How good can you make your kingdom in 22 turns?

**Proserpine** · 09-07-2008, 19:16

Following on from my other recent topic, Why Turtle, here:

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=106903

I issue the following challenge to all "turtlers" out there. Vanilla MTW2, any faction.

Blitzers say: Breetai completed the short campaign in 8 turns, Askthepizzaguy and Sir Rethvir did it in 9. ATPG has conquered all provinces in 23 and has so far crushed all comers in PvP mode of his turtle v blitz challenge. Therefore blitzing "rules".

But some people think a turtle could win if far enough away from the blitzer at the start.

So here it is. You pick any faction. Your goal is to have the largest, most developed and richest kingdom you can possibly have, by turn 22. That is the max, no. of turns before the blitzer will get to you. Sacking is permitted. You can conquer (but you are a turtle not a blitzer, remember). You are in long campaign mode, and the settings are VH/VH.

**Ferret** · 09-07-2008, 19:39

A turtle challenge! I like it, wonder who will step up to be the Turtle master...

**Carlos Matthews** · 09-07-2008, 21:15

I would but I can't find my Med2 disk..

**Proserpine** · 09-07-2008, 22:59

Originally Posted by ArtistofWarfare

Why 22 turns? That seems pretty premature...

What about - Who can build the most glorious empire that includes the New World?

Or even, who can orchestrate the strongest most powerful faction BEFORE they start their blitz?

That to me sounds interesting. Blitzing 8 provinces per turn using armored seargents is what I find to be an utter snooze fest.

It's 22 turns because on turn 23 (at latest), you must assume that you have to withstand the might of ATPG's legions of armoured spearmen or whatever . . . who will control the whole map apart from your empire. ATPG has done the whole 106 provinces in 23 turns and thinks it can be done in 22. The point is you have to tech up fast and build forces and an economy which has a chance of winning against an out-and-out blitz attach.

**Askthepizzaguy** · 09-08-2008, 01:42

The only question I have is; by what measure are we declaring the winner?

Certainly not most provinces... and largest city, because some factions start with better stuff. How about, what is the largest, most advanced, professional army you can field in 22 turns?

**Proserpine** · 09-08-2008, 02:13

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

The only question I have is; by what measure are we declaring the winner?

Certainly not most provinces... and largest city, because some factions start with better stuff. How about, what is the largest, most advanced, professional army you can field in 22 turns?

Sounds good to me . . .

**PrestigeX** · 09-12-2008, 22:42

I know some players are all about blitzing and so forth,,,

but i generally prefer to enjoy the game and treat it somewhat as thought I were really managing an empire.

Blitzing is more of a fault within the engine of the game, and not very realistic in the sense of how it's done.

Historically, i know blitzing has happened but usually that is because the invaders have .

a. A huge huge force of very good troops (ie. Alexander the great, Julius caesar, Genghis Khan, Germans in ww2 etc).

b. Some form of technological superiority making their troops better than the enemy..again my example fits.. Alexander's phalangites/companion cav... Caesar's legions, the Khan's horde of Horse Archer monghols.. the Luftwafte and Panzer division ..

so in the game using a few armoured spearmen and some kinghts to conquer the world (in the game) is just unrealistic to me.

**Galain_Ironhide** · 09-17-2008, 00:51

Originally Posted by Proserpine

So here it is. You pick any faction. Your goal is to have the largest, most developed and richest kingdom you can possibly have, by turn 22. That is the max, no. of turns before the blitzer will get to you. Sacking is permitted. You can conquer (but you are a turtle not a blitzer, remember). You are in long campaign mode, and the settings are VH/VH.

So amongst all of the debate, has anybody actually bothered to take part in this challenge?

Wheres all the screenshots of glorious 22-turn-old nations?

**coldpolar** · 09-17-2008, 01:57

while i agree with ATPG that no turtler can defeat a blitzer one-on-one. though i consider myself very able i would rather not be on the receiving end of his prodigious blitzing skills. however, i feel that by the time such a blitzer hits the turtler he has already won without the two ever having met.

to illustrate my point, as egypt i faced the mongols not much longer after i had first captured the lands around antioch. i had some time to prepare, cannon towers across the board, large if mediocre garrisons in cities, and one high quality field army and one of slightly lesser grade. much to the delight of my ego a long hard-fought campaign was concluded without a single mongol ever having set foot in a city square. i attribute my victory to intelligent manouevers on the battle map with a reliance of fords, good preparation and replenishment of troops, and of course a mixture of luck and poor AI.

i have no doubt that if the roles were reversed and i took charge of the horde the results would have been very different. with one exception- the AI would have lost again.

so i propose i better test would be to pit a blitzer against a map with every faction controlled by players (not acting in union of course). history has shown states utlizing an endlessly aggressive blitz to be the exception and thus only one or at the most two blitzers would be needed as representatives. then i feel it would be very much more debateable the outcome. sadly the situation is hypothetical. happily this means the deabte is potentially endless!