Capo de Tutti Capi - II [Concluded]

[Csargo]

Other people are spending their time analyzing the heck out of GH and Sasaki. That's not my gig; I'd rather spend my time looking places others haven't looked.

I can't really read a person who refuses to post, so I'm forced to question the ones that are active and the ones I feel aren't active enough. But then there's so many people it's hard to question them all.

[Lt. Pinard]

YES I finally caught up. God dont you people have anything better to do on a Friday night and Saturday morning?

I think that Myrddraal's plan for glenn is the best we can do for him. And it something we should try to follow.


Also I think people under FoS should be tied into protection groups and then we can go from there before lynching ppl.

For example people like stranger and GH who seem to be accused cause of their posting and no solid evidence

[TinCow]

I suggest that should any detectives find a guilty result on Glenn, they should speak up personally. The town can always form protection groups for that person. I'd also suggest that if he is investigated and gets an innocent verdict, that the detectives should just shut up about it.

If we hear nothing after another night, then it should be safe to assume that Glenn is innocent.

I would like to hear an innocent verdict as well. If we hear nothing, how are we to know that anyone investigated him at all? Given that we're talking about a potential Don here, I think we need to be really, really sure. I don't think anyone has any reason to trust me, but I also don't think anyone has any reason to be suspicious of me so far. So, I'll volunteer to act as a filter for any detective results. I will post, verbatim and without comment, any investigation PMs I receive, with the name of the sender removed.

[Crazed Rabbit]

I suggest that should any detectives find a guilty result on Glenn, they should speak up personally. The town can always form protection groups for that person. I'd also suggest that if he is investigated and gets an innocent verdict, that the detectives should just shut up about it.

GAH! Last game, Dons came up as innocent. That means Glenn would show up as innocent.

I believe it would be incredibly foolish to leave Glenn off the hook.

He was protected night one. The odds are better that he was a don getting protected by a luca than a doctor choosing to protect him.

He was suspicious before that.

He makes up a simply outlandish claim full of holes a mile wide. Even then, the third member of their 'group' hasn't been found, suggesting idiocy or non-existence.

He accuses everyone against him of being in league with the mafia.

We were trying to get him lynched last round but he narrowly escaped.

Last Capo Proletariat got attacked night one and saved by her luca, but was able to escape the noose to become the most powerful don. Let's not let that happen again.

Current suspected mafia:
Glenn & Jimbob
Tiberius and perhaps GH
The Stranger, maybe Sigurd

As to why a mafia family wants beefy dead - he somehow escaped four men with guns by himself and pure chance, which suggests a definite role for him.

CR

[ajaxfetish]

GAH! Last game, Dons came up as innocent. That means Glenn would show up as innocent.

I believe it would be incredibly foolish to leave Glenn off the hook.

He was protected night one. The odds are better that he was a don getting protected by a luca than a doctor choosing to protect him.

I think the plan was to investigate both him and jimbob. Assuming he's a don and jimbob is a member of his family, jimbob at least should show up as criminal.

And I must have missed the part where the mafia are out to get Beefy187. Wasn't it pevergreen's vigilante squad that targeted him? Where did the mafia definitely get involved? It is interesting how he managed to escape seemingly by sheer luck however.

Ajax

[Andres]

CR is right, an innocent on Glenn won't help us any further. I thought we agreed on investigating Glenn and his savior, Jimbob? If one of them is guilty, then we should lynch them both.

About Drisos, here's a part of the pm conversation I had with TS, yesterday in the afternoon:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

oprechte reveal... hij vertrouwd me 100% en moros ook... jij binnenkort ook wel denk ik... maar voorlopg doen we t zo...

drisos is zover oprecht dat hij detective is... dat over sigurd is bluf.

Wat is dat nu? Waarom gaat hij effe een willekeurige speler uitpikken en beschuldigen van Don te zijn?

Waar is dat nu goed voor?

A.

hij zei op msn... als ik neer ga neem ik gwn iemand mee... voor de grap... drm noemde hij mij er ook bij... hij had enkel suspicions...

[***information about our protection group***]

The Stranger: "His reveal is sincere... He trusts me and Moros 100 %. He'll trust you as well later on, I think. But for now, we'll do it like this...
Drisos is sincere about being a detective... He's bluffing about Sigurd.
Andres: "What's that? Why does he pick a random player and accuses him of being a Don? What's it good for?
The Stranger: "He told me on msn... if I go down, I just take somebody with me... for fun. That's why he also called me... He only had some suspicions.

[Drisos]

I can't see that you have cleared my name yet... I would like to know why?

hmmm... just a guess.. I still think you're guilty? is that so hard to believe?

You stated that you knew I was a Don as Andres more than once questioned this.

I think I made it clear before though - I don't trust andres. and above all, I don't want to explain everything. scummy? like I care.. Seamus will give my role soon anyway.. it's just lazyness.

I can't see that this has been answered. You claim to be a detective, yet detectives will get an innocent read on a Don pr. Seamus' role descriptions the same results as doctors, Surgeons, Detectives, FBI agents and townies would.

I couldn't have investigated anyone, anyway.. I was killed right away, remember? so I have a different reason for my suspicion.

btw- of course, if people think it would be unfair to be townie contactperson after my death.. ok, I'll just leave this game behind. It's town's call. I personally think you should do anything allowed within the rules. that's what rules are for, eh? if you shouldn't go that far, why do the rules allow it..

well, anyway.. I'll stop by and see what you decided, later..

[Myrddraal]

ajax fetish and Andres are right. They (Glenn and Jimbom) can't both show up innocent if one is Don and one a Luca.

[Pannonian]

ajax fetish and Andres are right. They (Glenn and Jimbom) can't both show up innocent if one is Don and one a Luca.

Give me some credit at least for coming up with that argument. The problem is that no detectives have showed up with results, and if they did, we don't know if they're genuine (hence my query about wise guys doing the dirty work for adopted families). We'll have to think up something else to check their credentials with, but in the meantime, we can lynch Tiberius.

[GeneralHankerchief]

I do think GH is probably guilty. His behavior brings to mind a vague recollection of another game in which he "pretended" to be upset and offended by all the accusations flying his way (I think it was GF II).

I'm not upset at all the various accusations flying around at me, I'm upset that they still come up after I answered them to satisfaction.

@Sigurd: I wasn't thinking. You are no longer suspicious in my book, not like that matters.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Are you a townie GH?

Give me some credit at least for coming up with that argument. The problem is that no detectives have showed up with results, and if they did, we don't know if they're genuine (hence my query about wise guys doing the dirty work for adopted families). We'll have to think up something else to check their credentials with, but in the meantime, we can lynch Tiberius.

I think we can be pretty sure they are genuine. For a mafia family to risk one of it's members on such a scheme, they would have to be betting that no other detective had investigated JimBob (by the way it's pointless to investigate Glenn).

[Pannonian]

I think we can be pretty sure they are genuine. For a mafia family to risk one of it's members on such a scheme, they would have to be betting that no other detective had investigated JimBob (by the way it's pointless to investigate Glenn).

But what about the wheeze I suggested? Get a wise guy affiliated to the family to lie on their behalf, and that way no full members of the family are risked. The question is whether or not such wise guys get a credit in the family's win if they die before being promoted.

[The Stranger]

why is it pointless to investigate glenn?

[CountArach]

why is it pointless to investigate glenn?

Don's show up as innocent. That is why both Glenn and JimBob need to be investigated to get any real results.

[The Stranger]

yeah... but that is what is happening isnt it.. its not useless to investigate glenn... just useless to investigate alone him.

[CountArach]

yeah... but that is what is happening isnt it.. its not useless to investigate glenn... just useless to investigate alone him.

Well I don't know what the Detectives are doing, but I hope that at least 1 of them is going for Glenn and at least 1 other is going for JimBob. Better yet I hope that an FBI detective is going for both at once.

[Csargo]

If a families Don is about to be lynched I'd expect that someone from the family would try to save them.

[The Stranger]

Well I don't know what the Detectives are doing, but I hope that at least 1 of them is going for Glenn and at least 1 other is going for JimBob. Better yet I hope that an FBI detective is going for both at once.

i hope so too...

[Sasaki Kojiro]

But what about the wheeze I suggested? Get a wise guy affiliated to the family to lie on their behalf, and that way no full members of the family are risked. The question is whether or not such wise guys get a credit in the family's win if they die before being promoted.

Wise guys are as valuable to a family as a full member. Or close enough anyway. They allow extra kills and become made's pretty quickly.

[Tratorix]

So, I'll volunteer to act as a filter for any detective results. I will post, verbatim and without comment, any investigation PMs I receive, with the name of the sender removed.

Not to burst your bubble here Tincow, but I believe that's illegal. Detectives and other roles usually have to reveal publically and what you are suggesting would count as them revealing to you through pm.

[Myrddraal]

@TinCow, the reason it can't work if you volunteer to take results from detectives is that there's no accountability for those detectives. Any Tom Dick or Vincentino can claim to be a detective to you, and there's no way for you to check. Also, if you are mafia you can hit them all without the town knowing who to protect.

If we ask the detective to reveal publicly (in exchange for protection) then they must put themselves in the spotlight, and make themselves open for investigation themselves. No sensible mafia family would place even a wise guy in that position, since they're almost certainly sacrificing him/her.

If we also say that given innocent results, they just say nothing, we have a chance of them 'transmitting' their results to us without revealing. I think we can be almost certain that the detectives are checking out Glenn and Jimbob.

At the same time, lets not forget our other suspects. Tiberius in particular. If we don't get any investigation results this turn, I'm voting for him.

@Glenn, you say you are 'investigating' tonight. I think you should forsake your investigations till we are sure of your innocence, and tie yourself down with pro-town activity. Till we can trust you, I'd rather know you were doing nothing than wonder if you're targeting townies.

@Pann, sorry if I missed credit. I was just noticing the most recent posts

[The Stranger]

Not to burst your bubble here Tincow, but I believe that's illegal. Detectives and other roles usually have to reveal publically and what you are suggesting would count as them revealing to you through pm.

no they dont... not in this game

[Moros]

I'm quite baffled to see that after being away for almost a day, I didn't have to catch up quite as much as I tought. I didn't even had to read a single pm.

Personally I have to do some rereading about GH, my memory isn't fully working because of lack of sleep and alcohol. (Well I just had my first week of vacation since September, so cut me some slack). No worries though I have always been sober when playing. Thank God!

It's however a case I want to dig into. I have contacts saying a detective investigated him, and he came out as criminal. (This however doesn't mean he therefore is mafia side). Also it seems a lot of persons have been suspecting him from the start.Though I still have some mixed feelings. I hope however that the conclusion of this night will give some insight.

Personally Sasaki gives me a bad feeling in the stomach. Is it just because of what happened last time? Perhaps, I just can't ever thrust him again. Poor me. However sasaki has been inverstigated this night by someone I utterly thrust. As if I were a fool. However the result will probably not been seen as a definite proof in this thread. But I know that the result will influence whether I'll try to make a case or not. Hopefully I'm wrong. A case against a player as Sasaki, is a task not fit for mere mortals, I'm afraid.

Dear me, it does sound as if I have read a bit to many posts made by one of our slightly more eloquent players.

Another striking thing however is that Pannonian is not wanting Glenn and JimBob to be investigated. Yes some Wiseguy could claim this however if another detective does it he can stand up too. Why would a wiseguy want to do this? I don't think he can gain much points if any with this. Nor does the Wiseguy itself as the point system is secret till after the game. What wiseguy would take this chance? There are other families and they could start up one too, also I think a mafia family won't want to miss a possible recuit that can become a made. They need the few numbers they have to ensure their victory.
Is it perhaps you fear that if Glenn or JimBob or freind investigates you, which would either way happen quite fast, the investigation might be believed? Are you scared you will lose a dear secret? Or is this just a legimate concern?

I know I'm finger pointing a lot, but I just have to ask why a possible good tactic should not be used. Someone needed to ask this question. I however wouldn't vote to lynch you or something at all. However soon, when I recieve a forwarded pm callen N 2 results (or perhaps a slightly higher number) , I might. Also Detectives know that this is the title given to investigation results pms. (I assume Seamus pm titles are the same to all) So this a proof that I in fact do have contact with a detetcive that is to be thrusted. Or at least I hope other detectives did have pm's with the same title. lol. Or I'm screwed.

Anyway I want some awser Pannonian, just to check.

GH, Sasaki you could expect a few questions too. Or a pm conversation if that fits you better.

EDIT: due to the lenght of this post I notice quite a few new posts have been made while I was typing. Hopefully not to much of this post now is outdated or in vain. However no post here should ever be in vain.

[Tratorix]

I think we can be almost certain that the detectives are checking out Glenn and Jimbob.

Why would a detective be investigating Glenn? He's either a pro-town role or a Don, so either way he shows up innocent.

Also, i'm curious as to how Kommodus found Hannibilbarc guilty using Holmes. Doesn't Holmes work by comparing players to their posting styles in previous games? I don't belive i've ever seen Hannibalbarc in a game here before.

[Myrddraal]

Why would a detective be investigating Glenn? He's either a pro-town role or a Don, so either way he shows up innocent.

Good point.

[Csargo]

Also, i'm curious as to how Kommodus found Hannibilbarc guilty using Holmes. Doesn't Holmes work by comparing players to their posting styles in previous games? I don't belive i've ever seen Hannibalbarc in a game here before.

Well Kommo said his behavior mimics a previous mafioso. Though I haven't noticed many posts by Hannibal so it's hard to believe Kommo has had some sort of result on him this early.

[Moros]

how's that true? I find that a bold statement to make by someone who doesn't thrust Glenn and has had few contact with him. He can't be a luca or made or perhaps some other mafia role, you say. Why?

Edit: indeed. Kommo has the respect and belief of many. He can use it and abuse it easily. However never may we ignore possible true holmes results.

[Csargo]

Who are you talking about? Kinda hard to tell.

[Tratorix]

how's that true? I find that a bold statement to make by someone who doesn't thrust Glenn and has had few contact with him. He can't be a luca or made or perhaps some other mafia role, you say. Why?

The current theory we are going under is that he was a Don protected by his Luca. If he is a made or Luca, I don't see Jimbob sticking up for him like he is.

[Moros]

Hmmm. Wel knowing he's innocent I know that's not the case. However it does makes sense, this theory. However a kind of doctor/surgeon could possibly have done it. Or he might have something special at section 2. of a role pm. Everybody seems to have some kind of ability.

(I know this is red part for everyones role pm seamus, but I don't think I'm breaking any rules, as most should have figured this out already.)

Edit: changed yet into already. My sentence wouldn't have made ot much sense otherwise would it?