Persia reborn (or something)

**Hegix** · 08-07-2008, 13:38

Just out of curiosity, are there any reasons for the difference in extent between the Parthian and Armenian Persian "Homelands"?

Armenian Persia extends to include both Tarsos, Antioch and Damascus in the west and up to Baktria in the east while Pahlavan Persia draws the line for reforms earlier. I could guess that there is no real reason for it other than they are 2 different devs, but I ask anyway

A bit of praise at the end as well. Thank you very much for adding another dimension to these factions that have quickly become my favorites, just because of the added reason for conquest other than just expansion.

**Foot** · 08-07-2008, 14:09

Probably partly because the Hayasdan reforms look back to the Achaemenid era while the Parthian ones look toward the Arsacid era. Different ideals, different goals.

Foot

**The Persian Cataphract** · 08-07-2008, 14:52

Some admission is probably in place here, but the reformed Parthian "boundaries" are somewhat static and not nearly as refined as Hayasdan's process, and this is mostly due to how the Pahlava start out as nomads. The problems that later arise pertains mostly to areas just outside of the boundaries, lands into India, Bactria, Soghdia, the Caucasus and Cappadocia, and basically the origins of Arsacid power, at Dahyu Daha, Margiana and Chorasmia. They are restricted to pastoralism which ultimately leads to low-level fortifications at best and limited economical means. Just a bit awkward, but that's how the system looks like...

The reforms are not mine; I don't do any coding, and the concept itself as an idea (Which is undeniably more realistic, in spite of its short-comings) is a product of Teleklos' and Steppe_Merc's design. I really can't take any credit for it (In my own small modification, I have extended the area of the reforms slightly to match Bactria, Margiana, Paropamisos/Kophen and the Caucasus, nothing overtly crazy or irrational).

**Gaivs** · 08-07-2008, 15:28

Kind of off topic, aimed at TPC. I heard one scholar mention Surenas as a title, and not a name (referring to Crassus etc). Whats the deal with that?

**Obelics** · 08-07-2008, 15:45

for curiousity, is it possible to expand Kiat and Nisa to a more advanced settlement? For example in Nisa i cant built walls gardens etc. despite the fact i gave it Pastoralism...

My actual city i can build advanced things are Hecaromphilos, Asaak, Alexandria Ariana.

Again after i conquered Bactra i cant build advanced things. So is Batctra limited too?

Thanks!

I forgot: i have the same problem with Marakanda, i cant expand it.

**Tristuskhan** · 08-08-2008, 19:07

Originally Posted by Obelics

for curiousity, is it possible to expand Kiat and Nisa to a more advanced settlement? For example in Nisa i cant built walls gardens etc. despite the fact i gave it Pastoralism...

My actual city i can build advanced things are Hecaromphilos, Asaak, Alexandria Ariana.

Again after i conquered Bactra i cant build advanced things. So is Batctra limited too?

Thanks!

I forgot: i have the same problem with Marakanda, i cant expand it.

Uh? What? Kuna and Cyruz are back on their way?

Goooood news. And you already have reformed governments? Even better....

Awarakaramaaaazzz!

Mmmm, now for the answer: as far as I know Reforms can be reached in: Asaak, Hekatompylos, Apameia, Karmana, Gabai, Susa, Alexandria-Ariana, Persepolis, Prophtasia. Maybe the (sooner or later to become) former capital of Hayasdan but i'm not sure about that one. Baktria is definitely not a reformable province. Hint: build an allied kingdom in Baktra and you'll be able to field the infantry you should not need but well, probably one needs it anyways.

Non, les braves gens n'aiment pas que
l'on suive une autre route qu'eux....(special tribute to Cptn Gaston)

**The Persian Cataphract** · 08-07-2008, 15:49

It's not just a scholar's assessment, it's essentially the consensus. We don't really know who "Surena" is, by name that is. We see several of these "abstracted" clan titles in later Graeco-Roman sources in the form of "Merena" (Mîhrân), and Karena/Karenas (Kârên-Pahlav) amongst a few. What we might know about them is that their designations may be of actual rank, as in "head of clan".

Some have made allusions towards this Surena being the historical parallel to the later Iranian mythological figure, the champion Rustam, who himself hailed from the "Zâbûl" area (Which is close to the original Sûrên-Pahlav holdings). It's sketchy at best and derives itself mainly from the "Cycles of Seistan", a collection of local folk-lore.