What would offend a Celt?

[Chirurgeon]

Dress him up in a Toga and send him to Academy?

[QuintusSertorius]

Dress him up in a Toga and send him to Academy?

He didn't ask how you offend traditional Roman sensibilities.

[Theodotos I]

To be more specific. If I, as a ancient Gallic king, sent a messenger to another king, what would he do if he wanted to insult me and my messenger. There are several ancient accounts in the middle east of messengers being sent back with their beards shaved off. What's the Gallic equivalent?
And I'll have to say the replies I've gotten so far are very, shall we say, interesting. . .

[QuintusSertorius]

Refuse to see him and make him eat with the slaves?

[roman]

Brand him or cut off his sword arm?

[Havok.]

What would certainly offend a whole celtic tribe?
hmmm....

[Hax]

To be more specific. If I, as a ancient Gallic king, sent a messenger to another king, what would he do if he wanted to insult me and my messenger. There are several ancient accounts in the middle east of messengers being sent back with their beards shaved off. What's the Gallic equivalent?
And I'll have to say the replies I've gotten so far are very, shall we say, interesting. . .

When Vercingetorix didn't agree with someone, he had his ears cut off and one of his eyes gouged out.

[Hax]

Me too
though i'm a player of Portuguese bagpipes, called Transmontana, not sure if you guys know it...

Ah, gaita de fole Transmontana?

I play the Gaita Galega and Cornemuse du Centre myself.

[Maeran]

Me too
though i'm a player of Portuguese bagpipes, called Transmontana, not sure if you guys know it...

No, I didn't know you played them. .

Appo's idea just takes too long. You'd be tired.

The tradition of hospitality is a wide ranging one (it would work with Greeks too probably). Presumably you're looking for a reason for war here.

Perhaps you could throw meat to the dogs but not give any to the emissary. Or present him with a humiliating gift (like the king of France sending Henry V tennis balls in Shakespeare's play, but not as lame).

[Cadwalader]

Send a "gift", like a small sack of money or something: "obviously you need this lol".


I think that would piss a majesty off. I got the inspiration from Snorri's Heimskringla, where the English king sends Norway's king a sword. This is seen as something you do to your servants. The offended king (Harald I, the first king of all Norway) sent the English king Athelstan one of his sons in return. This was seen as even more humiliating. Athelstan kept the boy, which later became Hàkon the good of Norway!

[Celtic_Punk]

I think the main way to offend a modern Celt is to call him English.

thats more than an offence, thats the quickest way to be sleeping at the bottom of the irish sea



but seriously, if you call into question the parentage of himself or his children, or his skills as a tradesmen/businessmen then you are going to get a mouthful of knuckles

[Jolt]

When Vercingetorix didn't agree with someone, he had his ears cut off and one of his eyes gouged out.

Wow. Then Vercingetorix was a earless, eyeless man from boyhood, it seems. >_> :P

[Hax]

No, I mean that when someone didn't agree with Vercingetorix, the latter had the ears cut off and one eye gouged out of the guy that didn't agree with him.

[Havok.]

Ah, gaita de fole Transmontana?

I play the Gaita Galega and Cornemuse du Centre myself.

Aye, besides that one, Transmontana, i'm gathering money for a Scottish Smallpipe too
just beatiful

[Jolt]

No, I mean that when someone didn't agree with Vercingetorix, the latter had the ears cut off and one eye gouged out of the guy that didn't agree with him.

I know. -_-' I was just making fun of a possible:
"Random guy: No
Vercingetorix: Oh yeah? Hehehe. HOW DO YOU LIKE THIS? *cuts off one of his own ears
Random guy: ...Eew. Ugh...Still no..
Vercingetorix: You sure? Really? Then.. *cuts off the other ear and takes off one eye*
Random guy: ...Okay...
Vercingetorix: Really? YAY!!"

[Hax]

Hahaha, sorry.

It's getting late. Awesome.

Aye, besides that one, Transmontana, i'm gathering money for a Scottish Smallpipe too

Smallpipes have a really weird style of playing. They sound nice, but are pretty weird.

[Havok.]

Smallpipes have a really weird style of playing. They sound nice, but are pretty weird.

They are quite different from the majority of bagpipes, and i totally agree they are something a bit unusual but their sound is truly amazing


sorry, back to the topic now lads

[Cyclops]

Sorry not to give a serious answer.

Here's an example of a successful (?) insult given to a Gaul.

Negotiations broke down, resulting in Quintus Fabius, a member of a powerful patrician family, killing one of the Gallic leaders. The Gauls demanded the Fabians be handed over to them for justice. However, the defiant Romans not only refused, but, as Livy writes, "those who ought to have been punished were instead appointed for the coming year military tribunes with consular powers (the highest that could be granted)." The enraged Gauls promised war against the Romans to avenge the insult that they had been dealt, resulting in the Battle of the Allia and the subsequent siege of Rome itself.

from wiki

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Allia

slightly different version of events in Appian here:

http://www.livius.org/ap-ark/appian/..._gallic_2.html

[cmacq]

Yes, and thus these moronic Latins were set straight on the path to empire.

Again, in the Gaulish Culture (450-45 BC) the greatest insult to a defeated enemy would be the desecration of the falled foe's body by removing the head (seat of the soul) and displaying it as a trophy. Within the belief system of this society, this act alone deigned the dead an afterlife. By the way, their concept of an afterlife was the keystone that held this Culture and individual Gaulish societies together. Then cutting the corpse into small bits and scattering them or feeding them to animals (burning the body bits would actually have been seen as favorable). On this line, feeding the body bits to the victors hounds, would have been by far the most insulting. Anything more would have been seen as crass window dressing.

[dominique]

Yes, and thus these moronic Latins were set straight on the path to empire.

Your post gave me a strange idea and a good laugh:

The romans were like this guy who got dressed as a girl and raped in prison, and when he's back in the 'hood, he gets even with the world by bullying everybody and his dog.

Modern version: NO, I WAS NO PRISON BITCH!

Roman version: NO, ROME WASN'T SACKED, THE GEESE SAVED US!



for a little reference on the joke:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Allia

[Aodhan]

As there are no Celts today, I assume you're question is about pre-Roman Gaul or southern Germany. In that case, one Gaul to another may tell their enemy, that after he took his head, above the door he'd nail it to the shed, so his ugly face might scare away the crows. And for his body, if he could only hide the smell, he will chop it up and feed it to the dogs, if they'd deem it fit enough to eat?

What do you mean, there are still Celts in Scotland and Ireland, and most "English" people are in fact at least parts Celt, there are very few Roman bloodlines left in Britain. Did you perhaps mean Gauls?

And in answer to what would offend a Celt, the best thing you could possibly do is kill him, behead him, and then throw his head into a ditch and take the Torque, as a Roman "hero" did in some famous battle in CisAlpine Gaul, although I don't remember the exact battle.

[Celtic_Punk]

tell one of us, we ain't a Celt. someone did that to me back in the last month of school this year. busted his nose in a rage. Wasn't the OOONLY thing he said tho, but thats what really set me off haha.

Thats really only because we are a dying breed these days. Celts were very numerous. The "celt empire" spread from central Europe (around Austria) to all across northern Europe. not united, even so thats quite the achievement for one culture to spread so vastly.

Insulting a Celts honour, forcing him to his knees, defiling his wife, insulting his gods, Hell spit in his face, just simple things like that. Or you could always just dress him up like a prostitute and drag him through Rome?

[cmacq]

Actually, the term Celt means a person that lived in Gaul. It has been misused in recent times to make nationalistic common cause, which is also strange enough another modern myth. Referring in an analytical sense to a Celtic Culture, Language Group, or Archaeological Construct is one thing, however claiming one is a qualitative abstract is quite another, indeed.

edited: sorry it actually means a Gaul.

[||Lz3||]

Actually, the term Celt means a person that lived in Gaul. It has been misused in recent times to make nationalistic common cause, which is also strange enough another modern myth.

watch out you said he wasn't celt... he might bust your nose too JK

[cmacq]

Another myth, as maybe we'll get a little cheese with that?

[Celtic_Punk]

lol good one LZ3

and what the other guy said, that IS not true. Celts ORIGINALLY from central europe. some tribes in northern gaul sailed to Britain (most likely swam considering our shitty boats we had then haha) in search of tin.

When Caesar wanted to pass a law that would allow "Celtus" to serve as senators(the bill being proposed just before he was murdered I believe) INCLUDED ALL clans under Roman rule.

Celtus was a blanket term for all people of the Celtic ethnicity, which was based on a native term Celts gave themselves.

All the peoples considered as Celts (Gauls, Britons, Gaels, Galatians, ect.) share similarities in language, religion, warfare, society, and other certain areas of daily life.

one exception to this is the Gaelic languages, the three surviving languages(Irish, Welsh, and Scottish Gaelic) developed quite differently (and im sure they were still different to continental celts) due to the isolation of the isles. Till the Romans came there was little contact with mainland Europe.

[Cyclops]

Actually, the term Celt means a person that lived in Gaul. It has been misused in recent times to make nationalistic common cause, which is also strange enough another modern myth. Referring in an analytical sense to a Celtic Culture, Language Group, or Archaeological Construct is one thing, however claiming one is qualitative abstract is quite another, indeed.

...yep, that'll do it.

Were the Keltoi the folks up the Danube from the Thrakoi? I suspect the Hellenikoi first struck the occasionally-blue-painted metalworkers of La Tene thereabouts. Or was it around Massilia?

Caesar says there were 3 groups in "All Gaul", Belgae, Aquitani and Gauls. Are they all Celts? Its so confusing. And are Celtiberians really Basques, or Irish?

I suppose its a bit like "what is a Turk?" There's a political, linguistic, cultural and mythical answer and all rather different.

Personally I think if you're angry and drink beer you're a Celt. I consider myself a Celt, more so on a Saturday night after my football team loses.

Hety one answer to the OP would be to denigrate the Celt's footy team, that works for me.

[cmacq]

Sorry C-Punk, I think you may have jumped a few rungs on your logic ladder? Better check your facts, as there were people the Romans called Gauls, whom they considered Celts that didn’t live in Gaul. Then there were others they simply called Celts that also didn’t live in Gaul. For example the Cimbri in Denmark. Yet, the Romans never called the Britons Celt; nor did they the Irish, or even the Scotts. There were even people that lived in Gaul they did not call Celt. You however may be confusing the Latin Celti or Celtae and Greek Κέλται or Κελτός for the English word taken from the work of Edward Lhuyd in the early 1700’s. A very common mistake but the later is a horse of a different colour.

Strange how if the Roman or Greek historical record doesn’t agree with a preconception, suddenly the ancient, which ironically is the source of most knowledge, becomes so stunningly ignorant.

CmacQ

[Celtic_Punk]

A gaul was no more a celt by your reasoning than any other. The first recorded settlement (by the greeks) of celts was north of the Alps. NOT in Gaul. The word Celtus (the roman term for celts) is an ethnic word that is a blanket for all celtic clans stretching from iberia to galatia. The only people you can really get away with calling non celts are iberians (due to punic infulence) and Galatians.

even if the Romans thought celts were just Gauls(which they didn't), why was there an entire word just for Gauls? and another thing, The Romans were stunningly ignorant people. so if they even believed celts were only gauls, id still be looking for another source.

edit: im familiar with the term from the 1700's, but the fact of the matter is, the celts spread from north of the alps, to iberia, to galatia, and then to the isles. the cultures may have changed (which is why you are most likely so confused) but they still shared critical similarities which allowed them to be traced.

[Celtic_Punk]

...yep, that'll do it.

Were the Keltoi the folks up the Danube from the Thrakoi? I suspect the Hellenikoi first struck the occasionally-blue-painted metalworkers of La Tene thereabouts. Or was it around Massilia?

Caesar says there were 3 groups in "All Gaul", Belgae, Aquitani and Gauls. Are they all Celts? Its so confusing. And are Celtiberians really Basques, or Irish?

I suppose its a bit like "what is a Turk?" There's a political, linguistic, cultural and mythical answer and all rather different.

Personally I think if you're angry and drink beer you're a Celt. I consider myself a Celt, more so on a Saturday night after my football team loses.

Hety one answer to the OP would be to denigrate the Celt's footy team, that works for me.

i doubt the celtiberians were irish, people who came to my island went to britian first, and stopped in ireland (there really isnt another place to go, cept davy jones locker) im sure they are a mix of Basques and celts migrating from southwest Gaul. Celts from Britain and Eire came from the northern coast of France and from belgium, (probably more north aswell) the Isolation of ireland resulted in a strange change of syntax with the Gaelic language aswell. (thats why its so friggin hard to learn the language, i was one of the unfortunate kids who's mum was afraid of the "troubles" so we moved to canada and I never learned it )


You are probably a Gael by blood Cyclops, being from aussyland. Hell theres an entire part of my family that lives in NZ cause their dad's dad's dad's dad's (so on n so on) got shafted stealing corn cause his family had no food (i wonder why? 800 years of theft, rape, murder, oppression come to mind anyone?)