I HATE Assassins!

I just fought the most epic battle of my Sicilian campaign so far. My full stack army consisting of General, Rodeleros, Muslim Archers/Crossbows, Chivalric Knights, and Cannon; against about 1 and 2/3 English stacks, each with General and consisting mostly of Billmen, Dismounted English Knights, Feudal Knights, and Mortars/Trebuchets. I was impressed at the AI building such an army.

Anyway, our armies met outside Caen, and despite a few concerns with my Rodeleros getting Shaken, I won in the end with 1770 kills to about 250 and 150 for the two enemy armies. It left Caen with a small garrison. That one battle paved the way for my conquest of the mostly defenceless British Isles. So I was absolutedly delighted and waited to see what traits my General would pick up (and as a little bonus I got a historic battle marker, a nice feature, and the first of this campaign).

However, as soon as the enemy armies disappeared off the campaign map, my General fell and left a Captain in command. I was then informed he had been killed by an emeny assassin. All my other Generals are fighting wars in the east against the Hungarians, Byzantines, Venetians and rebels at Rhodes (bar one General besieging Valencia, then I will own all of Iberia).

So now I just have to pray this army can cope without the necessary morale boost if I assault Caen, and hope it does not rebel as captain stacks often seem to do.

So you can see why I hate assassins.:wall:

EDIT: Rodelros = Sword-and-Buckler Men

I learnt that the hard way too, which is why now whenever I am invading with any stack including a General, I always cary a spy with them. That always seems to foil the assassins attempts as it must give the general a bonus of some kind.

I also keep spies in my freshly aquired provinces too, as more often than not the AI faction that I just took it from sends 3 or 4 assassins in against my defending General.

Yep, assassin does just as well in case you run into some annoying witch.... having your general cursed isn't a picnic either.

What is a Rodelero?
And why are you using Chivalric Knights as Sicily? I'm playing Sicily too now and I have stuck to using Norman Knights because as far as I can see they are just as strong as Chivs and donot require any stables.

Rodeleros=Sword and Buckler men. I think Chivalric knights have a higher charge value than Norman knights, so that could be why he's using them. Personally, I prefer Norman knights for the flavor. :yes:

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Originally Posted by Philbert

What is a Rodelero?
And why are you using Chivalric Knights as Sicily? I'm playing Sicily too now and I have stuck to using Norman Knights because as far as I can see they are just as strong as Chivs and donot require any stables.

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Hm, i never had any problems with generals being assassinated.

My problem is that my generals keep dying of age right before important battles. Just as if the tenseness of the situation isn't all good for their blood pressure. So no assassins needed by the enemy... ;)

Spies help somewhat in fending off foreign assassins, but having an assassin travel with the general is even more effective.

The AI normally tends to target generals only when they are inside a settlement. It is very rare for them to hit targets outside, although it does occur. In general, the AI doesn't tend to use assassins a lot unless they randomly managed to build an inn or higher.

Sorry I forgot to mention by Rodeleros I meant Sword and Buckler Men, I have no idea why I called them that.:shrug:

I normally have used Norman Knights since they look cool and are easier to retrain than the Chivalric Knights, but there's only 70 or so turns left and everywhere seems to be a Citadel, except Rhodes which had isolated itself from the civilised world.

I'll try putting Spies in with my armies now, I have a Master Thieves Guild in Milan...

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Originally Posted by Caledonian Rhyfelwyr

Sorry I forgot to mention by Rodeleros I meant Sword and Buckler Men, I have no idea why I called them that.:shrug:

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Too much Aoe3?

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Originally Posted by Caledonian Rhyfelwyr

I'll try putting Spies in with my armies now, I have a Master Thieves Guild in Milan...

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Put assassins in.

this happenened to me in Barbie Invasion. i played the marvellous mounted Sarmatians, horde settled in Greece, took nearly a hundred turns to sort out the debt and get to churn out Nobble Horsemen / bosphoran spears, beat the WRE force of 1st cohorts and auxilia palatina, take Ravenna, lovely "Sarmatian warlord " ancillary, bam! assassinated. next turn the heir assassinated. game over!

its the cool thing about the turks esp. in crusades, they seem to have a special affinity with assassins. "he should Not have offended you, Sultan."

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Originally Posted by FactionHeir

Too much Aoe3?

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I've never even played AoE 3. How bizarre.:dizzy2:

I decided to join the Assassins haters Club ~D.

During the last two turns of my game, I lost two of my generals to the assassins, one governing Vienna, and one leading an army near Vienna, defending Hungarian border. They were probably the victim of the same assassin.
Can't wait to find him ...:hanged:

Don’t be too hasty in hating them. Did you know that when an assassin take out a church that it lowers that factions standing with the pope. You can get a faction roundly hated by the old man if you can keep them from rebuilding…

I love my own assassins

I hate everyone else's - luckily when you find them they are easy to assassinate!

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Originally Posted by Fisherking

Don’t be too hasty in hating them. Did you know that when an assassin take out a church that it lowers that factions standing with the pope. You can get a faction roundly hated by the old man if you can keep them from rebuilding…

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Agree! I build them by the tonne and send them out to do in all the opposition family members. That makes for easier battles. Also, build them up in reputation by doing in those pesky rebel armies......and of course the enemy assassins.........:whip:

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Originally Posted by Tanaquil

this happenened to me in Barbie Invasion.

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Barbie Invasion? Was that released by Mattel? :clown: :laugh4:

:sweatdrop:

Thankyou, thankyou, I'm here all week.

Oh geez, i need :help: :wall:

Actually, It was a Russ Meyer film.

And, like many of his films, is currently available on LAZERdisk.


:belly:


Well OK, many of his films are still available on lazerdisk.



What I personally find a bit empty about assassins, as well as spies, is that they maintain a gender bias when it is unnecessary. Perhaps it's too difficult for them to have a boy/girl system of identity linked with the little imaginary images of people walking around inside my computer. Or maybe they just didn't think about it.:washing:



I want CA to bring back female assassins, like in their first title.



I bet Russ Meyer would like it too.

I don't remember ever seeing an enemy assassin to squat. The ones I have run into seem always to be level 2 o3 . I've even let them hang around my city with a general in it. If they ever have attacked I've never known about it. I don't ever remember having a sabotage done on me in 10 months of playing on v/h difficulty. Well, maybe I'll luck out soon and get to join the club of victims.

I Love my Assassins....And have never encountered anyone else's.

I have this one Assassin, Who's currently wreaking havoc in one fo my enemies castle's..Let see them rebuild the Garrison HQ 5th time!! *Insert Evil Cackle*

I remember while playing as Venice I had the perfect conquest planned, a young family member with loads of command to lead the massive high-tech army of death. The turn I was going to attack, he of course got assasinated by some mong who thinks it's fun to ruin the plans I'd laid for a looong time.

The reason this affected me so, is that I don't start a conquest without a family member to be the general, and this guy was the only one below the age of 56 (he was 21 methinks). For some reason my family had stopped breeding, so in this campaign I had to start adopting (noooo! My perfect bloodline ruined :()

Not to hijack but my awesome general deaths come from floods and earthquakes that are seemingly miles away from the character...sigh

is there an age below which a character won't die of old age? i'm suspecting an unspotted assassin did in my king...

I've never seen a General die before 60 years old, though they are nearly always dead by 62.:shrug:

Although once there was a Pope that live to 64, and even a Spanish General who lived to 68! He seemed to live until I moved my spy away and so got covered in a fog of war. When I moved the spy back the next turn, the general was gone.:fainting:

Sometimes they die late-50s... but usually 60 seems to be the mean.

I've found that you can easily get through the game without recruiting a single assassin or merchant. By "get through" I mean conquer all 108 provinces without batting an eye.

IF you feel like doing things the cloak and dagger way, they come in handy.

Personally, I like to assemble the largest fighting force history has ever seen, and steamroll over as many factions simultaneously as possible. This way everyone knows exactly where the threat is coming from, and which emperor to bow down to.

I prefer to be the most feared and powerful despot in all of the world, rather than a man who knows how to train and hire a few blades.

Like Han Solo, I prefer a straight fight to all this sneaking around.

If I were to train spies and assassins, they would be useful merely for swatting my rivals' agents like flies.

And then your new subjects will say, 'sure he slaughtered all of our extended family and plundered our city, but he did give us pizza in return' 'yep, there is that'.

I've found another reason to hate assassins.

One inquisitor was giving me a hard time, executing my priests and generals all over the place. So I sent an assassin after him. He failed and got caught. As a consequence, the Pope, my long time ally (with military access) canceled the alliance. Now I have to spend some money to regain the old man's favor, and work hard to restore a lost reputation. :thumbsdown:

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Originally Posted by DVX BELLORVM

I've found another reason to hate assassins.

One inquisitor was giving me a hard time, executing my priests and generals all over the place. So I sent an assassin after him. He failed and got caught. As a consequence, the Pope, my long time ally (with military access) canceled the alliance. Now I have to spend some money to regain the old man's favor, and work hard to restore a lost reputation. :thumbsdown:

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Yeah. That's why I hate the old man.

Even though he can call crusades for me, I'd much rather he not even exist. He is much more trouble than he's worth.

He's a hypocrite. He can slay my generals all he wants with inquisitors, violating "thou shalt not kill" and the Christian code of "turn the other cheek" and the golden rule AND judge not lest ye be judged. He can call crusades against people that have done him no harm. Then he excommunicates me for slaying HIS assassins (inquisitors) and attacking people who HAVE done me wrong (like aggressor catholic natons).

So he's nothing but a big fat hypocrite in a dress and a pointy hat. I hate that man.

Apologies to all real-world catholics, this anger is not meant for you, but for previous popes who really do deserve the hypocrisy award. There's awfully strong evidence that the Pope is not infallible, but that's a whole different, serious debate which would be completely off-topic and reserved to the back room. So again, my apologies to real catholics, but the pope is not the greatest guy in the world. Not in my immodest opinion, anyway.

:thumbsdown:

Ok, here comes the train driver and steers this topic back on track...
I don't like enemy assassins either. In my current Sicilian campaign, the king, the only male family member, is threatened by frenchy assassins. They are 0-2 points assassins mostly so the king is pretty safe. The big downside is that he's getting loads of new traits from those attempts. Now he's paranoid and introverted and it's getting worse. Naturally he's got huge personal security, food taster and all that.
What is also annoying is to see neutral faction assassins targeting your faction members. There is little you can do but to assassinate the assassins or start a war and wipe the whole faction out. I sometimes fortify the borders of my kingdom using mountains and forts so no foreign troops nor agents get in.
- Guru

I wonder if assassins are really not just a drain on the economy. If one runs a true blitz campaign assassins are not very necessary. They are very useful for destroying an economy (buildings and merchants), but the cost one spends could be better spent it seems on a few more units to help with looting. I played a Britania campaigns as Scotland and England using one at most (I don't think I had one in the English campaign) and had only a few merchants. The blitz seemed to have even more steam than usual. I also built minimal infratructure except to get necessary buildings to recruit units in strategic places. Recruiting them and using them is a very good way to get your king's dread up to 10 if you are so inclined.

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Originally Posted by Old Geezer

I wonder if assassins are really not just a drain on the economy. If one runs a true blitz campaign assassins are not very necessary. They are very useful for destroying an economy (buildings and merchants), but the cost one spends could be better spent it seems on a few more units to help with looting. I played a Britania campaigns as Scotland and England using one at most (I don't think I had one in the English campaign) and had only a few merchants. The blitz seemed to have even more steam than usual. I also built minimal infratructure except to get necessary buildings to recruit units in strategic places. Recruiting them and using them is a very good way to get your king's dread up to 10 if you are so inclined.

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Why do you keep reading my brain, Geezer?

Of course assassins are a drain on the economy. They waste florins every turn and they don't kill enemy troops, only generals. They destroy buildings you could have sold later at a better price or used yourself.

As for dread, I managed to get Rufus up to 10 dread without recruiting even one single assassin as England. But of course I had all provinces and I did much exterminating in order to hold them down. Butcher, butcher, butcher, kill prisoners, kill prisoners, join and then leave crusades. Generally, be a jerk.

Having 10 dread means you are king of the jerks!

_________________
I am the king of the jerks.

I keep assassins around to eliminate inquisitors. Very effective.

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Originally Posted by irishron2004

I keep assassins around to eliminate inquisitors. Very effective.

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Even more effective is to roll up the map before inquisitors show up and if they do, bop them on the head by surrounding them with 8 weakened peasant/militia units and stomping on them with unit number 9.

No need for assassins.