Idea for unit research

[Cullhwch]

Note: this almost certainly oversteps the purely historical basis of EB, but since the whole purpose of the game is to rule and expand your empire as you see fit, this still may be a worthwhile idea.

We all know that every faction is deficient in at least one unit type, as that faction simply never developed it. But you as the player not necessarily beholden to the decisions made by historical figures. How about if Carthage wanted to develop cavalry archers (just as an example), they could build a massively expensive and time-consuming "building" (something on the order of a major dock expansion) as a marker to unlock recruitment of the desired unit type? Hell, the building itself could provide the recruitment in the EDB. If certain generic unit models could be used universally, would this be a worthwhile idea to consider? Too fanciful?

[a completely inoffensive name]

Note: this almost certainly oversteps the purely historical basis of EB, but since the whole purpose of the game is to rule and expand your empire as you see fit, this still may be a worthwhile idea.

We all know that every faction is deficient in at least one unit type, as that faction simply never developed it. But you as the player not necessarily beholden to the decisions made by historical figures. How about if Carthage wanted to develop cavalry archers (just as an example), they could build a massively expensive and time-consuming "building" (something on the order of a major dock expansion) as a marker to unlock recruitment of the desired unit type? Hell, the building itself could provide the recruitment in the EDB. If certain generic unit models could be used universally, would this be a worthwhile idea to consider? Too fanciful?

The main (and original) goal of EB is to be as historically accurate as possible, any idea that conflicts with this goal is 99.99% probably not even going to be considered. Just telling you this as a heads up. I kinda like the idea myself, but I know it won't be considered.

[Cullhwch]

Yeah, I knew that it probably wouldn't be considered when I posted it. It's along the lines of a ruler throwing money at a cool idea until it becomes a reality. Sorta like how the Romans developed their navy.

[Ludens]

The usual way of dealing with a deficiency in ones military was to look for foreign expertise and hire it. Trying to have your own people learn horse-archery seems like a waste of time and resources: they are never going to be as good at it as those steppe-dwellers, and the latter are hardly expensive to hire. And horse-archery isn't something that can be learned in a month: it requires a life-time of dedication, and this therefore generally the preserve of those who use it for a living. The Romans acquiring a navy this way seems more likely, but it's a pretty rare event. It also leads to all kind of scenarios that the team would have to anticipate and implement (Roman cataphracts, Celtic legions, Celtic cataphracts and so on), so I don't see this happening, even if it wouldn't take up building slots and other resources.

[eddy_purpus]

Note: this almost certainly oversteps the purely historical basis of EB, but since the whole purpose of the game is to rule and expand your empire as you see fit, this still may be a worthwhile idea.

We all know that every faction is deficient in at least one unit type, as that faction simply never developed it. But you as the player not necessarily beholden to the decisions made by historical figures. How about if Carthage wanted to develop cavalry archers (just as an example), they could build a massively expensive and time-consuming "building" (something on the order of a major dock expansion) as a marker to unlock recruitment of the desired unit type? Hell, the building itself could provide the recruitment in the EDB. If certain generic unit models could be used universally, would this be a worthwhile idea to consider? Too fanciful?

as you said ... to fanciful . this would get away of that feeling of uniqueness of every faction in the game . imagine roma with some crazy indian elephants ?
no !
i think that this idea , is not going to be considered by the EB TEAM , why ?
too much unhistorical...
they have said it . they want historical accuracy for eveery faction in the game .

[a completely inoffensive name]

Even if there was unlimited building and unit slots to use, I doubt it would be logical to assume that in the roughly 300 year span of the EB time frame a culture/nation could assimilate another culture's idea and become experts at it within three centuries. A culture's battle tactics were usually shaped and perfected over millennia, and usually for their own surrounding environment only. Am I wrong in saying that?

[Ludens]

Even if there was unlimited building and unit slots to use, I doubt it would be logical to assume that in the roughly 300 year span of the EB time frame a culture/nation could assimilate another culture's idea and become experts at it within three centuries. A culture's battle tactics were usually shaped and perfected over millennia, and usually for their own surrounding environment only. Am I wrong in saying that?

Millennia is a bit exaggerated. It all depends on the technique in question, and how much the culture in question is willing or able to change it's ways. Take for example Japan in the nineteenth century. Following the Convention of Kanagawa in 1854, the country became involved in the wider world, and they were horrified to see that western world was dominating the east. They realized they too were no match for the western powers, so they radically adopted western techniques and doctrines. Most notably, they got the British to help them build and train a navy, and then went on to demonstrate their expertise by humiliating the Russians in the Russo-Japanese war of 1904-1905, not fifty year later. Another 36 years on, the Japanese took on the American and British navies, and despite not winning decisively, they still hit hard. So in less than a century, the Japanese had copied the western way of naval warfare, and teaching the inventors a few lessons in the process.

However, this is rare, and I agree with the thrust of your argument. Military reforms require considerable effort, and often social reforms as well. I mean: how long did the Romans take to adopt cataphracts? And did they do it because the emperor thought they looked cool, or because the Parthians were a serious problem and the Romans had trouble coping.

[Cullhwch]

I was not advocating that the factions become expert in using foreign fighting styles. To the contrary, actually. Some generic mercenary type units could be shared amongst all factions unfamiliar with their fighting styles. In BI, the Eastern Roman cataphracts were effective yet still quite inferior to those of the Sassanids. Knockoffs.

Hell, this building of which I speak could just be a sort of mercenary meetingplace/recruitment network with small pools of the relevant unit types, and each upgrade to this complex would improve both the numbers of units and the replenishment speed. Is this more feasible?

Oh, and eddy, use uppercase letters on occasion and regular font width. It'll make things easier for people to read.

[Ludens]

You mean as an alternative mercenary pool that can be constructed in cities? It sounds feasible and realistic, although I still doubt horse archers would make it all the way to Carthage unless there was a single empire in between.

[Cullhwch]

That's why the horse archer upgrade for that particular building in Carthage would be either extremely expensive or produce very small pools of units.

[Majd il-Romani]

you guys realize there are REGIONALS, right? Like if Lusotannan conquers Saka they will recruit local Horse Achers, Casse will recuit italian-style units if they take italy, etc

[Cullhwch]

Yes, I understand the regional recruitment concept perfectly. But my idea is to recruit units from the surrounding regions, not the local area. For instance, a low level Roman merc recruitment network in Italy would be limited to a few Gallic units and the odd Illyrian here and there. However, if the network was fully upgraded, the Romans would be able to recruit a smattering of unit types from all over the Mediterranean, although the Gallic mercs would have the greatest availability.

This may at appear to de-emphasize the regional MIC system, but there is a fix for that. Merc recruitment centers could be linked to the regional MICs. A level 2 regional MIC could be a prerequisite for a level 1 merc network, for instance. There are ways to implement this without supplanting the MIC system.

[Sheogorath]

Even if there was unlimited building and unit slots to use, I doubt it would be logical to assume that in the roughly 300 year span of the EB time frame a culture/nation could assimilate another culture's idea and become experts at it within three centuries. A culture's battle tactics were usually shaped and perfected over millennia, and usually for their own surrounding environment only. Am I wrong in saying that?

Not only would you have to consider one culture assimilating another cultures ideas, but cultures assimilating combined ideas of two cultures that another culture assimilated and mashed together to create something else and...
Yeah...I dont think it'd go over too well :P