Understanding Christianity

[Rhyfelwyr]

In response to the original post I have said that prayer, more than once IIRC, when I went to an Evangelical church, not sure exactly what type, with a friend of mine when I was younger. Although I used to go more regularly to Church of Scotland services I genuinely tried to be sincere in the prayer, although I'm not sure if I was. I seem to be doing a reverse of the standard and getting more religious as I get older...

As for my Evangelical friend he's currently trying to prove the existence of dragons, since apparently they are referred to in the bible. He's also trying to show these and maybe other dinosaurs existed within the bibles timeframe, somthing to do with red blood cells which should have disappeared or something like that dont' ask me to get into the science.

EDIT: Apologisations for the lack of grammage in the above posting...

[Divinus Arma]

The Trinity:

The Father is a title used to more easily understand the Divine Mind. The Divine Mind is the intellect of God, his self-awareness. The self-aware perspective of the Lord exists not merely in the physical reality in which you and I perceive, but reality itself outside of time and space, where all matter and energy exist formless, fleeting and permanent all in one. Only a perspective absent of the frames of space and time can "see" reality as it really is. When there is no small and there is no large, nothing near and nothing in the distance. When past, present, and future are non-existent as points of reference. This can only be possible when the perceiving mind is capable of an objective sense of space, where subjective references of size and distance are unremarkable and unnecessary. This can only be possible when the perceiving mind exists eternal, where all events can be experienced simultaneously. Because God is all things at all times, and his perspective is equally limitless, allowing to experience all things and at all times, our Lord is as the word reveals him to be: Self-aware; Omniscient, and omnipercipient.

The Holy Spirit is the fabric of existence: The Divine Will. The intangible component of particulate interactions that forms the relationship between matter and energy and allows shape to manifest out of nothingness. The Divine Will is the infinite power of the Divine Mind to shape and create, the capability and being to manipulate energy into matter. While also governing the laws of science that allow the creation to exist, the Divine Will is the whole of creation itself. Thus again, the word reveals our Lord to be omnipresent and Omnipotent.

The Son is our title for the Divine Will manifested into the form of a human being with all of the limitations of a human mind and body, especially human intellect, human understanding, and human perception. Thus, the Divine Mind of God exists independently of the mind of Jesus though they are coexistent through the Divine Will. Jesus Christ does not have a separate and unique human soul much as we do, but instead is in entirety the Holy Spirit.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

The Trinity:

The Father is a title used to more easily understand the Divine Mind. The Divine Mind is the intellect of God, his self-awareness. The self-aware perspective of the Lord exists not merely in the physical reality in which you and I perceive, but reality itself outside of time and space, where all matter and energy exist formless, fleeting and permanent all in one. Only a perspective absent of the frames of space and time can "see" reality as it really is. When there is no small and there is no large, nothing near and nothing in the distance. When past, present, and future are non-existent as points of reference. This can only be possible when the perceiving mind is capable of an objective sense of space, where subjective references of size and distance are unremarkable and unnecessary. This can only be possible when the perceiving mind exists eternal, where all events can be experienced simultaneously. Because God is all things at all times, and his perspective is equally limitless, allowing to experience all things and at all times, our Lord is as the word reveals him to be: Self-aware; Omniscient, and omnipercipient.

The Holy Spirit is the fabric of existence: The Divine Will. The intangible component of particulate interactions that forms the relationship between matter and energy and allows shape to manifest out of nothingness. The Divine Will is the infinite power of the Divine Mind to shape and create, the capability and being to manipulate energy into matter. While also governing the laws of science that allow the creation to exist, the Divine Will is the whole of creation itself. Thus again, the word reveals our Lord to be omnipresent and Omnipotent.

The Son is our title for the Divine Will manifested into the form of a human being with all of the limitations of a human mind and body, especially human intellect, human understanding, and human perception. Thus, the Divine Mind of God exists independently of the mind of Jesus though they are coexistent through the Divine Will. Jesus Christ does not have a separate and unique human soul much as we do, but instead is in entirety the Holy Spirit.

Huh? You almost, but not quite, seem to be argueing Nestorianism. One God without division. I've not come across the claim that the Son was generated at the birth of Jesus before, though I'm not up on the Arrian herresy.

Where are you getting this from, I'm interested.

[Divinus Arma]

I'm not stating that the Son is a created being. Only his physical form was "created". Jesus Christ did not "physically", as in the form of a human, exist prior to his birth. He existed since the original creation, one with the Father. The Son, the Father, and the Holy Spirit are all connected and indivisible. The form is what is different. Like a drop of water from an infinite ocean, Jesus is the drop, but still water.

[Sigurd]

I'm not stating that the Son is a created being. Only his physical form was "created".
Jesus Christ did not "physically", as in the form of a human, exist prior to his birth.

I am following you this far

He existed since the original creation, one with the Father.

So... he did not exist prior to the original creation? (definition?)

The Son, the Father, and the Holy Spirit are all connected and indivisible. The form is what is different. Like a drop of water from an infinite ocean, Jesus is the drop, but still water.

So... Jesus is no longer physical, and different from the Father and the Holy spirit who are not physical?

[Adrian II]

Teh old!

[Ronin]

I am following you this far

So... he did not exist prior to the original creation? (definition?)

So... Jesus is no longer physical, and different from the Father and the Holy spirit who are not physical?

now you know why priests have wine during mass.

after a couple of glasses it all makes more sense

[Divinus Arma]

Sorry, I'm not exactly 100% capable of articulating this myself, and misstatements can completetly change the meaning of a sentence.

I am following you this far

So... he did not exist prior to the original creation? (definition?)

Sorry. I meant that Jesus, being God, has existed as long as God. Just not in a human form. Jesus is the mouthpiece of the Father, the WORD by which the Father may communicate directly to us.

So... Jesus is no longer physical, and different from the Father and the Holy spirit who are not physical?

Jesus is a physical manifestation of the Holy Spirit, with a human mind rather than the self-aware intellect of God.

The Father is the intellect of God. The Holy Spirit is the essence of God; God's experience of the world, the will of the intellect.

Here is an analogy: Think of your self-aware intellect. Is that physical? Think of your desires and urges: Is that physical? Your desires and urges become physical when you transform your environment to match your will. Not in a literal sense, but the physical world you leave in a moment of choice is an echo of your determination.

So to with the Intellect and Will of God. The intellect (Father) dictates, the will (Holy Spirit) manifests, and we experience the echo of that determination.

Jesus Christ is both the determination and the echo.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

I don't buy that all the way.

We have:

God the Father

God the Son

God the Holy Ghost.

Now, since God has existed since the beggining, he cannot be divided, be more or less, he cannot grow diminish etc. the Son must have existed co-eternally with the father.

If the Father were to create the Son then there would be a divine liniage, with a beggining in time, but God is whole, eternal and indivisable.

So, the Son has to have existed since the beggining.

This does not mean that Jesus has existed since the beggining, but that the entity we call the God the Son has. Various instances for him to pop up are the Garden of Eden and the wrestling match in Genesis, as well as, perhaps, Mount Sinai etc.