The Prometheus: Large Mafia Game [Concluded]

[Reenk Roink]

vote: Reenk Roink

his combonation of pikachu wizardry as he signed to go on board was very peculiar, i've heard pokemon is all the rage with the bad guys

In another time in another game, I would be enraged and try my utmost to get you killed (either with a retaliation vote or a special ability), but I also must give credit to people who make the game funny, plus I am going to be a good, vigilant, unselfish townie here .

Also, I fired my agent due to his limited vocabulary.

Also, my lawyer advises me to abstain, and my mother tells me to do it courteously .

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

THIS IS NOT A VOTE!

Seriously though, before anyone gets on my case for doing this (and it's not going to be habitual like before), I have no idea what is going on. Why aren't there any kills?

[Askthepizzaguy]

I've been thinking about it some more, and to me a game with 23 players seems to indicate more than one mafia. For balance, I'd say 3 or 4 mafia out of 23 would be realistic. It just seems strange to me that in the writeup there seems to indicate one person.

This man was a fanatic, devoted to the cause of protecting the sacred and holy earth; he was ready to give his life to stop Sholken

This part intrigues me. Who are his accomplices? Why would there be only one guy?

I have to conclude that, unless the mafioso has some kind of extra life or defense system built into the game, he can't be alone.

[KukriKhan]

With 22 players, my estimate would be 2 mafia, possibly a third - or unaffiliated serial killer, a doctor (shielder), and a detective.

If the mafia guys didn't start out knowing each other, that may explain the lack of a kill - maybe they did investigations instead, trying to find their twin (or the detective, to get rid of him).

If that's so, it marks them as cautious players, which (making a leap) also might mark them as seasoned players.

Not much to go on, but it's early times.

[shlin28]

Vote: Pever

First person I saw when the day began.

[Reenk Roink]

If the mafia guys didn't start out knowing each other, that may explain the lack of a kill - maybe they did investigations instead, trying to find their twin (or the detective, to get rid of him).

What makes you think that the mafia can do investigations KukriKhan-sama...?

Suspicious, but you know I am not one to go and vote for someone for that reason.

[seireikhaan]

Vote: Reenk Roink.

Welcome back.


As to why there were no kills; frankly, I'm quite surprised nobody has accused me of being mafioso right away, given my, ahem, track record. I'd say the mafia probably has one kill, and whomever was supposed to submit it pulled a "khaan", so to speak. I'm gonna guess that there's likely a serial killer who would give us a 2nd kill. However, maybe he has some other ability and used it night one?

[Sigurd]

The original mafia game only had mafia and town and the party version only have one mafiosi.
I am not going to fish for roles here, but if there are no pro-town roles in this game, we could assume there is only us vs. the agent(s).

I think someone asked if this game was going to be complex and the host's answer was that it would be of a classical nature.
My guess would be one or two agents among us. The rest of us are shark bait.

I noticed a few players making it a point to post during the night. If the agent are going for the blame the lurker routine we might find our stowaway amongst those.
If the stowaway was infact not able to send in his order, we have a lurker.

Initial rounds votes are always going to be based on .... nothing.

vote: PP for being a lurker (since 31.10.08)

[Askthepizzaguy]

The original mafia game only had mafia and town and the party version only have one mafiosi.
I am not going to fish for roles here, but if there are no pro-town roles in this game, we could assume there is only us vs. the agent(s).

I think someone asked if this game was going to be complex and the host's answer was that it would be of a classical nature.
My guess would be one or two agents among us. The rest of us are shark bait.

I noticed a few players making it a point to post during the night. If the agent are going for the blame the lurker routine we might find our stowaway amongst those.
If the stowaway was infact not able to send in his order, we have a lurker.

Initial rounds votes are always going to be based on .... nothing.

vote: PP for being a lurker (since 31.10.08)

I tend to agree. I've noticed in all the games I've hosted and the few that I've played, the agents tend to have almost universally, a "blame the lurker" strategy. It's easy to pick on someone who isn't here to defend themselves, and town is usually quick to jump on the bandwagon, and that results in innocent townies dying. If someone is away, and then comes back and contributes, that happens to most of us at one time or another, and I know for sure that it usually results in innocent townies dying. It might be used as a shield this time, but it shouldn't indicate town or mafia one way or the other.

What I suggest is more likely is those lurkers who almost never post, and when they do, it's one or two posts, then leave again for a long time. Lurkers who lurk for legitimate reasons (not connected to the internet, away for work, real life issues) tend to get blamed by the mafioso who will then lurk for real.

The reason I'm pointing this out, is that any mafioso who are listening had better start posting more, because they would condemn themselves by being a true lurker. They usually leave telltale signs when they post, and when they are here they can respond to interrogative questioning, or be rightly accused of avoiding the question. In any case, posting more is better for town. Long periods of silence doesn't help town's investigation and can only help mafia.

The scummy pattern of behavior is easier to identify; contributing little to the game for most of the game, and then having accusatory postures later on to throw town off. I'm looking for those in particular, because if they are here, they are online, but they don't bother posting (like Warmaster Horus did in Chaotix's FF mafia... I caught him deliberately avoiding the thread and he was mafia) then that's usually really scummy behavior.

[Csargo]

I would think that perhaps the mafioso was either not online that whole time, or perhaps is trying to get us to think that he wasn't online. The trouble is, there's no evidence either way, so it's not a good clue, yet.

Vote: Ichigo

We need real votes, not fake ones. Not voting or fake voting, to me, doesn't help town at all. Either it's a bad townie move or a good mafia move.

Question: from the initial scene, can we conclude there's only one mafia? Or are there more?

Are you calling me a liar?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Vote:That guy over there

No, I'm not. But it's obviously a silly vote. So I have to assume you're being silly now. As always.



Play as you like, I'm just saying it's not useful to town when you do that.

[Csargo]

No, I'm not. But it's obviously a silly vote. So I have to assume you're being silly now. As always.



Play as you like, I'm just saying it's not useful to town when you do that.

So, you're saying how I'm playing isn't useful? I assume you have some way of backing up that.

[Askthepizzaguy]

So, you're saying how I'm playing isn't useful? I assume you have some way of backing up that.

Well, voting for someone who doesn't exist, or "that guy over there"... it's not a real vote. So it's non-contributory to town's winning. It also creates a distraction. For example, I'm now discussing this thing with you instead of focusing on other things that matter. I hate to be the example, but it's an example.

I would assume it's self-evident why it's both not helpful and also potentially harmful. I don't feel the need to continue explaining, my friend. With all due respect of course.

[Reenk Roink]

It seems Askthepizzaguy is the new Sasaki, a politer one though...

[Askthepizzaguy]

It seems Askthepizzaguy is the new Sasaki, a politer one though...

Thanks, Reenk. *sarcasm

I assume a vote: Sasaki is coming next?

[Csargo]

Well, voting for someone who doesn't exist, or "that guy over there"... it's not a real vote. So it's non-contributory to town's winning. It also creates a distraction. For example, I'm now discussing this thing with you instead of focusing on other things that matter. I hate to be the example, but it's an example.

I would assume it's self-evident why it's both not helpful and also potentially harmful. I don't feel the need to continue explaining, my friend. With all due respect of course.

So? How likely is it that we are going to lynch a member of the mafia this round? My vote is basically the equivalent to abstaining. Discussion is always good no matter what it is about. What do you mean? No kills, no way to discern whether or not the mafia is inactive or just playing games. There's not much else to talk about.

I'm here participating so I don't see how it's not helpful or how it could come to harm the town.

[Askthepizzaguy]

So? How likely is it that we are going to lynch a member of the mafia this round? My vote is basically the equivalent to abstaining. Discussion is always good no matter what it is about. What do you mean? No kills, no way to discern whether or not the mafia is inactive or just playing games. There's not much else to talk about.

I'm here participating so I don't see how it's not helpful or how it could come to harm the town.

Well suspect behavior in any round is something we need to look for. I'm not one of those who says that well, round one is useless, so let's not bother playing seriously.

First of all, you're playing while invisible. Maybe that's normal, typical behavior for you, but frankly it tells me that you don't want us to know what you're doing. You're posting something silly and distracting, and now engaging in this debate with me, rather than working with me to find the mafioso.

Maybe you got a pm or something telling you to behave this way, but according to previous games, this is all typical behavior for you. So I have to assume you're just being yourself. My point is, as Askthepizzaguy observing Ichigo's behavior, you're acting unhelpful and suspiciously. Why would you do that, in any round?

Round one may usually be a wash for town, but it becomes even harder for town to gain any play whatsoever when certain townies are being uncooperative. Are you town, or are you mafia?

I assume you're still town, but you're not playing a very good town. Which means, given the option, maybe we should keep you alive, because you're a townie and we want to lynch a mafia. But still, if we run out of options in later rounds, your play here leaves you to be a relatively safe bet for a lynch. If we don't get a mafia, we at least get a bad townie.

I know you disagree, but it doesn't matter. Posting silly or confusing, and generally unhelpful things does in fact make you a bad townie. If I'm wrong on this, feel free to correct me. If anyone else disagrees, please say so.

I'm not saying we must therefore lynch you now, because I still suspect you're just being yourself and that doesn't make you mafia or town. But the style isn't very good for town. For now, I will keep my vote on you because I think you're being less helpful. Later on, if I see other more definitively bad play, I will probably change my vote.

I'm probably over-analyzing things, but I still say it's bad play.

[pevergreen]

Man...My head hurts. The noises kept me awake all night.

Unvote: Shlin28, Vote: PIZZA
Stop talking so much man, it hurts.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I won't stop talking, buddy.

If you want, I'll hide my thoughts in spoilers, but I refuse to just lay down anytime someone tells me to do something.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

A very, very good question. Not paying attention, or deliberate tactic?

Impossible to say. There could even have been any number of special rules for Night 1 -- this is not a standard role-set according to CR.

Vote:abstain

[Crazed Rabbit]

Current Tally:

Pizzaguy: 1 (pevergreen)
Makaikhaan:1 (Chaotix)
Reenk Roink:2 (Aries, makaikhaan)
Ichigo:1 (Pizzaguy)
pevergreen: 1 (shlin)
Peasant Phill: 1 (Sigurd)

Abstain:1 (Seamus)

The round will continue for ~24 hours so that all the people can see the game has started, and I'm going to ask that the thread title be changed.

CR

[Yoyoma1910]

Vote:PizzaGuy


Stop talking like a snake oil salesman.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Second on the bandwagon, eh Yoyoma?

I could vote you for jumping on me without a real reason, but it would only highlight that such tactics don't make sense. Are you trying to defend your buddy Ichigo and lynch the guy who suspects him?

I'm keeping my vote on Ichigo.

[pevergreen]

Mr. Pizza, I did hear in my life, that its third on the bandwagon. Just letting you know, man.

[Askthepizzaguy]

from a logical perspective, there is nothing inherently significant with either second or third on the "bandwagon".

Voting for someone for no good reason, then calling it a reason, is suspicious.

[Csargo]

First of all, you're playing while invisible. Maybe that's normal, typical behavior for you, but frankly it tells me that you don't want us to know what you're doing. You're posting something silly and distracting, and now engaging in this debate with me, rather than working with me to find the mafioso.

I've been invisible for months now, and I'm not going to change it just so you can stalk me. You're the only one distracted by it, nobody else seems to care about my 1-2 joking posts. How do I know you aren't a mafioso? I guess we should all join hands and merrily skip to our deaths?

Maybe you got a pm or something telling you to behave this way, but according to previous games, this is all typical behavior for you. So I have to assume you're just being yourself. My point is, as Askthepizzaguy observing Ichigo's behavior, you're acting unhelpful and suspiciously. Why would you do that, in any round?

Alright... I would do it because it works for me and is fun.

Round one may usually be a wash for town, but it becomes even harder for town to gain any play whatsoever when certain townies are being uncooperative. Are you town, or are you mafia?

How am I being uncooperative? Umm, question is kinda pointless.

I assume you're still town, but you're not playing a very good town. Which means, given the option, maybe we should keep you alive, because you're a townie and we want to lynch a mafia. But still, if we run out of options in later rounds, your play here leaves you to be a relatively safe bet for a lynch. If we don't get a mafia, we at least get a bad townie.

If you think I'm a townie why are you voting me? I'm no worse a townie then you. I'm here and participating, which is more then can be said for many others. Just because I like to have a little fun doesn't automatically make me a bad townie or that the way I play is bad for the town.

I'm not saying we must therefore lynch you now, because I still suspect you're just being yourself and that doesn't make you mafia or town. But the style isn't very good for town. For now, I will keep my vote on you because I think you're being less helpful. Later on, if I see other more definitively bad play, I will probably change my vote.

I think my style is very good for the town.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I've been invisible for months now, and I'm not going to change it just so you can stalk me. You're the only one distracted by it, nobody else seems to care. How do I know you aren't a mafioso?

Very few others have posted. We still have a long way to go.

I'm pointing out that you are both invisible and posting silly messages. Neither of these helps town, and one of them is intentionally distracting.

Alright... I would do it because it works for me and is fun.

Not much of an argument there, so I'll conclude that you've conceded that the strategy doesn't make sense.

If you think I'm a townie why are you voting me? I'm no worse a townie then you. I'm here and participating, which is more then can be said for many others. Just because I like to have a little fun doesn't automatically make me a bad townie or that the way I play is bad for the town.

I don't know if you're a townie or not. The point is, I'm at least attempting to root out the mafioso, which helps town, and doesn't throw in the towel. You said that it doesn't matter who we vote for, and you're not even trying.

What makes you think surrendering and conceding the first day to the mafioso is a good idea?

I think my style is very good for the town.

I disagree. I think attempting to do something, anything, besides the bare minimum (random voting) is much better than "vote:That guy over there."

That's not even a random vote, but if I consider it an abstain, your debating me on the merits of playing nonsensically have their downfalls as well. Much of the conversation here has been about that, and I say it's counterproductive.

I'm simply asking town to decide here whether they prefer an interrogative and rational strategy, or non-votes and non-posts. Since we obviously disagree, they can make the judgment call.



EDIT: On further reflection, I think you're trying to get me to debate endlessly intentionally. What are your motives?

[pevergreen]

I think Pizza. Mate. You just dont know this Ichigo guy. He's completely normal, you are reading into it too much. Like a guy who paints a picture and then you come up and say that it means about his soul and crap like that. Leave him be.

[Askthepizzaguy]

As you wish. Maybe I'm not on as solid ground as I think. But my argument itself is solid, and his argument is not.

Stuff like that incites me to attack, because I sense an opening. It's getting late, maybe I should just chill out and go to sleep.

I do want to say in my defense that it is better for townies to at least try to ask questions, because quiet games allow mafioso to lurk and then they win.

good night all!

[Peasant Phill]

Janitors log, stardate somewhere between January the 32th and Uranus:

Dear log,
Being Janitor on this vessel is even worse than the time I was set to work on the party space shuttle. At least there they had the decency to let me do my job. Here it's all, Phill come here, Phill go there and Phill we'll put you in sustained sleep for a while,...
And just now, when I finaly wanted to take care of that leaking toilet on deck 12, I had to join a meeting. Not that I was listening very well but apparently we need to vote on something. I don't know and I don't care so I voted abstain.

Over and out.

OOC: I didn't have time for this game this weekend with all saints day and the renovation of my home.

[pevergreen]

OOC: Are you Phill, the Janitor?

edit: Hence the grin? *facepalm*