Just wondering if any of you folks have had a lot of luck RALLYING troops. It seems like once the dudes are flagging, I'm pretty much out of luck.
Perhaps it can stop a single flagging unit? Has anyone had better luck than I?
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Just wondering if any of you folks have had a lot of luck RALLYING troops. It seems like once the dudes are flagging, I'm pretty much out of luck.
Perhaps it can stop a single flagging unit? Has anyone had better luck than I?
Sometimes i do , sometimes i don't (have better luck). I'm not sure 100%, but i think it has to do with our general (how close they are to him) and if the ennemy is in hot pursuit. Plus, Certain types of units because the built in moral factor have a tendency to rally or not to.
Well, from my experience, there's a number of factors to take into account.
First, your troops aren't going to stop to listen to you, much less rally, when they have enemy troops charging down their backs. Rallying works best when your troops have gotten some distance between themselves and the enemy (which is rare, since most human players will hunt your routing forces down). I once had a 2 vs. 2 battle where my forces routed early (due to a mistake in judging where one of the armies was going to come from). They all ran, but the player who had done that to me decided to focus his attention on my partner. Once I was some distance away, I was able to rally all but on torn up Ashigaru unit.
The other major factor to consider is why the troops broke to begin with. If the battle is hopelessly against you, the troops won't see any reason to continue the fight. Rallying often works best when the troops ran because of some morale reason (guns, monks, or severe flanking) which is no longer a factor when they're out of range of the enemy.
One last thing to consider is that your troops running away were probably tired to begin with. They just ran some distance to escape the enemy. Now you want to march them all the way back. This will usually cause the troops to just run away as soon as they make contact with the enemies. The best rallies are ones that you can give your troops a minute breather before sending them back into the breech.
On the small scale of Shogun battlefields, and given the tactics, yes, rallying isn't very effective. But it shouldn't be forgotten about. We won the battle I mentioned above because I was able to rally, regroup and assail the flanks of my partner's attackers.
Well, there is no luck involved in this matter. There are a few factors:
1. whether the enemy is chasing hardly
2. whether they have high honor friendly units in sight(low honor ones will likely to route with them)
3. whether your general is killed or also fleeing
4. something I might have missed.... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
From experience, If you also have a steady unit between your routers and the pursuers/enemy line, then they're also much more likely to rally (although having routers run through your lines can have a rather impressive domino effect).
If the battle is a close thing, troops seem to be more willing to rally, as stated before. Also, it seems to depend on the composition of the remaining enemy units. In a recent battle, my men routed from a mainly teppo/ashigaru army. They rallied even though they were outnumbered (and then kicked some righteous donkey)- I'm sure if the enemy had consisted of strong HtH units, they would have just kept going.
Kyodaispan
troops are more likely to rally (and fight again) if they have decent honor, around 3. Most Honor 0 units probably won't come back, much less be coerced into battle again if they do rally.
Also a badly damaged unit,70% or more will run away without a "rally" option at all.
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"A WISE MAN ONCE SAID,LETS KICK THAIR ASS!"
It's true that the honour of your taisho and the troops, plus individual unit values (see terazawa's extremely useful chart at: http://terazawa.totalwar.org/tactics/values.htm ) makes rallying easier/harder. But i only really play low koku online, making my general honour 2 or 3, morale 0, meaning as soon as one unit snaps, the whole army thinks (in technical terms) "screw this". In higher koku battles, i find that units un-involved in melee will be much happier to turn round and fight soe more (hint: keep some melee units back with your guns and arrows, if your charging units break, you still have backup and keep your general in your troops line of retreat, the more they run, the closer they get to their taisho).
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TIGER LILY!!!
check it out for yourself at: http://homepage.ntlworld.com/tom.surman/frames.html
I think this is a good arguement for reserves on the field.
They are more likely to help your first attack force rally, since they are unlikely to be flanked (when kept near the rear). They will also be fresh, giving them a bonus against the tired enemy.
I've just fought a really strange battle where rallying was crucial to a close fought victory. One one side of the field my troops were winning handsomely and taking names, but on the other side things were very dicy for a little while; I think it was only due to multiple rallies that I managed to win; the waverinmg left side just held on for long enough for the enemy to totally collapse on the right.
The battle was a bit too costly though - 900+ of theirs to 500 of mine; the problem is the Hojo horde doesn't miss 900 troops too much whereas I certainly miss 500 of my troops, so this victory belongs in the Pyrrhic class...apart from the fact that the Hojo daimyo was among the fallen. He has an heir though...damn!!
Maro.. I, also, have had an exhausting battle recently.
Rank 4 Taisho on each side, he(Shimazu) with 4 full ND in his 16 units, me (Oda) with 1 ND(Superior Armor) and 1 monk of my 16 units and a small hill on defense. I commit most of my units to meet his so mine hold the uphill advantage. My archers (on hold) take his attack, Yari and Ashi counter-attack. But I'm forced to hold my elites back while he is still holding back his last two ND. My single YC is ,also, held back to try to deal with his CA and YC. Nail-biting time. My boys are doing great damage but his ND are cutting up both the Archers and Yari they face.
At last he throws in one ND reserve. I meet them with my ND. Archers(mine,center) begin to rout, first one , then another. An ashi follows, then a Yari. He throws in his last ND and his Daimyo and guards. I meet them with my monks. His Yari cav charge the melee. I order my cav to charge his CA.
Stalemate in the center, My only ND meet his, my monks meet his Daimyo and yari nad ND remnants, and ND remnants and Yari cav(his) and Yari and archer remnants(mine) face off on my left. My far right is an honor 4 ashi vs 16 ND, and a Yari of each side. None there will, it seems, give in!
My yari cav, chasing his CA, fail in morale! Fleeing, they run into his cav and are slaughtered. A friendly yari, seeing this, cracks and flees. My left is failing!
Rallied yari and archers are brought back to guard the rear of the melee. They are still too rattled to re-join the fight. An Ashi rallies, the few surviving cavalry leave the field...cowards! I'll have all your heads!
On the right my yari finally forces his last 4 yari to crack. Incredibly mine have lost but 7 to his 56, yet they held me up that long. I send these yari to assist the ashi against the last of his left,10 ND . They fight to the last man. Now both ashi and Yari must about-face and hit ND, CA, and Daimyo in flank. The left is rallying. The center is holding.
In the center half my monks and ND are dead, both beginning to quail, but regaining their courage, somehow. Finally the yari and Ashi from my right arrive, the former attacking the Daimyo, the latter his CA. Tense moments.. all holding, all holding...who will crack first? next?
At last! His Daimyo, with his last two guards, breaks and runs! His army begins to flee! Pursue, all!
Dammit! His reinforcements meet his fleeing mass, and they begin to rally! I hurl in units as they come, 23 monks, 27 yari, 30+ yari, 30+ ND....again his men fight the good fight. One of my yari finally reaches his Daimyo. They fight briefly and he flees again! His men rout again! Pursue, all! (now at a walk, keeping together)
Successively they meet and defeat 4 reinforcing ND, who break quickly, flee, rally, and return again. They are reinforced with yari and ashi...egads! The battle is turning! Now he has fresh archers coming in, too! Fall back, all!
One by one four of my yari rout. I throw in the last of the monks to gain time to retreat. They hold til the last 3 rout.
Throw in the ND! Fall back! Fall back! ND fight bravely til the last 3 rout! Yari are now rallying! Fall back! Fall back!
Now, as we pass the original battlefield I'm
down to one, final, straw. His leaderless army (Daimyo fled!) keeps halting, then again begins in pursuit. When he halts, I halt. When he moves, I fall back. The sun is going down! Huzzah! Victory!
I've won a Pyrhic victory and concede the province next season. His losses of over 800 are but a quarter of his force. Mine, almost 600, are two-thirds of my total.
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Wind fells blossoms, rain
fells steel,yet bamboo bends and drinks
[This message has been edited by ShaiHulud (edited 04-24-2001).]
i tend to let the trooops rally themselves...works for me
One place in single player that rallies happen frequently is at a bridge crossing.
If you have successively crammed units on to a bridge the first units on will probably become depleted, waiver and run. They will filter off the bridge and start to run but since they are now out of danger they usually rally on their own. I try to let them rest, and only use them again for backup.
I have also, in single player and through my own mis-management, had my Diamyo route along with some troops around him, but because I had reserves to take up the slack, I was able to get him to rally, and rejoin for a victory. This has rare but it has happened a couple of times over several campaigns.
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Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl.
i'm still kinda confused about why i need to rally my own troops...since they automatically rally anyways (or not...hehe)
MajorFreak,
Units don't seem to rally as readily automatically as they do with the manual rally option. Also, as a unit is running away, it gets fatigued. I've had the rally option highlight for a bit, and then go out and never come on again.
It is true that manual rallying doesn't always work, and, if you have a bunch of units to rally, going around to each one takes you attention away from the battle. If there are only a few men left in a unit, I let it go.
MizuYuuki ~~~
Clan Takiyama ~~~
Just a thought... There may be a max distance at which a Taisho's influence to Rally extends. When the Rally icon is lit, best to use it.
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Wind fells blossoms, rain
fells steel,yet bamboo bends and drinks