m3tw

[anders]

generally, I think theres some factors that needs to be in place for a TW setting in order for CA to consider it:

a relatively well-known era for which theres some public interest, and which isnt too similar to the eras alredy used( so probbly no dark ages or renaissance)

an era in which melee combat in cohesive units were the order of the day

an era with relatively varied units, and clearly defines unit types which are relatively well documented( so no stone age or sub-saharan setting)

this doesnt leave many settings to use apart from the three, ancient europe, medieval europe and japan, which are visited.

[Zenicetus]

There's another variant on the fantasy idea, and that's the "alternate history". To some extent all the TW games are alternate histories in the way they diverge from recorded history, but you could take that much further, with a really wild starting scenario.

For example, I read a novel a while back... I can't remember the title, but the premise was that the Black Death was much, much worse than the historical plague. It was so bad it totally depopulated Europe out to the Eastern steppes and down through the Med, wiping out Western civilization. Science and technology was developed by the Muslim nations and the Chinese, and those became the dominant players on the world stage. The Muslim nations occupy an empty Europe, and China colonizes the Americas (it goes against their historical isolationism, but hey, it's a fantasy).

You could have either a M2:TW or Empire:TW period game based on that scenario, with those two great civilizations (and their allies) in conflict, and no traditional European nations at all. Imagine Chinese battle junks duking it out with Arab ships of the line in the Caribbean....

[zor]

How about an Alien: Total War where aliens invade and are one faction among many. Or imagine a Starcraft: Total War. I never played the game but Rise of Legends: Total War sounds good too.

I find pre-WWII gunpowder-dominated eras to be boring for some reason. A caveman era would also be boring.

[Captain Fishpants]

There's another variant on the fantasy idea, and that's the "alternate history". To some extent all the TW games are alternate histories in the way they diverge from recorded history, but you could take that much further, with a really wild starting scenario.

For example, I read a novel a while back... I can't remember the title, but the premise was that the Black Death was much, much worse than the historical plague. It was so bad it totally depopulated Europe out to the Eastern steppes and down through the Med, wiping out Western civilization. Science and technology was developed by the Muslim nations and the Chinese, and those became the dominant players on the world stage. The Muslim nations occupy an empty Europe, and China colonizes the Americas (it goes against their historical isolationism, but hey, it's a fantasy).

You could have either a M2:TW or Empire:TW period game based on that scenario, with those two great civilizations (and their allies) in conflict, and no traditional European nations at all. Imagine Chinese battle junks duking it out with Arab ships of the line in the Caribbean....

The book you're thinking of is "The Years of Rice and Salt" by Kim Stanley Robinson. Interesting piece of counter-factual history.

And China wasn't always isolationist. There was a period when it looked outward and was expansionist, which is why, for example, there's some very bad blood between the Vietnamese and the Chinese. There's also the "1421 hypothesis" which proposes that the Chinese did go on world-spanning voyages.

[PBI]

A CA member commenting on Chinese history. Is this a hint that there is at least the possibility of a future TW game with a Far-East setting? I know, I know, you couldn't possibly comment.

There's a possibility I hadn't thought of though; a game focused around the relatively outward-looking Ming dynasty. The problems I've always seen with a China-centred game have been:
*Not much scope for naval combat.
*Not much scope for the fun "clash of culture" type battles we get in Rome and Medieval due to the relatively inward-looking nature of Chinese history.

That's why I like the idea of a Mongolia: Total War, since it has the far-eastern setting and solves the second problem due to the expansion of the Mongols, but it has the problem that ships really aren't that useful on the steppes. A Ming dynasty setting would solve both problems though; a relatively outward-looking dynasty with a big emphasis on naval exploration (Zheng He being the most obvious example).

[Mailman653]

I've seen a few shows on the 1421 theory. Granted they had that huge fleet but the argument the main proponet of that theory does not really convince me that it happend.

But, going back on topic, I'm out of TW ideas lol, I think we should collect all the ideas in this thread and make a poll. I would be surprised if Antartica:TW made it to the top three.

[PBI]

I've seen a few shows on the 1421 theory. Granted they had that huge fleet but the argument the main proponet of that theory does not really convince me that it happend.

But, going back on topic, I'm out of TW ideas lol, I think we should collect all the ideas in this thread and make a poll. I would be surprised if Antartica:TW made it to the top three.

I believe the general consensus on the 1421 hypothesis (that the Ming dynasty discovered America before Columbus) is that it's nonsense, but the Chinese admiral Zheng He certainly did make some impressive voyages in the Indian Ocean, reaching India, Arabia and East Africa. And even though they didn't reach America, I suspect they could have done, if they'd had any interest in trying to sail east across the Pacific. Anyway, even without the Americas, I think there's still more than enough actual history in the Ming dynasty to make a game.

There was such a poll a while back in the Entrance Hall, I guess we could do with a new one since the last one was before Empire was announced.

[Captain Fishpants]

A CA member commenting on Chinese history. Is this a hint that there is at least the possibility of a future TW game with a Far-East setting? I know, I know, you couldn't possibly comment.

...

It's a hint that I need to know a metric shedload (that's 2.2 Imperial shedloads and 2.4 US shedloads) about historical stuff in order to do my job properly.

I can't talk about future plans other than to say they exist, and this means that people's TW cravings will be satisfied for a good long while yet.

Right, back to getting an interesting hundred years of history into Empire. Busy century, the 18th, all things considered.

[PBI]

Or maybe it's a hint that I'm so eager for a Chinese based TW that I will jump upon any mention of anything Chinese by a CA member as being equivalent to an announcement that the next game is to be China:TW. Apologies.

[Che Roriniho]

I think eventually they will have a game called simply Total War, which willl cover everything: Ancient Native Americans, to Modern-Day Zimbabwe. There will be over 300 factions and almost limitless Units, HUGE battles (millions on each side is possible). Just you try Taking the Sioux to capturing Bombay... Wait, I think my head just exploded from how awesome that would be.

[pevergreen]

And at this point, how impossible.

[G^2]

Maybe they could do a fantasy-historical blend ...

If it were historical, I wish they would include the whole world in the campaign map. They could still keep it focused on Europe, but you could try exploring west or east or south whenever you wanted to ... and you could play as an Asian faction in the far east if you wanted to ... kind of like Europa Universalis except with Total War game mechanics. Zor

@ Zor

Most TW games already have an element of fantasy about them, for example could England really conquere all of Europe in the Middle Ages? However, I do see your point and a historical fantasy game would be interesting.

That would be very interesting but as many have mentioned (Che Roriniho/Peverpink) probably impossible to do with the current technology. Perhaps in anouther ten years though. . .

I do however, like the idea of the Kingdoms expansion where there are many focused campaigns better than one large campaign. This is because I usally get bored after conquering a region and the game gets tedious having to manage more than 20 settlements. Thus, if CA did a World TW set throughout the world with four or five maps, like Japan, East Africa, India and Ceneral America, that would be really cool.

[Belgolas]

I can see chinese boats coming from Russia to Alaska now. Technically they could.

Anyways a total war on Asia would be nice. Need to get away from Europe. Plus how many games are set in Asia? Not many.

[pevergreen]

CA has to look at it from a marketing point of view. The general populace is not educated about history in the "east". Most people would not be familar in the geography. I think it would be interesting, but I would rather play in a geographical area I had some idea of where things would be.