Trapped in Taormina [Concluded]

[Caius]

I can't say a word.

[GeneralHankerchief]

I can't say a word.

Huh?

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

The mafia, who I presume was/were behind my death, is certainly made up of a wily group/individual. By killing me, a supposedly good lynch target, they appear to have eliminated a fair level of discussion. Who's intelligent enough to design and pull a stratagem like this off? My finger points towards Sasaki.

As I've said before, he spent night one with the prostitute (a night with minimal kills), and then intelligently decided to mask any guilt by confessing. There's nothing wrong with his posts, but there never usually is from a player as cunning as he is.

Prole went unnoticed by me earlier, but I suggest examination. In other words, bandwagon her, see her defence and from there decide on her guilt.

[woad&fangs]

woad&fangs
Caius
Gaius Sribonius Curio
Sasaki Kojiro
Elite Ferret- I think the mak/pm thing confirms him innocent
LittleGrizzly
axel- Innocent because of inactivity
Privateerkev
Proletariat

so that leaves as possible suspects...

Woad
Caius
Curio
Sasaki
LittleGrizz
Pkev
Prole

Now, Tincow obviously had some sort of role. If I had to guess I would say that he is the crazy bro but I'm not sure. 1 Mafioso attacked both Tincow and Mak. Actually, upon rereading it looks like the Yakuza killed Tincow and a Carelli killed Mak. However, both people limped. This means that we have killed at least one of the Carellis before tonight. According to Ichigo, that player was OOjebus. It would be a good idea to look for links between 00jebus and other players.

Manfredo appears to have killed Omanes. I consider Sasaki and Prole to be good suspects for the role of Manfredo based on Omane's logic.

Edit: I looked back at the tally on the day 00jebus was lynched. Sasaki, Pkev, and Caius voted to lynch him. Sasaki is smart enough to vote for his partner if he is revealed. Privateerkev, I believe, is to new to the game to think like that. In my eyes this means Pkev is not a Carelli. I also don't think Caius would vote for his partner but I am less sure than with pkev.

[Husar]

Didn 't I say several pages ago that they are killing all suspects? Wasn't that why I expected to die? Oh well, anyway, maybe it's time to lynch those who were suspected but not killed? That would be Sasaki, Privateerkev and Proletariat IMO.

Of course there are other suspicious people but we'd rather see one of them win than get fooled by one of those three, right?

[Privateerkev]

I don't think TC was the MiB. I suspect he was the "noob". If you go back and look at Mith's last posts, it looks like he might have been the MiB. Plus, TC voted for Ichigo which I do not think the real MiB would do.

[Makanyane]

Elite Ferret- I think the mak/pm thing confirms him innocent

please don't go on that - it only proves he didn't fall for a rather transparent little possible trap, not that he's innocent.

EDIT: re; Prole - she's not visible so its not possible for us to know if she's been on to pm or not. She doesn't seem to have been posting in other areas much recently so absence from this thread doesn't necessarily mean RL absence.

[woad&fangs]

please don't go on that - it only proves he didn't fall for a rather transparent little possible trap, not that he's innocent.

Transparent? Ow, that hurts my self esteem. I'm pretty sure I would have fallen for it

Also, Woad's Carelli suspect list 2.0

Caius
Curio
Sasaki
LittleGrizz
Prole

[Sasaki Kojiro]

The mafia, who I presume was/were behind my death, is certainly made up of a wily group/individual. By killing me, a supposedly good lynch target, they appear to have eliminated a fair level of discussion. Who's intelligent enough to design and pull a stratagem like this off? My finger points towards Sasaki.

Two things. First: you were clearly killed by manfredo. He appears to be separate from the mafia--no kill from him last night. Second: killing of the lynch targets doesn't eliminate discussion and it's also not a good strategy. The only discussion it removes is votes for the person who got killed, which the mafia would want. So this point is wifom at best.

As I've said before, he spent night one with the prostitute (a night with minimal kills), and then intelligently decided to mask any guilt by confessing. There's nothing wrong with his posts, but there never usually is from a player as cunning as he is.

The write up indicated that I was at home that night. I've never claimed this was proof of my innocence but it's certainly no evidence of guilt.

Also, Woad's Carelli suspect list 2.0

Caius
Curio
Sasaki
LittleGrizz
Prole

Curio was found innocent by detective.


I'm looking at caius and W&F today. Prole I will have to reexamine, given that TinCow was mafia despite the prostitute visit--but I don't think their situations are the same.

[woad&fangs]

3.0
Caius
Sasaki
LittleGrizz
Prole

To be honest, I'm dissapointed that the town hasn't dragged me into the spotlight more often. I've done well as mafia in large games in the past because people have let me sit back in the dark and play with them like puppets.

[Makanyane]

I've done well as mafia in large games in the past because people have let me sit back in the dark and play with them like puppets.

yeah but you haven't been doing enough to be 'playing with them like puppets'
or can you point to where you've been directing the discussion?

Second: killing of the lynch targets doesn't eliminate discussion and it's also not a good strategy. The only discussion it removes is votes for the person who got killed, which the mafia would want. So this point is wifom at best.

I know its not conventional mafia strategy - but applied consistently it could work to undermine the town - as townies who have no role lose their favoured suspect, run out of ideas and drop out of the discussion to be wogged.... kind of like what's apparently happened here. Also allows clever mafioso to say 'hey I wouldn't be so dumb as to take out best suspect...'

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I know its not conventional mafia strategy - but applied consistently it could work to undermine the town - as townies who have no role lose their favoured suspect, run out of ideas and drop out of the discussion to be wogged....kind of like what's apparently happened here.

WoG rates are consistent with other games and it doesn't follow that townies would ditch the game based on their suspect being killed--and in any case that's an inferior strategy to letting them live and chase after someone who may be an opponent or a pro town role. My read of the night kills is that the mafia are gunning for other mafia.

Also allows clever mafioso to say 'hey I wouldn't be so dumb as to take out best suspect...'

Second: killing of the lynch targets doesn't eliminate discussion and it's also not a good strategy. The only discussion it removes is votes for the person who got killed, which the mafia would want. So this point is wifom at best.

We aren't going to get anywhere if we base our suspicions on poor or blatantly false logic.

[Husar]

To be honest, I'm dissapointed that the town hasn't dragged me into the spotlight more often. I've done well as mafia in large games in the past because people have let me sit back in the dark and play with them like puppets.

Oh I noticed you if that makes you happy, but I don't know what to think about you and I'd be fine with you winning, I could say good job with a smile etc. but if Sasaki for example would win as mafia I'd be completely devastated. Obviously that makes me a racist scumbag but that's genetic, I can't help it.

I know its not conventional mafia strategy - but applied consistently it could work to undermine the town - as townies who have no role lose their favoured suspect, run out of ideas and drop out of the discussion to be wogged.... kind of like what's apparently happened here. Also allows clever mafioso to say 'hey I wouldn't be so dumb as to take out best suspect...'

[woad&fangs]

One of Grizz'z earlier posts said he was inactive because he was playing PS3. I can't see a mafioso doing that.

I'm not quite sure what to make of the early exchange between PK and Prole. For now I think that she is innocent but I have no real proof to go off of.

Caius has been lurking because he lost track of what was going on. Whether that makes him a mafioso or not is impossible to tell.

Vote: Sasaki
I know that without solid proof you are virtually incapable of being caught. At the VERY least we have 2 killers with 9 players left. Curio is innocent because he was investigated. I am innocent. Axel is innocent. That is a 2/6 chance that you are mafia. Along with my doubts about other peoples guilt voting for you seems like the obvious action for me.

[Privateerkev]

W&F asked me to search for Prole's and LG's posts because his function is broken.

Here is Prole's:

First there were 8 posts in a relatively short amount of time.

Hrm. An unusually interesting first round. I don't understand the point of blocking actions that don't happen. In basketball you can't block a shot when no one shoots, so it'll be interesting to see what the point of this game mechanic is. Or if Sasaki just made it up for some reason.

I didn't imply that, I said that. It was a comment about the game rules, don't read too much into it. I get some veteran status because I've played alot, not because I'm a brilliant analyzer or liar. Post your role PM, Priva. I'll show you mine if you show me yours.

Just because. Some people are pretending this first round of votes is more significant than it is. But it's the same crap shoot all first rounds are

I'm a townie and you said that role pm is public knowledge. Why should I bother posting it?

I haven't seen where it's been posted anyway, so I'm not even sure what you meant by public knowledge.

Challenged me? You said posting the role pm was pointless since it was public knowledge. I didn't bother posting it then, and you think that's scummy?

Sure. I'm a townie. Investigate away, detective.

/shakes on it

I'm still not sure who to vote for, but I gotta run to work soon. Here goes a random vote

Vote: Caius

What kinda crummy deal is this with you still having the lynching vote on me? :P

Unvote: Caius Vote: Privateerkev

Then 4 days of absence until the prostitute slept with her:

Well, I had a fantastic night of fetishism with the prostitute last night. I need to reread the last day and process the most recent revelations before I can add anything of real value.

Then 2 posts about Sigurd:

This just smacks of a classic Sigurd mafia maneuver (heretofore referred to as CSMM). He was in the chat yesterday for a bit, so I think he had time to post here. Just a line or two ('hey, been busy with work and family, will try and catch up later') could've brought down his vote tally to a tie with Omanes.

Kinda of an odd lack of survival instinct, for Sigurd tho... I'm puzzled.

Not much at stake? :/

According to you, our detective just died.

Then nothing for 2 days until this:

Husar seems really close to his usual indignant townie self, even with his weak answer. Sigurd can't be trusted, no way can we buy this 'it's faster to type up stuff and hit c&p.'

Neither of the Haudegan or Little Grizzly lynches seem that solid, so I'll flip a coin... and Vote: Haudegan. Would be nice to hear more out of axel

And nothing since.

[Privateerkev]

Now for LG:

First there were 3 posts in the beginning of the game:

Im here, suspecting everyone and not nitpicking....

I really can't do this random voting thing... ill have to go for Vote Sasaki

Sasaki
TinCow
GH
CR
Khaan
W&F
Omanes
Pever
The stranger
Rytmic

Is this list based on experience at playing mafia only ? or something more ?

I have an inherent distrust of sasaki probably just from the only mafia game i have played.

So if we were expecting 3 kills and only 1 happened at least 1 'mafia' didn't hand any orders in (one character can kill or investigate) so should we be looking suspicously at inactivity ?

Then nothing for 5 days until this:

Sorry for inactivity my friend has left his playstation 3 down my house and i struggle to get off the thing... which is why ive been lurking a few days, back on best townie behaviour

can someone explain what happened last night... i thought the prostitute was with Ichigo but then prole revealed she was with her ?

The paino wire and the fibre wire, seem a bit too close to be different calling cards... how much can we trust ichigo's reveal ? tbh i trusted on first sight but have very slight suspicions.

Proles inactivity... possibly a sign of scummyness ? was possibly blocked last night by the prostitute, looked like andres writing style to me (but someone else is probably better at judging it) so was there a killer off the radar last night ? apart from the one we possibly killed (00) ?

I don't think PK should be voted just because he has twice as many posts as anyone else, it could be a cover trying to seem like a helpful townie but if it is im fooled...

Mith whats the hunch ? the inactivity could just be down to being to busy not a crime in itself...

i really don't know who to vote for... ill Vote Abstain for the moment, the only other votes i could have made would be omanes because of others reasoning or prole for inactivity (which is a crime im guilty off) so hopefully theres something a bit more to work with in a few hours

Did I miss something here: Proletariat reveals that she was visited by the Prostitue, not Juliette-Ichigo. Is there a third female role?

this is what confused me i thought the prostitute was with ichigo but she was with prole... unless all 3 of them... ok probably not....

The next one is a long answer to specific quotes so I'll just add the link:

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showp...&postcount=584

That whole rumored part made me wonder but further down in andres report

Unfortunately, the women were in one of the more expensive rooms of the hotel...

that seems pretty definite

And then it was basically one post a day on average:

axel's continued presence in the game makes no sense unless he has a role.

Thats good enough for me

Vote Axel

Well i think i explained my few days of absence and since then i have returned and tryed to be helpful, i generally try not to post unless i have got something to say and even when i do post im just making observations and collecting facts, im not great at reading people so i haven't got a whole lot i could contribute anyway.

Check out my contributions in Capo II fairly similar in style and frequency excluding the few days i missed here because of my friends PS3. Check out the backroom during that absence from here i think i only posted once there, which is under my usual posting rate.

I mean i don't see how my agreeing with PK's reasoning is scummy, it seems sensible enough to me, how can a player whose done less than those wog'd survive ? by sending pm's is the answer

How come im getting voted for lurking when theres far worse lurkers around ? like axel for one example, ive obviously been doing enough not to get wog'd and those few days are the only gap.

Im not sure what Ichigo is on about, he cannot have investigated me and think im scum, if he didn't get round to investigating me then i don't understand what his 'hint' is all about as he has nothing more than anyone else to base it on and if he did investigate me then he must be scum, but were all pretty sure he isn't ?

ill post more later but im in the middle of an essay a sec

check my posting record well i wasn't posting in here!! (don't forget)

Edit: if you take out the gap where i was away i have made every vote and practically posted each day and night phase

this is the sum total of ichigo's hint.... he thought me and northnovas had roles and since he now knows 2 roles its obvious

what im assuming he's implying by its obvious is that if me or northnovas had a role it has to be a bad one seen as he knows who has the good roles, but he only thought i had a role, so its only obvious that im scum if ichigo's first thought was right, by the sounds of whats been going on here i don't think ichigo got the chance to investigate me because he wouldn't be dropping me in it like this or he would be hinting at my innocence.

The suspicions about me didn't appear until after a day or 2 of inactivity and ichigo dropping my name in, i went through the reasons a page or 2 back.

im at a bit of a loose end of who to vote but i think we should leave those manfredo will/could kill until we know he's dead and off the scene

Serial killer bait:
Sasaki
Tincow
PK


so were left with
Innocent:
Proletariat
Curio
axel
Elite Ferret
LittleGrizzly


and

possible mafia:
Northnovas
W&F
Makanye
Omanes
Mithrandir
Caius


something about sasakis innocent list and posible mafia list rings true for me so i am going to vote woad & fangs

Alive (13)

Tiberius of the Drake
woad&fangs
Omanes
Caius
Gaius Sribonius Curio
Sasaki Kojiro
TinCow
Elite Ferret
LittleGrizzly
axel
Makanyane
Privateerkev
Proletariat


this is the list of those still alive, i think we should listen to KK and lynch the quiet ones.

my list of quiet people is
Proletariat
Axel
Cauis
Omanes
and tiberius ? (not sure here)

ill go back and check whether thier posting elsewhere, we know prole is afk so probably RL reasons rather than scum.

Omanes was rather quiet for a few days then got accussed by a few of lurking, he came back with an excuse for a days absence and has been more involved since returning

sorry gtg ill finish this later...

[Tiberius of the Drake]

unfortunately, the chaos of real life, and the cyber world has kept me from the computer. and at the moment I dont have any idea what pahse it is laet alone who is alive or dead. Can some one post a live/dead count (am I dead?) and if it is day pahase a vote count.

If it is infact day phase,

Vote: Abstain

[Gaius Scribonius Curio]

OK, its time for sme analysis...

To begin the write-up.

TinCow returned from the gathering at the Porta Messina. He decided to go straight to his hotel.

While he was walking down one of the many narrow, steep streets of Taormina, he sensed that something was wrong.

His instincts told him to duck.

He barely avoided getting sliced into two pieces by a sword.

He heard a voice cursing and started to run. The quick footsteps behind him told him that the he was been followed.

All of the sudden, TinCow turned around, a throwing knife in his hand. His attacker dodged the knife and swung his sword at TinCow's neck. Again, his reflexes saved him. While the attacker was trying to refind his balance, TinCow kicked the attacker in the groin.

The attacker fell down and TinCow walked up to his victim, a second knife in his hand.

"You picked the wrong target tonight," he said with a cold-hearted voice.

He stabbed his knife at his attacker who quickly turned away from it, jumped back on his feet and swung the sword again at TinCow, who was completely out of balance. The sword sliced TinCow in two pieces.

In one fluent move, the attacker pierced the sword through TinCow's chest, for good measure. The killer limped away, still suffering from the hard kick in the groin.

Tincow was killed by a sword. This is almost certainly the Yakusa. However the method in which Tincow fights back means there is a fairly high likelihood that he had a role (imo).

However which role was it? The new nervous killer? The MiB? A Carelli? Or something else?

The nervous guy doesn't fit, due to the confidence that is obvious from the write-up.
The MiB wouldn't have voted for Ichigo, Tincow did. This isn't plausible.
A Carelli makes more sense, but the order of the kills doesn't allow for it. Andres subtlely gives us an order in that Tincow is killed en route to his hotel, Omanes is killed whilst at the hotel and Makanyane is killed in the middle of the night, because she can't sleep.

The only other possibility I can think of is that the MiB wasn't the brother, but there is contradictary evidence for that. In other words I'm stumped atm. On we go...

Omanes was enjoying the splendid view accross the bay of Naxos, looking at Mount Etna.

Sipping from his limoncello he sighed. It was hard to believe that this beautiful place was the scene of such horrendous events.

He promised himself to come back after this nightmare was over, to re-discover what had to be one of the most lovely places in the world.

Sipping again from his limocello, he didn't hear the careful footsteps behind him.

The killer watched Omanes and sneaked up on him. The murdered pointed the silenced gun to the back of Omanes's head and pulled the trigger.

While Omanes was laying in a pool of his own blood, the professional killer shot two more bullets in Omanes' head and one more in his chest.

He calmly left the scene.

Professional killer=Manfredo imo. The method of execution is bold and risky, seemingly in his hotel room, or in a bar somewhere, Omanes has met his end.
If this is the case (and this is unlikely, but we are in need of optimism here...) it follows that Manfredo has assassinated a prime suspect. Remember that there was a large amount of suspicion floating over Omanes. Perhaps (stretching the realms of possibility to the limit...) Manfredo has gone pro-town and is attempting to find and eliminate Mafia. Due to the ordering of the kills it is possible that Omanes was Taketski, however from the write-up this now seems unlikely.

Makanyane left her hotelroom. She couldn't sleep and she figured a drink in the bar would help.

She entered the elevator. When the elevator reached its' destination, she waited until the doors opened.

A dark figure, weilding a tommy gun was standing right in front of her.

The salvo of the machine gun litterally butchered her to dead.

The attacker limped away.

The method of assassination, a tommy gun, is crude, but effective. As I'd expect from a Carelli mafioso. For the reasons stated above I don't believe this killer was Manfredo or Taketski. There is the possibility that was was the new, nervous killer, unable to go through with another last-ditch conversation.

The fact that there were only three kills is encouraging, but our situation is still dire.

The lack of an MiB killing means that Sigurd may have access to some correct information. However he could have merely guessed. Its down to him to persuade us otherwise.

woad&fangs
Caius
Gaius Scribonius Curio (please spell my name right... or just type Curio)
Sasaki Kojiro
Elite Ferret
LittleGrizzly
axel
Privateerkev
Proletariat

The list of all those left alive...

Curio- found innocent by detective (so I claim...), but seriously I'm innocent.

Axel- His lack of activity pretty much rules him out, unless he is ridiculously clever and is fooling us all, a candidate for the nervous killer, as there was a kill two nights ago, but none last night (when he wasn't active).

Elite Ferret- Seems to have been squeaky clean since taking control of TS's (at the time suspicious) role. Has RL issues and thus has been fairly quiet. I'd say innocent, but bears watching.

Prole- has been fairly inactive of late and indeed has been laying fairly low since the opening exchanges with PK. Could be down to RL issues but it still is verging on the suspicious.

Little Grizzly- Was under a real threat of lynching at one point (on what is now viewed as fairly weak evidence). His contributions have picked up of late and appears to be innocent.

PrivateerKev-Easily the most verbose among us, Kev's contributions have diminished as we approach the end-game. Has been the target of a concerted attack by Sigurd, but there is no evidence against him aside from Sigurd's dubious reveal. My gut feeling is innocent.

Woad&Fangs- Has been working quietly to save the town and is now surprised that he hasn't been targeted. There's nothing in his posts to suggest he's mafia, but he is correct insaying that he hasn't been under intense scrunity, maybe this should change today? Atm, I'm leaning towards innocent, but there's no evidence for (or against) him that I can see...

Sasaki Kojiro- Billed as the master of deception, despite the enmity (for want of a better word) that Sasaki has accrued in the past, that he is still alive is testament to his skill. There is some evidence to suggest his innocence, but as others have said he is still dangerous and still possibe Mafia. I don't believe he is...

(... but that could be my naivety talking).

Caius- One word and one word only can describe him... lurker. Perhaps honestly bewildered at the pace and intensity of the game, he has said and done nothing to help the town. In fact he has barely even voted! Unlucky innocent with no time to think or cunning mafioso? You decide, for myself...

FOS: Caius

...the only lurker left alive.

[Privateerkev]

PrivateerKev-Easily the most verbose among us, Kev's contributions have diminished as we approach the end-game. Has been the target of a concerted attack by Sigurd, but there is no evidence against him aside from Sigurd's dubious reveal. My gut feeling is innocent.

It's true that I've quieted down a little. I've gotten more confused as the game has gone on. That and I started to get tired of arguing with a ghost who has nothing to lose.

I like your analysis but there is one thing missing. The killer who got Mak was limping. And TC kicked his killer between the legs. This suggests that it was the same person. So we may have one person who can do two kills.

At least this finally removes the last shreds of doubt that Sigurd was in fact Taketsi. He has been hiding behind the "but there is a yakuza still around" excuse long enough. That excuse is now useless in light of this new information.

As for TC being Carelli, it doesn't make sense. He was blocked on a night where 4 attacks happened. I find it more likely that he was the noob.

I think our best chance is in hoping that Manfredo is indeed on our side. I can only see two kill reports that look like him. One was Ichigo. And one was Omanes. If Manfredo is with us, then there is just one killer.

I still think Caius is the best lynch candidate. Look at his post record. He is very active all over the board. And he is in other games in the gameroom. Yet he hardly posts in this thread.

tally:

Caius: 2 (Privateerkev, Elite Ferret)

Sasaki: 1 (woad&fangs)

[Gaius Scribonius Curio]

I like your analysis...

Thank you.

...but there is one thing missing. The killer who got Mak was limping. And TC kicked his killer between the legs. This suggests that it was the same person. So we may have one person who can do two kills.

I did indeed miss that, but it isn't necessarily true. I'm going to go back and check the other write-ups to see if there is another reason for this.

At least this finally removes the last shreds of doubt that Sigurd was in fact Taketsi.

I don't believe that. It makes a lot more sense that he had a secret role, or that he's merely a misguided townie, trying to play God! (OOC:)

As for TC being Carelli, it doesn't make sense. He was blocked on a night where 4 attacks happened. I find it more likely that he was the noob.

I did say that it was unlikely, and that I'm stumped.

I think our best chance is in hoping that Manfredo is indeed on our side. I can only see two kill reports that look like him. One was Ichigo. And one was Omanes. If Manfredo is with us, then there is just one killer.

Will have to check this, will be back later.

tally:

Caius: 2 (Privateerkev, Elite Ferret)

Sasaki: 1 (woad&fangs)

[Proletariat]

I'm obviously innocent, look at the night I was visited by the prostitute and how many kills there were. It's likely the mafia is leaving me alive in order to make it appear I wasn't innocent after all, making me an easier lynch when there's only a few players left.

They're either cunning or I'm off my rocker, but I can't see any other reason why the mafia has left me alive. Maybe they thought I was ignoring the thread and would get WoGed.

[Privateerkev]

I'm obviously innocent, look at the night I was visited by the prostitute and how many kills there were. It's likely the mafia is leaving me alive in order to make it appear I wasn't innocent after all, making me an easier lynch when there's only a few players left.

TC was visited by the prostitute when there were 4 attacks/kills. Now we suspect he had a role since he was particularly hard to kill and it seems the "noobish mafioso" is dead.

Being visited by the prostitute is not an automatic proof of innocence.

[Gaius Scribonius Curio]

Results of my search are in.

Prior to tonight there was no mention of a limping killer, PK's suggestion that Taketski has multiple kills is a possiblity.

Also, the professional killer (Manfredo), shows up only two or three times.

Night one: I can't say for certain if Seamus was killed by Manfredo, but it is a possibility.

Night four: Ichigo aka Juliette is killed, by Manfredo, objective 1 is acheived for him.

Night six: Omanes, a prime suspect who escaped lynching due to a lucky combination of events is executed by a 'professional' killer, who we (or at least I) assume is Manfredo.

Again PK's assumption seems to be accurate.

[Privateerkev]

Prior to tonight there was no mention of a limping killer, PK's suggestion that Taketski has multiple kills is a possiblity.

Just so Sigurd doesn't crow on and on, I want to make clear that I never said Taketsi had the ability to do multiple kills. I believe Sigurd is Taketsi. Now I am pretty much convinced of it. Sigurd had investigative powers. And the remaining mafia person was able to make two kills. One as yakuza and one as Carelli. It seems a Carelli has been hiding one kill by making it appear as yakuza. That has led people to believe Taketsi is alive. Now it is fairly obvious that Taketsi is dead and it was Sigurd. One could argue that the opposite is true. That Sigurd was Carelli and the remaining mafia is Taketsi. But Sigard has staked a lot on claiming investigative powers and Carellis don't have those.

Also, the professional killer (Manfredo), shows up only two or three times.

Night one: I can't say for certain if Seamus was killed by Manfredo, but it is a possibility.

Night four: Ichigo aka Juliette is killed, by Manfredo, objective 1 is acheived for him.

Night six: Omanes, a prime suspect who escaped lynching due to a ucy combination of events is executed by a 'professional' killer, who we (or at least I) assume is Manfredo.

Again PK's assumption seems to be accurate.

I don't see night 1 being done by Manfredo. Ichigo and Omanes seem very similar. Seamus seems like he was done by a Carelli.

[Mithrandir]

Probably just 2 killers left, hence the limping.


Sasaki and littlegrizz

[Andres]

(am I dead?).

Yes. WoG at the beginning of this day phase. Sorry.

[Sigurd]

Now it is fairly obvious that Taketsi is dead and it was Sigurd. One could argue that the opposite is true. That Sigurd was Carelli and the remaining mafia is Taketsi. But Sigard has staked a lot on claiming investigative powers and Carellis don't have those.

I don't see night 1 being done by Manfredo. Ichigo and Omanes seem very similar. Seamus seems like he was done by a Carelli.

Let’s hypothise shall we?

If I was Taketsi and I only investigated the few nights I were alive, I should have 6 investigations. If I found the prostitute on the first night, and innocent players the following night and then the last night found you out of bed but innocent, why would I not use it?

As Taketsi I would have wanted the prostitute dead wouldn’t I. But then someone just had to lynch me because I was absent.

I then retaliate against the prostitute making her (him) seem scummy. Wait… How do I know?.. Think fast .. Oh, let’s do a CSMM (thanks Prole). Yeah I will be some poor thief sneaking into people’s rooms, yeah that’ll fool them. Ah damn… a CSMM requires planning and a prepared role pm.. Crap.. nvm. Let’s just use my investigations, one from each night to make sure I can’t be caught in lies.


If I was Taketsi but now dead, my goal would still be to get rid of the mafia. The prostitute should live to hinder the mafia’s work. If I were Taketsi, why would I lie about any of my investigations, I would make sure they were all correct to establish some trust. Then this n00b player is suddenly getting really smart and guesses everything right, down to the recruitment of additional mafia. Where in the hell did he get that information if not he was himself recruited into the Carellies? He was townie one minute than a certified lying bastard the next. Ah, yes the Carelli got themselves a recruit. I must take him down to prove my pro-town alignment.


Am I getting close?

Now let’s see, if this n00b is Carelli, who is protecting him? Why haven’t Sasaki jumped on this guy for knowing more than he should? Ah yes, they must be communicating behind the scenes as mafia and recruit. In fact, this n00b is learning from Netherworld. Why haven’t TinCow jumped all over this new guy? He is probably getting comfy with many of the players behind the scenes just as TinCow did, completely fooling 3 of the elders (veteran is no longer sufficient) players.

Now how is that for a hypothesis?
Either way my friends it still leaves Sasaki and Privateerkev looking guilty as hell.
Why not make it a tie between them and let fate decide.

[Gaius Scribonius Curio]

So in other words, what you're saying is that PK was right the whole time? And it follows that you have indeed been lying about your role the whole time. Which in turn means you have been lying the whole time!

Hence you are not to be trusted...

Vote:Caius

(...but its a very nice theory)

[Husar]

But then someone just had to lynch me because I was absent.

That looks like a remark concerning me and thus I will yet again say that I was surprised by how quickly you got lynched and how many jumped onto the bandwagon, I made up much stronger cases before and noone jumped on them.
Still, at the time it looked like a good idea but now I'm not sure anymore, although it still might have been a good idea.

Either way my friends it still leaves Sasaki and Privateerkev looking guilty as hell.

While I would say hell itself, not being conscious, is not guilty of anything, that assessment seems correct to me, it's very weird that these two are still alive but noone else seems to care.

Why not make it a tie between them and let fate decide.

That is a fine idea.

[Privateerkev]

Let’s hypothise shall we?

If I was Taketsi and I only investigated the few nights I were alive, I should have 6 investigations. If I found the prostitute on the first night, and innocent players the following night and then the last night found you out of bed but innocent, why would I not use it?

But since you have 6, you can mix and match to get 3. Perhaps you showed people 2 from day 1 and then 1 from day 2. Then you "tweaked" them to get the results you wanted.

I then retaliate against the prostitute making her (him) seem scummy. Wait… How do I know?.. Think fast .. Oh, let’s do a CSMM (thanks Prole). Yeah I will be some poor thief sneaking into people’s rooms, yeah that’ll fool them. Ah damn… a CSMM requires planning and a prepared role pm.. Crap.. nvm. Let’s just use my investigations, one from each night to make sure I can’t be caught in lies.

At least now your admitting you were lying about having some secret watcher role.

If I was Taketsi but now dead, my goal would still be to get rid of the mafia. The prostitute should live to hinder the mafia’s work. If I were Taketsi, why would I lie about any of my investigations, I would make sure they were all correct to establish some trust.

Throwing 3 quick sentences down was a bad way of establishing trust. You could have posted PM's. Though you ran the danger of having the detective come out and prove your Taketsi. Since we would know he is the detective, it would prove your mafia. You couldn't have that so you made the situation as muddy as possible while still trying to effect the game.

Then this n00b player is suddenly getting really smart and guesses everything right, down to the recruitment of additional mafia. Where in the hell did he get that information if not he was himself recruited into the Carellies? He was townie one minute than a certified lying bastard the next. Ah, yes the Carelli got themselves a recruit. I must take him down to prove my pro-town alignment.

Your giving me far too much credit. I pulled the recruiting idea out of my butt. I was reading Netherworld and Capo 2. I couldn't figure out how you could be Taketsi, yet still have a yakuza running around. But now I figured out how, and it has nothing to do with recruiting. A Carelli has been fooling all of us.

Now let’s see, if this n00b is Carelli, who is protecting him? Why haven’t Sasaki jumped on this guy for knowing more than he should? Ah yes, they must be communicating behind the scenes as mafia and recruit. In fact, this n00b is learning from Netherworld. Why haven’t TinCow jumped all over this new guy? He is probably getting comfy with many of the players behind the scenes just as TinCow did, completely fooling 3 of the elders (veteran is no longer sufficient) players.

Your leaving out a really important development. TC is pretty much confirmed as the mafia "noob". So, that throws your whole theory out of whack. All that is left it one mafia and Manfredo. And it doesn't look like Manfredo is working for the mafia. Therefore, 2 players can't be working together as mafia.

tally:

Caius: 3 (Privateerkev, Elite Ferret, Curio)

Sasaki: 1 (woad&fangs)