Surprisingly good units

[QuintusSertorius]

The only way I'm able to judge an unit "surprisingly good" is when I have problems breaking it...

For me the grand-champions are African Elite Pikemen. IA Karth-Hadasht fields huge numbers of them and when playing Ptollies I often see them inflicting huge losses to my Agema Klerouchon (attacking from the front) and Tindanotae (attacking from the rear). Tough nuts to crack...

They're elites; they don't really qualify as "surprisingly" so because they're supposed to be that good. That's why they're expensive and have high stats.

[Irishmafia2020]

Ethiopian Spearmen and Arabian light archer/spearmen are both surprisingly good units on the Sabyn or regional roster. The Ethiopians are cheap, but fast moving, and amongst the best light infantry that I have played with. The Archer spearmen do double duty, and they are slightly better than the Persian variant.

Baktrian Hippies - probably the best medium cavalry in the game... they hit like light cataphracts in a charge, and they don't wear out as quickly.

Indo Hellenic Medium Skirmishers - specialized elephant killers who double as Thureophoroi in a pinch... not bad for the cheapest Indo-Greek unit! Indian Longbowman and Infantry guild warriors are also amazing regionals...

Equites Campanici - Campanian Cavalry, not bad for western regional cavalry. I certainly expected them to be garbage, not even equal to the successor cavalry. Actually they are a decent light cav, and my units of them tend to maintain their combat effectiveness (less than 50% casualties) through multiple battles. They have a weak charge, but are a good melee unit...

Indo-Iranian light cavalry - wow... a "light Cavalry" with a charge value of 32, and a melee value of 9. Plus they have high morale... These guys are the best light cavalry in the game... Just imagine what they could do if you got them out west...

Subeshi Archers - the infantry general's answer to those pesky horse archers. Seriously, they outrange HA's and have a high lethality, plus they are cheap and available from a level 1 regional barracks.... just make sure that they stand behind some spear men.

Peltastai - ummm.... I am embarrassed to say that i never really used these guys to their full potential. In all of my campaigns, I thought that they were basically useless, and irrelevant to the battle line. Only after reading about how great they are in other people's campaigns did I ever try to use them. Now I am a believer. For me, these are surprisingly good units - easily the equal of the archer-spearmen of the east.

[QuintusSertorius]

Peltastai - ummm.... I am embarrassed to say that i never really used these guys to their full potential. In all of my campaigns, I thought that they were basically useless, and irrelevant to the battle line. Only after reading about how great they are in other people's campaigns did I ever try to use them. Now I am a believer. For me, these are surprisingly good units - easily the equal of the archer-spearmen of the east.

It's their armour, the lethality of their sword and their stamina. It's a pretty lethal combination, especially because swordsmen are automatically 4 points of attack up on spearmen.

[QuintusSertorius]

I'm musing over whether these guys qualify:



Uazali are in a similar spot to Peltastai - medium infantry who can duke it out even with heavier ones for a time. Great flankers, though not as versatile as the aforementioned skirmishers.

[Mediolanicus]

I'm musing over whether these guys qualify:



Uazali are in a similar spot to Peltastai - medium infantry who can duke it out even with heavier ones for a time. Great flankers, though not as versatile as the aforementioned skirmishers.

...and not easily retrained if you take them away from Karia.

They are good light infantry, but always take heavy casualties in my armies.
If I use a few units of them in an army outside Asia Minor, then after three battles or so I only have half a unit left. And then I replace them by Peltastai.

[QuintusSertorius]

Not easily retrained (I don't anyway), but available more widely in a merc variant anyway.

[Mediolanicus]

Good point.

What about morale? I find them a bit more prone to rout than my Peltastai.

[The Persian Cataphract]

The Kambojans (Indo-Iranian light cavalry) can not be praised enough. These guys kick aaaaaaaaaaass! They are quick, and their value as "Eastern Prodromoi" is a sure winner. Here are a few others who take the bill as well:



They are bang for the buck. Now, I consider the Bactrian Hippeis to actually be extra-heavy cavalry due to the added barding, but their field of use is of such similar nature, I must excuse myself. The two last ones are the Steppe Hell's Angels as I call them. If I play as Saka, I make sure to at least have 25% of these guys formed up for one gigantic charge, after the horse-archers have finished with loosening up the enemy, and "closing the sphere" with horse-archers enveloping for butchery.

Celtic factions should consider themselves lucky for not having to face nomads early.

[konny]

With 462 upkeep and only level 3 barracks needed, absolutly not elites - but fight like devils. In every assault on a city I used these in my Casse campaign they get out with about 1:10 kills against mediocre enemies like spearmen (the record was some 450 killed enemies in one battle, by one unit of Milnaht of course), and still use to win against better units like Botroas or even Druids.




Another must-have in early Casse armies. They die like flies under missle fire and won't survive against regular swordfighters, but are able to kill lots of (much more expensive) spearmen like Cemmeinarn.

[Socy]

Yet again no pictures (Actually, I'll sneak in a question here, how do you upload them anyway? ) but:

Kavakaza Sparabara - Caucasian Spearmen

Hai Nizagamartik - Armenian Spearmen

Kovkasi Lernain Netadzik - Caucasian Archers

Neither of these units have ever disappointed me in my Hayasdan campaigns (Early game that is) and I've been able to conquer the entire Caucasus-region (The city where Hayasdan and the nearby settlements, 5-8 something, not sure and dont have EB available for checking) with armies consisting only of Kavakaza Sparabara and Kovkasi Lernain Netadzik in my early games (And family members, wich.. Might be tad bit better in terms of quality.). The Kavakaza are really good considering their price, same goes for the Kovkasi, in my oppinion In all my Macedonian/Seleucid games I also make sure to hire some Caucasian archers, I just think they are plain awesome .

[QuintusSertorius]

Yet again no pictures (Actually, I'll sneak in a question here, how do you upload them anyway? )

Go onto the EB website, and browse the unit rosters for the factions. If you can't find it there, chances are it's in the Eleutheroi roster.

[gamegeek2]

Yeah, all the greek units that cost around 1300 are excellent. I have to agree with the Keltohellenikoi Hoplitai pick for #1.

Also, I couldn't get an image, but the Cordinau Orca. Even though they're expensive, they're a great deal, and barely ever lose ANY fight with infantry or non-charging cavalry.

- Are a double-duty weapon against the Parthians and their nomadic buddies. Kill the horse archers both in melee and at range. Like their standard Persian Archer counterparts, great with levy phalanx.

- The Cretans' armoured Eastern counterpart. Just great all-around guys in your army, and, if moved to the east to fight the nomads, are simply AMAZING.

- Cost-efficient Greek dudes who can take javelins and throw them right back. They beat most everything that costs the same (except hoplites) and are just great utility guys to have around, even when you have Thorakitai.

- Just as cost-efficient as its lighter counterpart, it takes on most things its cost and wins handily. Also virtually impervious to most missiles from the front.

- Yeah. Available as an excellent mercenary and as cheap but highly effective multi-purpose cavalry around the Pontic steppe north of the Black sea and to the west in Skythia Minor.

[Ravenfeeder]

Ok so no precursor missile and lousy defence, but they are cheap and there's lots of them. Once pinned to the front by the Chalk Spiders these guys absolutely mince KH bodyguards and Spartans - that armour piercing axe is great!

[machinor]

Yeah, gotta love Eastern infantry. Die like flies but are cheap and come in nice big formations and with a handy armor-pierching axe. Eastern Axemen are even better because of their javelins.

[Codyos Vladimiros]

Yeah, gotta love Eastern infantry. Die like flies but are cheap and come in nice big formations and with a handy armor-pierching axe. Eastern Axemen are even better because of their javelins.

They really remind me of the Ghazi infantry of MTW1. I use them the same way, mostly as flankers. They're like antimatter-they annihilate both themselves and the enemy forces.

[machinor]

Hahaha! Great comparison! :D Yeah it's true, now that you mention it, they really are similar to Ghazi infantry.

[Celtic_Punk]

Cladaca (Goidilic Light Infantry)-
When I did my Casse Migration to Northern Ireland (my place of birth WOO!) These were pretty much my vanguard. They'll hold their own against pretty much anything the isles can throw at you. I didn't get to fight much of other cultures before the savefile was corrupted but i was very impressed. They are good skirmishers like most celt units and with their swords they are more than capable in close combat.


Ordmalica (Goidilic Shock Infantry)-
When Mark Hamil said to Jason Mewes in Jay n Silent Bob Strike back "don't fuck with the jedi master, son" I'm pretty sure he meant these guys. They will mess you up. Two handed axes are not something you wanna screw around with, they will chew a hole through the enemy's battleline like a hungry wolf in a room full of chickens.


Balroae (Caledonian Skirmishers)-
There's nothing a vicious Scotsman hyped up on amphetamines and hammered like your uncle can't do. Even though their primarily skirmishers, dont let that discourage you from letting them at the Romans legions. There was a reason Rome never went to Scotland. They scared them so much they built a wall and we're more than content at letting us Gaels kill ourselves then to be eaten alive by drunken naked Irishmen.


Peltastai (Hellenic Heavy Skirmishers)-
If your phalanx (classical or Makedonian) is failing, you need to plug a hole, or you just want to utterly crush the enemy with a decisive flanking manoeuvre, these guys are the men for the job. Making critical flanks are in their job description.(literally) they however are not supposed to hold the line. but they can! I have been well aquainted with fighting in cities, and when im forcing my way to the square, there are two units i cannot do without- Classical Hoplites and Peltastai. While i cycle my Hoplites out of the fight to rest, someone needs to take up the fight, and these guys can hold the line long enough for my men to rest up and cycle back in. dependable and cheap unit!


Somatophylakes Strategou (Baktrian Early Bodyguard)-
Yes yes yes, this is a SURPRISINGLY good units thread, but I've never been so impressed by a bodyguard unit. Even the Spartan bodyguards can falter. But these guys have never failed me. and if they do break, at least the enemy regrets engaging them. I have no problem racking up 350+ kills without losing more than 20! They suck up Persian arrows like a fatkid on cake, and come back out the otherside with the heads of them to prove it! If there's one thing I know... It's a bad day to be a Persian!

Thats the best of the cheap that have surprised me.
The best units I've encountered come from the Isles. and haven't even used their entire roster! the Goillic Cavalry is also a force to be reckoned with.

[Che Roriniho]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Cladaca (Goidilic Light Infantry)-
When I did my Casse Migration to Northern Ireland (my place of birth WOO!) These were pretty much my vanguard. They'll hold their own against pretty much anything the isles can throw at you. I didn't get to fight much of other cultures before the savefile was corrupted but i was very impressed. They are good skirmishers like most celt units and with their swords they are more than capable in close combat.


Ordmalica (Goidilic Shock Infantry)-
When Mark Hamil said to Jason Mewes in Jay n Silent Bob Strike back "don't fuck with the jedi master, son" I'm pretty sure he meant these guys. They will mess you up. Two handed axes are not something you wanna screw around with, they will chew a hole through the enemy's battleline like a hungry wolf in a room full of chickens.


Balroae (Caledonian Skirmishers)-
There's nothing a vicious Scotsman hyped up on amphetamines and hammered like your uncle can't do. Even though their primarily skirmishers, dont let that discourage you from letting them at the Romans legions. There was a reason Rome never went to Scotland. They scared them so much they built a wall and we're more than content at letting us Gaels kill ourselves then to be eaten alive by drunken naked Irishmen.


Peltastai (Hellenic Heavy Skirmishers)-
If your phalanx (classical or Makedonian) is failing, you need to plug a hole, or you just want to utterly crush the enemy with a decisive flanking manoeuvre, these guys are the men for the job. Making critical flanks are in their job description.(literally) they however are not supposed to hold the line. but they can! I have been well aquainted with fighting in cities, and when im forcing my way to the square, there are two units i cannot do without- Classical Hoplites and Peltastai. While i cycle my Hoplites out of the fight to rest, someone needs to take up the fight, and these guys can hold the line long enough for my men to rest up and cycle back in. dependable and cheap unit!


Somatophylakes Strategou (Baktrian Early Bodyguard)-
Yes yes yes, this is a SURPRISINGLY good units thread, but I've never been so impressed by a bodyguard unit. Even the Spartan bodyguards can falter. But these guys have never failed me. and if they do break, at least the enemy regrets engaging them. I have no problem racking up 350+ kills without losing more than 20! They suck up Persian arrows like a fatkid on cake, and come back out the otherside with the heads of them to prove it! If there's one thing I know... It's a bad day to be a Persian!

Thats the best of the cheap that have surprised me.
The best units I've encountered come from the Isles. and haven't even used their entire roster! the Goillic Cavalry is also a force to be reckoned with.

Jesus. Goes to show how much I need to play as Casse at some point, and possibly how much a Goidilic faction in EBII (hint, hint)

[Celtic_Punk]

throw em in the Roman checkerboard formation and your unstoppable! lmao

[SwissBarbar]

Machimoi (Native Egyptian Infantry)






These Units did really surprise me. I play with Carthage and try to conquer the Ptolemies. The Machimois are besides the Toxotai, Akontistai and the Native Hellenic Spearmen the only units i can build there at the moment.

I really am surprised how they can stand their ground defending a city when supported by city-towers, even against heavy enemy forces and when outnumberd.

[Master Young Phoenix]

I'm very impressed by the performance of Swebozi Jugunthiz. They're a great 1st wave of troops to send at the enemy. They hold out quite well in combat, but send in the Slagonez and Gaizoz Frijotes to back them up. In my current campaign they've made the greatest contributions to the conquest of the rebel tribes and i've used them quite offensively.

[HasdrubalBarca]

Machimoi (Native Egyptian Infantry)






These Units did really surprise me. I play with Carthage and try to conquer the Ptolemies. The Machimois are besides the Toxotai, Akontistai and the Native Hellenic Spearmen the only units i can build there at the moment.

I really am surprised how they can stand their ground defending a city when supported by city-towers, even against heavy enemy forces and when outnumberd.

agreed

the gallic Naked Spearmen are almost overpowered in the hands of the player when playing vs even the romans the morale effect they have has won me so many battles in my Aedui campaign