I hope you improve the battles

[ludwag]

The battles use to be a field where you can do whatevery you want. like riding with your cavalry and charging from the back. The size of battles was historicly much bigger. And that made it harder to do this. So it was nessecary to go fancy things to get the cavalry trough the lines of infantry. Like breaking your own lines to make a gap in both the enemy and your own lines or placing the cavalry in front, or just do like they do in The Gladiator, lol.

I know you cant make the battles this big. But if you make tha map smaller. or make very thick forest around, like the historical battle from medieval 2, battle of hastings.

This is also forces you or the computer to attack the enemy from the front like in real battles.

And not making a stupid battle with all the units spread all over the map attacking eachother one on one and cavalry flanking them and running back and doing it again and units flee and come back again and full chaos, you know what i mean?

If you do this there will be more focus on planning and strategy. Making flanking something we have to do with strategy and not just running around them. We will have to fight for the flank. And that is what they did in ancient time, and the game will be more awesome.

[Warmaster Horus]

Friend, this is hardcoded. It means it can't be modded, which is what the EB team is trying to do.
Besides, the M2 AI is famous for its stupidity. So, getting it to do smart stuff is nearly impossible.

[Foot]

There is no way we can manually edit each tile on the campaign map to come up with what you suggest on the battle field. The battlefield is based on the campaign map tile, but otherwise it is randomly generated, afaik. Historical battles can be manually edited. Basically we cannot do what you suggest at all.

Foot

[ludwag]

You can edit the campaign map. And from there you can change tha battlegrounds, in cost of a little campagin map realism. And if you can edit the size of the battle map to. it would be perfect. It sounds very easy tough.

But in EB, the battlegrounds actually looks better. And that is becouse you changed the campaign map.

I noticed that in my first EB battle. Seriously, you sould just start a campaign with Getai and move your army up between the mountains your first turn and the Elutheroi army will attack, and you see a prefect battlefield. seriously you should try.

I love that the threes are more bushy and denser and smaller.

so if you cant make the battle map smaller, you can edit the size of the trees. and you can edit the size of the soldiers.

But that would probably change the gameplay very mutch

What possibilities do you have?

[Foot]

We can alter the campaign map, but that only gives us limited control over how the battlemap will look. We spent a lot of time doing that for EBI and it worked out pretty well but what you see in EBI is pretty much the best we can achieve. A bit of tweaking here and there may improve it slightly but we really cannot fully do what you suggest. There will be many map tiles that produce battlemaps that lack a lot of the terrain features that you would wish to see, of course there will also be plenty of battlemaps where tactics will be absolutely necessary. However we cannot fine tune it to the level that you seem to wish for, its just not possible.

Foot

[ludwag]

okay, i see. Just one more question: Are you able to make some kind of army-camps full of tents, in the battlemap? That lies in the background or something to make a more ancient battle-feeling? Just some idea i had. Like it is a part of the vegetation and are present on every battlefield. Maybe just some stupid idea.

[Foot]

No, I don't think that is possible either. Watchtowers, for example, appear on the battlemap, but they are hardcoded and we cannot add new elements such as military camps.

Foot

[ludwag]

okay. but can you make the size of the soldiers, just a ittle bigger? barley noticeable. So that the battles appear a little bigger?

[Foot]

What? Making the soldiers on a larger model? We've already started making units it would be impossible to change their size now. I'm not sure how it would make battles look bigger. The Battlemap would appear smaller but there would be the same number of soldiers on there making the whole thing look smaller. Decreasing the size of soldiers (along with other elements such as trees) would actually make the battlemap look bigger and also give the impression of a larger battle.

However there is no way either of that is possible, as I've mentioned.

Foot

[ludwag]

ah. i diddnt know they would all have to be remodeled. But if had made them bigger, the battle would not be bigger, but the battle map would be smaller. But nvm, i love the mod anyway :)

[Ravenic]

On the subject of changing terrain, it would be nice if something could be done for the battle maps where the entire map is basically a big forest, which means you basically can't see anything that's going on. (Tell me thats historical all you want, but historically I'd have Centurions to micromanage my cohorts, and I wouldn't have to try and do it from fifty feet in the air, or level with the horse's ass if I zoom in all the way)

And then theres my personal favorite, where a map has a mountain or something on it that goes up practically at a 90 degree angle, and the A.I. deploys at the very top. Perhaps it'd be possible to simply make this regions 'impassable'? Steep enough in other words.

I know neither of those are probably do-able...but it's something nice to think about.

[Hax]

And then theres my personal favorite, where a map has a mountain or something on it that goes up practically at a 90 degree angle, and the A.I. deploys at the very top. Perhaps it'd be possible to simply make this regions 'impassable'? Steep enough in other words.

This is very possible in Medieval II.

[Ravenic]

I certainly hope so, though I don't really see how it could happen unless M2TW offers alot more flexibility than RTW that I'm not aware of. I've certainly had the '90 degree angle' situation happen to me in M2TW just like in Rome :(

[ratbarf]

No, I don't think that is possible either. Watchtowers, for example, appear on the battlemap, but they are hardcoded and we cannot add new elements such as military camps.

Foot

You absolutely sure about that? I have had lots of times in M2 where I have fought a battle with a building on the map that I can't use. (Usually a church of some sort)

[Foot]

Oh yeah, that is possible. But they are randomly generated, and generally appear in the middle of the map. You can even get little villages and the like as well.

Foot

[General Appo]

Yeah, I´ve been pretty pissed by the hundreds of times there´s been a little castle just next to my starting position, the gate is open, and I´d really need some defenses against the heavily outnumbering enemy. Yet there is no way for me to enter the castle. I can walk up to the open gate, but through it? No way.
Stupid, why put them there in the first place if you can´t use them.

Little farms with mills and wells can actually be pretty useful for dividing your enemy´s forces into two when they´re crossing the area. But still annoying that you can´t garrison them or anything.
At least it appears this sort of actions will be possible in ETW. Better late then never.

[ludwag]

so with eb 2 you will have to change all this castles and small villages into ancient?

[General Appo]

Well, if it is possible I´m sure the EB team will attempt to do so. Or just remove them, provided of course that is possible.
The whole editing buildings thing is pretty damn hard though.

[Mithridates VI Eupator]

Maybe not in the first release, though.
Given the complex process, remodeling and texturing all those battle-map buildings will likely be a quite lengthy affair.

[a completely inoffensive name]

I personally think the building editing should be the number one priority and have the most resources put into it for the first release of EBII. As a mod whose purpose is to immerse the player in history, any medieval buildings on the campaign or battle map completely ruins the goal, accuracy and utterly shatters the player's suspension of disbelief.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspension_of_belief

[Foot]

No.1 you say. Hmm, before, say the core mechanics of the campaign, before the actual models for the units, before you can actually play the game.

I mean if you don't want to play it until we have ancient buildings thats easy enough, but if you don't want to play it before its playable thats not an issue because - you can't!

Foot

[a completely inoffensive name]

No.1 you say. Hmm, before, say the core mechanics of the campaign, before the actual models for the units, before you can actually play the game.

I mean if you don't want to play it until we have ancient buildings thats easy enough, but if you don't want to play it before its playable thats not an issue because - you can't!

Foot

umm I don't think I said that should be the only thing to work on. My point was to have more effort put into the building editing now as well as finish the basics such as unit models, mech..etc.. I didn't say to just get the buildings down and then release the product. From what I hear and read, building editing is one of the most time consuming and difficult tasks to do, so why not just it done right off the bat instead of planning to finish it by EB II v 1.1.

I have no problem waiting however long it takes, but in my point of view it seems as a mismanagement of time to not get the most difficult things done with first and finish up the easier things later. Again, I am not trying to say it should be the only thing worked on.

[Foot]

How about we have a first release of EBII without the ancient buildings, with a warning mentioning this fact, and then allow people to decide whether to play an early release or not. You, of course, would not, others would.

Foot

[a completely inoffensive name]

How about we have a first release of EBII without the ancient buildings, with a warning mentioning this fact, and then allow people to decide whether to play an early release or not. You, of course, would not, others would.

Foot

Actually it would depend on how much other stuff would be in that release. If its just the bare basics then no. If you managed to add fun stuff such as messages of the A.S. breaking up or the moving of Alexander's body (both of which don't work in EB I), then I would download it.

[Foot]

So buildings aren't entirely your no. 1 priority, then? Odd that you think they should be ours.

Foot

[a completely inoffensive name]

So buildings aren't entirely your no. 1 priority, then? Odd that you think they should be ours.

Foot

No, they are still my no. 1 priority. I am just saying if you managed to add a lot of other goodies to offset the fact that everything looks medieval and 1000+ years out of place, then yeah I would probably get it then. I am not gonna get too picky over a free game.

[lobf]

If they're really a problem, I could live with an EBII sin ancient buildings. Like you say, Mr. Hunt (BTW, mods, there are really people named Mike Hunt) it's a free game. So what?

[a completely inoffensive name]

If they're really a problem, I could live with an EBII sin ancient buildings. Like you say, Mr. Hunt (BTW, mods, there are really people named Mike Hunt) it's a free game. So what?

Whatever, its not really that much of a big deal, I am just used to doing the most difficult stuff first and handle the easy stuff later, so if you fall behind schedule its easier to catch up.

[General Appo]

Well you know, with this kinda project it´s a bit more complicated. For example, lets say all skinners are on vacation or working for their exams or having trouble with their computer. Then it´s kinda hard to say "okay, this month the skinning will be top priority".

[a completely inoffensive name]

Well you know, with this kinda project it´s a bit more complicated. For example, lets say all skinners are on vacation or working for their exams or having trouble with their computer. Then it´s kinda hard to say "okay, this month the skinning will be top priority".

Well obviously, but I am sure the EB team is more organized then that.