How do I nerf the Ptolemies - without conquering them?

[QuintusSertorius]

The Yellow Death has been relatively muted thus far in my game, largely through my use of Force Diplomacy to restore provinces they took off the Seleukids in Syria, and transporting their armies back to Africa so they ran out of resources to fight there.

However, that's just staving off the problem, the armies in question come back eventually, and the Seleukids really aren't able to keep up, especially now I've kicked them out of Asia Minor.

I'm thinking I could give Saba Ptolemais-Theron, Pselkis and the other deep desert provinces, that would at least starve them of some funds.

What else can I do though? I don't want to declare war on them, they're the kind of faction who's AI then decided it'll attack your navies constantly if you do that.

Are there any ridiculously expensive units I could spawn in their cities to drain their money? Do they have elephants?

Is there any way using the console to kill armies (like a reverse create_unit)?

So how do you hamstring and otherwise paralyse the Ptolemies without conquering Egypt?

[johnhughthom]

They do get elephants but I think they are in those deep desert provinces you want to give to Saba. What about creating a load of those ridiculously expensive fleets they have?

[QuintusSertorius]

The "tens" you mean? Not sure how to do create_unit with ships. I suppose I could do that on existing Ptolemaic fleets. Perhaps move one somewhere inaccessible and put ten "tens" in it or something.

[thelord]

Try giving Salamis to the AS, it made a huge difference in my game.

[QuintusSertorius]

Try giving Salamis to the AS, it made a huge difference in my game.

Not a bad idea at all.

As far as "desert provinces" goes, would it be worth taking Ammonion and Augila off them as well?

Or maybe just remove them from Syria altogether. Nabataea and Sinai are both expansion regions for Saba; just leave them with Judea and Phoenicia.

[Cartaphilus]

I'm doing the same.

You can give Cyprus (or Cyrene) to Kh too. It could be a good solution. And it can simulate some rebel Ptolly princes as well.

And you can use Saba to recreate the Maccabean "realm".

[Skandinav]

You could also make them give you 20000 ( or something ) mnai every turn in a hundred turns to bleed them dry a little with force diplomacy. Do not fret as in most campaigns they have ressources in abundance and chances are still pretty good no other faction will invade them for various reasons and their borders will be static for a designated time period. You can then use the mnai to fund factions who are in decline and shouldn´t be.

I also think that factions who are protectorates have a tendency to be more passive, although I am not quite sure.

This combined with a multi-factional border and the occasional province swapping through forced diplomacy have given me a fairly balanced middle-east in my last couple of campaigns, but I also recommend playing on medium difficulty since ai aggression seems much more plausible and intelligent here, if you are looking for a role-play/historical game that is.

[delra]

Give southern Egypt to Saba and Cyrene to Carthage so they start fighting at three directions instead of one.

[Banzai!]

add_money -40000, numidia

and repeat.

[overweightninja]

In regards to giving southern Egpypt to the Saba, be careful. I did the same thing in a Kart-Hadast campaign a little while ago and the Saba were unable to keep order and hold anything north of Meroe, the troops spawned from the rebelling cities actually ended making the Ptollies more powerful than when I started :(
Syria is a good place to start stealing settlements...
Cheers

[QuintusSertorius]

In regards to giving southern Egpypt to the Saba, be careful. I did the same thing in a Kart-Hadast campaign a little while ago and the Saba were unable to keep order and hold anything north of Meroe, the troops spawned from the rebelling cities actually ended making the Ptollies more powerful than when I started :(
Syria is a good place to start stealing settlements...
Cheers

I noticed this the turn after I'd given them away; I added some Hellenic Native Spearmen and once they'd stopped depleting the garrisons it stuck. Long as they hold the deep desert, I think that's enough. Especially since the Ptolemies also lost much of Syria too. And Cyprus.

Here's what I did to them:



I've also been moving their armies away from anything dangerous, like conquering Seleukid Syria or regaining the desert provinces.

[Sygrod]

Since you are moving their armies: Move some to deserted islands. You can even send some to Finland or Ireland. I am sure they would enjoy the vacation.

[QuintusSertorius]

Since you are moving their armies: Move some to deserted islands. You can even send some to Finland or Ireland. I am sure they would enjoy the vacation.

Isn't Finland connected by land bridge to Denmark? I recently put the Lusotanii in southern Ireland, so I'd be worried about what a Ptolemaic army there might do.

[General Appo]

Isn't Finland connected by land bridge to Denmark?

Don´t think so, but I believe they will still be able to walk into the lands of the Balts, though they´ll probably just begin the long journey home. Just put them in Terhazza or on the Horn of Africa (just south of Sab´yn).

[QuintusSertorius]

Don´t think so, but I believe they will still be able to walk into the lands of the Balts, though they´ll probably just begin the long journey home. Just put them in Terhazza or on the Horn of Africa (just south of Sab´yn).

The bugged Getai faction leader is on the Horn of Africa; don't want to put anyone else there in case it crashes my game.

Is there a danger of them attacking Terhazza if I put them there? Or is it generally impassable country that no one can move around in?

[pantsukki]

Isn't Finland connected by land bridge to Denmark? I recently put the Lusotanii in southern Ireland, so I'd be worried about what a Ptolemaic army there might do.

I believe that the connected country is Sweden. Finland lies east of Sweden, not Denmark. See for example this map: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Scandinavia.jpg

We're anything but Swedes!

[Jaywalker-Jack]

As far as I can tell a protectorate will only defend themselves, and attempt no expansion. So you could force the Ptolemies into this status. I'm not sure on that though, any protectorates Ive had have been small fry to begin with.

[General Appo]

I´m afraid it doesn´t work that, it only appears so because they pay you half their income (or something like that) which makes it hard especially for smaller nations to go on the offensive.
As for how historical it would be, I amnot sure. Rome allied with the Ptolemais already around 190 BC, and Rome gradually gained more and more power over them, but it´s hard to say when exactly it crossed the line between an alliance and a protectorate.

[QuintusSertorius]

I believe that the connected country is Sweden. Finland lies east of Sweden, not Denmark. See for example this map: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Scandinavia.jpg

We're anything but Swedes!

Sorry, that's sloppy geography on my part. I was thinking of the Sweden-Denmark land bridge. Which surely any unit placed in Finland can just walk round to. Those rivers have crossings, don't they?

[pantsukki]

Sorry, that's sloppy geography on my part. I was thinking of the Sweden-Denmark land bridge. Which surely any unit placed in Finland can just walk round to. Those rivers have crossings, don't they?

Well, yes. But in EB Finland and Sweden aren't connected, the map doesn't reach that far north. So it would take a *long* time to march from Finland to Denmark.