. he didn't fight back) and because it knew Harry wouldn't die because he owned all three Hallows. The second time was when there was actual fighting involved, so that's when it betrayed Voldemort.

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

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The wand was allowed to "kill" Harry the first time because Harry allowed it to happen (i.e. he didn't fight back) and because it knew Harry wouldn't die because he owned all three Hallows. The second time was when there was actual fighting involved, so that's when it betrayed Voldemort.

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Well, as doc_bean says:

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He starts off as this big, immortal, nearly invincible wizard and in the end gets blown up by his own wand.

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You'd think Voldemort would have thought of that at least enough to prolong the duel. Remember, with Dumbledore dead Voldemort is the most powerful wizard in existance. Surely he could have thought of something besides a bit of banter before his rebounding curse killed him. That duel was just cheesy.

I was wrong:

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Originally Posted by doc_bean

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-That part is pretty complicated, essentially: Harry did die, in doing so Voldemort destroyed the Horcrux (which was not fully bound to Harry's soul, since he was shielded by his mother's love), that was baby Voldi in the station, the station is the place between life and death, where he could talk to the ghost of Dumbledore, he did however have a tiny connection with life left (the blood bond with Voldemort), harry had united the Hallows and apparently had become 'the master of death', so he could return to life with the Horcrux destroyed. I'm not entirely sure how important the blood bond is though, that part got pretty complicated

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It's actually the blood bond that makes it impossible for Voldemort to kill Harry, but the Voldemort part of him was destroyed by it (since it's dark magic it can destroy a Horcrux).
Harry was the master of death because he had indeed united the three Hallows, but that he came in possession of all three doesn't seem to have him the master of death, rather he got because he WAS the master of death all along, the one who greeted Death as an equal and accepted it. Ultimately I guess the Hallows where more symbolic than anything else, after all, Dumbledore DID defeat Grindelwald when he had the wand (and was the rightful owner).
Of course, this would imply some sort of reverse causality since the wand came into his posesion through a series of coincidences, yet was destined to do so.


Like i always said, HP books are enjoyable, but don't stand up to well against scrutiny...

I have way too much time on my hands...

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Originally Posted by doc_bean

I have way too much time on my hands...

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[Dumbledore] Alas, Harry, that is, indeed, the truth... [/Dumbledore]






























:grin:

OK, halfway through book 6. Starting a bit of a ways into 3 these books really don't strike me as something that would be... appropriate... for younger children.

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Ron and Hermione need to friggin' give up and just shag already. :rolleyes:

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Started well but did seem to drag on in the middle then rush to a quick conclusion near the end. It seemed as if the author almost ran out of ideas and patience and hastily penned through the destruction of the remaining horcruxes in a matter of a chapter or so.

I was disappointed with how the really rather engaging Horcrux story that had been started in the previous book had been accelerated to it's ultimate anticlimax. The first Horcrux, the locket was surrounded by an interesting plot, was hidden in a location that contributed towards the plot of the previous book, clearly required the sword of Gryffindor to destroy it and it's destruction was dramatic. The locket takes most of the book before it can be destroyed, the cup takes quite some retrieving and the idea of the Gringotts break in is interesting, though this is where it all starts to go wrong with the far fetched escape on the dragon. Once they arrive back at Hogwarts the plot and quality of writing nosedives with the poorly put together, and rushed through destruction of the tiara in the room of requirement by the fiend fire. Ron and Hermione are unrealistically absent from the plot later on and then return with the destroyed cup - basilisk fangs, chamber of secrets etc - this takes away from the importance of the sword somewhat, the fang is acceptable against a soft organic book but not against metallic items such as the ring, locket, cup and tiara. Then Neville Longbottom turns up with a sword, which turns out to be the sword of Gryffindor and unceremoniously beheads the serpent - just to get that one out of the way and save a few pages. All far too easy and convenient. I'm not entirely sure how the sword magically made it's way from Griphook the Goblin, last seen in Gringotts, to Hogwarts ending up in Neville's hand... perhaps I missed that bit somewhere?

The way that Voldemort was destroyed did make some sense however. As I understood it, Harry was the true master of the Elder Wand as he had acquired it from Draco Malfoy who had been the previous master. His disarming of Malfoy and taking of his own wand caused the Elder Wand to recognise Harry as it's master, this is why Voldemort's curses against Harry with that wand had all failed - the first killing the Horcrux inside harry and the second rebounding and killing Voldemort with his own curse. It made sense that Voldemort would bring about his own end, though the whole scene of his demise seemed rather contrived.

As to the deaths, they were far too clinical and callous from the author's perspective. Central characters killed off with hardly a mention, especially in the case of Snape, one of the Weasley twins, Remus Lupin and Nymphadora Tonks. Killing off for just for the sake of it just to boost sales with the "who get's killed off?" mania.

I liked the book, and the previous 6 better, but I do think it could have been so much better if the last few chapters had been better thought out and not rushed through to conclusion.

I whole-heartedly agree Caravel, it did seem incredibly rushed especially towards the end.

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Originally Posted by Caravel

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The way that Voldemort was destroyed did make some sense however. As I understood it, Harry was the true master of the Elder Wand as he had acquired it from Draco Malfoy who had been the previous master. His disarming of Malfoy and taking of his own wand caused the Elder Wand to recognise Harry as it's master, this is why Voldemort's curses against Harry with that wand had all failed - the first killing the Horcrux inside harry and the second rebounding and killing Voldemort with his own curse. It made sense that Voldemort would bring about his own end, though the whole scene of his demise seemed rather contrived.

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That's how I thought at first, but remember the last major duel with the Elder Wand. Grindelwald was an extremely powerful wizard, and the rightful owner of the Elder Wand. At the time, he was about equal with Dumbledore, and yet Dumbledore defeated the Elder Wand and took it from Grindelwald.

Harry, on the other hand, was never as powerful as Dumbledore, and Voldemort was almost as strong as Dumbledore, as evidenced by their duel in book five. Whereas Grindelwald and Dumbledore duelled for a long time, with the one who did not have the Elder Wand winning in the end, Harry and Voldemort each send one curse, and Voldemort just dies. You'd think that Voldemort could at least have put up some resistance, seeing as he was much stronger than Harry.

It seems that main characters nowadays can't die, unless of course their evil. Of course there are some exceptions, but mostly it's true. I truely hate it, they've become predictible to the point where it's not really worth the time. Too me at least.

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Originally Posted by Caravel

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I was disappointed with how the really rather engaging Horcrux story that had been started in the previous book had been accelerated to it's ultimate anticlimax. The first Horcrux, the locket was surrounded by an interesting plot, was hidden in a location that contributed towards the plot of the previous book, clearly required the sword of Gryffindor to destroy it and it's destruction was dramatic. The locket takes most of the book before it can be destroyed, the cup takes quite some retrieving and the idea of the Gringotts break in is interesting, though this is where it all starts to go wrong with the far fetched escape on the dragon. Once they arrive back at Hogwarts the plot and quality of writing nosedives with the poorly put together, and rushed through destruction of the tiara in the room of requirement by the fiend fire. Ron and Hermione are unrealistically absent from the plot later on and then return with the destroyed cup - basilisk fangs, chamber of secrets etc - this takes away from the importance of the sword somewhat, the fang is acceptable against a soft organic book but not against metallic items such as the ring, locket, cup and tiara. Then Neville Longbottom turns up with a sword, which turns out to be the sword of Gryffindor and unceremoniously beheads the serpent - just to get that one out of the way and save a few pages. All far too easy and convenient. I'm not entirely sure how the sword magically made it's way from Griphook the Goblin, last seen in Gringotts, to Hogwarts ending up in Neville's hand... perhaps I missed that bit somewhere?

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I thought the evolution of the horcrux quest mirrored the way Voldemort destroyed his own soul/self to make them. The first Horcrux was the diary, which was extremely powerful and dangerous and capable of 'resurrecting a new Tom Riddle'. The second one was the ring, hidden in a place not many would find, capable of killing anyone who puts it on, it ultimately was the reason Dumbledore died. The third one was the locket, also well hidden and well guarded, yet wasn't cursed in the way the ring was cursed, it did almost kill harry and like the diary, seemed capable of resurrecting it's own Voldemort (the locket is arguably a more dangerous/better Horcrux than the rind, but we do find out about it sooner too). The cup was hidden in Gringotts, a place deemed impossible to rob by common means, yet was not protected by 'dark magic' like the previous two items. The tiara was hidden in the RoR, perhaps because Voldemort was arrogant enough to assume he was the only one who could enter the room to retrieve something (he must have realised people could always use it to hide stuff, yet they never seemed to have retrieved what they had hidden), an incredibly arrogant assumption and weak protection. Nagini was an animal and thus generally considered unfit to make into a horcrux, yet he did so anyway. With each additional horcrux he created he became less human, but more arrogant and careless, convinced of his own superiority.

The sword of griffindor was never really needed to destroy a horcrux, they should just destroy them beyond (ordinary) magical repair. Dark magic fits this definition very well (Snape was capable of 'curing' or 'countering' dark magic, but almost everyone else said wounds caused by dark magic don't heal, even Snape couldn't fully reverse the effects), the fiendfyre thing was rather cheap, but also not totally a deus ex machina. Same with the basilik fang.

I agree that the pacing wasn't brilliant but I didn't think it was in the other books either (book 1 and 4 were worse imo).

But like I said, HP isn't good because of it's solid plotting and consistent world, it's good because of the characterization and the sense of adventure.

Caravel is truly right. Indeed, it rushed from the middle to the end, and there are some things which are a bit weird, such as Ron and the Chamber of Secrets.

Cheese!

My gripes:

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As usual for HP, the climax hinges on multiple fundamental aspects of magic which are expected to be logically apparent to the 'muggle' readers having never been even considered by generations of wizards. Even worse, they just happen to favor the good guys, when there is no logical reason why they couldn't just as easily favor the bad guys. One is forced to conclude that either wizards are, by and large, idiots with little or no understanding of their own powers or the author has little respect for her readership. This is consistent throughout the HP series, critical story elements get their introduction mere moments before they alter the whole way the storyverse works.

Secondly almost all of the deaths occur 'off camera.' 400 pages of Harry sitting in a tent brooding, and we can't get a paragraph for Lupin and his wife?

Thirdly why do only dead people get depth? Dumbledore is nearly a one note living saint... while he's alive. Then, even as his slanderers in the story are mocked, the author proceeds to slander Dumbledore in a completely unecessary side story that puts him in a wizarding version of the Hitler Youth for a few months, and then lets him help kill his sister. Then we see that Snape did it all for love. He wasn't redeemed or trustworthy, he was just lovesick and a little dumb, so he ate a bad death and got Potter for his confessor. All part of Harry growing up you say? But it's the pattern that matters, only the bad guys and the dead guys get nasty things said about them.

Fourthly, length. The best part of the early books was how vividly they created a unique storyverse with fun rules and characters. The worst part of the later books was how desperately JKR drug them out, stretching scenes of supposed angst for whole chapters of inanity.

Now, the good parts:

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As with all the Harry Potter books, the world in which it exists is well and cleverly evoked. I've barely touched ground in London, but the descriptions ring true to what I know of England, but with a very obvious overlay of magical flair.

The characters really have grown up. From what I remember, being a teenager was a lot like spending months wandering around, brooding in a tent. Not that I wanted to read about that part of it. :p

The books are very easy to read. They flow naturally from one element to the next, and until the end you don't feel like you've missed much of importance.

Finally, JKR is a native story teller. She knows how to create a good tale and keep it moving and interesting. Yeah, it drags, but not so much that you put it down. If the writing sometimes fails, the ideas themselves keep coming up fun.

Conclusion:

If you've read the others, don't miss it. If you haven't, you can find ample better fantasy series to read.

My new favorite word is "snog". You brits really have some hilarious slang terms. :laugh4:

Second, I gotta give J.K. some credit where it's due, she does a great job on throwing in those extremely random one liners, esp. the booger humor from the Weasley Twins.

Third, I couldn't agree more with Caravel's comments. The last bit just feels incredibly rushed. And the epilogue is woefully inadequate in my view. Nevertheless I'd say overall the books were good and the story was compelling, and I'm glad I read them.

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LOL @ The spoiler tags

I have to admit I'm annoyed that not once did anyone say "innit". Obviously no Chavs in the book (Thank Christ).

Well, I'd better be off "snogging" some girls because I've already finished HP7. :grin:

:laugh4:

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Wasn't the best Potter book but It was decent.

1. Neville beheading the serphent wasn't cheap. Only an incredibly brave person can get the sword and if you follow the series Neville is braver than anyone outside of Harry so he got his reward.

2. Diary+locket+ring+cup+diadem+snake+Harry+Voldemort= 8 pieces of soul. Wasn't Voldemort supposed to have a 7 piece soul?

3. Dumbledore could easily have blown Malfoy into little bits but he used that split second to immobilize Harry instead. Basically he surrendered to Malfoy giving Malfoy possession of the Elder Wand.

4. Yeah the last fight was dissapointing but even without the Horcruxes Voldemort is a hundred times better than Harry so Harry needed a random lucky spell to win.

5. Yes, the books do get a lot darker and 5,6,7 are probably not good for little kids but remember that the little kids that started reading the series are now in their mid to late teens.

6. Oh, and in my opionon Harry treated Ginny like crap